Front Derailleur Tab & Compact Cranks

[Bauch]

I was looking at the attached pic of a De Rosa Neo Primato, and it sure looks like it is equipped with a compact crankset. Does anyone else out there have a similar setup, i.e., a frame with a front derailleur tab and compact cranks?

What size opening is required on the tab in order to make this work? Are any further modifications needed?

Thanks!

[e-RICHIE]

that's an industry nightmare atmo.

afaik, the proper placement of the ft der braze-on is
outer ring dependent. adding a compact on a frame
made for a 53 will look like that there picmo.

[MilanoTom]

A thin round file (for sharpening chain saws) can be used to lengthen the tab opening to get the front derailleur low enough for a 50t outer ring. It's sure not an ideal solution, but it works.

Tom

[e-RICHIE]

It's sure not an ideal solution, but it works.

Tom
agreed -
atmo that shouldn't be a solution on
the types of bicycles we all talk aboutmo.

[Bauch]

...it sounds like a clamp is the way to go if there is any chance of using a compact crank.

[J.Greene]

A thin round file (for sharpening chain saws) can be used to lengthen the tab opening to get the front derailleur low enough for a 50t outer ring. It's sure not an ideal solution, but it works.

Tom

I've tapped another hole in the der also. Worked well. Still not perfect, but I didn't mess with the frame.

JG

[Grant McLean]

It surprises me that it's an issue.

The bike DeRosa bike in your photo does look like it's a compact!

I can't say that i've personally set up the steel frame/braze on combo
with a compact derailleur, but our shop sells lots of bikes with front der
braze ons, (like almost every carbon frame on the market) and it's no
problem adjusting the derailleur to a 50T outer.

The b/o is usually attached to the frame so the 53T is very close to the top
of the adjustment range. Dropping it a few mm's for a 50T is well within
the range of the slot.

no?????

-g

[J.Greene]

It surprises me that it's an issue.


no?????

-g

My wife rides a Madone with a 48 outer. I had to tap a new hole to get the shifting I wanted with the Ultegra der.

JG
I can't believe I just admitted we own a trek with a 48 tooth c-ring and shimano.

[cpg]

I don't get the original question. It looks like the crank is a compact and the front der is on the lower half of the slot. That would mean with a 53 tooth large ring the front der would be in the upper half of the slot. What's the problem?

Curt

[Grant McLean]

I can't believe I just admitted we own a trek with a 48 tooth c-ring and shimano.

your "wife's" bike.... eh??

48T is likely too far

-g

[J.Greene]

your "wife's" bike.... eh??

48T is likely too far

-g

I've ridden shimano (once) but never a trek. When i built her bike up I didn't even test ride it.

btw, I know a bunch of juniors who run a 45 outer to meet gearing restrictions.

JG

[MilanoTom]

agreed -
atmo that shouldn't be a solution on
the types of bicycles we all talk aboutmo.

Agreed. On the "Verge" Sachs, which I understand to be from within the last five years or so, the derailleur dropped close enough to work with a 50t outer ring (it's maybe a millimeter or so higher than ideal). Similarly, I had no problem positioning the front derailleur on my 2005 Pegoretti Palosanto.

I've had older frames, however, for which it was more of an issue. My Grandis Overmax was made in the late 1990s, before anybody had thought of using compacts. I set it up with an FSA compact crankset (this was just before Campagnolo introduced their CT components, and nobody had introduced compact front derailleurs) and the front derailleur sat way too high. When the frameset was brazed, nobody had to consider the range of chainring sizes we have available now.

Tom

[handsomerob]

OT... but that De Rosa pictured is an absolute beauty.

[J.Greene]

When the frameset was brazed, nobody had to consider the range of chainring sizes we have available now.

Tom

Kind of ironic because the number of chainring sizes readily available is kinda small compared to then.

I remember the first Campagnolo catalog with C-Record. One of the pictures in the catalog had every size chainring available in one tooth increments between 39 and 55 IIRC.

everything has fewer sku's as compared to then.
JG

[Grant McLean]

OT... but that De Rosa pictured is an absolute beauty.


:)

[MilanoTom]

Kind of ironic because the number of chainring sizes readily available is kinda small compared to then.

I remember the first Campagnolo catalog with C-Record. One of the pictures in the catalog had every size chainring available in one tooth increments between 39 and 55 IIRC.

everything has fewer sku's as compared to then.
JG

Right, but as e-Ritchie pointed out, placement is based on the outer ring. That's what I meant in reference to the range available. I doubt that Campagnolo's intent was to suggest the use of a 40t chainring in the outer position.

Tom

[J.Greene]

Right, but as e-Ritchie pointed out, placement is based on the outer ring. That's what I meant in reference to the range available. I doubt that Campagnolo's intent was to suggest the use of a 40t chainring in the outer position.
Tom


We agree. I don't think Campy ever had any intent of the opposite either. They had a lot more sku's to suit any need.

Race bikes were set up in a very narrow range as they are now. I think the whole compact thing got going as the boomers got back into cycling with 30-40 more lbs than they had when they first rode, not to mention the people who are new to the sport. To racers this thread does not register.

JG

[handsomerob]

:)

dang it Grant... you tend to hold a pitchfork more often than a halo, don't you.

classic geometry and construction, sky blue, white tape and saddle, Aliante, Campy, Zondas... what is not to love about that bike?

[e-RICHIE]

It surprises me that it's an issue.


-g
it's an issue only if your sensibilities are offended by having the body
of the front der hanging off the bottom of the braze on partmo atmo.
consider this written in rich text.

[Grant McLean]

it's an issue only if your sensibilities are offended by having the body
of the front der hanging off the bottom of the braze on partmo atmo.
consider this written in rich text.

I'm more offended by senseless band-on clamps that hold a braze on derailleur
or 31.8 clamp-on derailleurs when shimmed down to 28.6 seat tubes...

Next to those, a drooping compact mount is ... perfect, in an imperfect world...


:)

-g

[MilanoTom]

it's an issue only if your sensibilities are offended by having the body
of the front der hanging off the bottom of the braze on partmo atmo.
consider this written in rich text.

Shoot, if I can get it bolted on so that the cage is at the right height and angle, I'm fine. It's not like I can see it while I'm riding.

I agree with Grant, though. The clamp-on adaptors and shimmed clamp-ons look like crap. What's the world coming to when Campagnolo has shimmed clamp-ons? Campaghetto.

Tom

[e-RICHIE]

I'm more offended by senseless band-on clamps that hold a braze on derailleur
or 31.8 clamp-on derailleurs when shimmed down to 28.6 seat tubes...
me toomo me toomo.
add to that a one size fits most menality that the industry
seems to take, and you have a recipe for indifference.

howard fukingc beale where are you atmo?



Next to those, a drooping compact mount is ... perfect, in an imperfect world...
sound like a sequel atmo.
What's the world coming to when Campagnolo has shimmed clamp-ons?

Tom

there are campagnolo shimmed on clampsmo?
news to me.

[MilanoTom]

Last summer, a buddy of mine was trying to get a new (Centaur, I think) Campagnolo clamp-on front for some skinny tube bike he had. All he could get was something with a crappy plastic shim inside the metal clampmo.

Tom

[e-RICHIE]

Last summer, a buddy of mine was trying to get a new (Centaur, I think) Campagnolo clamp-on front for some skinny tube bike he had. All he could get was something with a crappy plastic shim inside the metal clampmo.

Tom
he should have bought the original campagnolo 28.6 clamp on
body from me atmo. i have the north american supply, straight
from vicenzamo.


michael, we're bigger than u.s. steel.

[Kervin]

I went from a record alloy 53/39 with a bz '01 dbl front der to a compact 50/34 with a bz '07 compact ft on an older Coppi frame. It didn't need any filing.

[MilanoTom]

he should have bought the original campagnolo 28.6 clamp on
body from me atmo. i have the north american supply, straight
from vicenzamo.


michael, we're bigger than u.s. steel.

It was sealed in a boxmo - it must have come from their "For The Great Unwashed" supply.

If I make it to Chester sometime, I'll bring one back for him as a souvenirmo.

Tom

[victoryfactory]

I can tell you from personal experience that (at least on Shimano)
you can run the FD cage a lot higher off the chain ring with no shifting
problems than you might think.

Probably not optimum, and certainly not cool looking
or race recommended but I recently put
the compact on my Atlanta and forgot to lower the FD.

Rode for three weeks before I noticed it, no shifting or rubbing problems
so I left it as is, I'll be putting the regular cranks back on in a couple
of weeks anyway.

VF, lazy slob shifter

[e-RICHIE]

It was sealed in a boxmo - it must have come from their "For The Great Unwashed" supply.

If I make it to Chester sometime, I'll bring one back for him as a souvenirmo.

Tom
awesome -
this buds :beer: for youmo atmo.

[Grant McLean]

he should have bought the original campagnolo 28.6 clamp on
body from me atmo. i have the north american supply, straight
from vicenzamo.



not kiddingmo

-g

[handsomerob]

not kiddingmo

-g

no wonder I can never find one in stock anywhere. As a fan of Waterfords, my old Serotta Club Special, my old Surly Cross Check, my old Schwinn Tempo, my old Bianchi RD... I really have no idea why Campagnolo considers 28.6mm clamps unnecessary to stock. More of the bikes I have owned required 28.6mm clamp than anything else.

damned skinny tube haters. They are probably just mad that a logo with 3" lettering won't fit on a Columbus SLX tube.

[Grant McLean]

I really have no idea why Campagnolo considers 28.6mm clamps unnecessary to stock. More of the bikes I have owned required 28.6mm clamp than anything else.

damned skinny tube haters. .

...then they went against the family,
and created this one with the rivet, so you can't
even swap the cage! Leave the derailleur, take the canoli !

idiots!

-g

[MilanoTom]

awesome -
this buds :beer: for youmo atmo.

Put one aside for me in case Grant tries to buy them all. I've got April 21 off for Patriots' Day (one good thing about working in Boston). It might be a good opportunity to make the pilgrimage.

Tom

[e-RICHIE]

...then they went against the family,
and created this one with the rivet, so you can't
even swap the cage! Leave the derailleur, take the canoli !

idiots!

-g
they will return the favor in 09.
i went howard beale on them atmo.

Johnny Ola: Hyman Roth always makes money for his partners.
One by one, our old friends are gone. Death, natural or not, prison,
deported. Hyman Roth is the only one left, because he always made
money for his partners.

[Grant McLean]

Put one aside for me in case Grant tries to buy them all.


you're all clear.

I have my own stash,
and I don't mean handlebar moustashe...


-g

[handsomerob]

...then they went against the family,
and created this one with the rivet, so you can't
even swap the cage! Leave the derailleur, take the canoli !

idiots!

-g

I didn't even know they have now gone with a rivet... :crap:

I thought it was bad enough that their "lower" level FD's had the C ring thing and "upper" level had the bolt so you couldn't switch clamps/braze-ons between the "tiers".

No wonder "some" people have made the leap. Does SRAM offer 28.6mm clamp FD's? :rolleyes: