Lemond rode a Serotta to victory in Chambery?

[sw3759]

well according to the most recent issue of RIDE magazine that has a review
of the HSG carbon and a caption for one the photos read

"Greg LeMond used frames built by Serotta during his career and the company
still relishes the chance to use the rainbow colours to hint at it's link
with the Armericans victory in Chambery in 1989.Serotta made many frames
that were badged as another brand.As it grew,however,Serotta became a respected marque in it's own right"

so would that actually make LeMonds bike a Serotta,rebadged as a TVT,rebadged as a Lemond??
i had to chuckle when i read that...good photos and review of the HSG though.history facts
a little off though.



Scott

[merckx]

it was a calfee, no?

[stevep]

the photos look like a tvt to me... but im looking at ones from the tour not the worlds.

[saab2000]

Tvt

[Z3c]

Well, if it were a Serotta, it would be a Serotta rebadged as a TVT, decaled to be a Bottechia as LeMond was not riding his own brand frames in '89. It was a TVT unless it was a really early Ottrott prototype!

LeMond started riding Calfee's in either 91/2/3 and they were not involved in any of his big victories unfortunately. Didn't stop me from wanting and ultimately getting one though!

Scott

[merckx]

I always understood that Craig Calfee made Lemond's '89 world frame. I'll have to dig through some pics from back than. The Calfees were/are pretty distinctive.

[David Kirk]

I think not.

Dave

[nicrump]

TVT without a doubt.

[znfdl]

Lemond also rode the early Spectrum designed Ti frames.

[William]

No, you've all got it wrong. EvErYoNe knows Lemond rode a re-badged Zanconato. Sheesh!!! :rolleyes:





William ;) :D

[Dr. Doofus]

it was a murray rebadged as a huffy rebadged as a centurion rebadged as a trek rebadged as a serotta rebadged as a calfee rebadged as a tvt rebadged as a lemond

sheesh

you guys don't know nuthin

[SWorks4me]

you guys don't know nuthin


He was Specialized!

[Bill Bove]

I had both his Chambery bike and the TdF TT bike in my hands and between my legs. TVT badged as a LeMond and Cinelli rebadged as a Bottechia that was re-rebadged later on as a Lemond.

[Avispa]

well according to the most recent issue of RIDE magazine that has a review of the HSG carbon and a caption for one the photos read: [QUOTE=sw3759]well according to the most recent issue of RIDE magazine that has a review
of the HSG carbon and a caption for one the photos read

"Greg LeMond used frames built by Serotta during his career... Serotta made many frames that were badged as another brand. As it grew, however, Serotta became a respected marque in it's own right"

Nope.... That's all misinformation from the part of RIDE. Good magazine, I subscribe to it, but I don't think it is cool when the media gets lazy!

Greg used many frames as he was always looking for the best stuff, but he didn't ride a Serotta in the '89 worlds, that's for sure. It is true, however, that many frames that left the Serotta factory where indeed badged as other's company. The one thing is that the Serotta factory, many times shipped frames that it didn't know or was not told where or by whom the frames were going to be ultimately used. That was common practice in the cycling world 'till the late 90's. Not just a Serotta thing...

For further info, check out this thread (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=35198&page=1&pp=15&highlight=Toulon+var+technologies) and this post (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=416164&postcount=19) in particular.

..A..

[gt6267a]

Nope.... That's all misinformation from the part of RIDE. Good magazine, I subscribe to it, but I don't think it is cool when the media gets lazy!

Check out this thread (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=35198&page=1&pp=15&highlight=Toulon+var+technologies) and this post (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=416164&postcount=19) in particular.

..A..


i always wanted those handlebars ....

[sw3759]

Nope.... That's all misinformation from the part of RIDE. Good magazine, I subscribe to it, but I don't think it is cool when the media gets lazy!



i got lazy too.should have done a search i suppose.didn't realize it
had already been covered but thanks for posting the link.sorry but i just received that mag in the mail a week ago.guess it came on slow boat from OZ


Scott

[Avispa]

i always wanted those handlebars ....

Handlebars! You already got some handlebars buddy! :D :D ;)

..A..

[gt6267a]

Handlebars! You already got some handlebars buddy! :D :D ;)

..A..

oh yeah i do and they ROCK! the stem isn't hard on the eyes either. the legend is looking and feeling pretty sweet these days! thank you again!

[Redturbo]

No rebadging would of changed his results. atmo ;)

[Z3c]

I would like to see a picture of the Chambery '89 Worlds bike with a LeMond logo on it; it was badged as a Bottechia.

I bet it was a Della Santa rebadged as a Serotta/TVT/Bottechia!

[LegendRider]

Here comes some thread drift... I remember seeing Lance ride a Serotta-badged Serotta in the TTT at the 1990 (?) Worlds.

[Dr. Doofus]

Here comes some thread drift... I remember seeing Lance ride a Serotta-badged Serotta in the TTT at the 1990 (?) Worlds.

mean coment deleted

[LegendRider]

mean coment deleted

About me or Lance?

[BoulderGeek]

I drank a lot of wine and rode a little in Chambery.

What does that rebadge me as?

[Avispa]

No rebadging would of changed his results. atmo ;)

John Slawta, Mr LandShark used to say:

"It's not the bike, it's the rider.... Unless, it's a LandShark!"

Go Andy Hampsten, Go! :D :D

..A..

[SWorks4me]

I drank a lot of wine and rode a little in Chambery.

What does that rebadge me as?

Frog -atmo

[Dr. Doofus]

About me or Lance?

lance

but i was having a chimeric olsen twin moment

thought better of it

[Alexi]

i always wanted those handlebars ....


I've got a pair NIB at my house, and there is a tale that the Jerks bike shop has a ton of them hidden away...

[Bill Bove]

I would like to see a picture of the Chambery '89 Worlds bike with a LeMond logo on it; it was badged as a Bottechia.

I bet it was a Della Santa rebadged as a Serotta/TVT/Bottechia!

The 89 worlds bike was a TVT badged as a LeMond. I rebadged it when I worked at Ten Speed Drive imports.

[72gmc]

there is a tale that the Jerks bike shop has a ton of them hidden away...

why? Will Scott Drop-ins become currency after global warming causes the collapse of governments and the rise of bicycle cults?

[BdaGhisallo]

LeMond didn't start using the Calfee made/designed CarbonFrames bikes until the '91 season. In 1990 it was still TVT frames for Greg. I don't believe he ever rode a Serotta frame in any guise. His undercover framebuilder of choice was Della Santa, iirc.

[stevep]

he rode merlins with z at some point.
tom kellogg would be a better reference for dates.
i thk they used them for 1/2 a season maybe then went to carbon.

[SWorks4me]

Wasn't there a blend of Coors Light and ADR...wasn't the silver bullet train riding Serottas then?

[sw3759]

I would like to see a picture of the Chambery '89 Worlds bike with a LeMond logo on it; it was badged as a Bottechia.



Z3C,
If you want to see an actual "picture" of the rebadged TVT get ahold the 89' ESPN Worlds coverage DVD or video,the one WCP sells.the only coverage of that race that i know of.it shows Lemond before the race checking some measurements and you can clearly see the Lemond logo on the downtube..


Scott

[zap]

he rode merlins with z at some point.
tom kellogg would be a better reference for dates.
i thk they used them for 1/2 a season maybe then went to carbon.

I just read an old bicycling article (july '92) reviewing Lemond carbon z ride and production ti bike, Indurains pina and Bugno's Bianchi. The carbon was from carbonframes and the ti frame was built by Southeast Associated Machine in TN. Sure looks like a Litespeed.

Article did mention that Merlin could not build to Lemonds spec. like custom brake bridge, horizontal adjustable do and conventional bb.

Who knows, maybe this old bicycling article has some factual errors as well.

[SWorks4me]

enough of this...

I just called Will Geoghegan to get Lemond's cell#. I am just going to ask him myself! atmo

[stevep]

I just read an old bicycling article (july '92) reviewing Lemond carbon z ride and production ti bike, Indurains pina and Bugno's Bianchi. The carbon was from carbonframes and the ti frame was built by Southeast Associated Machine in TN. Sure looks like a Litespeed.

Article did mention that Merlin could not build to Lemonds spec. like custom brake bridge, horizontal adjustable do and conventional bb.

Who knows, maybe this old bicycling article has some factual errors as well.


merlin at the time was hot. ti was the new kid on the block, they were backed up and selling everything they could make. light, strong, etc
in their infinite stupidity they were not willing to comp the z team frames. they forced lemond and the team to purchase product.
this meant that they could not promote or advertise that they had made the frames. it also pissed lemond off so they used them some but rather quickly went to carbon ( i thk calfee w/ his web lugs ). some of the team used them more than others... but nowhere was there even a small merlin decal.

i dont know about the litespeed reference and where that may fit in this...but thats the merlin side of the story.

i have a few other stories about their inability to make a connection with real riders that will come out at some point. they had opportunities that they missed because from the top if the tower they couldnt see the street... and they became a boutique rather than a performance brand.

[SWorks4me]

Z3C,
you can clearly see the Lemond logo on the downtube..


Scott

do you believe everything you read? atmo

[93LegendTG]

FYI: Here is a link to an Ebayer who is selling the poster:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Greg-Lemond-Poster-1989-World-Championships-Chambery_W0QQitemZ320189970263QQihZ011QQcategoryZ3 6141QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

[LegendRider]

The latest ProCycling was had LeMond as the guest editor. I haven't read it yet, but in flipping through it quickly, I saw lots of old photos of him on various rigs. There is at least one good shot of him on his CarbonFrames (Calfee). It's definitely worth checking out.

[e-RICHIE]

Who knows, maybe this old bicycling article has some factual errors as well.
should be a sticky atmo.

[Z3c]

All,

I guess I was thinking of the famous red TT bike that had the Bottechia label on it.. I certainly didn't think the Chambery bike was anything but a Tvt..other than maybe a DelLiteSpeedrota..

I always like the quote that IIRC, was from Andy Hampsten, that the only thing scarier than descending on a Tvt was climbing without one. They say you could see the fork blades bend during braking..

I know for a fact that my Della Santa is from Roland!

Scott

[stevep]

All,

I guess I was thinking of the famous red TT bike that had the Bottechia label on it.. I certainly didn't think the Chambery bike was anything but a Tvt..other than maybe a DelLiteSpeedrota..

I always like the quote that IIRC, was from Andy Hampsten, that the only thing scarier than descending on a Tvt was climbing without one. They say you could see the fork blades bend during braking..

I know for a fact that my Della Santa is from Roland!

Scott

i snagged a kg-96 look when they first came out.
1 ride and i returned it.
" i will kill myself riding this bike"
on a descent it was frightening..the fork wound around unbelieveable...it twisted dramatically.

i know there are 15 guys here who still love the bike... but that was my take. i cannot imagine riding one down in the real mountains.

[Dr. Doofus]

i snagged a kg-96 look when they first came out.
1 ride and i returned it.
" i will kill myself riding this bike"
on a descent it was frightening..the fork wound around unbelieveable...it twisted dramatically.

i know there are 15 guys here who still love the bike... but that was my take. i cannot imagine riding one down in the real mountains.


yo pooch

get me NOS 753 look

those were nice

[stevep]

yo pooch

get me NOS 753 look

those were nice

that was the ride.
had one of those also.
busted in half in a meeting with an idiot in a car.
too bad. i liked that set up.

i sold a lot of those in the day.

[sw3759]

"do you believe everything you read? atmo"


you referring to the fact that i can see the lemond decals in the video.yes i believe that...not sure what it is you think i read that is unbelievable :confused:

[classic1]

Lemonds 89 worlds bike. He raced on a regal, not a rolls as pictured.

Stage race geometry atmo

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc104/classic1_bucket/scan.jpg

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc104/classic1_bucket/scan2.jpg http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc104/classic1_bucket/scan3.jpg

[BdaGhisallo]

I don't think it was a Regal that he was riding in '89. I believe it was some kind of "Coppi" named saddle or Coppi referenced at least. It had a metal rail ringing the rear of the saddle, covered by leather in a few spots.

He did transition to using a Regal in '90 and stayed on it until the San Marco Titanio 200 came out in '92 and he used them for the remainder of his career.

[BdaGhisallo]

I don't think it was a Regal that he was riding in '89. I believe it was some kind of "Coppi" named saddle or Coppi referenced at least. It had a metal rail ringing the rear of the saddle, covered by leather in a few spots.

He did transition to using a Regal in '90 and stayed on it until the San Marco Titanio 200 came out in '92 and he used them for the remainder of his career.

[BdaGhisallo]

I don't think it was a Regal that he was riding in '89. I believe it was some kind of "Coppi" named saddle or Coppi referenced at least, made by Selle Italia. I can recall seing LeMond in an ad for it looking at a picture of it in an art gallery - ads were sophisticated back then. It had a metal rail ringing the rear of the saddle, covered by leather in a few spots. I never saw much of it out in the public consumer realm, mind you.

He did transition to using a Regal in '90 and stayed on it until the San Marco Titanio 200 came out in '92 and he used them for the remainder of his career.

[classic1]

Yeah, I reckon you are three times more correct about that than me. :p

I vaguely remember the Coppi saddles, very 'Regalish' looking with oval or oblong shaped rivets IIRC.

[BigDaddySmooth]

All,

I know for a fact that my Della Santa is from Roland!

Scott

Here, here. Mine too. :banana:

[Tom Kellogg]

OK, here is the deal. At Greg’s request, I designed and Merlin built the Team Z Titanium frames for the ’91 season. The team paid Merlin and me for the work we did, a very unusual turn of events in the pro world. That was 11 months before the first butted titanium frames were made (March of ’92). At the end of the ’91 season, which was not very good for Greg, his company, through his father, approached Merlin in an attempt to find a supplier of titanium frames that could be marketed under the Lemond name. At that time, Merlin was working on what would eventually become the Extralight. Merlin offered Lemond Cycles the exclusive rights to the Extralight for five years but Merlin was turned down because of the price. That was the end of any talks between Lemond Cycles and Merlin. In the end, it worked out beautifully for Merlin since the Extralight became the state of the art for racing frames by mid ’92 and remained there for some years. For at least a year after that Lemond Titanium frames were made by Sandvik.

Merlin sent the raw Team frames to us on April 2nd ’91 and we shipped them over to Paris on the 29th. I painted them to match the then current Lemond Z paint jobs; Red, Yellow, Blue along with what was the current SOA for forks (SR alu). Each frame had the rider’s name painted into the finish near the rear of the top tube and Greg supplied all of the Lemond decals. As part of the deal, Merlin DID get a decal on the frames. They were the Merlin tubing badge applied at the top of the seat tube just below the top tube. Once the frames were in France, the team mechanic used a small Campy decal to cover up the Merlin decals. In some of the photos from that year, you can see a little bit of the Merlin’s wing showing out from under the Campy decal. Campy gave away components, Merlin didn’t. In the end, the relationship between Greg and Merlin was always good. I have always gotten along well with Greg as well. The relationship between Merlin and Lemond Cycles was different though and I suspect that it was simply that money was necessarily involved.

Below is a list of the Serial numbers and the riders associated with each. We built an extra frame for Greg, but I can’t seem to find any records of it. Who knows?

4120 CORNILLET
4121 WILLERTON
4122 BONNET
4123 LEMOND
4125 CASADO
4126 MILLAR
4127 CAPELLE
4128 BOYER
4129 SIMON
4130 BENNINGTON
4131 FOREST
4132 LAMARCHAND
4133 GOUVENOU
4134 LAMMERTS
4135 DUCLOS
4138 ARROYO

[WickedWheels]

OK, here is the deal. At Greg’s request, I designed and Merlin built the Team Z Titanium frames for the ’91 season. The team paid Merlin and me for the work we did, a very unusual turn of events in the pro world. That was 11 months before the first butted titanium frames were made (March of ’92). At the end of the ’91 season, which was not very good for Greg, his company, through his father, approached Merlin in an attempt to find a supplier of titanium frames that could be marketed under the Lemond name. At that time, Merlin was working on what would eventually become the Extralight. Merlin offered Lemond Cycles the exclusive rights to the Extralight for five years but Merlin was turned down because of the price. That was the end of any talks between Lemond Cycles and Merlin. In the end, it worked out beautifully for Merlin since the Extralight became the state of the art for racing frames by mid ’92 and remained there for some years. For at least a year after that Lemond Titanium frames were made by Sandvik.

Merlin sent the raw Team frames to us on April 2nd ’91 and we shipped them over to Paris on the 29th. I painted them to match the then current Lemond Z paint jobs; Red, Yellow, Blue along with what was the current SOA for forks (SR alu). Each frame had the rider’s name painted into the finish near the rear of the top tube and Greg supplied all of the Lemond decals. As part of the deal, Merlin DID get a decal on the frames. They were the Merlin tubing badge applied at the top of the seat tube just below the top tube. Once the frames were in France, the team mechanic used a small Campy decal to cover up the Merlin decals. In some of the photos from that year, you can see a little bit of the Merlin’s wing showing out from under the Campy decal. Campy gave away components, Merlin didn’t. In the end, the relationship between Greg and Merlin was always good. I have always gotten along well with Greg as well. The relationship between Merlin and Lemond Cycles was different though and I suspect that it was simply that money was necessarily involved.

Below is a list of the Serial numbers and the riders associated with each. We built an extra frame for Greg, but I can’t seem to find any records of it. Who knows?

4120 CORNILLET
4121 WILLERTON
4122 BONNET
4123 LEMOND
4125 CASADO
4126 MILLAR
4127 CAPELLE
4128 BOYER
4129 SIMON
4130 BENNINGTON
4131 FOREST
4132 LAMARCHAND
4133 GOUVENOU
4134 LAMMERTS
4135 DUCLOS
4138 ARROYO

That was the best, most informative answer I've ever seen on the Serotta forum. Thanks Tom!

[72gmc]

Great answers, great dog picture. I heart Tom.

[stevep]

from the horses mouth.