Garmin 705... who has personal experience?

[terrytnt]

Apparently the 705 just released, so has anyone had a chance to check it out on the road. My Campy Ergobrain is nearing its end and wanted to go wireless and figure the garmin is an option (albeit an expensive one).

[jasond]

It's sort of big however I didn't buy it for it's compact design. The reason I purchased the 705 was so I could upgrade to power later. No other computer allowed me a few different options for a power meter. I was going to buy a polar cs600 however I hate how polar locks you into their product. Not only do they lock you into their product but it seems like each time they upgrade their units you have to buy an entire new setup to get all the features.

I haven't been able to explore everything the garmin can do but I can tell you one feature I absolutely love. Being able to upload my rides to MotionBased.com (http://www.motionbased.com/) and analyze my rides is great. I can also share my rides with others just by sending them a link. For example Yesterdays lunch time ride (http://trail.motionbased.com/trail/invitation/dashboard.mb?episodePk.pkValue=5193046) . If you really want to analyze your ride then I would suggest SportTracks (http://www.zonefivesoftware.com/SportTracks/) as this software is free and allows for more analysis, of course you can donate $$$ if you like. You can compare all kinds of variables like speed, elevation, heart rate, heart rate %, grade, and power. It can get fairly confusing though if you have to many things on one graph. The software will also import real time weather, export to google earth, and keep track of the mileage on all your equipment (Bikes, shoes, whatever you want). The only thing that I have found with both is the accuracy seems to be a little off. Like my "lunch time ride" says total time of 45 mins however the computer says 43 mins. With SportTracks the speed seems slightly off, not to bad though. The great thing about sporttracks is it's open source so there is a number of people that publish plugins and write code for the program. It's a little easier to have your voice heard if you want a improvement.

The computer seems accurate for the amount of times I have used it. I have never lost signal and seem to have a strong signal all the times. Another feature I like is you can customize the data screen with up to 8 different data fields. The chooses seem unlimited however I try to keep that screen simple as I don't think I really need to know anything outside of heart rate, speed, cadence, and average speed. There is a , what I think is, cool feature that allows you to train against a "ghost". The unit will display where you are against your training partner. Might be a nice feature to motivate yourself. If you'd like I will explore some more features and send you a pm in a few days.

[csm]

that looks pretty cool. any idea how the power rating things will work? will it be like a powertap hub?

[djg21]

that looks pretty cool. any idea how the power rating things will work? will it be like a powertap hub?


It doesn't have a power unit. It uses the Ant+ Sport wireless protocol to communicate with power meters such as the SRM. Thus far, it does not communicate with the Powertap Sl 2.4, which uses a proprietary communication protocol.

I contacted Saris to ask about compatibility, and it stated:

"It's something that we are aware of and that we are working on.

At this time our wireless technology is still on a proprietary network, as it has been for 3 years.
But, we firmly believe change is for the better and in line with the innovative style of our company. In addition, we listen to and respect our customer's opinions. Therefore, we are working hard to provide a compatibility solution for the ANT+Sport network but are, as of yet, unsure what form this will take or when it might happen."

[jasond]

that looks pretty cool. any idea how the power rating things will work? will it be like a powertap hub?

You can use SRM, Ergomo, or CinQo(if you have the correct crankset) but no powertap. PT uses a proprietary protocol that will not work with Garmins ANT+Sport, same thing with Polar.

[csm]

so I would still need a special hub or bb or something?

[jasond]

so I would still need a special hub or bb or something?

Yes, unfortunately you would. The new CinQo will be out soon and will give PT a little competition in it's price market at $1,100 for the power unit plus a computer between $600 and $1,000, you could get out of it for $1,700ish. However you will need a specific type of crankset though until they expand the compatible cranksets. Or you could buy the iBike, doesn't seem to accurate though. I've read good and bad things about the unit.

[csm]

ah who needs the power feature anyway! the rest of it looks pretty neat. the cheaper one would probably suffice but then... it wouldn't be the 705.

[saab2000]

With all respect to those who actually benefit from power measurements, most of us know exactly what it is we need to do to get faster - eat fewer Reuben sandwiches with onion ring sides and (many) pints of beer and ride more.

GH has evidently figured that one out. Look at the emaciated man. Looks like a bike racer.

[OtayBW]

....For example Yesterdays lunch time ride (http://trail.motionbased.com/trail/invitation/dashboard.mb?episodePk.pkValue=5193046) . If you really want to analyze your ride then I would suggest SportTracks (http://www.zonefivesoftware.com/SportTracks/) as this software is free and allows for more analysis, of course you can donate $$$ if you like.....
Can you prove a link that doesn't require a password?
Thanks.

[jasond]

Can you prove a link that doesn't require a password?
Thanks.

Here you go, just click the Dashboard button. (http://trail.motionbased.com/trail/invitation/email/accept.mb?senderPk.pkValue=-2&unitSystemPkValue=2&episodePk.pkValue=5193046)

[terrytnt]

Thanks Jason, comprehensive overview... much appreciated.

Am I correct that you can also use the Garmin indoor on rollers (assuming there's a magnet attachment for the rear wheel)? Also, do you find you need to recharge after every ride (recognizing duration of ride is a key factor)?

Finally, the 305s are substantially reduced in price, do you think the 705 is worth the upgrade in features?

thanks,

tnt

[jasond]

Thanks Jason, comprehensive overview... much appreciated.

Am I correct that you can also use the Garmin indoor on rollers (assuming there's a magnet attachment for the rear wheel)? Also, do you find you need to recharge after every ride (recognizing duration of ride is a key factor)?

Finally, the 305s are substantially reduced in price, do you think the 705 is worth the upgrade in features?

thanks,

tnt

Regarding using it indoors, yes as long as you have the magnet attached to the rear wheel. I unfortunately can not do this without sending my wheel to the LBS as I bought the R-sys wheels which have an integrated magnet. Sort of wondering if some company will come up with a solution for this since it wouldn't be very wise to screw a magnet to a carbon spoke.

The battery life seems long, when I first received the unit I charged it fully however the battery display only showed half charged. I had to drain the battery so I could do a full recharge (this is a known issue, some units battery display will only show half charged until you do this). I had the unit on for well over 15 hours before it died. However, other than for my car ride in to work it wasn't really "working" just sitting at idle. I used it the other day and have not recharged it yet. I'm not sure if I would worry about battery life as much as I may worry about data storage. Not sure how much available space the 705 has but I've read some warning about overwriting data. I'll have to do some searching to find out where I read that.

As for the differences between the 705 and 305, I'm really not sure.

This is my first garmin unit. So far I've been impressed, I have read some stories about people having trouble with their 305's, 205's, and foreunners. But then again I have read stories about good experiences with garmin units.

[terrytnt]

Thanks Jason, your insights are very much appreciated. Regarding data, my plan would be transfer to a data tracking report so I can evaluate over extended time periods, therefore my assumption is I could clear data from the 705.

Sure many of us would love you hear you observations and conclusion over time. My campy ergobrain is still working so I'll probably hold off until mid summer or whenever it decides to fail.

thanks again,

[scrooge]

...The only thing that I have found with both is the accuracy seems to be a little off....The computer seems accurate for the amount of times I have used it. .

That's the rub for me...if I'm going to drop a few hundred bucks on a computer, I want it to be VERY accurate, ALL the time. I guess I hear too many comments like this (especially regarding vertical gain/loss) to be ready to drop that kind of coin yet. :confused:

[CarbonCycles]

That's the rub for me...if I'm going to drop a few hundred bucks on a computer, I want it to be VERY accurate, ALL the time. I guess I hear too many comments like this (especially regarding vertical gain/loss) to be ready to drop that kind of coin yet. :confused:

I'm assuming you do NOT realize that the DOD has mandated that all commercially sold GPS systems intentionally include an inherent error within their precision?

[scrooge]

I'm assuming you do NOT realize that the DOD has mandated that all commercially sold GPS systems intentionally include an inherent error within their precision?

That's a fair assumption. I did not realize that.

But regardless, if I'm going to be riding in the mountains (which I do a lot) I'd like an accurate read of elevation gain/loss--and I don't consider a few hundred (or in some cases I've read--a few thousand feet) to be even close to accurate.

[Kurt]

Re my 305, the data between it, TC and MB does not match up – actually its not even close to be helpful - 1612’ on the 305, 1827’ on TC and 2455 on MB, that sort of difference. The memory does not last that long on the device itself so one is stuck with useless data on a pc. I assume this is true with them all as I have checked this with 3 other units. That with the 1-2 ride battery makes this device a paperweight as far as I am concerned.

[jasond]

I've never had more than a 7ft difference however I haven't been riding in some serious elevation. When you import your info into SportTracks you can use a plugin that will correct elevation however this does nothing for the difference between start and finish when starting and finishing in the exact same location.

Edit:

Just noticed MB has an elevation correction setting that corrects everything. My start and finish elevation is now the exact same.

[Kurt]

I've never had more than a 7ft difference however I haven't been riding in some serious elevation. When you import your info into SportTracks you can use a plugin that will correct elevation however this does nothing for the difference between start and finish when starting and finishing in the exact same location.

Edit:

Just noticed MB has an elevation correction setting that corrects everything. My start and finish elevation is now the exact same.


totally blows imo, if you have better luck with the 705 then I am happy for you because they dont get anymore $ from me. They even sent me a new unit with the same issue. forget everything else, how is the data from the device to just there software?

[11.4]

I'm assuming you do NOT realize that the DOD has mandated that all commercially sold GPS systems intentionally include an inherent error within their precision?

When GPS first became commercially available, there was something like a 230 foot PCI error calculated into the position. That was reduced within a couple years to approximately 30 feet. There is currently a more advanced encrypted algorithm that provides less than one-foot accuracy which is only available to military and related users, but the standard available for high-end commercially available units is about 3 feet. When sampling rate and antenna performance are compromised, the accuracy erodes -- this is the practical problem with a small unit like the 705 that basically has a lower-end GPS unit integrated -- but any significant lack of accuracy in a 705 is more a matter of product design than DoD interference.

[CarbonCycles]

When GPS first became commercially available, there was something like a 230 foot PCI error calculated into the position. That was reduced within a couple years to approximately 30 feet. There is currently a more advanced encrypted algorithm that provides less than one-foot accuracy which is only available to military and related users, but the standard available for high-end commercially available units is about 3 feet. When sampling rate and antenna performance are compromised, the accuracy erodes -- this is the practical problem with a small unit like the 705 that basically has a lower-end GPS unit integrated -- but any significant lack of accuracy in a 705 is more a matter of product design than DoD interference.

Yes, well put and nothing to further contribute.

[paczki]

Anyone have any further thoughts about the 705?

[jbrainin]

I've been using my 705, mostly happily, for about three months now. For the most part, it works very well. Its battery last significantly longer than that of the 305: I did a 142 mile ride from Pagosa Springs, Co to Taos, NM, a ride of nearly 11 hours and still had plenty of charge left.

There are two problems I've encountered with the unit. The first I attribute to first generation unit software: every so often the unit just freezes so I have to turn it off and on again in order to get it working. The other may be a software bug or just bizarre rfi interference at a specific location in Santa Fe: while going downhill in the same area, my displayed heartrate shoots up to 220 bpm or more when, in fact, it is probably no more than 110.

The mapping features of the unit are excellent and have been useful to me on a few rides.

That's all I can think of at the moment.

Jonathan

[terrytnt]

Thanks Jonathan for the update. Still can't convince myself the shell out the buck... not to mention the unit is so darn large.

Been thinking about the new Cateye V3....

[paczki]

Thank you. Very helpful.