View Full Version : Should Serotta bring back DKS?

09-10-2004, 09:47 AM
-and- would you be willing to pay the significant cost difference (it takes a lot of man hours to make the DKS stay from what I hear - something like 6 man hours - is that correct?)

09-10-2004, 10:26 AM
It probably would make a great cyclocross bike. I'd consider buying one.

If it does indeed take 6 extra hours, someone needs to explain why.

For the road. Na. Put sheep skin cover on that brooks saddle and spend the money you save on Campy Record groupo :D

Ahneida Ride
09-10-2004, 11:21 AM
Serotta is a "custom" shop. Custom means custom. If a client wants
a DKS, offer it and charge the appropiate amount.

Offer DKS in limited production, built only over the winter perhaps, But still
offer this option !

09-10-2004, 01:33 PM
I wonder what Smiley will say on this one??? :)

09-10-2004, 01:53 PM
I think I have a pretty good idea how he feels about it.

Ill bet an Ottrott with DKS would be right up his alley...and mine for that matter! I suppose even Douglas might be coaxed into a DKS Ottrott.

09-10-2004, 03:30 PM
the only reason to bring it back is so i can order a ottrott dks . i got my hors and thats that :banana:

09-12-2004, 10:39 PM
So that I would not feel guilty when I steal Smiley's Hors.

:) Stealing Smley's Steed So Slick So Steelless So STill Serotta Sandy :)

Tom Byrnes
09-12-2004, 11:06 PM
I rode dbrk's beautiful white Legend with DKS for three consecutive days at the recent TdFL. How remarkably stable it was on the fast descents. I liked it so much that I am going to order a Kirk Terraplane once our storage area above our garage is completed (in two-three wekks). I assume that the Terraplane will have a similar feel and ride.


09-13-2004, 06:39 AM
Tom why not buy Ben's old bike available on the deals section of the website ?

09-13-2004, 07:04 AM
I would love to own a DKS.


09-13-2004, 07:56 AM
I must be the only person on this forum that thinks the DKS is plug ugly. But people should be given the choice to buy one if they have the $$.

09-13-2004, 08:30 AM
As Thom mentioned I own DaveThompson's Legend DKS (which I guess makes it my DKS). It's not the aesthetics that draws me to this bike but the ride (it's sure grippy and smooth, though it creaks when you climb and that takes some getting used to) and, I confess, it's relative oddity. I mean, it simply doesn't ride like a non-DKS or a YBB or anything else. This is something I very much like in a bike because it's a good reason (rationalization, will do too) for having a few different bikes. The DKS is definitely its own experience. I put its aesthetics in the category of Bates, Terraplane, or others who do something that no one lese really does: such images work past our normal categories and offer a certain challenge to acceptance. I like the sloper with the DKS look because, well, then it looks even less like a "normal" bicycle to me.

who thinks that "normal" is for other people...but most people think that

09-13-2004, 08:39 AM
Dr Brooks, if your DKS creaks when out of the saddle then remove the elastomers and put a teflon filler* betwwen the straps and the stays and re-install the elastomers so the fit snug , this happened to a client of mine with his bike and that was the fix .

* plumbers teflon tape works well or even electricians black tape and trim off edges after install . By the way this client even talked to Captain Kirk on my suggestion and we could not figure this out untill I rode behind him and said what the heck and did this fix , no noise since .

09-13-2004, 08:45 AM
Out of interest if this is a good idea...why donīt do other builders do a "DKS- style-gadget" or have Serotta patented the idea?

How heavy is the extra gadget....would it be a serious consideration for racing - say Paris Roubaix - where you need a bit more "give" in the rear fork? or for tight flat circuits where you need to maximise road contact and the extra weight (if any?) is less critical.
Has this sort of design gone "out of fashion" because now we have so much flexibility in tube materials and design?


PS The Terraplane is beautiful.

Ahneida Ride
09-13-2004, 09:52 AM
1.) Serotta owns the Patent.

2.) DKS adds 154 grams ........ from Serotta Catalogue

3.) Cost. Rumor has infomed me that Cost was the factor in dumping the
DKS. Much more expensive to build just then installing pre built
carbon stays.

09-13-2004, 10:06 AM
Ahneida Ride:

I don't think manufacturing cost had ANYTHING at all to do with it.
It's not how much you sell it for, it's whether the customers will pay the price.
Serrota, like any business would have kept making that model if there was a big demand. A few geeks on our esteemed message board aside, Most
people can't get past the look of the DKS to appreciate it's ride advantages.


09-13-2004, 10:27 AM
Geeks , I take pride in that one VF .

09-13-2004, 12:53 PM
I do agree its a bit - ahem - different looking.

The DKS makes riding downhill an absolute pleasure. I think of it less like suspension (which is how many portray it) and more like glue for your wheels. When you corner, the inside stay gives, and the outside stay pushes the tire down firmly, thus giving more tire to road contact with less tire roll. It makes going round corners that much more pleasant!

The elastomers just take the buzz out of the road. - also a nice bonus -

And how can ANY Serotta be Ugly??? Its just different looking.

Props to Kirk for making the terraplane! Beautiful adaptation.

What is 150 grams anyway when you look at everything else? You can lose weight in alot of places to compensate for this. In my case that would be my spare tire!

09-13-2004, 02:09 PM
Ahneida Ride:

I don't think manufacturing cost had ANYTHING at all to do with it.
It's not how much you sell it for, it's whether the customers will pay the price.
Serrota, like any business would have kept making that model if there was a big demand. A few geeks on our esteemed message board aside, Most
people can't get past the look of the DKS to appreciate it's ride advantages.

re-read what you wrote. Whether or not the customers will pay the price is directly linked to what you sell it for. I'd buy 10 if they were $100 each. The cost of manufacture includes the labor used building a DKS and therefore not building an ST or other. I agree they would have kept making them if there was big demand. They would also have kept making them if they were costless to produce. Two ways for them to have stayed alive, higher demand, lower cost.

flydhest--owner of a Hors Categorie Cyclocross.

09-13-2004, 02:21 PM
sometimes i do feel like the odd man out here. didn't really like my ottrott. and while i sorta, kinda, on some rides, liked my hors, what i REALLY liked about it was the rest of the legend, not so much the DKS. maybe because i don't much like going downhill fast. i frankly like how my CSi rides better. i guess i'm becoming a retro grouch when it comes to seatstays: make mine ti or steel, and make 'em simple and straight. ;)

09-13-2004, 04:48 PM
Anyone here try a softride? I would think that if you really need suspension, that these would do a fine job. If you don't really need that much, then their current ST offering is probably good enough for you. I still can't get over the serotta prices, but thats all relative, since I don't mind paying to fill my gas guzzling SUV....:):)

Tom Byrnes
09-16-2004, 01:12 AM
Tom why not buy Ben's old bike available on the deals section of the website ?

Smiley - Thanks for the heads-up. I forgot that Ben's Hors was still available. I assumed that it had been sold. While I would love another titanium Serotta, and obtaining Ben Serotta's own personal Hors would be very special, his bike may not fit me as well as I would like it to. Ideally, I would like a 58-59 cm seat tube and a 55.5 or 56 cm top tube, although I assume that I could change the stem and make his bike work for me.

I like the look and design of the Kirk Terraplane and can get a bike made exactly to my size and liking. Seeing up close and personal Dave Kirk's bike, M A Martin's (Ginger's) Terraplane and dbrk's Aimee's Hello Kitty Kirk at the recent TdFL was very impressive. Our knowledgeable SerottaPal and "quasi-dealer", Mavic1010, apparently ordered a Kirk right after listening to Dave and seeing examples of his fine work.

Dave Kirk is a fine and pleasant man, a very knowledgeable and skilled bike builder and quite worthy of our business, as, of course, are Ben Serotta and his colleagues. However, I already own three fine Serotta bikes; now its time for a Kirk.

But thanks again for the heads-up. Ben's Hors is beautiful bike and if $$ and storage space were not problems for me right now, I would buy it immediately.


09-17-2004, 10:36 PM
The Hors is like a puppy; not a pretty one but, one that will always be there for you, (ie: under you on steep decents). As pointed out in the past, this bike was made for perfomance with no consideration for appearance. It works, the SoftRide is heavier, (good tri bike tho) there just isn't another bike like it. The ride is ti, plush with pleanty of traction. :bike:
The cure to the creak on my bike was replacing the seal washers and keeping the pivot areas lubed.
Don't like the extra grams, switch to carbon cranks. :rolleyes:
Hey Tom, your specs are just about what my Hors is. There's no way I'd part with this bike. :no:
If it were available and I could get the funds, the cross DKS would be hanging around here someplace. :crap:
I believe that the option should be offered when the builder can do it for what the builder will charge. It's worth waiting for.
And the debate continues.... :argue:

09-17-2004, 11:10 PM
So *that's* why Mavic1010 was riding with me during the TDFL! I knew it wasn't due to my sparkling conversation! He was probably sizing up my bike and figuring out what to offer for it! Once he decided it woudln't fit him...Poof! He was gone! (not really, Mavic 1010 was a very good escort. I think he even hung back a bit when the dogs were chasing us...but it makes a nice story)