Closing of Threads

[Sandy]

I have had several threads closed, or locked, whatever it is officially called. One was on how great I think the forum is, another on King a pit bull I met at a local shelter, and most recently the one on how people pay their bills. I don't really care too much that they were closed, but wonder if closing threads is the best solution to what sometimes occurs within a given thread.

When there are strong emotional feelings on a topic,with very different personal perspectives, sometimes a poster or several posters start to attack a poster on a personal basis and no longer just on a content basis. Sometimes a poster makes disparaging remarks about a specific group of people. A moderator intervenes and closes the thread. This allows the actions of one or a few posters to stop the ongoing discourse and legitimate discussion within the framewirk of the thread.

Perhaps a better solution than simply closing the thread is to let the individual or individuals who are doing the personal attacks and/or disparaging remarks, clearly understand that his or her behavior is not acceptable and must cease immediately. If it does not, then the individual should then receive some type of action which would end the behavior, such as not being allowed to post for a certain time frame.

Why punish those who post with respect for others when only one or few are posting personal attacks or making unreasonable comments?


Sandy

[csm]

i gotta start reading more here....

[Birddog]

I'm not sure nor am I saying any of these apply to your threads, but this top ten is fairly accurate in general.

http://www.seorefugee.com/seoblog/2007/02/16/10-mistakes-that-will-kill-a-forum/

Birddog

[bigbill]

You can't predict the direction of a thread. There are so many people out there just waiting to be offended or have a favorite argument that they can apply to someones reply. Personal attacks are always wrong. It is the internet, it takes quite the man (figuratively) to slam someone about their opinion when they can just log off and not have to answer the rebuttal.

[e-RICHIE]

I'm not sure nor am I saying any of these apply to your threads, but this top ten is fairly accurate in general.

http://www.seorefugee.com/seoblog/2007/02/16/10-mistakes-that-will-kill-a-forum/

Birddog
2. Cliques -
no cliques atmo?

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . that would seem to me to be a better way to handle it. I don't think you're being too sensitive about it. It does get tiring . . .

But I'm not sure that it's technically possible. I believe it's possible to block a member from posting from a particular IP address, but that doesn't stop the person from just going to a different computer with a different IP address and posting under a newly established forum account if they really want to.

But that's what a textbook "troll" would do, and the personal attacks I have seen lately don't come from people who I would consider "trolls", i.e., people who are deliberately trying to stir up trouble or otherwise vandalize the forum.

Rather, they come from established forum members who have simply let their tempers get the better of them for a short time. I think that's different and doesn't necessarily merit banishment. Nevertheless, I agree with you--there seem to have been quite a few more threads devolving in this direction lately. It's a slippery slope, particularly when the subject veers towards, politics, as so many seem to have done lately. Will this trend get worse over the next year as we edge ever-closer to an election? Gosh, I hope not! . . .

Perhaps Pete could try a variation of what you suggest--just have a standard "warning" message to let people know to cool it, and see if that works.

That's why being a moderator is such a thankless job and I appreciate Pete doing it--lots of vigilance required, lots of chances to get people exercised at you, and not much reward.

BBD

[Len J]

. . . that would seem to me to be a better way to handle it. I don't think you're being too sensitive about it. It does get tiring . . .

But I'm not sure that it's technically possible. I believe it's possible to block a member from posting from a particular IP address, but that doesn't stop the person from just going to a different computer with a different IP address and posting under a newly established forum account if they really want to.

But that's what a textbook "troll" would do, and the personal attacks I have seen lately don't come from people who I would consider "trolls", i.e., people who are deliberately trying to stir up trouble or otherwise vandalize the forum.

Rather, they come from established forum members who have simply let their tempers get the better of them for a short time. I think that's different and doesn't necessarily merit banishment. Nevertheless, I agree with you--there seem to have been quite a few more threads devolving in this direction lately. It's a slippery slope, particularly when the subject veers towards, politics, as so many seem to have done lately. Will this trend get worse over the next year as we edge ever-closer to an election? Gosh, I hope not! . . .

Perhaps Pete could try a variation of what you suggest--just have a standard "warning" message to let people know to cool it, and see if that works.

That's why being a moderator is such a thankless job and I appreciate Pete doing it--lots of vigilance required, lots of chances to get people exercised at you, and not much reward.

BBD


Other forums do it successfully.

You have a set of forum posting standards which include, no personal attacks.

Enforce it.

1.) Warn and delete the offending post.
2.) Second incident = 48 hour ban
3.) Third offense = 1 week ban
4.) 4th offense = permanent ban.

Use IP addresses and tone of the posts. Very few people are clever enough to hide their real persona under another handle. New poster doing the same thing is pretty obvious.

Problem is that it takes time and attention and consistancy. Something that Serotta has so far been unwilling to invest.

It can be done. But it has to be done correctly, or more damage will be done.

In the clossed threads there were only a few that got personal and insulting....why not just delete those posts? The rest of the discussions were actually pretty informative.

IMO

Len

[DarrenCT]

we are all adults here (sorta).

let the threads run (unless they are xrated)

actually keep those too

[Kahuna]

+1.

But then, what do I know?

-K

we are all adults here (sorta).

let the threads run (unless they are xrated)

actually keep those too

[Sandy]

Very interesting remarks thus far.

I post on thre forums- the Serotta Forum (very active), a car forum- Cayman Club, and a Yahoo message board forum for one particular company. The decorum and feel of the forums are completely different. The Yahoo forum (very small) seems to have no control and no moderator input whatsoever. It is a free for all and very highly charged personal attacks the norm. That detracts greatly from the message board. The car forum is very well organized and has numerous moderators who are remarkably aware of what is happening and being said on the forum. There are no, as in none, of the posts made by first time posters that are deleted because of their content. These type posts simply are never allowed to occur. The forum pushes for using the search mechanism so that the number of posts on a single topic does not get out of hand. Posters stay focused on the initial post in a thread, personal attacks almost never occur,a nd threads are never hijacked. that all seems good. problem is that there does not exist the comaraderie and free flow of ides that exists on the Serotta Forum. The Serotta Forum has a feel in between the other two.

Moderators have a thankless and very difficult job. It is a job that needs balance and is very hard to do. No one can please everyone.


Sandy

[DarrenCT]

let's hire a counsel for this forum.

im recommending sandy for vice-pres

legend/stevep = cfo

jerk = customer service president


any other thoughts?

[Sandy]

let's hire a counsel for this forum.

im recommending sandy for vice-pres

legend/stevep = cfo

jerk = customer service president


any other thoughts?

I would have a temper tantrum because I was not the president of the forum, stevep would take all the funds, and the jerk would say it was ok for stevep to do that, as the two off them relaxed somewhere on some beach. :)

VP

[Birddog]

no cliques atmo?

Nope, no cliques. Jeez 10% of the posts are about people trying to get rid of clicks, ticks, squeals, and squeeks. Special lunch tables are OK though.

Birddog

[e-RICHIE]

Nope, no cliques. Jeez 10% of the posts are about people trying to get rid of clicks, ticks, squeals, and squeeks. Special lunch tables are OK though.

Birddog
art mirrors life atmo.

[swoop]

the first rule of fight club.....

[Viper]

art mirrors life atmo.

Life swims in beer atmo.

[swoop]

closing threads=campy
this thread = dura ace
boonen thread= sram
f/d clamp thread = dudes that take fixies on group rides and wonder why they get dropped.

[Sandy]

I'm not sure nor am I saying any of these apply to your threads, but this top ten is fairly accurate in general.

http://www.seorefugee.com/seoblog/2007/02/16/10-mistakes-that-will-kill-a-forum/

Birddog

Great link. Excellent content.


Sandy

[3chordwonder]

Edit - the above link has plenty of more informed reading material about this than my post did.

[RPS]

Great link. Excellent content.


SandyAgreed. I found the content informative.
Also, your suggestion seems good in order to keep the unruly from ultimately having their way.

[Steve Hampsten]

Great link. Excellent content.



+2

And I think Pete's doing a heckuva good job as closing threads keeps the insanity fresh. Which is important this time of year, yes?

Seriously, Pete is right to kill those suckers, imho. Discussion doesn't benefit from getting personal.

[swoop]

thanks pete and james. you both work too hard and we love you.

[Sandy]

thanks pete and james. you both work too hard and we love you.

Moderating is an exceptionally difficult job as it requires a balanced approach. Within the scope of a forum comes a myriad of different perspectives, thinkng, knowledge, personalities, sensitivities, logic, focus,.....To ask a few people to somehow moderte such a collection of people is almost asking too much. I agree- Pete and James work very hard at it, and try very hard to be fair to all. We can't really ask for too much more.


Sandy

[DarrenCT]

+2

And I think Pete's doing a heckuva good job as closing threads keeps the insanity fresh. Which is important this time of year, yes?

Seriously, Pete is right to kill those suckers, imho. Discussion doesn't benefit from getting personal.

you a probably right.

either way its not that big of a f'ing deal...

[stevep]

I would have a temper tantrum because I was not the president of the forum, stevep would take all the funds, and the jerk would say it was ok for stevep to do that, as the two off them relaxed somewhere on some beach. :)

VP

sandy, can you bring 2 beers down. the last ones weren't quite cold enough and the glasses were not icy.
we are over past the cabana on the nude beach side.
thanks,
jerk and stevep

hurry though, the jerk can see the bottom of his glass.

ask roman meal to bring us some tapas but make sure he has the blindfold on like he promised his wife.

[paczki]

I'm sorry this is getting out of hand.
Lock this thread!
:banana:

[BumbleBeeDave]

we are all adults here (sorta).

let the threads run (unless they are xrated)

actually keep those too

As a newbie, why should I post when I have seen others become the subject of nasty, unnecessary personal attacks--and the same could easily happen to me?

As a lurker, why should I contribute any ideas or information when I have seen others become the subject of nasty, unnecessary personal attacks--and the same could easily happen to me?

As a person, why should I invite any kind of discussion or polite debate on any interesting subject when I have seen others become the subject of nasty, unnecessary personal attacks--and the same could easily happen to me?

As a potential Serotta customer, why should I ask for advice, information, or suggestions when I have seen others become the subject of nasty, unnecessary personal attacks--and the same could easily happen to me?

The answer--at least to me--is that these people don't bother . . . they leave. They don't declare "This sucks, I'm leaving." They just disappear. The newbies leave and go somewhere else. The lurkers leave and go somewhere else. The decent people leave and go somewhere else. The potential Serotta customers leave and go somewhere else.

As usual, Len J has a great idea. Just lengthen the penalties a bit. I just hope Serotta goes for it and it's technically possible to do.

BBD

[Kevan]

I didn't do it!

[Avispa]

You can't predict the direction of a thread. There are so many people out there just waiting to be offended or have a favorite argument that they can apply to someones reply. Personal attacks are always wrong. It is the internet, it takes quite the man (figuratively) to slam someone about their opinion when they can just log off and not have to answer the rebuttal.

Word!

I think the Serotta staff or forum moderators should just close or delete all non-bike related threads or not have a forum at all!

I find it difficult to hear from the Serotta staff: "It would be impossible to control or monitor what it is said on the forum..." yet, one day, you find that a thread, no matter how stupid or profound it may be disappears or is locked.

..A..

[Ginger]

I didn't do it!
Well...no...you didn't. That's the problem.

:) (just kidding)

Lock the threads, they'll make more. Everyone who was participating in a thread can start another one with the topic reframed to avoid the nasty parts of the original thread.

And a little note from the moderator to the offending poster that caused the thread to be locked wouldn't hurt...

Thanks Serotta James and Serotta Pete! You guys are great!

[C5 Snowboarder]

When personal attacks and abusive behavior is apparent then close it -- but what gets me physt is when a moderator closes a thread because it is a topic or a direction with which he/she does not agree. :no: :no: :crap:

[SPOKE]

as a community we could do a bit of "policeing" the personal attacks?

[JohnS]

There is one poster, who because of his past posts, draws a negative reaction, no matter what he posts. It's not his fault.
There is another poster who belittles any viewpoint other than his own. That is his fault. I know he can't talk to people that way in person, or he'd always be getting a nose job or new teeth.

[norman neville]

There is one poster, who because of his past posts, draws a negative reaction, no matter what he posts. It's not his fault.
There is another poster who belittles any viewpoint other than his own. That is his fault. I know he can't talk to people that way in person, or he'd always be getting a nose job or new teeth.

don't be so sure...

[JohnS]

don't be so sure...
Why did you take my post personally?

[Acotts]

don't be so sure...

curious....

[alembical]

Sandy,

After the closing of your thread regarding the Pit bull, I had sent an apology PM to the moderator for my role in that thread drift. Sorry, I should have sent one to you too.

Your good thread got swamped by a poor discussion between me and another member on the merits of beating dogs to show them who is the boss. I apologize for my role in that and letting it get to the point where the thread was locked (even after a warning it would be) by the moderators. I am glad that at least it was just locked and not entirely removed, because before I got there the thread had some good information.

Once again, thanks Serotta for hosting this and sorry that you sometimes need to babysit some of us.

Alembical

[norman neville]

Why did you take my post personally?

no, not at all, but you and some other folks tend to speak as if you have a clue when in fact you don't. and when someone points it out, you get all testy and whine about it.

if you're going to spout a backward political opinion or make up numbers or out yourself as a tool in a public forum, you do indeed take the risk of being called on it. it happened yesterday. it's happened before.

really, though, this is a forum about bicycles, so if you and yours would keep your ot opinions to yourselves, then (most, respectful) others would do the same. that way, everybody could smile and grin and have a good time. i'm guilty of not letting some bs (like you're quoted post here) pass, as well as guilty of belittling some nonsensical opinions or ill-intentioned falsehoods, but i try not to start threads that will cause any discomfiture of the less enlightened, especially here as this forum is especially useful for its wide-ranging ON-TOPIC (or nearly on-topic) material.

quadrophenia is a great album; the who a great band. you WERE right about that. kinks too. great songwriters and iconic bands seemed to get kicked up in bunches. not that there aren't always geniuses at work, but in order to reach that iconic status, you need to have been fairly widely heard. hope that doesn't offend the personal enemies of any davies brothers.

[norman neville]

curious....

since when?

[sspielman]

There is one poster, who because of his past posts, draws a negative reaction, no matter what he posts. It's not his fault.
There is another poster who belittles any viewpoint other than his own. That is his fault. I know he can't talk to people that way in person, or he'd always be getting a nose job or new teeth.

Every once in a while things do heat up here... I think that the moderators do a good job of letting things go in the interest of good discussion. Of course, it is a balancing act...As the discussion heats up, some people have a lower tolerance for the intensity of discourse...and check out. To them, the heated discussion just detracts from the signal to noise ratio. Personally, I enjoy discussing topics on which I have a strong opinion with others whose strong opinions are differing....

[Acotts]

[QUOTE=norman neville]no, not at all, but you and some other folks tend to speak as if you have a clue when in fact you don't. and when someone points it out, you get all testy and whine about it.

if you're going to spout a backward political opinion or make up numbers or out yourself as a tool in a public forum, you do indeed take the risk of being called on it. it happened yesterday. it's happened before.

so if you and yours would keep your ot opinions to yourselves, then (most, respectful) others would do the same.

... i'm guilty of not letting some bs (like you're quoted post here) pass, as well as guilty of belittling some nonsensical opinions or ill-intentioned falsehoods]
...wow.

and now we know why threads are closed.

[Fixed]

bro one thing we can agree on a lot of cats gave their lives so we could disagree
cheers

[Tom]

don't be so sure...

Why does Monty Python's argument sketch suddenly start echoing in my head?

I thought Norman was making a funny but I also haven't been following all the exchanges.

[norman neville]

[QUOTE=norman neville]no, not at all, but you and some other folks tend to speak as if you have a clue when in fact you don't. and when someone points it out, you get all testy and whine about it.

if you're going to spout a backward political opinion or make up numbers or out yourself as a tool in a public forum, you do indeed take the risk of being called on it. it happened yesterday. it's happened before.

so if you and yours would keep your ot opinions to yourselves, then (most, respectful) others would do the same.

... i'm guilty of not letting some bs (like you're quoted post here) pass, as well as guilty of belittling some nonsensical opinions or ill-intentioned falsehoods]
...wow.

and now we know why threads are closed.

wow, selective citation! brilliant. now we know how you react when you can't make a valid point.

well, you left off the most important part. treat others with respect and keep your opinions to yourself regarding off topic material. or if you spew garbage, don't cry if you get caught in it.

calling out bs or lies is not the problem. the bs and the lies in the firstplace are the problem.

threads are closed because some thin-skinned folks who like to kick cry when someone dares to kick back.

[Fixed]

Why does Monty Python's argument sketch suddenly start echoing in my head?

I thought Norman was making a funny but I also haven't been following all the exchanges.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y05EmK66Gsk
cheers

[norman neville]

Why does Monty Python's argument sketch suddenly start echoing in my head?

I thought Norman was making a funny but I also haven't been following all the exchanges.

absolutely! yes. a guy who made up some figures yesterday and was wildly mistaken made a blanket statement that was totally pulled out of his butt about how people react to someone else's posts, and i said 'don't be so sure'. seemed pretty harmless at the time, but i should have known...

feel free to stop by for a lemon cookie, tom.

[Pete Serotta]

:no: :no: :no: Please no personal attacks

[Tobias]

threads are closed because some thin-skinned folks who like to kick cry when someone dares to kick back.Maybe, but who normally kicks first?

When discussing objective subject matter, I don't see why it should ever get personal -- although it often does. Matters of numbers and science should be discussed calmly until the problem is resolved.

The problem I see more often is that when discussing subjective matter like whether a red bike looks better than a blue one, a few people who like red bikes call those who like blue bikes idiots for having such stupid taste.

If the forum were conducted in person, I have no doubt people would be more civil. If not, there would be a lot of bloody noses -- IMHO, ATMO, etc...

[Pete Serotta]

:banana: :banana: :banana: Yep well said but then I am an opinion of one wine loving Irishman !!

Maybe, but who normally kicks first?

When discussing objective subject matter, I don't see why it should ever get personal -- although it often does. Matters of numbers and science should be discussed calmly until the problem is resolved.

The problem I see more often is that when discussing subjective matter like whether a red bike looks better than a blue one, a few people who like red bikes call those who like blue bikes idiots for having such stupid taste.

If the forum were conducted in person, I have no doubt people would be more civil. If not, there would be a lot of bloody noses -- IMHO, ATMO, etc...

[Fixed]

a lesson to learn from our attoney friends here they don't enter in on this stuff cheers
imho

[Acotts]

Did you guys ever read the Invisible Man?

It is a story about manners. I think it should be prerequisite reading before being allowed to post in good forums.

[norman neville]

Maybe, but who normally kicks first?

When discussing objective subject matter, I don't see why it should ever get personal -- although it often does. Matters of numbers and science should be discussed calmly until the problem is resolved.

The problem I see more often is that when discussing subjective matter like whether a red bike looks better than a blue one, a few people who like red bikes call those who like blue bikes idiots for having such stupid taste.



point taken.

but who cries?

and not everything is subjective, no matter how much some folks wish that were the case. not every opinion is valid. sorry, but it's true. you need to come by your opinions through hard work and know they may be challenged.

however, my larger point is: keep it relatively on-topic and most of these problems may go away. some posts which seem harmless bring out the worst in people. that may seem harsh, but it has proven itself over and over. bad movies, bad music and swoop's mom are probably okay, but plaintive ponderings brought into the forum may bring discord.

i don't mind a donnybrook, but some folks are rightly uncomfortable since this isn't the proper place, and it does tend to crowd out any other discussion.

[e-RICHIE]

atmo -


http://bp3.blogger.com/_p0XmByB17Is/RlZIv7w0l_I/AAAAAAAAABM/Q7MyUL3Q1KY/s1600/chart.jpg

[Tobias]

There is at least one frequent poster who lashes out at anyone who disagrees with his opinion.
Normally the comments are harsh, arrogant, ridiculing, cynical and/or belittling.
Frankly, I stay out of many discussions because of him and a few like him.
Mostly because I know myself and know I won’t let it slide.
And when confronted, all his little buddies come to the rescue.
For many it’s a lose lose to get involved.

and not everything is subjective, no matter how much some folks wish that were the case. not every opinion is valid. sorry, but it's true. you need to come by your opinions through hard work and know they may be challenged.I’m in full agreement that many things are very objective, although many here want to treat them as subjective because they don’t understand the underlying science. They (or should I say we) frequently draw wrong conclusions from limited information. IMO it's just part of being human.

[Tom]

And I don't like the implications that I do. I'm very sensitive on that subject. You see, it all started with my mom and a lemon....

heh heh.


The reason I haven't been following the exchanges is because the political stuff really gets under my skin, for me it's way too important a subject and since my frustration with things will boil over I know I won't stay civil for very long. It's a function of being able to see the future, which isn't really a gift. So there's a lot of posts and threads around here I just don't read.


So take yer damn cookies and, uh, never mind.

[avalonracing]

It's a function of being able to see the future, which isn't really a gift.

Oh my God, I'm not alone! I thought that I was the only one with "The Gift".

[Tom]

Only problem is I can't see which move to cover.

[swoop]

keeping the interweb safe.

the process is called anonymity and deindividuation... and it get's mixed in with a little group think and response polarization.

its the sort of wine-hangover of the interweb.

and just like alcohol, everyone should know their limits and take a breather anytime the (real) passions are stirred.

the one thing the medium sucks at is tone... and some folks don't do well with tone to begin with in real life. my assumption is that by nature this is an informal tone... and not academic, clinical, or commercial.

if you find yourself thinking about the interweb when not on the interweb,.... its prolly a good time to take a day or two off.

doesn't natter who's right or wrong.. just that there's a forum for ideas to bounce into each other. there is no right or wrong. i think it makes sense to keep near things bike related or that have a meaningful context even if its humorous.

i wouldn't say this is about cliques but its natural for clusters to form and shift.. its fundamnetal to how people communicate and convey context.
the main intervention is that reality prevails.. no one really cares about what gear you roll but you.... and no one needs to get it but you.

and not everyone has the same capacity to read subtext.... but there is this wonderful thing.. you can block dudes you habitually find winding you up.

no matter how much you're here... nothing here should matter. that's the doc's advice. this is all well intentioned throw aways. if you're stirred to feelings... its a cue to shut er down for the day.

atmo.

[norman neville]

And I don't like the implications that I do. I'm very sensitive on that subject. You see, it all started with my mom and a lemon....

heh heh.


The reason I haven't been following the exchanges is because the political stuff really gets under my skin, for me it's way too important a subject and since my frustration with things will boil over I know I won't stay civil for very long. It's a function of being able to see the future, which isn't really a gift. So there's a lot of posts and threads around here I just don't read.


So take yer damn cookies and, uh, never mind.

really.

[Tobias]

doesn't natter who's right or wrong.. just that there's a forum for ideas to bounce into each other. there is no right or wrong.This is exactly what I thought Norman Neville was saying -- many times things are either right or wrong. However, those should be the easiest to resolve. As long as people have the capacity to learn and understand, someone will step up and educate -- as in teach what is right.

[swoop]

This is exactly what I thought Norman Neville was saying -- many times things are either right or wrong. However, those should be the easiest to resolve. As long as people have the capacity to learn and understand, someone will step up and educate -- as in teach what is right.

nothing is ever more wrong than big bottles, helmet mirrors, the new eagles album and socalsteve's texas sized 400 year old saddle on his moots.

other than that.. really what matters (except that you all validate me)? oh also... campy rocks.

trying to bring yall up to my level.

(i'm kidding about steve's saddle).

[Acotts]

[QUOTE=swoop]

oh also... campy rocks.

QUOTE]

Hey! lets keep components out of this!!!! Lest you want the boot!

[ergott]

Sorry if I'm getting all these threads locked, but the fact of the matter is, I'm always right and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong. Got a problem with that?

My 9th grade English teacher had this bumper sticker on his wall.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51MH60DMFML._SS500_.gif

[quaintjh]

point taken.

but who cries?

and not everything is subjective, no matter how much some folks wish that were the case. not every opinion is valid. sorry, but it's true. you need to come by your opinions through hard work and know they may be challenged.

however, my larger point is: keep it relatively on-topic and most of these problems may go away. some posts which seem harmless bring out the worst in people. that may seem harsh, but it has proven itself over and over. bad movies, bad music and swoop's mom are probably okay, but plaintive ponderings brought into the forum may bring discord.

i don't mind a donnybrook, but some folks are rightly uncomfortable since this isn't the proper place, and it does tend to crowd out any other discussion.


Opinons are "blue is best for a bike." What is at issue here are reasoned judgements. As such, if the held judgement is shown to follow from faulty reasoning that process appears to be a personal attack on the person articulating the judgement. It shouldn't be atmrj. To say "your reasoning is flawed" is not equal to "your dog is ugly."

[capybaras]

Some people's dogs are ugly

[stevep]

This is exactly what I thought Norman Neville was saying -- many times things are either right or wrong. However, those should be the easiest to resolve. As long as people have the capacity to learn and understand, someone will step up and educate -- as in teach what is right.

some people argue better than others.

some people listen better than others.

some dont listen at all.

its life.


( sounds like bob dylan 1963, its stevep 2007 )

[Fixed]

bro the samurai bike geek loses face loses everything
cheers :beer:

[e-RICHIE]

some people argue better than others.

some people listen better than others.

some dont listen at all.

its life.


( sounds like bob dylan 1963, its stevep 2007 )
Puccipedia 6.0 atmo

[taz-t]

some people argue better than others.

some people listen better than others.

some dont listen at all.

its life.


( sounds like bob dylan 1963, its stevep 2007 )


is that stevep in the flannel shirt? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F7SxpxgpRg)

[Grant McLean]

There is at least one frequent poster who lashes out at anyone who disagrees with his opinion.
Normally the comments are harsh, arrogant, ridiculing, cynical and/or belittling.
Frankly, I stay out of many discussions because of him and a few like him.
Mostly because I know myself and know I won’t let it slide.
And when confronted, all his little buddies come to the rescue.
For many it’s a lose lose to get involved.


I really dislike this kind of post .
Try speaking your mind during the discussion.
If you can't even say who you're talking about, take it up with them.
Otherwise, nobody here knows what your talking about.
Why dredge up the past? What's wrong with "little buddies"?
You're making it personal, like a great ex wife...

-g

[manet]

my pm box is open

[Sandy]

Some people's dogs are ugly

Some dog's people are uglier!! :)


Handsome Sandy

[Grant McLean]

my pm box is open

mp sent

-g

[Blue Jays]

Can a "non-bicycle" subforum be created with the assorted threads on spouses, boyfriends, girlfriends, beer, vacations, pets, employment issues, politics, religion, and similar stuff categorized there?
It would make perusing the general bicycle forum LOTS easier, IMHO.

http://sbw.sportbikes.com/images/smilies/2cents.gif http://sbw.sportbikes.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

[Steve Hampsten]

[QUOTE=Blue Jays]Can a "non-bicycle" subforum be created with the assorted threads on spouses, boyfriends, girlfriends, beer, vacations, pets, employment issues, politics, religion, and similar stuff categorized there?
It would make perusing the general bicycle forum LOTS easier, IMHO.

you're in it, baby

grab a beer

[Blue Jays]

/\/\ Steve, if you must know tonight's choice, it's a Magic Hat #9!

:beer: :)

[Steve Hampsten]

/\/\ Steve, if you must know tonight's choice, it's a Magic Hat #9!

:beer: :)

kewl

i heart beer

found a '01 tuscan red from donaratico/bolgheri that killed it tonite - may need its own thread

my guys are in for four cases



are there any brewers/vintners/distillers that build their own bikes?

or vice versa

albert?

brent?

i'm seeing a niche that could be filled...

jus' sayin'

[stevep]

is that stevep in the flannel shirt? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F7SxpxgpRg)

i love dylan.
listen to it all day.
the mega best

[Tobias]

You're making it personal, like a great ex wife...What is this, junior high? Name calling? :confused:
I’m flattered that you at least compared me to a “GREAT” ex wife.
Although not having any exes, I'm not sure what to make of it.

[MarleyMon]

"If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody,
come sit next to me."
Alice Roosevelt Longworth

I like the closing of threads, kinda like the "condemned" ratings
that the bishops' council give - practically assures worthwhile viewing.

[swoop]

What is this, junior high? Name calling? :confused:
I’m flattered that you at least compared me to a “GREAT” ex wife.
Although not having any exes, I'm not sure what to make of it.

mp sent.

[Lifelover]

point taken.

..
and not everything is subjective, no matter how much some folks wish that were the case. not every opinion is valid. sorry, but it's true. ...


You do a great job of proving your own point here.

Well done!

[norman neville]

You do a great job of proving your own point here.

Well done!

wow

[Sandy]

Is it possible that this thread that was started about "closing of threads" might succumb to precisely what the thread is about?


With a closed mind,


Sandy

[Dave B]

I like swiss cheese.

Ever taken a bite out of a big block of it.

I love that. Your breath isn't great after, but it tastes great.

I like bikes too.

[csm]

yet this thread still lives....

[onekgguy]

There should be no reason to close threads. At some point people need to learn to walk away. When a thread becomes locked I feel like I did when I was in Jr hs and the teacher quieted the class by having us all put our head on our desks. Are we not all adults?

Kevin g

[swoop]

oy... oy oyoy oy. lets talk bikes.

[DarrenCT]

There should be no reason to close threads. At some point people need to learn to walk away. When a thread becomes locked I feel like I did when I was in Jr hs and the teacher quieted the class by having us all put our head on our desks. Are we not all adults?

Kevin g

ohhh those were the days. or how about when the teacher would bring in the principal??