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saab2000
12-04-2007, 12:56 PM
So last week I had my first real experience in the snow and slop and ice with my 2006 GTI. This one supposedly has the 'All Season' tires. Riiiight....

Even with the all seasons it was hopeless.

My years in Europe taught me that winter tires make a massive difference in winter driving.

I ordered a set today. Hate to drop that money on something which isn't for the bike, but it's the right thing to do.

Who else installs real winter wheels for their car?

William
12-04-2007, 01:04 PM
I just got a set of BFGoodrich 33x10.5x15's ALT's on my vehicle so I should be all set....as long as it's not real icy.




William

Blue Jays
12-04-2007, 01:11 PM
I'm considering installing a set of new Blizzaks on a jalopy that I bought specifically for winter use. It's a junker, so I don't care if someone else slides into it, gets scratched by gravel/sand/salt on the roadway, or appearance.
True snow tires will provide great grip at the expense of some extra noise. Police cars around here run snow tires from around Thanksgiving through springtime.

old_school
12-04-2007, 01:19 PM
Driveway from hell and I need to get out before the plow arrives ...
awd + 4 snows
currently running dunlop winter sport m3

SadieKate
12-04-2007, 01:22 PM
My wunnerful hubby called me last night to tell me he was ordering a set of Michelin Latitude X-Ice for my Trooper. Who needs diamonds and jewelry when you got him? ;)

sg8357
12-04-2007, 01:32 PM
The Penske way to prep your BMW for a Vermont winter.

Steel Rims
Blizzak tires
277lb portland cement, bagged in trunk
Heated garage

Park said BMW in garage, await spring.

djg
12-04-2007, 01:40 PM
I don't -- not in northern Virginia -- but when I lived up north I had to (and did).

benb
12-04-2007, 01:40 PM
Personally I'd be disappointed that the GTI would require dedicated snow tires as a front wheel drive car...

I'd suspect you just have a poor set of All season tires.. (What are they?)

I didn't drive the GTI as it hadn't been released yet IIRC but I drove the front wheel drive A3 before buying my Acura RSX Type S... my car did OK in the snow with the stock all season tires and is now quite good with the better all season tires I got this winter..

These cars to me just shouldn't require 2 sets of rims/tires to get by.. they aren't nearly fast enough/sporty enough IMO to justify that kind of expense..

If you're totally hard up and have a brand new set of all seasons which work OK in other parts of the year but are totally unworkable in the winter I guess it makes a lot of sense to get a second set of rims + dedicated snow tires.. if you could sell your existing tires and switch to a better all-season that could cost less though..

The tires I just got were the Goodyear F1 All Season.. they are fantastic in every type of weather so far. Grippier then stock in the dry, 100% better in the rain, probably 50% better in the snow at least. Short of a blizzard at a ski area up in the mountains I'm not worried at all.

Ti Designs
12-04-2007, 01:42 PM
Steel Rims
Blizzak tires
277lb portland cement, bagged in trunk...


What's with this idea of adding weight to the car for winter driving? I know of a lot of people who put sand bags in the trunk - like the average driver can handle oversteer? The ice racing guys are looking for the lightest cars, knowing that more weight is harder to get around a turn. The hot setup in ice racing (if the term "hot" can be applied to ice racing) is the Chevy Sprint (rebadged Suzuki Swift GTI) with the 1 liter turbo motor and 185/60-14 Blizzak WS-50's. At 1700 pounds it'll outrun a WRX on ice.

J.Greene
12-04-2007, 01:46 PM
Who else installs real winter wheels for their car?

Not me, but I am looking for a new swinsuit. It's resort season atmo.

JG

pjm
12-04-2007, 01:52 PM
All-season radials vs. a good winter weather tire like a Nokian?
Night and day. On a GTI or any other front driver.

Put'em on all 4 corners.

rwsaunders
12-04-2007, 01:54 PM
Just put 4 new Blizzak's on my wife's Honda van. I've used them for 8 years and they work very well here in the snow and ice.

www.tirerack.com

ThasFACE
12-04-2007, 01:57 PM
Another vote for blizzaks. I had a set for winter driving while I was at school in Ann Arbor and was pretty pleased.

maunahaole
12-04-2007, 01:59 PM
The snow is Western Michigan is especially slick because it has a high water content. Something about that lake nearby, I guess... ;)

When I lived in California, I had snows on my Saab one winter. It made a HUGE difference in traction - I could drive it through deep snow and feel a lot of grip, where it just would have spun the wheels with regular tires.

Ti Designs
12-04-2007, 02:02 PM
These cars to me just shouldn't require 2 sets of rims/tires to get by.. they aren't nearly fast enough/sporty enough IMO to justify that kind of expense..

That expense is your only contact with the road... As for the not fast enough or sporty enough, showroom stock Neons lap NHI faster than most 911's on lapping days...

saab2000
12-04-2007, 02:05 PM
Personally I'd be disappointed that the GTI would require dedicated snow tires as a front wheel drive car...

I'd suspect you just have a poor set of All season tires.. (What are they?)


I am a realist when it comes to so-called all-season tires. They are a compromise and provide less than adequate grip both summer and winter.

In Europe (or at least in Switzerland) it is completely normal to run winter tires in winter and summer tires in summer. Driving conditions are vastly different.

I am not disappointed in the front-wheel drive characteristics. It is a sports car that happens to be front-wheel drive and is hardly optimal in the snow. The winter tires should help immensely.

Getting steel rims and Bridgestone Blizzaks.

avalonracing
12-04-2007, 02:11 PM
About two years ago I bought a new C-Class Benz in the Sport trim. When I went in to pick up the car my salesman said, "Oh, you'll need to get different tires in the winter. Those are summer, sport tires". Great.
I figured buying a set of winter wheels was cheaper than smashing up my car
so, I bought winter tires mounted on another set of alloys. They work... They repel snow. In other words, we haven't had but one small snowfall since I got them. That thousand dollars was just burning a hole in my pocket anyway. Not. Oh, the tires feel nice an squirmy on dry pavement too so, for a third of the year my Sport Trim car feels ponderous.

rwsaunders
12-04-2007, 02:19 PM
My wife's van is front wheel drive too, but without the Blizzak's it might as well be a 7 passenger toboggan. Make sure that you mount the snow tires on all four wheels, as the tire compound is softer than all-seasons. The grip apparently must be equal for the ABS to work properly.

No snow tires needed on my Audi wagon; that bugger's a tank in the snow. :cool:

saab2000
12-04-2007, 02:26 PM
I got four of them. Standard business.

BTW, Avalon, you won't be sorry for the winter tires after a few trips in the slush with them. No joke. The ABS and stability and all that work WAY better with winter wheels.


I don't like spending the $700 either, but I think it is worth the money.

The other day I was trying to start from a stop at a red like the car seriously had a hard time even getting up the crowning of the road. With winter wheels it'll be a non-event.

For the most part there are two kinds of people. Those who don't think they need them and don't get them. And those who ponied up the money and wonder how they got along without them all those years. That's my thought from when I started driving in Europe 20+ years ago.

ti_boi
12-04-2007, 02:29 PM
So last week I had my first real experience in the snow and slop and ice with my 2006 GTI. This one supposedly has the 'All Season' tires. Riiiight....

Even with the all seasons it was hopeless.

My years in Europe taught me that winter tires make a massive difference in winter driving.

I ordered a set today. Hate to drop that money on something which isn't for the bike, but it's the right thing to do.

Who else installs real winter wheels for their car?

My winter shoes are VIKINGS made in Sweden and speed rated...an awesome tire....meaty....gets me through it in the Bimmer.....AWD is one thing, but tires make a huge difference.

benb
12-04-2007, 02:32 PM
That expense is your only contact with the road... As for the not fast enough or sporty enough, showroom stock Neons lap NHI faster than most 911's on lapping days...

There are two things here..

1) Define expectations. No GTI with any tires is going to tow other cars out of snowbanks or drive down roads with 1 foot of unplowed snow.

2) I've been to NH International (if that's what you're talking about) many times. Saying a stock neon can beat a 911 is meaningless. That's completely the driver. It also happens to be one of the most technical race tracks in the country. Spending $1500 on an extra set of rims & tires for a $100,000 sports cars is a different thing then spending that same money on a $20,000 car.

If you've got a Mustang, M3, RWD sedan, RWD pickup, etc.. and you have to get through the snow and the stock tires are summer tires.. yah.. you have to get snow tires. And I've done that in the past.

But front wheel drive cars with realistic expectations... (6" or less of snow? Salted roads? Drive intelligently? Don't speed in the snow?) You shouldn't need to spent $800 on snow tires.

I've had Blizzaks. I had them on the Mustang I used to own. They made the car go from useless to somewhat manageable. But I have yet to drive a front wheel drive car with all seasons that couldn't run rings around that car with Blizzaks.

The GTI (or my car) will still be stopped dead as soon as the snow exceeds the ride height of the car by a non trivial amount. Under that limit good all seasons should be good enough to get you through with no worries, even if you like to hit the ski areas, etc..

If there is something else about the GTI that is making it bad like crazy drive by wire throttle response that makes it hard to get going in the snow that's a shame.

Mostly all I'm getting at here is don't judge all tires of a certain category by your experience with one model of that type of tire years ago, or think an experience with one car will be exactly the same as the same tire on a different car. You can get a lot of information just by going and reading tire racks reviews, etc.. an all season that gets a "8" rating in the snow is not going to perform the same as one that gets a "3" rating in the snow. And on some cars that "8" all season is going to be awfully close to the "9" or "10" a snow tire gets.

roman meal
12-04-2007, 02:37 PM
The Penske way to prep your BMW for a Vermont winter.

Steel Rims
Blizzak tires
277lb portland cement, bagged in trunk
Heated garage

Park said BMW in garage, await spring.


I do the same thing w/ the steel rims and Blizzaks, but no cement and heat in the garage in New Hampshire. There's so much hot air up here this time of year, the roads are pretty clear.

I'm Roman Meal, and I approved this message.

saab2000
12-04-2007, 02:40 PM
But front wheel drive cars with realistic expectations... (6" or less of snow? Salted roads? Drive intelligently? Don't speed in the snow?) You shouldn't need to spent $800 on snow tires.




I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. The GTI runs in the cruddy weather. It'll run a lot better with winter tires. The folks I know who drive performance oriented cars would hold the same opinion.

A bit like running Veloflex Criteriums for a sloppy cross race, don't you think?

benb
12-04-2007, 02:46 PM
I don't know that we're even disagreeing.. people drive very differently. You may have expectations of driving much faster or getting through much deeper snow.

And we're talking about different cars.. do you have DSG? Do you have non-defeatable traction control?

staggerwing
12-04-2007, 02:49 PM
I've been running summer and winter specific tires ever since I bought a Honda CRXsi, back in 1990. The stock Yokohamas on that thing wouldn't even let me get up a moderately sloping street in 1/2" of wet snow.

It was the same way with the mighty 225/50-15 steamrollers on a 94 Passat we had. Pirelli winter 190s in a slightly narrower, and higher aspect ratio, 195/60-15, worked liked a hot knife through butter. With the manual transmission, those tires, and a little patience, I could go anywhere with that tank.

And, when I bought a 2005 Mazda 3, the only additional item I added was a set of Dunlop winters from TireRack. I forget the actual width, although I did go from a 50 series 17" performance tire, to a 60 series 16" winter tire; while keeping the overall diameter the same.

When you get down to it, the only real additional cost is rims. It really doesn't make much difference if you wear out 3 sets of all season, or 2 sets of performance + 1 set of winters. From that perspective, they are cheaper than my collision deductible. Not to mention, a significant accident is one of those events that keeps on "taking," as in higher rates, and difficulty obtaining decent coverage.

TMB
12-04-2007, 02:49 PM
I install 4 snow tires on each car.

They go on in mid-october ( in case we have to deal with any of the mountain passes) and stay on till March.

I am currently using on of the Semperit tires on two of our cars. I like them.

All Season tires are the worst of all worlds in my opinion. For winter, I cannot get out of my driveway with all seasons. With winters I can go anywhere.

Our cars are 2 VW Passats and 1 Audi Avant Quattro ( which, with snow tires, is like a tractor)

saab2000
12-04-2007, 02:49 PM
I don't know that we're even disagreeing.. people drive very differently. You may have expectations of driving much faster or getting through much deeper snow.

And we're talking about different cars.. do you have DSG? Do you have non-defeatable traction control?

I do not have DSG. I have the 6-speed manual. And I do have defeatable traction control.

The tests which show dramatically better starting and stopping distances for cars with winter tires (as opposed to summer or even all-season tires) and my own experience demonstrate the efficacy of the winter tires.

Peace.

:beer:

Tom
12-04-2007, 02:56 PM
Anyway, yes. A set of four rims and winter tires.

Attached to a rusted out 73 Chevy Impala.

A winter beater is a winter beater only if you find out at the end of the winter when the thaw happens that the only thing holding the quarter panels on were the ice and salt blocks built up in the wheel wells.

SadieKate
12-04-2007, 02:59 PM
I'm new to this whole topic, but it sure seems to me that there is a big difference between driving in fairly low snow and driving across ice.

chuckred
12-04-2007, 03:01 PM
http://www.nokiantires.com/images/highres/hakka_rsi.jpg Hakkapeliitta RSi - Nokian (http://www.nokiantires.com/en/tire_hakkarsi.aspx)

It worked well with all seasons, but as Saab mentioned, all season tires are at best a compromise and don't work great (passable, but not great) in snow and ice.

I had an old Rabbit when I lived in Park City UT back in the early 80's. With all seasons, it usually got around. With studded tires on the front it got through just about everything - but was pretty exciting when you put the brakes on! When things got really tough, chains made it a tank - until it snowplowed the snow deep enough that it dammed up against the flywheel and stalled it out. I just don't buy Benb's suggestion that a front wheel drive GTi with all seasons would hack it in serious snow country - with the expectation being that you can get moving on a hill, stop on ice within some reasonable distance and make it around corners...

Our old 325 i with studded tires is "OK" in the snow - handles fine, but not always easy to get it moving. The 150 pounds of sand in the trunk makes a big difference.

Ti Designs
12-04-2007, 03:20 PM
But front wheel drive cars with realistic expectations... (6" or less of snow? Salted roads? Drive intelligently? Don't speed in the snow?) You shouldn't need to spent $800 on snow tires.

Ah, my expectations are never realistic.

Bittersweet
12-04-2007, 03:21 PM
What's with this idea of adding weight to the car for winter driving? I know of a lot of people who put sand bags in the trunk - like the average driver can handle oversteer? The ice racing guys are looking for the lightest cars, knowing that more weight is harder to get around a turn. The hot setup in ice racing (if the term "hot" can be applied to ice racing) is the Chevy Sprint (rebadged Suzuki Swift GTI) with the 1 liter turbo motor and 185/60-14 Blizzak WS-50's. At 1700 pounds it'll outrun a WRX on ice.

Ti:

Sand in the trunk must be a north country tradition. I grew up in NH and now live in W. MA. We always did it with rear wheel drive sedans and our pick-up truck. I know you've driven on the track quite a bit so understand vehicle dynamics quite well so I won't bore you with the theories. I think the idea was to change the weight distribution to slightly closer to 50/50 on these vehicles instead of being front heavy. On a practical level it did seem to help weight those rear wheels down into the snow when you needed some bite kinda of like when you get your car stuck and load all your friends in the trunk and hop up and down to get grip. And, the sand comes in handy to spread under the tires when all else fails. That last reason may be why we all did it at first and then it took on two purposes (the weight theory more dubious).

I'm a huge believer in snows and run them on my fwd Mini Cooper S JCW and the family V70R awd wagon. The summer tires provide great performance the rest of the time but are deadly in the snow with their wide, flat, smooth tread pattern. The snows make both cars great until it gets too deep and then it is time to give up and move to a taller vehicle. We blasted out of NYC on Sunday on the Merritt in the Volvo shod with Hakkapeliitas and saw a lot of SUVs spun around in the median and side. A classic case of over-exuberance and poor tread when stopping power and cornering grip is more of a premium than getting up to speed with awd.

FWIW I had a GTI VR6 and it was terrible in the snow. Quite torquey and wide tread made it frightening. Dedicated snows helped a lot.

My best snow car ever I shared with my sister. An '86 Jetta that we ran studded 175 Gislaveds on steelies. It was like driving an ice racer on the roads of NH and VT. I had a super fun drive one day on hard packed snow all the way across the Molly Stark Trail in VT from NY to NH. A really long NHI or LRP with hard snow.

Kervin
12-04-2007, 03:24 PM
I've got a Mercedes C-coupe that I put winter tires on. 400 ft up hill driveway and we are almost the last house on a mile long gravel road. All those electronic gizmos make driving in the snow very un-dramatic.

deechee
12-04-2007, 03:25 PM
I learned winter driving with 4 seasons. I find that there are a lot of people who drive much faster with winter tires (or 4wd/awd) since they can accelerate faster but don't realize that they may not stop as quick. I've gotten stuck in the snow only a handful of times in my lifetime. Nothing beats a shovel, car rocking, and knowing what to do when your car is on ice.

When I had my decent civic, goodyear ultra grips were great. Very little road noise, great for highway drives for which it was used. Unfortunately, two winters is about all it could take without affecting performance.

If I could afford it, I would have three sets of tires. Summers, winters (for light snow and slush) and studded tires for the -15C and freezing rain days. Winter tires are great most of the time but try climbing or descending an ice covered steep hill. Numerous streets in downtown Montreal become jammed because cars can't make it up the hill; winter tires, 4wd be damned. Its hilarious to watch. (These are the days I just walk.) Winter tires are also terrible in the rain. The soft compound doesn't allow proper channeling of the water through the tread. No tire will solve common sense.

ps. I've had plenty of experience pushing my friend's vw golf out of the snow. I gotta say, hatchbacks are a lot easier to push out than sedans. hahaha.

Tom
12-04-2007, 03:28 PM
Take an old Chevy two wheel drive pickup out and see what happens.

(1) You can't go. The rear wheels just spin

(2) You can't turn. The rear end cuts loose at 15mph... with your foot off the gas.

(3) You can stop, though. When the rear end cuts loose the tree, telephone pole or bridge abutment does a fine job of bringing you to a stop.

So you put cement blocks or a bag of sand back there.

You put your jumpers under the seat, your Dri-Gas in the tank, your can of ether in the glove compartment and your pint in your pocket. Now you're ready.

chuckred
12-04-2007, 04:03 PM
For the most part there are two kinds of people. Those who don't think they need them and don't get them. And those who ponied up the money and wonder how they got along without them all those years.


The two kinds I see after a big storm - those who are blocking traffic or in a ditch and those who are driving...

Oirad
12-04-2007, 04:08 PM
My ol' Fat (Chance) fixed is my vehicle of choice in snow and ice and I just installed a pair of Nokian studded tires. Now I can go ice riding!

Oirad

huey
12-04-2007, 04:57 PM
I agree with what everyone else has said, tires make a huge difference.

I live in Phoenix and decided to go up North for a weekend last January. We got caught in a freak snow storm coming home from Heber-Overgaard i.e (N.M. border).The car was sliding all over the road. Sliding backwards while stopping going up a hill, sliding into on coming traffic while countersteering, just generally a miserable experience. I am very fortunate that we made it home unscathed. I have driven in the snow before and consider myself a good driver. My Audi A4 Avant Quattro is equipped with Michelin Pilot Sports 2's, and made driving in the conditions absolutely treacherous. While these tires work great here for all but the most extreme conditions, I realized how much of a difference that winter tires make. I just picked up a set of Dunlop M3's for this winter for the 3-4 trips that I plan take.

Bottom line, don't be stupid and get the right tires.

Blue Jays
12-04-2007, 05:18 PM
The good part is snow tires can be mounted on POS black-painted steel rims typically available in a "package" from a place like TireRack or similar. In fact, that is the preferred technique.
Get the nice rims out of the salt spray and nasty gravel for a few months...

Viper
12-04-2007, 05:42 PM
1). Anyone who says they have "Blizzaks" is using a general term; there are 4-5 different types of Bridgestone Blizzaks and each one suits a specific purpose (hardcore snow, light snow, high performance, etc).

2). If you have a Front Wheel drive car and believe that all-seasons will do the trick, you're only fooling yourself. If you live in areas where snow or ice is fairly frequent, all-seasons won't do the trick. Tires do more than just help forward traction, they are key when the car is turning, rotating and all-seasons are weak.

If you live where snow is frequent, get a set of 'Studless Ice and Snow' tire (like a Blizzak WS-60). Since I do mainly highway driving, higher speed, experience a few snow storms, but avoid the roads when they're not cleared, I used a 'Performance Winter' tire (like a Blizzak LM-25). There are big differences between these two types of tires, even though they are "Winter tires", so don't let a LTS (local tire store) sell you "Winter tires"; be certain about the type of winter tire.

The talk and fact that winter is here is a bummer, atmo, so here is some Bob for you.

My BMW rolls with Goodyear Ultra Grip Performance, these shoes V-rated :) :

Kevan
12-04-2007, 05:52 PM
had then for my Volvo 850 wagon. The dang car could climb a tree with those. Always a pleasure driving with them.

mschol17
12-04-2007, 06:05 PM
As a former Grand Rapids resident, I think driving in snow is a technique more than having the right equipment. Ice is ice, and no tires are going to help you, but slush and snow are completely doable. It's not like you get 3' of snow at once. Almost nobody I know from Michigan drives with snow tires, yet they all seem to be able to get around no problem. I drove a RWD Toyota MR2 year round with few problems.

On the other hand, here in DC I'm looking forward to the impending apocalypse with 1" of snow predicted for tomorrow.

Blue Jays
12-04-2007, 06:09 PM
"...Almost nobody I know from Michigan drives with snow tires..."They would enjoy a more surefooted experience while driving their cars in wintry conditions (regardless of overall skill) with proper snow tires fitted to their vehicles.

Ti Designs
12-04-2007, 06:11 PM
1). Anyone who says they have "Blizzaks" is using a general term; there are 4-5 different types of Bridgestone Blizzaks and each one suits a specific purpose (hardcore snow, light snow, high performance, etc).

You bring up WS-60's as the snow/ice tire for FWD. I'm going to be ice racing this winter (rubber on ice catagory) and I'm thinking WS-50 which uses the same compound without the center channel. Second, I'm trying to decide between 185/60-14 or 175/70-13. The car is either going to be my 88 CRX Si (2200 Lbs) or the dedicated ice racing car, a Chevy Sprint (rebadged Suzuki Swift) with the 1.0L Turbo (1700 Lbs). The Honda doesn't have much body roll and may do better with the narrow tires. The Chevy has a high center of gravity, but not much weight and a whole lot of understeer. Thoughts???

Viper
12-04-2007, 06:20 PM
You bring up WS-60's as the snow/ice tire for FWD. I'm going to be ice racing this winter (rubber on ice catagory) and I'm thinking WS-50 which uses the same compound without the center channel. Second, I'm trying to decide between 185/60-14 or 175/70-13. The car is either going to be my 88 CRX Si (2200 Lbs) or the dedicated ice racing car, a Chevy Sprint (rebadged Suzuki Swift) with the 1.0L Turbo (1700 Lbs). The Honda doesn't have much body roll and may do better with the narrow tires. The Chevy has a high center of gravity, but not much weight and a whole lot of understeer. Thoughts???

The WS-50 is old technology, came out in 1999...it's a decent tire and can be had for a very good price.

I dunno about ice racing, for me that means watching hawt chicas on speed skates in the Olympics.

I would go for the smaller, narrower tire; winter tires (unless they are V rated high performance) have by nature, weak, soft sidewalls. Racing around, I'd want the smaller sidewall and narrower tires are always better for winter.

Ti Designs
12-04-2007, 06:38 PM
I would go for the smaller, narrower tire; winter tires (unless they are V rated high performance) have by nature, weak, soft sidewalls. Racing around, I'd want the smaller sidewall and narrower tires are always better for winter.

The performance tires don't come in a size that fits. In this case the lateral forces on the tires are going to be limited to what can be generated on ice. With the studded tires they could get enough cornering forces to lift the inside rear wheel on the VW's... Given the prices of close-out WS-50's and my old set on 13" wheels I may have to show up with both and figure it out as we go. The WS-50's have been around for a while, but last year in studless ice racing nothing else was even close. I just wish they felt more like tires and less like push brooms.

thwart
12-04-2007, 08:13 PM
Dunlop Graspics... on a Quattro A4. On dedicated steel wheels.

Bulletproof. :banana:

Just have to remember that the Quattro mechanism does not aid in straight line braking.

Having had a few different snows over the years, I really like the Dunlops. Quiet, smooth, and handle pretty well in the dry... and 3rd winter on 'em... very good tread life, they still look new.

SpeedyChix
12-04-2007, 08:44 PM
Given that the stock tires on the R32 are F1s winter rubber was a must. Been running Dunlop Wintersport M3s for the snow season. Love em. Nice performance snow tread. The AWD is kinda helpful though too.

For nice days, it's FMBs on the front. ;)

musgravecycles
12-04-2007, 10:42 PM
Nice! (both the FMB's and R32) How do you like the R32? Any issues with it?

SadieKate
12-04-2007, 11:14 PM
What's everyone's opinions of studless vs studded tires? Around here, the word is that it's not the snow it's the ice that's the problem. Actually, the problem is stopping on ice.

There's the camp that says go with something like the Michelin Latitude X-Ice (supposedly the new compounds for studless are vastly improved) and then there's the camp that believes in studded tires. I've got an Isuzu Trooper and live on the colder, snowier, icier side of town, but I work from home and hubby is retired so we can, for the most part, choose when we drive. We definitely want to do some snowshoeing, driving over to Portland, etc. Studless or studded?

Viper
12-04-2007, 11:22 PM
What's everyone's opinions of studless vs studded tires? Around here, the word is that it's not the snow it's the ice that's the problem. Actually, the problem is stopping on ice.

There's the camp that says go with something like the Michelin Latitude X-Ice (supposedly the new compounds for studless are vastly improved) and then there's the camp that believes in studded tires. I've got an Isuzu Trooper and live on the colder, snowier, icier side of town, but I work from home and hubby is retired so we can, for the most part, choose when we drive. We definitely want to do some snowshoeing, driving over to Portland, etc. Studless or studded?

Metal Studded tires are illegal in most states. Although they are good on ice, they tear up the pavement. Also, rubber/tire technology has come so far, that a set of agressive 'Studless Winter Tires' are good enough to get the job done. Lastly, the 'studs' in the tires can pop out on the highway and turn into a bullet...another reason why they were made illegal.

If you live on an area where you see lots of snow/ice, a new set of 'Studless Ice and Snow Winter' tires are the way to go. atmo.

pdxmech13
12-04-2007, 11:24 PM
All my car drivin friends back east swore up and down about Blizak (spl?) tires on steel rims. They always ordered them from tire rack and had them installed.

pdxmech13
12-04-2007, 11:25 PM
Given that the stock tires on the R32 are F1s winter rubber was a must. Been running Dunlop Wintersport M3s for the snow season. Love em. Nice performance snow tread. The AWD is kinda helpful though too.

For nice days, it's FMBs on the front. ;)

just wrong in so many ways this foto.........

PacNW2Ford
12-04-2007, 11:27 PM
Studded tires are good for ice, bad for roads.

I use Michelin Pilot Alpins on my WRX. Because it is AWD, not all-wheel-stop-or-corner.

Viper
12-04-2007, 11:30 PM
All my car drivin friends back east swore up and down about Blizak (spl?) tires on steel rims. They always ordered them from tire rack and had them installed.

There are at leat 11 different types of 'Blizzak' (a brand of tire made by Bridgestone). atmo:

http://www.bridgestonetire.com/tireselector/SearchByCategory_BS_EN.aspx?Category=Winter

Viper
12-04-2007, 11:33 PM
Studded tires are good for ice, bad for roads.

I use Michelin Pilot Alpins on my WRX. Because it is AWD, not all-wheel-stop-or-corner.

Great tire. It was either Michelin Pilot Alpins, Blizzak LM25 or Goodyear Ultra Grip Performance. I went with the Goodyears, mainly due to the V-rating; they have incredible dry traction on the highway, on/off ramps etc. They'll see their paces through some snow soon enough.

Winter Tires FTW. It costs between $500.00 and $1K dollars ($500.00 if you go with just tires and more if you get 'winter beater rims') but the price is a huge peace of mind during the months of Dec-March in NY.

SpeedyChix
12-05-2007, 07:06 AM
Nice! (both the FMB's and R32) How do you like the R32? Any issues with it?

I love it. Got it in fall of '04 and haven't looked back. It is very much a driver's car. Had to replace one rear shock and the AC funked out once. All covered stuff.

Enjoyed the Integra I'd had for eight years before the R...but this is whole 'nother world of fun.

Life is all about on ramps!

SpeedyChix
12-05-2007, 07:09 AM
just wrong in so many ways this foto.........

Wrong? :)

Was doing the tire change from summer to winter wheels and it was lightly misting. Had also recently mounted the FMBs and was doing the 'garage door shot' Turned around and looked at the car and really like the dots on the FMBs against the 'dots' on the car. The result is the pic. Visual performance?


btw, Tire Rack is awesome to work with, inexpesive wheelset and the M3s.

The Integra had a set of steel wheels and Blizzaks for its winter runs. Figure winter tires cost you some money out the gate, but they are taking the wear off your summer rubber. So the real added cost is initial outlay for the second set of wheels.

link
12-05-2007, 11:21 AM
Livin' at 10K I've tried a lot of different brands...

I stick with Nokian all year.

RSi in the winter
WR the rest of the time

SadieKate
12-05-2007, 11:54 AM
Those of you using studless tires, are any of you using it on a larger car, say a small/mid-size SUV like an Isuzu Trooper? I have no clue what a WRX is. All these acronyms being thrown out there without brand name or whether it is the tire or the car . . . oy. Can you be a little more specific for those of us who aren't car and tire geeks? Thanks.

Yes, I'm reading the tire rack reviews. We'll probably order whatever tires we choose from there, but my realtor who also lives in town is really pushing for studded with the comment that the "highway patrol went back to studded." But I'm not sure that this event occurred with more recent rubber compounds.

SadieKate
12-05-2007, 12:38 PM
Finally, I found an article comparing the two. Not much data on the light truck category but a bit of helpful info.

http://www.consumersearch.com/www/automotive/snow-tires/review.html

ERDR
12-05-2007, 04:15 PM
4 bridgestone blizzaks on my rear wheel drive car. granted, i have traction control, but i feel very confident even in 6 inches of new snow. call the guys at tire rack. they will suggest which model according to where you live and what type car you drive. shipped directly to you or their local affiliate if you don't want to install them yourself. i can't remember the specifics, but i recall being surprised at the cost. mounted on alloy rims (cheap but attractive) and shipped to my house, they were cheaper than ordering the tires alone from a national chain dealer for my previous car. no sales pitch but i was pleased.
s.

PacNW2Ford
12-06-2007, 12:58 AM
Sorry SadieKate, a "WRX" is a Subaru Impreza WRX, an all-wheel-drive compact car made by Subaru. See subaru.com or just look around your 'hood if you live in Bend.