B'stone RB-1--What's It Worth?

[93legendti]

Looking for input re: a Bridgestone RB-1--what's it worth? Thanks.

[gdw]

What year is it?
Does it have all the original components?
What condition is it in?

[Bill Bove]

didn't some guy in conn. build those for B'stone?




































rumor started :p

[stevep]

not much.

[dbrk]

Most folks consider '93 the best vintage but not Grant who thought the design, tubing, etc., was best about '91-'92. If the frame is perfect, I'd be surprised if you got more than $500 for it. I have a NOS RB-2 from '94 (the last year) and it's not worth the shipping or the hassle to sell and, anyway, it's a Bstone. I have a few others, including one with a Joe Bell paint job (I had two like that...) and, well, that's like putting underpants on Opus, beautiful, absurd, excessive, and always worth a laugh and a smile. I love Bridgestones, just love'em but the Toyo-made Rivs are about a million million times better made and compared to a cpg Riv or any of our gifted friends here, well, they are Pintos and Vegas, albeit ones that ride just fine. A good road bike has to pass The RB Test, which simply put is: "Does this bike ride at least as well as an RB-1?" It's a benchmark of the post-531 era, not that I really think that 531 needed improving upon.

dbrk

[93legendti]

Thanks, there's an '88 for $499 on eBay. Seems high compared to my $399 Csi, but who knows?

[dbrk]

Well, imhoatmoetc a five hundred dollar Bstone is a waaaay better bike than a lot of new stuff at three times that cost...but what do I know? Still, it's more than I would pay but a fine ride from the Petersen era of design and spec, and that would be a good thing.

dbrk

[93legendti]

Well, imhoatmoetc a five hundred dollar Bstone is a waaaay better bike than a lot of new stuff at three times that cost...but what do I know? Still, it's more than I would pay but a fine ride from the Petersen era of design and spec, and that would be a good thing.

dbrk

It's an '88, fwiw.

[Ken Robb]

Look at it this way: If you pay $500+/- and it rides like we expect you have a good rider that you can be relaxed about riding anywhere and not to worried about damage or theft. If you don't like the way it rides it's probably because you got the wrong size. Be that as it may it has already depreciated as far as it's going to so you can probably sell it for about what you paid. Even if you take a bit less you'll have had a fun ewxperience and know a bit more about bike design and what you like and don't like. See, cheap entertainment. :beer:

[Fat Robert]

what the market will bear

[Bill Bove]

I once bought a used Colorado Al for 300 bucks and spent another 400 on the repaint before I built it up. Crazy? Not to me. I loved the way that bike rode and wanted it to look the way I wanted it to look. I rode that bike into the ground. Still one of my all time fav's. Worth it? HELL-O YES.

[Ray]

I had a whole bunch of semi-fancy bikes once and bought a '92 RB-1 frameset off of ebay for about $300 and change, IIRC. It was immediately one of my two favorite road bikes and the one I rode the most for the better part of a couple of seasons. Its a pretty quick race bike but is surprisingly stable too. I liked it as much as any bike ever except for the custom Spectrum that caused me to sell it and a bunch of other semi-fancy bikes. So, well worth what you can usually find 'em for. If I still had a full stable of bikes, it'd be in there, but I'm down to just a few that I use a lot and no room or patience for more.

That said, they shouldn't cost much. I think I pretty close to broke even on mine, but I don't really remember. In any case, even if I'd given it away, I'd have done very well on the overall transaction. The prices may go up if they get rare enough, but there are enough of 'em floating around these days to keep it well below $500 for a good one.

-Ray

[Fixed]

Thanks, there's an '88 for $499 on eBay. Seems high compared to my $399 Csi, but who knows?

bro a csi is way better imho unless it;s a track bike
cheers

[mike p]

Sold a RB-1 in average cond. for 275.00 last summer. One of those bikes, if it fits you might as well keep it as you won't get that much for it.

Mike

[Ken Robb]

you guys should check out the iBob forum to see what some KoolAid drinkers have to say about RB1s. :beer:

[scrooge]

Saw one at a garage sale for ten bucks last summer. I have some regrets about not picking it up...

[fiamme red]

I love Bridgestones, just love'em but the Toyo-made Rivs are about a million million times better made and compared to a cpg Riv or any of our gifted friends here, well, they are Pintos and Vegas, albeit ones that ride just fine.In what respect were the Bridgestone RB-1's so poorly made compared to the modern Toyo frames? In any case the Pinto/Vega comparison seems harsh, because both those cars were more prone to failure than the average car (e.g., engine problems, safety problems, premature rust), and I'm not aware that RB-1's are more prone to failure than a Toyo or Goodrich-built Rivendell.

I have a friend who rides a lot (about 8,000-10,000 miles a year) and who has owned both a 1991 Bridgestone RB-1 and a custom-made Rivendell. He preferred the ride of the RB-1, because it handled more like a racing bike, and ended up selling the Rivendell.

Over the years, Grant Petersen's philosophy of designing bikes has changed. RB-1's were designed in the spirit of a classic Italian stage race bike. Of all the production Rivendell line, the one most similar to the RB-1 is the Rambouillet, but the Rambouillet is actually closer in geometry to a touring bike.

[Ray]

In what respect were the Bridgestone RB-1's so poorly made compared to the modern Toyo frames? In any case the Pinto/Vega comparison seems harsh, because both those cars were prone to failure than the average car (e.g., engine problems, safety problems, premature rust), and I'm not aware that RB-1's are more prone to failure than a Toyo or Goodrich-built Rivendell.

I have a friend who rides a lot (about 8,000-10,000 miles a year) and who has owned both a 1991 Bridgestone RB-1 and a custom-made Rivendell. He preferred the ride of the RB-1, because it handled more like a racing bike, and ended up selling the Rivendell.

Over the years, Grant Petersen's philosophy of designing bikes has changed. RB-1's were designed in the spirit of a classic Italian stage race bike. Of all the production Rivendell line, the one most similar to the RB-1 is the Rambouillet, but the Rambouillet is actually closer in geometry to a touring bike.
I think Douglas was just referring to the craft, the finish, etc of the new Riv frames. The RB-1 is just sort of crude in comparison, unfinished and plain lugs, etc. But they worked just fine and weren't prone to failure.

And I think you're dead right about the difference in ride and handling between the Riv production bikes and the RB-1. The RB-1 was a race bike, pure and simple. Some of the earliest Riv road frames (and the Heron Road frame) were pretty close to the same geometry, but with somewhat longer stays and lower bb, which changed the feel of the bike. I wouldn't say for the worse, but someone else might, because it was for sure different. I had an early Riv and it was almost geometrically identical to my RB-1 except the stays were about 2cm longer and the bb was 1cm lower. Still very responsive, but notably different ride and handling.

But the current crop of production Rivs are a very different kettle of fish. As you noted, the Rambouillet is the closest thing in the line up to an RB-1 and its not even remotely close. And its been put out to pasture for now anyway. Grant's gone in a completely different direction. Its a great direction for a lot of riders, IMHO, but a potential buyer should understand the difference. He or she is NOT getting an updated and fancier version of an RB-1.

-Ray

[sailorboy]

Last year I paid about 550 for a NOS '93 yellow RB1 frame, fork and Mavic headset. That was on ebay so likely a good representation of what the market will bear. I think 499 might be a bit high for a used one, especially if there are any significant condition issues. Then again, this kind of thing can change wildly from month to month. If two egos get going in a bidding war, who knows.

[dbrk]

Ray's explained it perfectly. If you saw an RB-1 without paint you would see a solid frame brazed as efficiently as necessary to finish the bike. When you see a Toyo-made bike, you see an entirely different level of attention to the craft. Take this up to the level of a current Rivendell made by Goodrich and it's not much of a comparison. My Vega/Pinto was a bit unkind because of the negative connotations. How about the way the door closed on my 1976 American Motors Hornet? Now compare that to the lovely kerthunk on your current Bimmer. That's more the picture I wanted to evoke.

Not many RBs broke, a few did and many, many, many are still riding as great as they did the day they were purchased. So I wasn't really talking about the ride, I was talking about the craft. Bikes don't have to be brilliantly made to hold up well and ride great. Heck, my Hornet was a heck of a car for a tin box! Does it matter how well the bikes are made? To ride well, they just need to be made well enough. So what you like depends what you value and prefer.

dbrk

[GoJavs]

I've owned three rb1s and two rb2s. All solid rides. I still dearly miss my navy blue '93 RB2. The price depends purely on demand. I've seen them go as high as $1k for NOS beauties to $250-300 to frames, beaters or RB2s.

Any which way, they usually end up with good owners.

[dannyg1]

Ray's explained it perfectly. If you saw an RB-1 without paint -snip-...... When you see a Toyo-made bike, you see an entirely different level of attention to the craft.

dbrk

Dbrk,

Bridgestones were made by Toyo from what I've read. Specialized road bikes too.

Danny

BTW: Let me say that your bike collection (from your flicker link) is one of the finest I've seen and I've been out looking. Stunning bike after stunning bike.

[Ken Robb]

[QUOTE=dannyg1]Dbrk,

Bridgestones were made by Toyo from what I've read. Specialized road bikes too.

Danny

nope--Toyo only has about 8 employees.

[93legendti]

For as long as I've been building I've always had what I called the "RB-1 test". Whatever was done with a design it had to pass the RB-1 test. If it wasn't better in some quantifiable way than an RB-1 then why bother.........back to the drawing board.

I felt it was true back then and to a great degree still feel the same way..........that a good athlete only needs an RB-1 to win a road race. If the rider has good legs and an RB-1 then that's all they need. Any more than that is gravy.

Dave

This quote of Dave's has me thinking: an "improved" RB-1 with Terraplane rear...hmmm..

[GoJavs]

As far as I know Bridgestones were made by.....Bridgestone.

[93legendti]

http://cgi.ebay.com:80/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280174562663&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBUAA:US:1123

An RB-1 fork from '93 just went for $177.50, including shipping, on eBay.

[dbrk]

Dbrk,Bridgestones were made by Toyo from what I've read. Specialized road bikes too....snip...Danny.

In fact, Bridgestones were only made by Bridgestone, never by Toyo. Toyo is a six person or so shop, not prepared for anything like the hundreds of bikes that Bstone was making daily ---not only for the US but for a huge Japanese market. As a piece of the conglomerate, bicycle bstone was always treated as sort of a plum, a place where there was money and interest but nothing like other parts of the company. But in terms of quality, the work Toyo does is far more attentive to detail than Bstone's best work in the 90s, at least imhoatmoetc.

Thanks for the kind words about the bikes. There are a slew here that deserve proper photos and haven't yet been made public.

dbrk