View Full Version : big vs. little
oracle
10-02-2007, 11:13 AM
jack's spacer thread got me to thinking: what does it feel like to ride a large (60cm+) frame with the bars so high off the floor? i have always preferred the top of the bars as close to the axle of the front wheel (any of you with problems going down a mountain, try dropping the stem down as far as it can go and see how this changes things; it's not just a vanity thing) as is allowable especially for descending at speed. how do large frames handle differently than small frames due to the overall higher center of gravity issues?
technical analysis (http://googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=big&word2=little)
I don't understand your question. If say a 54cm frame fits you why would you care about how a 60cm frame would ride? It won't fit so it won't ride well. I think thinking about the height of the bars relative to the wheel ignores the rider. First the rider needs to be in the position that works for them and their needs. Then the dots get connected.
Curt
oracle
10-02-2007, 12:03 PM
I don't understand your question. If say a 54cm frame fits you why would you care about how a 60cm frame would ride? It won't fit so it won't ride well.
Curt
thanks. i've figured that part out.
flydhest
10-02-2007, 12:11 PM
To put Curt's words a bit differently, bikes that ride well have to be designed well. I ride a 60 or so. Some bikes I've tried definitely feel like the bars are "too high" in that there is a feeling of detachment, even conditional on the bar-saddle drop being the same and other points of contact being "right." I think a good bike designer knows that (at least implicitly) and designs so that the bike works right.
I agree with you about being able to change weight placement and such to get better handling, but I guess I feel like that ought to be designed into the bike. No doubt when I finally buy one from Curt (which, alas, may have to wait until after the kitchen), it will be. Oh, and it will be blue, something that is important to me.
how do large frames handle differently than small frames due to the overall higher center of gravity issues?A taller bike/rider combination with a higher center of gravity must have a slower transient response to steering input.
Too Tall
10-02-2007, 01:10 PM
A taller bike/rider combination with a higher center of gravity must have a slower transient response to steering input.
He!! you say!
FWIIW somewhere around the last lap of a points race at Trexlertown the bars feel like they are 8 feet OVER my head :rolleyes:
I'll try to post a picture of my bikes head on soon. For some reason they are arranged with the highest bars on left to the lowest bars on the right. Considering the fact these include: Track bike (for racing at the track yo), Crit bike, Commuter (former RAAM type bike), Dirt Road Racing bike (Vanilla) and some old POS single spd. you'd never guess based on description alone which bike has what bar height.
oracle
10-02-2007, 01:14 PM
He!! you say!
FWIIW somewhere around the last lap of a points race at Trexlertown the bars feel like they are 8 feet OVER my head :rolleyes:
I'll try to post a picture of my bikes head on soon. For some reason they are arranged with the highest bars on left to the lowest bars on the right. Considering the fact these include: Track bike (for racing at the track yo), Crit bike, Commuter (former RAAM type bike), Dirt Road Racing bike (Vanilla) and some old POS single spd. you'd never guess based on description alone which bike has what bar height.
wwbb
Fixed
10-02-2007, 01:35 PM
bro i 'm not the smartest cat around but after many years of riding somethings sink in .. here is my latest .. saddle height and balance ..okay so don't kill me on this one.. if your high on your bike your balance is screwed
lower saddle the bike is a rock ... ride no hands with 2 saddle positions and see what i mean .. a little bend to the knee is a good thing just not too much ...
cheers
cadence90
10-02-2007, 01:38 PM
These threads are getting ridiculous. It feels like BikeForums all over again.
oracle
10-02-2007, 02:34 PM
These threads are getting ridiculous. It feels like BikeForums all over again.
truly insightful
cadence90
10-02-2007, 02:47 PM
truly insightful
Yeah. :rolleyes:
The real insight is hopping all over this board today.
He!! you say!
FWIIW somewhere around the last lap of a points race at Trexlertown the bars feel like they are 8 feet OVER my head :rolleyes:
I'll try to post a picture of my bikes head on soon. For some reason they are arranged with the highest bars on left to the lowest bars on the right. Considering the fact these include: Track bike (for racing at the track yo), Crit bike, Commuter (former RAAM type bike), Dirt Road Racing bike (Vanilla) and some old POS single spd. you'd never guess based on description alone which bike has what bar height.I should ask for a translation, because it sounds like you are implying that high CG bike/riders turn in quicker. Is that your point?
Too Tall
10-02-2007, 03:04 PM
No...nothing so pognant / pregnant ...you choose. Merely making fun of myself at your expense.
Pics. of 4 BigKid bikes below. Left to right: Seven Track bike, Serotta Former RAAM Bike/commuter, Vanilla dirt road go fast bike, Spectrum Crit bike (which totally rocks my world). Frame design accounts for these fits. Choices, we got em' :) :
Note, the bars. Fixed my man, saddle on the Vanilla is low..that's how I had it for D2R2.
Fixed
10-02-2007, 03:09 PM
beautiful
great get the job done bikes with no fluff i like all of them
cheers imho
cadence231
10-02-2007, 04:02 PM
truly insightful
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/giveupyourinquiriesvl5.jpg
No...nothing so pognant / pregnant ...you choose. Merely making fun of myself at your expense.
Pics. of 4 BigKid bikes below. Left to right: Seven Track bike, Serotta Former RAAM Bike/commuter, Vanilla dirt road go fast bike, Spectrum Crit bike (which totally rocks my world). Frame design accounts for these fits. Choices, we got em' :) :
Note, the bars. Fixed my man, saddle on the Vanilla is low..that's how I had it for D2R2.Nice bikes. :cool:
My original point was that larger objects (including bike riders) generally take more effort and/or time to change directions.
goonster
10-02-2007, 05:40 PM
TT,
Thanks for posting that.
I'd seen a picture of your Spectrum before and thought "that's an ungoshly amount of saddle-to-bar drop" but with those pictures I just had a "now it all makes sense" moment.
Trompe l'oeil, they call it. :beer:
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