Sugino 75 Crank Bolt Torque?? Grease or no?

[sfhbike]

Hi folks, can't find this anywhere on the net. I have a Sugino 75 crankset that I'll be re-installing after replacing a bb and don't know what the torque specification is on that. Is there anywhere that has Sugino torque specs listed (I've found many others)?

Also, not sure if I should grease or not (sorry to open that can of worms :rolleyes: ).

Thoughts?

[Ken Robb]

my German tech manual recommends guttentite but not quite achscheissteutite. Good luck. :beer:

[Grant McLean]

Grease (or anti-seize) the threads of the crank bolts, never the tapers.

Just make them tight. No need to split a gut.

-g

[Too Tall]

Hi folks, can't find this anywhere on the net. I have a Sugino 75 crankset that I'll be re-installing after replacing a bb and don't know what the torque specification is on that. Is there anywhere that has Sugino torque specs listed (I've found many others)?

Also, not sure if I should grease or not (sorry to open that can of worms :rolleyes: ).

Thoughts?

32-38 N.m or 23.6-28 lb.ft

Yes, you always use grease on the threads and interface (backside of bolt head that touches washer or crank arm if captured washer)

On new cranks be sure to re-check after 1 ride and if you don't plan to see that bike for a while (like forever) torque to max value and consider using clean threads and blue loctite.

[sfhbike]

Ok, I have one for NO grease on tapers. Too Tall, did you mean a yes on that (interfaces?)? [edit, i see now that you elaborate what you mean by interfaces]. Anyone want to expand on whatever virtues there might be on greasing the tapers? I know its an ongoing debate . . .

Also, I only have a 200 in/lb torque wrench here at home. Anyone have an idea of how much more of a turn I should give it to get it in the range. OR better, anyone in the DC area want to loan me a proper torque wrench for the job ;), or know where I might be able to rent or borrow one?

[sfhbike]

Answer from Sugino. That is an awfully low torque. Lowest I've ever heard for a crankset [going to send another email to doublecheck]:

Dear Mr. --

Thank you very much for your e-mail.

The torque is 12-16N.m.
However, this torque specification is appropriate
under the condition that the SG75 cranks are used with the NJS parts.

We recommend to grease the BB spindle slightly
to prevent seizing and rust on the spindle.

We also recommend to do maintenance periodically.

Best regads,
Yuki Iwai
SUGINO CYCLE INDUSTRIES, LTD.
iwai@suginoltd.co.jp
TEL. +81-(0)742-62-5311
FAX.+81-(0)742-62-5320
287-1 Tohkujo-cho, Nara, Japan 630-8144

[Too Tall]

Shady bro., that's whack! Torque these to 32-38 N.m or 23.6-28 lb.ft. It does not matter if you grease the axel, this won't affect torque required...this is a huge loose press fit. If it were a small fitting or a very high torque I'd have a diff. answer. Again, the answer you got from sugino is dead wrong....prob. a conversion error.

[Boundgear]

I'm pretty sure that the NJS standard is what you were given. I'd ignore those numbers and go with much more traditional numbers like 32-38 N.m or 23.6-28 lb.ft. NJS holds standards that are designed for a bike that gets torn down and rebuilt for each race.

Edit: I'm not a taper greaser either. Grease the threads and the washer.

[sfhbike]

Thanks Josh and all for your help. and for confirming Sugino's strange numbers. Hopefully will do the job this weekend after putting some framesaver in the tubes. Cheers.

[zap]

I know some folks and manufacturers say that bb axle taper should be free of oil/grease. Campy says no oil/grease, Phil Wood says yes to a bit of oil. Its possible fretting experts are also in disagreement.

I've been using pw bb for 15+ years and follow their instructions. I did the same (dab of oil) to a Shimano DA crankset/bb.

Some believe that lubing the spindle interface prolongs the life (less fretting damage) of the crankset if one removes and installs the crankset several times. I keep some of my cycling gear for a long time and still have the PW Ti/carbon bb in my Look Monoblade. In the last 14 years, I removed the Mavic crankset several times with no problems.

Torqueing steel crank bolts when installing to 32 38 Nm is correct for most cranksets. I use steel crank bolts to install/seat the crankset and then remove those in favor of SRP ti crank bolts that are torqued to 10-12 Nm.

[sfhbike]

Zap, what do you use to "oil" the spindle, as opposed to grease?

Last of the correspondence from Sugino below. Seems clearly geared toward NJS guidelines rather than use on the street. Thanks for everyone's feedback:

Dear Shady

We have never tested the SG 75 with the Phil Wood BB.
So, we cannot make a comment on this.

However, the torque is specified by NJS
in order to install it securely and to make a proper chainline.

As we told you, we recommend to do maintenance periodically and retighten it often.

Yuki Iwai
SUGINO CYCLE INDUSTRIES, LTD.
iwai@suginoltd.co.jp
TEL. +81-(0)742-62-5311
FAX.+81-(0)742-62-5320
287-1 Tohkujo-cho, Nara, Japan 630-8144

----- Original Message -----
From: Shady F. Hakim
To: Yuki Iwai
Cc: suginoltd@pop16.odn.ne.jp
Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2008 9:33 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: FW:Crank Bolt Torque for Sugino 75

Dear Yuki,

Thank you very much for your reply. I am surprised because this sounds like a VERY LOW torque number. Most of the estimates for other manufacturers are 32+ N.m. Why is this so low?

I was using this with SG75 NJS bottom bracket, but am switching to Phil Wood ISO taper BB. Also, this is for street use, not track. Does this make a difference in torque specifications?

Could you please doublecheck the torque number under these conditions? Again, thank you very much for your reply.

Best,

[giordana93]

use one of these:
ultimate torque wrench guaranteed (http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tork-grip.html)

no lube on the tapers

the lore, not stated above, for this is that cranks are made of soft aluminum, spindles of harder steel, and by lubing them you simply facilitated the spindle going too far into the crank, and after a few cycles of this the crank would essentially bottom out on the taper and impossible to keep tight and free from squeaks. don't know why there's no galling like the interface of frame and seatpost, but in 30 years I've never had a problem of a stuck crank on a spindle. guess it could happen, though.

[dookie]

from the same source as the wrench mentioned previously. seems to say grease is good. (http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/installing-cranks.html)

[xjoex]

On BBs with square tapers, I grease only the threads of the bolts and not the squared part of the bb spindle.

-Joe

[zap]

Zap, what do you use to "oil" the spindle, as opposed to grease?



I use whatever is on the "bike" table. It took me years to go through a small bottle of Finish Line oil so I probably used that more than anything else. Just use a small dab to lightly wet the flat surfaces.

Contact Phil Wood has they probably have more experience with various cranks than anyone.