Thanks for all the Forum support

[Pete Serotta]

Man, the porn and advertisers thought they would catch the "A" team sleeping...no way.. THey were on top of things and kept the airwaves "clean"/

Yeah we have to consider that the A team is fun loving and ....... ;)

Happy Thanksgiving...

A Team is welcome in RALEIGH to do some riding, eating, and yes some wine in JAN or Feb....Hope to see them and any others that would like to monitor the fun.. ;)

[stevep]

e-richie in a skinsuit is bad enough... can one of the masters of the universe delete those?
atmo...

offends my sensibility...

[e-RICHIE]

e-richie in a skinsuit is bad enough... can one of the masters of the universe delete those?
atmo...

offends my sensibility...
see me later -
i have pics without the skinsuit atmo.
er, it's a sinsuit.

see ya.

[swoop]

i wish you guys would just hit the 'physically remove message' box like they asked us to... that way we don't have to even look at the thread titles.. it just disappears.

atmo.

[zeroking17]

<snap>
i have pics without the skinsuit atmo.
er, it's a sinsuit.


I'm thinking lawsuit.

[Pete Serotta]

Yes and the history does also...then when someone is concerned about the ## of problems we have, there no way of validating how many porn, when, type, etc...If fact we can not even validate to see how effective we are at policing.

Then if folks REALLY get upset and we have no history of what has happened WE are at a loss to quantify, take action, or defend the forum.... When and if someone voices a legal or a moral concern.

THis is a topic that many will have varied opinions and yours and mine are just two of them.

I had made a plea to SEROTTA to leave the soft delete for the above reasons, The other suggestion we made was to change the registration process so first time posters would have to enter some characters, wait a period of time, etx,,,

Sorry that you and I are still in disagreement on this. WIsh we were local to each other and could discuss over a coffee, beer, or wine.

PETE


i wish you guys would just hit the 'physically remove message' box like they asked us to... that way we don't have to even look at the thread titles.. it just disappears.

atmo.

[swoop]

see the bit where it says "hit physically remove"... it doesn't say to interpret or do pre-crime, or to do what we feel like, or use whatever icon we see fit .. it says.. use 'physically remove'.

i'm happy to do this or not do this... it means nothing to me... but if i am going to do it i might as well do what was asked and would think it makes sense for the others to do the same.

i'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you.. i'm just doing what was asked in the way it was specified. what i'm avoiding is having a personal agenda by focusing on what was specified because it was specified... this is just fact based over here.

what would you like me to do?

[BumbleBeeDave]

I started out using hard delete, then thought about it and started using soft delete for the reason Pete gives above, though he didn't ask me to. If any effort is to be made to gauge the effectiveness of additional anti-spam measures, then there needs to be a record of how many spam threads have been started each day, each week, etc.

Likewise if any effort is to be made to see where the spam threads are coming from--physical location and, more importantly, IP addresses. If we "physically remove" the thread--hard delete it, in other words--then my understanding is that the thread is gone forever along with whatever tracking information may be attached to it

For those of us with "moderator" status, the thread is still visible if we wish to see it--which I don't. But it doesn't show up to bother everyone else. I'm at a loss to understand Swoop's position, because to only use soft delete doesn't hurt and might help in the future.

BBD

[swoop]

its not a position... i'm just trying to do what was asked the way it was asked until something else is asked. this is to avoid conflict, interpretation, or confusion.

this isn't jazz. atmo.

no conflict... do you want me to interpret someone's mood and feelings and alter what was asked based on my assumptions or do you wan't me to do it the way it was specified because it was specified?

shouldn't we do it the way they asked us to until they change the way they want us to?

i'm just sayin'.. i'm not making a point.. i'm following the directions. change the directions and i'll follow the new directions.

no biggie.

[Fixed]

white + black no grey
cheers imho

[BumbleBeeDave]

I just saw that Pete was doing it that way, so I started too.

BBD

[swoop]

yeah, i get that. that's why i spoke up. the instructions don't say do what he or she does.. they say do it this way.

pete's the mod... he's functioning under a different operating system and has the joy and burden of interpreting info. i'm happy to help here.. but once the filter is on its work and for work i charge the big bucks... so until pete/james changes the standards or modifies the instructions.. shouldn't we just do what was asked?

its aint personal.. its just.... doing what was asked they way it was specified seems to have a certain logic to it, no?

i kinda see the beginnings of a little ego coming through.. a little, look what i did i moderated.... and i think that presumes there's a hierarchy here that needn't exist and is unfair to folks on the message board.

can't we just do what was asked the way it was asked? bigger picture atmo.

[Pete Serotta]

Swoop, this is real easy to resolve. (I am requesting James to cancel the Serotta Pete ID)

I am not, nor have I ever told you or anyone else, how to post, what to do as a moderator etc.... but please do not tell me how to do it either.

The note you posted above did not even have me on distribution.

I and Andrew were doing the "soft delete" this way long before James or any others came into the picture. The reasons for it were again stated above.

Additionally I tried to explain why it was necessary, for if we did not change the way we do user ID registration the hard delete offers no audit trail for problems at a later time. Additionally, I sent private emails to you trying to explain the whys.

I am truly sorry that it has gotten this far.....PETE

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . and still do, that if James and Pete thought I was doing it wrong they would have said something to me. I have been using soft delete and they have said nothing. Since I am sure one of the other--or both--of them are looking at things each day, I figured they approved.

As a manager myself who must mediate with our own IT dept. at work to identify, track, and correct problems in our workflow, I feel preserving a record of incidents and associated data is an appropriate and important thing to do. It's standard procedure at my office so IT can analyze a problem and try to formulate a solution.

In any event, soft delete can't hurt and might help, so why not do it? It's certainly no extra trouble for me.

BBD

[swoop]

do you want me to ignore the directions or stick to em?

left or right? follow the directions or is there a different protocol now?
dave, the directions call out to hit 'remove thread'. that doesn't sound like a suggestion to me. it seems black and white and not about thinking or feeling.


help?

i come in peace. clarity is a lovely friend. there is no emotional part of this for me. i don't feel comfy ignoring a direction that was clearly spelled out.

[BumbleBeeDave]

do you want me to ignore the directions or stick to em?

left or right? follow the directions or is there a different protocol now?

help?

Eat some more turkey! That tryptophan will calm you down! ;)

I think Pete's being pretty clear here. I don't think the Serotta Ninja Moderator Police are going to break down your door if you keep using the hard delete. It just seems pretty clear to me that he's saying it's more useful in the long run to use the soft delete so we have a record of how many spam threads, where they came from, what type of subject, etc . . .

As you said above--not a biggie. Relax . . .

BBD

[swoop]

dude.. i'm not upset. i might be crazy.. because i don't understand why this evokes feeling for anyone. i was just following the actual instructions to avoid conflict.

i must not be able to articulate it very well.

[BumbleBeeDave]

Just pretend for a moment that I am Serotta James saying this . . .

1) When you are deleting threads, do NOT use the "hard delete" that totally destroys all the thread info.

2) Use the "soft delete" that removes the thread from general view, but preserves an audit trail of associated info, such as time of posting, subject, originating IP address, etc.

3) The forum has a problem. If you don't help James, et.al., by helping to preserve this info, then we can't fix it.

It's that simple.

BBD

(We now return you to our regularly schedules program . . . :p )

[swoop]

isn't following the instructions as written by serotta james more simple?
its easy for moderators to ruin a message board... why don't we just stay on script?

the script describes a protocol that is absolutely clear. its sort of stops there doesn't it?
i don't care what the instructions say... i just care that we either follow them or not. otherwise i don't want to be lumped in with y'all.


james is a smart man, i'm sure when he wrote 'physically remove message' he meant it and was aware that there were other options.

lets do the job we were asked the way were asked... otherwise i'd like to opt out.

[Ginger]

You know....I just hit the delete button and then click. If one happens or the other happens, it's a matter of fate. Sometimes I write something...sometimes I don't.

I think that we moderators can see the "soft delete" stuff after it's gone but regular users can't. I logged in as M_A_Martin after the first time I made the mistake and did a soft delete, realized that it was removed from the forum view and promptly decided I didn't really care which one I did.

One day I did soft delete because I was curious how many I actually deleted in a day (it seemed like a lot and it was.)

and...I did think of the tracking thing, but I didn't know if they were bothering. My thought on that was if they aren't going to track this stuff down, there's no reason to do a soft delete.

I'll go back to making an effort to do a hard delete when I see stuff.

No matter. Happy to help.

[Ginger]

e-richie in a skinsuit is bad enough... can one of the masters of the universe delete those?
atmo...

offends my sensibility...
I dunno...I thought he was pretty hot in that shot.

:D

[Len J]

isn't following the instructions as written by serotta james more simple?
its easy for moderators to ruin a message board... why don't we just stay on script?

the script describes a protocol that is absolutely clear. its sort of stops there doesn't it?
i don't care what the instructions say... i just care that we either follow them or not. otherwise i don't want to be lumped in with y'all.


james is a smart man, i'm sure when he wrote 'physically remove message' he meant it and was aware that there were other options.

lets do the job we were asked the way were asked... otherwise i'd like to opt out.

may be the single wierdest thread in the history of this forum.......I feel like I'm reading someone else's e-mail, or watching a car wreck....I can't look away.

Maybe take this off line?

Len

[swoop]

kitten herding. transparency in moderating for your entertainment. :banana:

[Ginger]

may be the single wierdest thread in the history of this forum.......I feel like I'm reading someone wlse's e-mail, or watching a car wreck....I can't look away.

Maybe take this off line?

Len

That's because you can't see the mess of soft delete porn threads that everyone's been leaving littering the board (me included)

I could delete this one...

:)

[Len J]

kitten herding.

need a moderators forum, like other boards have, to discuss these issues...........Maybe?

Len

[Ginger]

Yep. That's a good idea Len if we were moderator moderators. We used that on the MMBA's bb...

But really...no matter what anyone in the group says, we're just janitors.
Not much to talk about but who puked in area three. You know?

Serotta James and Pete take care of the ugly stuff.

I'm thinking this is just a clarification of what button to push.
(Swoop's good for that)

[BumbleBeeDave]

Maybe take this off line?

Great idea . . . I just did.

BBD

[BumbleBeeDave]

may be the single wierdest thread in the history of this forum.......

. . . Bacon! ;)

BBD

[Len J]

Yep. That's a good idea Len if we were moderator moderators. We used that on the MMBA's bb...

But really...no matter what anyone in the group says, we're just janitors.
Not much to talk about but who puked in area three. You know?

Serotta James and Pete take care of the ugly stuff.

I'm thinking this is just a clarification of what button to push.
(Swoop's good for that)

It's hard watching 3 good people with great intentions and unquestionable motivation bounce off each other....especially publically over something that seems .....I don't know, trivial.

Clearly some kind of private communication vehicle is needed.

But what do I know?

Len

[Len J]

. . . Bacon! ;)

BBD

all right........second weirdest. :rolleyes:

[BumbleBeeDave]

It's hard watching 3 good people with great intentions and unquestionable motivation bounce off each other....especially publically over something that seems .....I don't know, trivial.

Clearly some kind of private communication vehicle is needed.

But what do I know?

Len

. . . and you are a genius. You are hereby appointed SUPER-super-moderator!

What are your orders, Master?

BBD

[swoop]

freestyle moderating can sink the board. it starts small.... and with good intentions. the good james went so far as to describe a sequence to use for the clean up.. it absolves us of any and all interpretive intervention and keeps this place clean and level...
and with the best of intentions i'm just asserting my unease with leaving the protocol... no matter what the inspiration.

i'm sure if i met these fine people i'd find them all to be the loveliest cats ever...

and i'd like to help but by doing it the way i was asked to avoid getting lumped in to what happening when it was moderating gone wild here last time.


this isn't about hating on anyone.... its literally trivial.. but if its off the way we were told.. i'd like to not get sucked into a slippery well intentioned slope.

this is good and healthy isn't it? i'm just asking for us to do what we were asked to do. it is a million miles away from being personal or an attack.

i'm being direct but not mean or angry. the only thing i'm feeling is perplexed.
pete and james are the best.. i'm just a dude asking what trash can cuz it looks like it changed. i don't care but for what trash can.
i'm not worried about the moderator stuff... pete and james have that covered.

[BumbleBeeDave]

freestyle moderating can sink the board. it starts small.... and with good intentions.

. . . but you make a good point here. Let's wait until James gets back and see how he can clarify this.

In the meantime, let's talk about BACON . . . :rolleyes:

BBD

[Len J]

freestyle moderating can sink the board. it starts small.... and with good intentions. the good james went so far as to describe a sequence to use for the clean up.. it absolves us of any and all interpretive intervention and keeps this place clean and level...
and with the best of intentions i'm just asserting my unease with leaving the protocol... no matter what the inspiration.

i'm sure if i met these fine people i'd find them all to be the loveliest cats ever...

and i'd like to help but by doing it the way i was asked to avoid getting lumped in to what happening when it was moderating gone wild here last time.


this isn't about hating on anyone.... its literally trivial.. but if its off the way we were told.. i'd like to not get sucked into a slippery well intentioned slope.

this is good and healthy isn't it? i'm just asking for us to do what we were asked to do. it is a million miles away from being personal or an attack.

i'm being direct but not mean or angry. the only thing i'm feeling is perplexed.

you've made your position clear, as has Pete & Dave.....and you all seem to have very valid points (To this uninformed observer)....unfortunatly, it's like the kids fighting over where they are going with Dad....if Dad's not in the conversation, no one is right and no one is wrong, they are just arguing. Dad (James) is absent, and therefor no resolution is possible, it seems.

All you guys appear to be doing is "Hardening" your positions (at least to an outside view).

just holding up a mirror.

Len

[Ginger]

Somewhere Serotta James is eating turkey and watching football with no clue what's awaiting him tomorrow at work.

Sorry about that James!

[swoop]

i'm astonished that this is hurting feelings or causing drama.

[Len J]

i'm astonished that this is hurting feelings or causing drama.

the power of bare naked written word with no "body english" behind it.

Len

[Serotta_James]

Ahh! Geez.
I just want the porn gone. That's all.
This little experiment with empowering some of our more frequent forum visitors has been a success in my estimation: SPAM goes away fast!
Just keep deleting the SPAM, we'll clarify privately next week.
OK?

Now, go eat, drink, be merry and ride your bikes.

James

[e-RICHIE]

did anyone ever see the commitments?
that final scene where they all beat the
shiieit out of each other because wilson
pickett never showed as promised atmo?




http://youtube.com/watch?v=TpwXMLmBzX4

[BumbleBeeDave]

Now, go eat, drink, be merry and ride your bikes.

All at the same time?

BBD

[Ginger]

All at the same time?

BBD
You heard the man.

I'm on it James.

;)

[Serotta_James]

All at the same time?

BBD

Yes and send me pictures, but don't send me the medical bills.

JAmes