Black jerseys & jackets???

[mcteague]

Looking at cold weather gear I noticed that there are lots of all black, or mostly black jackets out there. The new PBK catalog has quite a few black jerseys. Is it just me or is this really stupid. #1 Black is way too hot in warm weather. #B Why would you want to be LESS visible to traffic? I know there are still red and yellow based tops, which I prefer, but why buy black? I suppose soaking up some of feeble winter sunshine might help a bit but I want cars to see me if at all possible.

Tim McTeague

[J.Greene]

It started here (http://www.richardsachs.com/articles/cybc0708crossresults.html).....

JG

[Ginger]

When are you wearing a long sleeved jersey in warm weather???

They're jackets. The jerseys will probably have a jacket over the top of them.

If the road is white with snow, black makes sense.

Actually, I like black jerseys except on the sunniest hot days.

Everyone who thinks they're visible in those florescent green jackets in the summer time with tons of foliage about? Wrong. You blend right in.

Anyone wearing any form of blue jersey? Blends right in to the gray pavement.

Black? In daylight you look like a lump of something on the road...but at least you don't blend in...Same with brilliant white. Bright red or orange are a few more of my favorites.

Reflective stripes everywhere.

At dusk, or at times of the whole shade/sun thing? I run my blinky lights because no driver can see me anyhow.

[flydhest]

Mary Ann, I'd add that I'm skeptical of relying on visibility for my safety, in any event. Sure, I use flashy lights and such at night, but I've had cars turn right in front of me in broad daylight, multiple times, in all sorts of clothing . . . and I ain't a small guy.

If they see me and avoid me, so much the better. I'll ride like I'm invisible, though, 'cause that's how they treat me.

[mcteague]

Jeez, wrong assumptions already. Who said I wear long sleeves in warm weather? Winter is coming so I have been looking at new clothing. For snow covered roads, well, that is roller time. Being seen is probably the least of your safety concerns at that point. As I am not cold blooded I find black, short sleeve, jerseys are solar collectors in hot temps. Also, I never said I relied on bright clothing for my safety just as I don't rely on a helmet. Still, nothing like stacking the deck in your favor as every little bit helps. Try checking out cyclists while out for a drive and see which ones register first, dark clad or bright.

Tim McTeague

[bnewt07]

I think insurance company stats show that black cars have more accidents than brighter colours such as red or yellow (when adjusted for the numbers of each on the road). Or perhaps this is another urban myth.

Personally I prefer riding in black or simple colours rather than looking like an accident in a paint factory but there you go.

[cadence231]

I'm with you mcteauge! I don't get why there all kinds of colors for shorts and jerseys but hardly any color when it comes to winter wear. I found a cool pair of Nalini tights 3 yrs ago that are grey, red and white. They are killer. I pair them up with my red teosport booties. Which is another sore point...black booties! Don't even get me started on zippered jersey pockets!

[Ozz]

...Try checking out cyclists while out for a drive and see which ones register first, dark clad or bright....
I see the ones that ride in the middle of the street....

I'm also too busy trying to see what kind of bike they are riding to notice the jersey. ;)

[Grant McLean]

but why buy black?

I wear a lot of black jerseys. Late spring/early fall, the heat issue isn't a factor. (at least here)

When it's getting darker in the fall or early spring, i've usually got a vest on overtop,
so the fact that the L/S jersey is black just means that it goes with any other
colour layering piece you might also wear.

I think that 3M reflective bits on Jackets and vests does more than colour
when it's dark out. When it's light out, I think black is visible. I usually
wear my white helmet in the afternoon, which i put some white 3m on the
back, which you can't see in the daylight, but is very visible when the light
hits it.

-g

[MilanoTom]

Anything that might catch the eye of a motorist is one more chance to avoid being hit. To that end, it always made sense to me to wear a jersey that had at least a little bit of color. It might not have the visual impact of a blinking light, but why miss one more opportunity to be seen?

A couple of years ago, the Merckx trade jerseys were black. It made me wonder if the designer had ever ridden a bicycle on public roads.

Regards.
Tom

[darylb]

I am not sure about the visibility part of it but black isnt hotter than other colors. It seems to make logical sense but not factual.

My daughter did her science project on it and it turns out reds are hotter. It has to do with which and how many uv rays are allowed to pass. In her experiment, and backed up by others, black registered about the same as white.

[swoop]

winter riding is dirty riding. black hides dirt. colored clothes and the myth of visiblity should give you a false sense of safety. wear a contrasting helmet or sock or knee warmer.

atmo.

[flydhest]

Jeez, wrong assumptions already. Who said I wear long sleeves in warm weather? Winter is coming so I have been looking at new clothing. For snow covered roads, well, that is roller time. Being seen is probably the least of your safety concerns at that point. As I am not cold blooded I find black, short sleeve, jerseys are solar collectors in hot temps. Also, I never said I relied on bright clothing for my safety just as I don't rely on a helmet. Still, nothing like stacking the deck in your favor as every little bit helps. Try checking out cyclists while out for a drive and see which ones register first, dark clad or bright.

Tim McTeague
Tim,
I think Mary Ann made a conclusion, not an assumption. Your #1 was that black jerseys are too hot and then, after referencing a specific source, you posted a picture of a bunch of long-sleeved jerseys.

I am not convinced from a driver's or cyclist's perspective that the colors always make you stand out, but I don't think I'd actively dissuade someone.

[rwsaunders]

I am not sure about the visibility part of it but black isnt hotter than other colors. It seems to make logical sense but not factual.

My daughter did her science project on it and it turns out reds are hotter. It has to do with which and how many uv rays are allowed to pass. In her experiment, and backed up by others, black registered about the same as white.

? Wear a white jersey in the sun and wear a black jersey in the sun. Post results when your research is complete.

[Kevan]

to me, black doesn't offer enough contrast to the typical wintery scene I ride in. Here, everything seems to turn shades of grey, black and white. Pavement is dark trees and leafless bushes are shades of grey and if there is snow the contrast is heightened. Nope, to me...I think you want to introduce non-wintery colors: red, blue or yellow.

That's just me.

[djg]

I often wear black shorts too -- go figure.

Neither of my helmets is black or dark colored and the helmets, my shoes, my tights, and all of my commuting bags (I have several sizes and styles I've accumulated and use according to what I'm carrying) have at least some reflective stuff and when commuting at dusk or after dark I have both front and rear lights. My vest is a bright yellow, although not safety yellow, and it has some reflective stripping on it too. I could be wrong -- it's an empirical question -- but I suspect I'm not really substantially less visible when wearing a black long-sleeved jersey (I have one) or a dark blue one (I have two). I don't think it's crazy to add bright colors to be seen, but I'm o.k. with what I have.

[Ginger]

Mary Ann, I'd add that I'm skeptical of relying on visibility for my safety, in any event. Sure, I use flashy lights and such at night, but I've had cars turn right in front of me in broad daylight, multiple times, in all sorts of clothing . . . and I ain't a small guy.

If they see me and avoid me, so much the better. I'll ride like I'm invisible, though, 'cause that's how they treat me.


Sorry I rambled...

That was my point. It really doesn't matter what color you wear. It isn't a form of protection. You are your only protection from cars.

I like black 'cause I'm sloppy. And it's slimming. :)


And really...if you look at a road cyclist from the rear, you don't see much of his jersey at all...the one constant? you see butt.

So why don't they make fluorescent orange glowing shorts for that "clothes will protect me" crowd?

[TimB]

Ginger, orange lycra is nearly see-through.

And ain't no one wants to see through the butt end of my shorts. (And if they do, I don't want to know about it.)

I don't count on my clothes to make me visible. I got a whole bunch of blinkies, reflective tape all down the back fender, and like Fly's description - I ride as if I'm invisible, since that's the way most cars seem to treat me.

Actually I find I get _more_ respect riding at night in the winter than I do during daylight at any time of year. Must be something about the confusing blinking?

[Bud_E]

Looking at cold weather gear I noticed that there are lots of all black, or mostly black jackets out there. The new PBK catalog has quite a few black jerseys. Is it just me or is this really stupid. #1 Black is way too hot in warm weather. #B Why would you want to be LESS visible to traffic? I know there are still red and yellow based tops, which I prefer, but why buy black? I suppose soaking up some of feeble winter sunshine might help a bit but I want cars to see me if at all possible.

Tim McTeague

Does this mean black is the new black ?

[Ozz]

Does this mean black is the new black ?
I think it means that most of the windstopper type fabrics produced are black, so that is what is used to make jerseys.....therefore, you end up with a lot of black winter jerseys :beer:

[mcteague]

Black shows dirt less? Check out a black car and a silver car and see which ones shows dirt more. I have several cotton t-shirts I wear in Summer. The dark teal and olive ones make me feel much hotter than white and tan. Check out http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg15220598.000.html

Q: I have always believed that in hot, sunny weather it is best to wear white or light-coloured clothing because this reflects the heat. But a friend insists that the opposite is true and that black clothing is better because it helps to radiate heat from the body. Who is right? Or is a combination of the two—black on the inside and white outside—the best option?

A: Light-coloured clothing will reflect the most heat. However, black clothing is better, but not for the reason your friend stated. Black clothing will absorb much more sunlight than white to the extent that its temperature can be 5 °C higher.

The reason why people like the Bedouins of the Sinai desert wear black is that the heat absorbed by their clothes warms the air next to the skin. This air rises and leaves through the porous fabric, drawing in external air through the bottom of the clothing. This creates a draught and the wearer feels more comfortable as a continuous breeze blows past the body.

Tim McTeague

[Ginger]

I think it means that most of the windstopper type fabrics produced are black, so that is what is used to make jerseys.....therefore, you end up with a lot of black winter jerseys :beer:

Oh sure...a reasonable response.

[72gmc]

I have to agree with mcteague--I will often try to talk myself into a winter wool top from someone-or-other but can't bring myself to do it because it's black. For all I know it says "Hit Me" in black thread all over the black top. Of course, most of my riding this time of year happens in low light or darkness, so, well, you know.

[1centaur]

I totally agree that there are way too many black clothes for winter. On the gray and gloomy New England days of late fall, winter and early spring, any bright color catches the eye.

I believe that manufacturers believe, probably based on actual sales, that people are more willing to buy black winter clothing because they expect it to get grime encrusted or grease stained and don't want to be bothered with detailed cleaning or with incomplete cleaning (since most of this stuff gets washed in cold water). The European makers are better at getting color in their winter clothing - Assos and Castelli in particular - though my insulated Castelli red booties were not available in the last 2 years.

[I Want Sachs?]

If good enough for Sachs, good enough for me.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9866331@N08/750336460/in/set-72157600706471236/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9866331@N08/1465858470/in/set-72157601930857072/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9866331@N08/1397406906/in/set-72157601930857072/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9866331@N08/750365906/in/set-72157600705959185/

[Grant McLean]

Black shows dirt less? Check out a black car and a silver car and see which ones shows dirt more.

Tim McTeague

I think swoop meant that when you wash the clothing,
and all the dirt doesn't come out, the black fabric will still look black.
Lighter colours still look dirty. Buy some yellow or red shorts
and see for yourself.

Nice try with the car colour analogy though...

-g

[Blue Jays]

I'm a traditionalist by nature when it comes to cycling clothing, yet I greatly prefer hi-viz yellows & oranges during gray, dark, and dreary days of winter. The emergency truck pictured below wouldn't be quite so visible if it were painted navy blue or black, for example...even with the flashing lights:

http://www.code3images.com/OSappat210.jpg

[Ozz]

I'm a traditionalist by nature when it comes to cycling clothing, yet I greatly prefer hi-viz yellows & oranges during gray, dark, and dreary days of winter. The emergency truck pictured below wouldn't be quite so visible if it were painted navy blue or black, for example...even with the flashing lights:

http://www.code3images.com/OSappat210.jpg
what?? where??? I need a bigger picture! ;)

[Blue Jays]

You replied with a quote, it should be right in the center of your screen. It's a bright yellow truck with yellow wheels and red lights! ;)

[Ginger]

Tim,
I think Mary Ann made a conclusion, not an assumption. .

Yes. A complaint about cold weather jerseys being black and a picture of long sleeved black jerseys...sort of makes that leap to complaining about long sleeved black cold weather jerseys...

Sorry I was drawn to the wrong conclusion Tim.

[vaxn8r]

I think swoop meant that when you wash the clothing,
and all the dirt doesn't come out, the black fabric will still look black.
Lighter colours still look dirty. Buy some yellow or red shorts
and see for yourself.

Nice try with the car colour analogy though...

-g
Yep, I have several yellow long sleevers that are covered with mud stains. I don't mind because I keep adding to them. My black jerseys just look black no matter how dirty they get.

When will some of these guys start using fender extenders. Grrrrr!

[mcteague]

Yes. A complaint about cold weather jerseys being black and a picture of long sleeved black jerseys...sort of makes that leap to complaining about long sleeved black cold weather jerseys...

Sorry I was drawn to the wrong conclusion Tim.

No offense taken. But you typed "When are you wearing a long sleeved jersey in warm weather???". The conclusion was somehow that I was wearing cold weather gear in warm temps. That is the leap I was questioning.

Tim McTeague