Legend Purchase Advice

[Ripple]

I am getting ready to buy my first custom frame. Test rode the Seven Axiom and Serotta Legend Ti at my LBS. The test ride convinced me that Serotta is the way to go...

I would appreciate your advice and opinions on the Legend options: GS vs SE and Carbon Stay (CS) vs Straight Ti. I am planning to get the matte Ti finish, so no need to include paint options / considerations.

I have read the basics from the Serotta Web site information and tried to learn as much as possible from the threads in this forum. Here are some questions on my mind:

What are the different ride characteristics that I would feel between the Legend GS CS and the SE CS?
How much of a custom fit difference between the GS and SE?
The SE CS stay has some "float" to help with a smooth ride connected to the road. I understand that the GS CS stay is fixed. How big of a difference is this?
What are the ride / fit differences between the F3 and S Fork?
Any thoughts on the straight Ti vs CS?

I'll be honest ... I am hung up on the $1000 price difference between the SE and GS ...


Thanks for helping out a newbie to this forum!

[stevep]

my only contribution is the straight ti is the bike to outlast all bikes.
they are practically indestructable in any kind of normal use and promise to deliver many, many years of the hardest use.
this is not to imply that carbon is less durable... but it might be more prone to nicks, scratches, general wear and tear.
i have 1 13 yr old ti bike and in an hour i could shine it up, put new decals on it and sell it for new.

something to be said for that.

" for sale, new 55cm ti frame... call in an hour..."

the other questions i defer on.

[CNY rider]

I have an all Ti Legend going on 4 years old.
The ride is exquisite.
It is the single best made product I have purchased ever.
I would go with all ti.
Mine has an O2 fork so no input on the F3.

Enjoy!

[davids]

I, too, would get full Ti. That would be a completely uncompromised bike for the ages. Ti doesn't get better than a Legend.

[Grant McLean]

The differences between the models pale in comparison to the difference
a great fitting, great handling bike can make, from one that's off the mark.

This is your first custom? Do you have total 100% confidence that you're
getting all contact points and geometry choices that work for you long term?
Is your dealer/fitter on your Christmas card list? The relationship with the
person making your dreams come true is the top priority. The rest is white noise.

-g

[Big Dan]

Call me crazy, but I would go all Ti.

:cool:

[malcolm]

I would go all Ti as well. I've owned both all Ti and Ti with carbon stays (legends) and I'm not sure I could tell a difference. Currently I've got an all Ti spectrum and love it. Loved the legends as well. Many will disagree but I really don't think I could tell much difference with the carbon stays.

[93legendti]

There are many threads on this topic. Many of the owners of both all ti and ST stay equipped bikes weighed in:

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=27670&highlight=legend
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=34947&highlight=legend
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=14964&highlight=ottrott
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=2309&highlight=legend\
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=8513&highlight=legend
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=10550&highlight=legend

[Pete Serotta]

Ripple, I see you are from NJ. If Mike Grotz from Cyclesport was your fitter you are in good hands. (Personal opinion).

There are other great fitters out there - such as at SIGNATURE CYCYLE in NY (Paul Levine) The forum is a good place to get recommendation,

Folks from long distances travel to them (as well as other good fitters). You are lucky you have two in your back yard.

As to Ti vs Ti/Carbon rear it is a personal toss up to most. (The ST does work)

- I like the all ti (again personal). I have an ST rear on my travel bike and it works fine also. The difference (for me) is slight and not a positive or negative on the roads I ride.

- As to GS / vs SE You n eed to rely on fitter to determine which will give you a better ride. A 57cm or less in size and the ride differences are slighter on average. (unless you need/want oversize stiff tubes.) Larger sizes there can be a ride difference.

- Fork, (again my personal opinion) F3 is the one (not cheap but few good things are)

Feel free to send me a private note pmckeon@bellsouth.net if I can answer any questions for you. (I lived in the NY tristate area for many years.

[Ahneida Ride]

I have a Legend ... all Ti .... I love this bike ....
Best purchase I ever made.

Go all Ti ... The ride is real sweet. Make sure you tell em not to build
it racing stiff unless you actually intend to actually do so.

Please PM me if I can entertain any questions.
I can still remember just a bit the pre-purchase ambivalence.

The Legend works best for Clydesdales. The GS (former Concours)
is a also a fantastic choice.

Request rack mounts .... easy to add them now and do not forget a
pump peg.

[DavidR]

Go with all Ti. I have an older one that still looks and rides great!!!

[Jeff N.]

Don't get sucked into the Ti stay hype. Go all Ti. And get a pump peg put on ( better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it...and there's no extra charge. I don't think. I'd say to also get a chain hanger, but with Serotta-unlike Seven- it's not an option). And go for the triple butted version, whatever it's called. I'd go polished ( it's actually BRUSHED...don't know why they call it polished) with matt decals. Sure, the extra grand is a bit much, but hey! Serotta's are expensive. That's a given. So pull the trigger. Oh! And make it a LEVEL top tube! ;) Jeff N.

[Ahneida Ride]

The differences between the models pale in comparison to the difference
a great fitting, great handling bike can make, from one that's off the mark.

This is your first custom? Do you have total 100% confidence that you're
getting all contact points and geometry choices that work for you long term?
Is your dealer/fitter on your Christmas card list? The relationship with the
person making your dreams come true is the top priority. The rest is white noise.

-g

Grant is soooooo correct. Go with a fitter you have confidence in.
Ask questions. Make sure the fitter and Serotta know how you intend to
use the bike. Make sure the fitter justifies his specifications.
A good fitter will tell ya why he/she is doing stuff. A good fitter will also
interrogate you and ask the same question in slightly different formats.

Fit is everything. ;)

How about Matte with polished decals? Very sophisticated.

My Best ....

[Ozz]

... Fit is everything. ;)

How about Matte with polished decals? Very sophisticated.

My Best ....
smart man...

for more sophistication...go polished with matt decals....(like mine)! :cool:

:beer:

[rwsaunders]

Go with all Ti. I have an older one that still looks and rides great!!!

+1. Worms come off the Ti easier than the carbon too. You should see my bike after today's ride. There are more worms (protein) on my frame and brakes than a box full of power bars.

[Ripple]

Thanks to everyone for your thoughts! I greatly appreciate the suggestions and the links to other threads.

Well I'm pretty much convinced around the Full Ti based on my test ride and the feedback from this forum, (Matte w/ polished decals!) and I'll definitely go invest some quality time with the fitter!

:beer:

[SoCalSteve]

Thanks to everyone for your thoughts! I greatly appreciate the suggestions and the links to other threads.

Well I'm pretty much convinced around the Full Ti based on my test ride and the feedback from this forum, (Matte w/ polished decals!) and I'll definitely go invest some quality time with the fitter!
:beer:

Your on the right track!

Of course, I love the ST stays...But, everyone is different.

Steve

PS: I have bikes with DKS stays (Hors Cat), Terraplane stays (Kirk) and ST stays (Ottrott).

[Mud]

My wife and I are very happy with the fits we had done at Cyclecraft by Brendan in 2005. Both of us have the ST rear (I have the Legend with the F3) and we enjoy the ride every time we get on the bikes. :banana:

[93legendti]

Your on the right track!

Of course, I love the ST stays...But, everyone is different.

Steve

PS: I have bikes with DKS stays (Hors Cat), Terraplane stays (Kirk) and ST stays (Ottrott).

+1. I have bikes with all 3 stays: DKS (HC road and cx), ST (Legend St and Ottrott ST and Kirk JKS Terraplane...well, my Terraplane stay bike is in process. :)

[FMS_rider]

From my limited experience I think the ST pivoted stays do make a small but noticeable improvement in ride quality (rear wheel feels like it hugs the road on rough pavement plus a bit more comfort), so I think you need to think in terms of a trade off: aesthetics+durability versus ride quality. I chose the STs on my Legend and have not regretted it.

Lew

[93legendti]

From my limited experience I think the ST pivoted stays do make a small but noticeable improvement in ride quality (rear wheel feels like it hugs the road on rough pavement plus a bit more comfort), so I think you need to think in terms of a trade off: aesthetics+durability versus ride quality. I chose the STs on my Legend and have not regretted it.

Lew
The last thing I worry about on any of my Serottas (7, at last count) is durability.

[csm]

even though it's been said and you've decided.... go all ti!

[kgreene10]

I bought a Fierte IT last year after my last ride crumpled against the carport. I was happy to find out that Serotta offers an insurance program -- $250 for five years of coverage and it's renewable. If your frame is damaged for any reason other than neglect, Serotta will repair or replace for a pretty small "co-pay." The Fierte is my first carbon bike and the insurance program made me feel less skittish about it. BTW, the bike now goes in rather than on the car.

[rounder]

The differences between the models pale in comparison to the difference
a great fitting, great handling bike can make, from one that's off the mark.

Yeah but...how do you know what is the right fit and how do you communicate that to the measurer. Also, if you give the same information to several qualified measurers would they come up with the same specs for building your new dream bike. I am a little leery about that and that is why I never went to brand new custom. I was talking to a girl who said she spent a lot of money for her custom serotta and had toe overlap...she is about 5' 7". Not trying to steal the thread but this is something have been wondering about.

[FATBOY]

Ahhhh, nothing like the mob mentality to help answer a question. All Ti. Truly, of all the bikes I have sold, NONE felt anything like the Legend (pre CF stay) I built for a friend very similar to myself in size and riding style. Telepathy is the only thing I can compare to the response I got from my movement on that particualr bike. So smooth, so stable yet so damn responsive and begging for hard pedaling that you felt like you were a fair degree better athlete than reality suggested. I have yet to hop on a bike with a Cf stay that felt like that bike. Be it steel, aluminum or ti....that all ti bike ruled.

[jpw]

Thanks to everyone for your thoughts! I greatly appreciate the suggestions and the links to other threads.

Well I'm pretty much convinced around the Full Ti based on my test ride and the feedback from this forum, (Matte w/ polished decals!) and I'll definitely go invest some quality time with the fitter!

:beer:

"Matte w/ polished decals!". Really?

Isn't Matte more difficult to keep looking good over time?

[toaster]

My Legend Ti is from 6 years ago. Half paint, half polish in Simply white and it looks and rides like the day it was first built. It also has tens of thousands of trouble free miles on it.

Highly recommend white! Bike washing is a basic skill and your white bicycle will always look new when clean.

[FMS_rider]

The last thing I worry about on any of my Serottas (7, at last count) is durability.I stand corrected. Make that a trade-off between aesthetics and ride quality. Although, for me, there wasn't much of a trade-off: the combination of unpainted ST stays and F3 fork is drop dead gorgeous to my eye --the workmanship is stunning. I also like the look of traditional bikes, but that need is being met with other bikes.
Lew

[Fixed]

all ti bro I raced one year on one great crit bike
cheers