polishing Ti

[link]

Serotta has a ti finish that they call "satin".

Does anyone how to duplicate the Serotta process to achieve the satin finish with hand rubbing and/or an implement installed in an electric drill? Basically, I'm asking if you know a home version of the factory process.

I want to start with a finished Moots stem and seatpost and go from there.

[MRB]

You can polish Ti with Scotch-Brite pads, which is a pretty good way to go. They are available in disks, pads, and flap wheels. This is often referred to as a "brushed" finish, which is a good way to go. If you are thinking about taking a brushed finish and polishing it to a very shinny mirror like luster, I would not recommend it as Ti oxidizes rapidly and becomes a high maintenance issue.

I have a brushed finish Ibis Ti Road bike that I love. And I have a polished finish TVT bike that is a pain in the backside.

JA

[link]

That's good info ...I really already knew that though, but thanks ...really.

What I'm really looking for is the "satin" finish recipe that would be achieved starting with the finish that's on the finished Moots product.

[cadence90]

I refinished a Moots ti post and stem using Scotch-Brite maroon pads (I think #7447) and lots of elbow grease. The resulting finish is pretty "satin".
YMMV.

[DarrenCT]

scotch brite?

do you use the green or yellow side? :)

[SPOKE]

start with the maroon pad to get the general surface then switch to the grey pad to complete the work.

[cadence90]

start with the maroon pad to get the general surface then switch to the grey pad to complete the work.
Exactly.
And then finish with Pledge.

[guyintense]

That's good info ...I really already knew that though, but thanks ...really.

What I'm really looking for is the "satin" finish recipe that would be achieved starting with the finish that's on the finished Moots product.

The Moots finish is bead blasted, no way to duplicate without a blast cabinet. I'm not sure what medium they use and the Moots guys ain't sayin. Well, they wouldn't tell me anyway.

[Ti Designs]

Wait, you can polish Ti?!?!?!?! :rolleyes:

You may want to check wall thickness before you go switching from bead blasted to anything smooth 'cause you're losing material along the way. If that's not a problem (I wouldn't do it on a Moots SL frame, but their stem and seatpost are probably thick enough to work on) then listen to Spoke, he's got it right.

As for finishes on Ti (which is part of what I do), I've been asked to do a lot of weird finishes and there are lots of options that most people would never think of. One that I did and thought it came out well was a brushed finish with waves on the top tube. A brushed finish is basicly lots of scratches which break up reflections, so all I needed to do was control which direction the scratches went. I started out with the sky, which was easy - #000 steel wool run lengthwise over the top tube. The waves needed to be darker with a circular shape, so I used scotchbright purple pads of various sizes on the dremel, which gave me the ability to do parts of an arc, then flair the ends up like waves breaking. The whole process including a test piece only took about two hours.

[Dave]

There really isn't a "formula" for producing a particular finish, unless you happen to have the exact same abrasive and equipment used by a specific manufacturer. Different polishing wheels and buffing compounds each produce a unique look.

If a frame has been bead blasted, it may have deep enough "dents" in the surface, that a fair amount of fine grit sanding is required to remove them, before you'll achieve a brushed finish.

As for the idea the Ti tarnishes, I'd have to disgree. Ti is hihgly corrosion resistant. I owned a polished Litespeed Ultimate and it certainly didn't tarnish. It was bare Ti, polished to a full mirror finish, with no clear coat. The downside to a mirror finish is it's very easy to mar and restoring an identical mirrored finish to a scuffed area was nearly impossible. That's because the final finish was not mechanicaly buffed, but produced by electropolishing - not something you can duplicate at home even with the finest buffing compound and softest buffing wheel.

[Ti Designs]

not something you can duplicate at home even with the finest buffing compound and softest buffing wheel.


I started Ti Designs because people kept telling me things couldn't be done...

http://www.ti-designs.com

[Dave]

I started Ti Designs because people kept telling me things couldn't be done...

http://www.ti-designs.com

I worked for many years in the metal machining and electroplating industry, including operating diamond tool lathes that produce machined metal mirrors with no polishing required. Of course, the materials that can be machined to a mirror finish are all non ferrous and relatively soft, like aluminum, copper, brass, gold, platinum and silver.

The site below describes the "diamond turning" process, but it's not all accurate information.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diamond_turning

[mosca]

link,

Serotta is currently listing their ti finishes as "polished" and "matte". The polished finish is a finely brushed style finish, whereas the matte finish is a bead blasted finish similar to Moots, as I understand it. Which style of finish are you trying to achieve?

[link]

link,

Serotta is currently listing their ti finishes as "polished" and "matte". The polished finish is a finely brushed style finish, whereas the matte finish is a bead blasted finish similar to Moots, as I understand it. Which style of finish are you trying to achieve?

Well, the understanding I have been given from my Serotta guy at Wheat Ridge Cyclery is that they have:

Polished
Satin
Matte

I'm trying to duplicate the satin finish by starting with the finish on Moots' stem and seatpost.

BTW, thanks so much for all the great discussion and information. What a group you are...

[mosca]

I've always been confused by the ti finish terminology that Serotta uses. I don't think they do a true polished finish - I think what they call polished is actually a finely brushed finish that most would call satin. Serotta people please ring in here and correct me if I'm wrong...

Anyway I recently refinished the front half of my Uniscasi shown here:

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=30040

After stripping the paint I found that the base metal surface was too rough for the scotchbrite pad method. I ended up using a roll of emery cloth to smooth the surface, followed by 320 grit sandpaper which got me close to the factory brushed finish. I used a "shoe shining" technique as much as possible to get the brush finish grain to go smoothly in the proper direction. I then went over the tubes with some Brasso polish which made everything consistent and gave it a nice sheen.

If the surface you begin with is not too rough, the Scotchbrite method seems feasible, but in this case the Scotchbrite pad did virtually nothing. I was initially worried about removing too much metal, as TiDesigns mentioned, but working by hand makes it virtually impossible to remove a measurable amount of metal from the tubes. Ti is hard.

This is all just my experience if it's any use to anyone. Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

[Dave]

I've always been confused by the ti finish terminology that Serotta uses. I don't think they do a true polished finish - I think what they call polished is actually a finely brushed finish that most would call satin. Serotta people please ring in here and correct me if I'm wrong...

Anyway I recently refinished the front half of my Uniscasi shown here:

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=30040

After stripping the paint I found that the base metal surface was too rough for the scotchbrite pad method. I ended up using a roll of emery cloth to smooth the surface, followed by 320 grit sandpaper which got me close to the factory brushed finish. I used a "shoe shining" technique as much as possible to get the brush finish grain to go smoothly in the proper direction. I then went over the tubes with some Brasso polish which made everything consistent and gave it a nice sheen.

If the surface you begin with is not too rough, the Scotchbrite method seems feasible, but in this case the Scotchbrite pad did virtually nothing. I was initially worried about removing too much metal, as TiDesigns mentioned, but working by hand makes it virtually impossible to remove a measurable amount of metal from the tubes. Ti is hard.

This is all just my experience if it's any use to anyone. Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

You've posted mostly good advice, except when experimenting with sandpaper, start with a finer grit like 400 and only progress to coarser grits if the pitted looking original finish of the metal remains after a reasonable amount of sanding. If you start out too coarse, you'll leave scratches that require even more metal removal to eliminate.

[link]

start with the maroon pad to get the general surface then switch to the grey pad to complete the work.

I'm going to follow this recipe.

Thank you all for lots of good schtuff.

[Ahneida Ride]

With a bit of SemiChrome Polish and elbo grease, one can take up the
brushed look to a chrome like finish. Use a Dremel and it can be come a
mirror finish.