Has anyone retrofit a frame with S&S Couplers?

[Buzz]

If so, any problems, experiences?

Thanks in advance.

[gone]

Here (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=14028&highlight=S%26S)
is my S&S coupled CII. I had it done a couple of years ago. Since then it's been to Europe 5 times, done RAGBRAI and I use it occasionally around home. No troubles at all and it's the only way to travel with a bike IMHO (sure beats traveling with a full size bike case).

[11.4]

You will have problems if your tubes decrease in wall thickness by the time you get to the sites for the couplers -- they need to be installed on thicker tubing and aggressive butting will create problems. You can't move the coupler location much or the sections won't fit in the box any longer, and usually the problem is that you want to move them both closer to the seat tube to get into the thicker part of the top and down tubes.

Also, some tubing wall thicknesses don't have S&S couplers to fit -- a builder starting a frame with S&S couplers up front will be sure to pick tubing diameters to match.

Given that you have to repaint plus pay the cost of couplers, you might see how much more it would cost to get a sturdy frame built from scratch with couplers. I say sturdy because the couplers will work better with a simple double-butted or even straight gauge tubing. If I remember correctly that's what Serotta does on their S&S ti frame, for example. If you don't, you may find you have unusual flexing problems or even tubing failure.

Last, the installer needs to cut and install perfectly or your frame can end up out of alignment or with an altered geometry.

I have a coupled bare ti frame that works really well -- there's no paint to worry about and ti is somewhat more resistant to dings (compared to steel). Also, the ti couplers are light and there's no concern about rust in the steel tubing nearby. When you spend that much extra on a frame, it's nice to know it isn't going to start rusting on you down the road.

[Blue Jays]

Concur completely with 11.4's comments above. Not worth the hassle and potential downstream problems. Just start new with the appropriate S&S bike built specifically for that purpose.

[e-RICHIE]

i've done 50 at least.
it's a pretty basic cut and braze job atmo.

[Ray]

I had a Riv All Rounder cut up several years ago. The whole thing cost something like $350, plus the suitcase and little associated doodads, but you'd have to buy those with a new frame too. It was pretty straight-forward, as R Sachs just said. I think if it's steel and has a long enough and thick enough section behind the butted portion, you should be good. It's probably more expensive now (this was 8 or 9 years ago), but nowhere near what a new coupled frame would cost.

-Ray

[Blue Jays]

The notion of retrofitting ain't my bag, baby. ;)
If it's a travel bike to be built, it's a travel bike from when it's dreamed-up in my pointy little head...until when I take delivery.

[93legendti]

http://www.sandsmachine.com/bp_bil.htm#Tubing%20profile.

[e-RICHIE]

http://www.sandsmachine.com/bp_bil.htm#Tubing%20profile.
the master himself (http://www.sandsmachine.com/p_bil_p21.jpg) atmo, just back from (or on the way to) ling.

[Ray]

the master himself (http://www.sandsmachine.com/p_bil_p21.jpg) atmo, just back from (or on the way to) ling.
Yup, Bilenky did mine way back when.

-Ray

[Pete Serotta]

couplers have jsut about doubled in cost over the past year.

Buzz, if that is your LENGEND you are thinking of doing I am not sure if you have double or triple butted.....that could make a difference

I know the news ti with couplers are only using double butting (has something to do with triple not working well from what I hear).

If it is the Legend and you decide to get it done send the serial # if you do not know about butting. Whoever does the work might need to know that.
:beer:

pete

[hmbmd]

The titanium bike is a uniscasi and the blue bike is a legend retrofitted with S & S couplers done by Bilenky in Philadelphia.

[TMB]

I have a custom Derek Bailey which was built in 1985.

I had it retro-fit earlier this year, cleaned it up, spread the triangle and a repaint.

I love her all over again.

[vaxn8r]

I had a Riv All Rounder cut up several years ago. The whole thing cost something like $350, plus the suitcase and little associated doodads, but you'd have to buy those with a new frame too. It was pretty straight-forward, as R Sachs just said. I think if it's steel and has a long enough and thick enough section behind the butted portion, you should be good. It's probably more expensive now (this was 8 or 9 years ago), but nowhere near what a new coupled frame would cost.

-Ray
I've never heard of S&S couplers going for less than about $400. This year the price is around $700. Of course that's a cost you're getting new or rebuilt.

[93legendti]

http://www.bilenky.com/retro%20prices.html

Prices
Retrofits:
$460-Steel Retrofit

$795-Titanium Retrofit

$525- 2 coupler recumbent retrofit

$575- 3 coupler recumbent retrofit

$1250- Tandem retrofit

[Buzz]

Thanks for the info everyone. I am trying to figure out options as I will be doing a trip to Italy next summer and plan on doing more travel with my bike.

Pete, this is my Legend and with triple butted tubes, I think. It looks very similar in size, tubing and geometry to the one posted by HMBMD as the Blue Legend.

Either way I want to get it re-painted this fall.

The cost of doing an S&S Ti from scratch, no matter who builds it is getting up there in price.

Pete, your bike is so nice though...that's what got me thinking about it.

[eddief]

my next travel bike might be a ritchey. steve rex chopped my kogswell steel and had no trouble with the retro. since he's right around the corner from sands machine, he has probably done more couplers than most. he does not do ti.

but you you can get one hell of ritchey frameset and travel case from gvhbikes.com for about $1100 and ti too at the ti premium. something you gotta throw in a case and give to gorillas should not be that pretty anyway.

[thejen12]

The titanium bike is a uniscasi and the blue bike is a legend retrofitted with S & S couplers done by Bilenky in Philadelphia.
Whoa, look at the unusual placement of the coupler on the top tube of the legend! Do you have to do anything extra to pack that bike, like remove a crankarm or two? Not that it might not still be worth it, but it's something to be aware of for someone who might be contemplating doing the same thing.

Jenn

[SpeedyChix]

Recenly had a ti built w/ S+S, the coupler $ is through the roof now for those.

But a few years back we had a Riv done after build. Lots of miles, no issues.

[bluehorseshoe]

I had Bilenky retrofit a Serotta Atlanta. It was very well done, and having a bike that fits in a suitcase is invaluable to me. Nice people, too; good to work with.

[jpw]

Whoa, look at the unusual placement of the coupler on the top tube of the legend! Do you have to do anything extra to pack that bike, like remove a crankarm or two? Not that it might not still be worth it, but it's something to be aware of for someone who might be contemplating doing the same thing.

Jenn

I was wondering about that tt coupler too. A very odd looking position - never seen that before. How would the rear half of the frame fit into a small case?