Bicyclist killed in RI

[MilanoTom]

Riding on a beautiful day in the middle of the afternoon in a beach resort area, only to have an SUV veer into the shoulder and take him out. As much as I love to ride, I confess that there are some days that I hesitate to walk out the door with a bicycle. St. Christopher and Madonna di Ghisallo can only do so much, especially when we play second fiddle to just about every possible distraction.

http://www.projo.com/ri/charlestown/content/CHARLESTOWN_FATAL05_09-05-07_6T70JBP.32ffee7.html

[Ahneida Ride]

Nothing will happen to the driver.

[Frog Hair]

What would you do if......

Before I complete this question, let me first say that all of my condolances go out to the family in RI (and the many others) of the cyclist hit by the driver. It chills me every time I hear about this kind of sensless tragedy. I hate this kind of news.

But we here at this forum, or at least most of us, drive a car. Albeit we are more tuned into watching for cyclists and pedestrians - we still drive cars (and SUVs). What if you hit a cyclist? It could happen. What if you had your bikes on the roof after a group ride and it happened. Would the media say "cyclist driving SUV kills cyclist."
Would you be set free with a small fine? Or would you be one of the few who actually gets time in jail? What would happen?

I hate to pass judgement on the lady who drove the vehicle in this case. It is so easy to do. Insert the words "driving an SUV" and I am as guilty as anyone for stero-typing. Like everything, there are multiple sides to a story. She could have been guilty by putting on make-up, on her cel phone or simple as having a sneezing fit at the wheel that made her veer 3 feet to the right. We'll likely never know.

A friend of mine hit a pedestrian once. Early morning and somewhat foggy. She was afraid to drive in conditions like this, and was the kind of person who detested cel phone use (make-up, etc) while driving. She never saw the person she hit. In an instant it was over and to this day she is terrified by the thought and worries about it every time she drives. In the end she was not charged by the court, but the local court of public opinion was out to hang her. It was an accident by all accounts, yet people wanted to harm her for the event.

All I want to say of this is that my prayers go out to both rider and driver. A life was lost, and I would bet that her (drivers) life will never be the same as result.

The drunk b-tards, or the malicious who harm and kill cyclists can spend the rest of their life behind bars. I hope she is not one of them. And I hope she can make something good of her life as a result of this.

Terrible news. My heart and prayers out to all involved.

[fstrthnu]

That's a shame. Some of the worst drivers in the world live in RI... Riding there can be very scary.

[ThasFACE]

That's a shame. Some of the worst drivers in the world live in RI... Riding there can be very scary.

I just got back from a cycling trip in Italy and, until now, I had never really appreciated how discourteous/oblivious motorists are in the states relative to our European counterparts. It was truly amazing to see how un-annoyed Italian drivers were by my presence on the road (no matter how busy it was). Granted, europe seems to have a _much_ larger cycling culture, but the difference was still striking.

That said, another spot that scares the bejesus out of me is eastern long island. It's worse than nyc, I think.

[Your_Friend!]

What would you do if......

Before I complete this question, let me first say that all of my condolances go out to the family in RI (and the many others) of the cyclist hit by the driver. It chills me every time I hear about this kind of sensless tragedy. I hate this kind of news.

But we here at this forum, or at least most of us, drive a car. Albeit we are more tuned into watching for cyclists and pedestrians - we still drive cars (and SUVs). What if you hit a cyclist? It could happen. What if you had your bikes on the roof after a group ride and it happened. Would the media say "cyclist driving SUV kills cyclist."
Would you be set free with a small fine? Or would you be one of the few who actually gets time in jail? What would happen?

I hate to pass judgement on the lady who drove the vehicle in this case. It is so easy to do. Insert the words "driving an SUV" and I am as guilty as anyone for stero-typing. Like everything, there are multiple sides to a story. She could have been guilty by putting on make-up, on her cel phone or simple as having a sneezing fit at the wheel that made her veer 3 feet to the right. We'll likely never know.

A friend of mine hit a pedestrian once. Early morning and somewhat foggy. She was afraid to drive in conditions like this, and was the kind of person who detested cel phone use (make-up, etc) while driving. She never saw the person she hit. In an instant it was over and to this day she is terrified by the thought and worries about it every time she drives. In the end she was not charged by the court, but the local court of public opinion was out to hang her. It was an accident by all accounts, yet people wanted to harm her for the event.

All I want to say of this is that my prayers go out to both rider and driver. A life was lost, and I would bet that her (drivers) life will never be the same as result.

The drunk b-tards, or the malicious who harm and kill cyclists can spend the rest of their life behind bars. I hope she is not one of them. And I hope she can make something good of her life as a result of this.

Terrible news. My heart and prayers out to all involved.



Frog Hair!

You Are Wise!

I Am Sad As Always

For Everyone Involved!

Friends!

Be Not So Quick

To Demonize!

The Roads Are Risky!

And _Very_ Dangerous

For Drivers, For Cyclists, For Pedestrians!


Love,
Your_Friend!

[Sandy]

What would you do if......

Before I complete this question, let me first say that all of my condolances go out to the family in RI (and the many others) of the cyclist hit by the driver. It chills me every time I hear about this kind of sensless tragedy. I hate this kind of news.

But we here at this forum, or at least most of us, drive a car. Albeit we are more tuned into watching for cyclists and pedestrians - we still drive cars (and SUVs). What if you hit a cyclist? It could happen. What if you had your bikes on the roof after a group ride and it happened. Would the media say "cyclist driving SUV kills cyclist."
Would you be set free with a small fine? Or would you be one of the few who actually gets time in jail? What would happen?

I hate to pass judgement on the lady who drove the vehicle in this case. It is so easy to do. Insert the words "driving an SUV" and I am as guilty as anyone for stero-typing. Like everything, there are multiple sides to a story. She could have been guilty by putting on make-up, on her cel phone or simple as having a sneezing fit at the wheel that made her veer 3 feet to the right. We'll likely never know.

A friend of mine hit a pedestrian once. Early morning and somewhat foggy. She was afraid to drive in conditions like this, and was the kind of person who detested cel phone use (make-up, etc) while driving. She never saw the person she hit. In an instant it was over and to this day she is terrified by the thought and worries about it every time she drives. In the end she was not charged by the court, but the local court of public opinion was out to hang her. It was an accident by all accounts, yet people wanted to harm her for the event.

All I want to say of this is that my prayers go out to both rider and driver. A life was lost, and I would bet that her (drivers) life will never be the same as result.

The drunk b-tards, or the malicious who harm and kill cyclists can spend the rest of their life behind bars. I hope she is not one of them. And I hope she can make something good of her life as a result of this.

Terrible news. My heart and prayers out to all involved.

An insight into cyclist/automobile accidents that we too seldom read here. Your thoughts make a great deal of sense. The burden is felt by both the cyclist and the driver, and cause is not always so clear. We often jump to conclusions without ample or full information. We should have empathy and concern for both the cyclist and the driver in many instances.


Sandy

[ti_boi]

Let me just say that any time you are involved in a fatal accident (though my experience was not in a car)....it marks you for life. There is guilt, shame, depression, and finally resolution that tests you to the very core -- and yes -- I know.

[Ray]

What would you do if......

What if you hit a cyclist? It could happen.

Terrible news. My heart and prayers out to all involved.
I did it once. I was only about 20 myself, on my way to work one morning in my old Honda Civic (this was almost 30 years ago, so Civics were still tiny little cars). I came to a yield sign about three blocks from my house, looked a little too far to my left, didn't see anyone coming and started to make a right hand turn. A little girl (maybe 11 or 12) was riding her bike, coming from my left but already in the intersection, and I hit her. I saw her at the last second and almost managed to avoid her, but not quite and I hit her a glancing blow that knocked her off her bike. Fortunately she was OK, a little scraped up and her bike was a little scraped up. I felt more terrible than I can begin to convey, even at that relatively insensitive age for the post-adolescent guy. Just horrible guilt. I took her home, we found her mom and explained what had happened. I offered to pay for her bike, any doctors bills, any ANYthing. Her mom was pretty shook up (as a parent myself now, I can't even IMAGINE how shook up she was) but she could see I was every bit as upset as she was and she was kind enough to forgive me and sort of let me off the hook.

It was totally my fault - there was no question about it. I just completely blew it and hit this completely innocent little kid. It was also totally an accident. She wasn't all that visible but it was my job to see her anyway and I was just a little too spacey, sleepy, pre-occupied, whatever... - and I didn't see her until it was too late. It still gives me the willies thinking about it now, all these years later. And she was fine. I can't imagine how I'd have dealt with it if she'd been badly hurt or, god forbid, killed. I don't think I could have dealt with that.

I'm not trying to turn the driver in this case or my far far far less serious accident into the victim - the rider who was hit in both cases was the victim and the driver was clearly in the wrong. But these things are almost never black and white and not without pretty serious consequences for all involved, regardless of the legal consequences.

It's just a damn shame.

-Ray

[barry1021]

I did it once. I was only about 20 myself, on my way to work one morning in my old Honda Civic (this was almost 30 years ago, so Civics were still tiny little cars). I came to a yield sign about three blocks from my house, looked a little too far to my left, didn't see anyone coming and started to make a right hand turn. A little girl (maybe 11 or 12) was riding her bike, coming from my left but already in the intersection, and I hit her. I saw her at the last second and almost managed to avoid her, but not quite and I hit her a glancing blow that knocked her off her bike. Fortunately she was OK, a little scraped up and her bike was a little scraped up. I felt more terrible than I can begin to convey, even at that relatively insensitive age for the post-adolescent guy. Just horrible guilt. I took her home, we found her mom and explained what had happened. I offered to pay for her bike, any doctors bills, any ANYthing. Her mom was pretty shook up (as a parent myself now, I can't even IMAGINE how shook up she was) but she could see I was every bit as upset as she was and she was kind enough to forgive me and sort of let me off the hook.

It was totally my fault - there was no question about it. I just completely blew it and hit this completely innocent little kid. It was also totally an accident. She wasn't all that visible but it was my job to see her anyway and I was just a little too spacey, sleepy, pre-occupied, whatever... - and I didn't see her until it was too late. It still gives me the willies thinking about it now, all these years later. And she was fine. I can't imagine how I'd have dealt with it if she'd been badly hurt or, god forbid, killed. I don't think I could have dealt with that.

I'm not trying to turn the driver in this case or my far far far less serious accident into the victim - the rider who was hit in both cases was the victim and the driver was clearly in the wrong. But these things are almost never black and white and not without pretty serious consequences for all involved, regardless of the legal consequences.

It's just a damn shame.

-Ray

into a near tragedy, Ray. Thanks for sharing

b21

[Bud_E]

Weirdly, in a way it may be a blessing to have a close call like that when you are young because for the rest of your life you will drive that much more carefully. In the long run that incident may have saved someone else's life.

[BumbleBeeDave]

We see all these threads here about cyclists getting "mowed down" by cars and yes, each and every one IS a tragedy. But to be fair we are not the only ones at risk. Every day over a hundred people are killed by cars hitting each other. I think the last figures I saw were over 40,000 deaths annually in car wrecks. And I have no idea how many pedestrians are killed every year.

Whenever I ride I try really hard to keep in mind that there are not just a lot of careless and/or angry and/or drunk drivers out there out to hit cyclists. They are out there to hit anything in their way. And they do. I just try to keep my eyes and ears open and make sure it isn't me or my loved ones that they hit. There's not much else you can do unless you never want to leave your house.

That being said, the lack of enforcement of the responsibility of being a driver in this country is criminal in itself. And it's not going to change until there are enough cyclists out there dependent on bikes for real transportation to constitute a real political force and force some change, just like organizations like MADD did with drunk driving. Will that ever happen? I predict it will when the price of gas goes high enough. But until then you can either stay indoors or just be careful out there.

BBD

[RIHans]

The area where this happened is very close to where the Ninigret Park Crit
course is. There are no details as of yet, no charges , etc.
Hans

FYI Thursday AM...
A story update in todays Providence Journal


http://www.projo.com/ri/charlestown/content/CHASAX_09-06-07_DS70V8G.326bd86.html

[Dekonick]

Yesterday I saw a car weaving on Rt 100 - a major highway. The driver was READING A #%#$ BOOK!!!!

Accidents happen, but geez!

[Ray]

Yesterday I saw a car weaving on Rt 100 - a major highway. The driver was READING A #%#$ BOOK!!!!

Accidents happen, but geez!
Which brings up a really important question that there isn't a clear answer to - how much distraction is acceptable? We all drive with distractions. Sometimes we're a little bit sleepy or spaced out (my own problem when I hit the little girl I talked about above). We listen to the radio, we listen to CDs (and reach for new ones from time to time), we talk to passengers in the car. We seem to have deemed these acceptable levels of distraction. Other things, like READING A #%#$ BOOK!!!! clearly aren't acceptable. I'd put text messaging and putting on make-up in that same category. But what about cell phones? They create a danger, but is it really more distracting to talk to someone on a cell phone than to talk to someone in the back seat or passenger seat? Does hands-free make a difference? How about books on tape - they can take you pretty far from the mental reality of the traffic you're in. How many of us haven't eaten a burger or something while behind the wheel?

The point is there are all sorts of levels of distraction for drivers - some we've determined are OK and some we've determined aren't. But LOTS of them exist in a gray area where we haven't really made a determination but they can clearly take the driver's attention away to the point that they can cause accidents and fatalities.

I'm not proposing a solution, just a reminder that while its occasionally black and white, it usually isn't.

-Ray

[Ray]

Weirdly, in a way it may be a blessing to have a close call like that when you are young because for the rest of your life you will drive that much more carefully. In the long run that incident may have saved someone else's life.
I wish I could say that was true. I'm a pretty careful driver now but for many years I can't say that I was. I like to think I was a good driver, but we all like to think that. I drove too fast and too aggressively for many years into my 30s. For sure, I never came close to making that particular mistake again, but I came damn close to making plenty of other ones that could have been just as serious and much worse. Some of it due to stupidity, some of it due to youthful hormones (is there a difference between that and stupidity?). Driving is an inherently dangerous activity and VERY few of us really drive as defensively as we should.

I've had a couple of close calls on the bike over the years that weren't my fault (and a few that were) and I'd get REALLY upset with the drivers that caused them. But I'd think back to my youth and realize I probably caused a similar number of close calls, not for cyclists but for other motorists.

-Ray

[RIHans]

From this mornings Providence Journal


http://www.projo.com/ri/charlestown/content/CHASAX_09-06-07_DS70V8G.326bd86.html

[LesMiner]

As I was reading through this thread I also had the noon time news on (multitasking?). Anyway, they just reported a cyclist hit and killed by a school bus near Lake Calhoun in Minneapolis. That area of Minneapolis is a very popular place to ride. It is also congested with traffic. They did interview a cyclist near the crash. He looked familar to me from many TCBC rides in the area. Is it me or are there more injuries and deaths from cars hitting cyclists?

[MilanoTom]

I can't think of much to add to this:

From the Providence Journal:

Westerly woman charged in fatal accident

01:00 AM EDT on Thursday, September 6, 2007

By Katie Mulvaney

Journal Staff Writer

CHARLESTOWN — The police yesterday charged the driver of the sport-utility vehicle that hit and killed a bicyclist on Route 1 Tuesday with driving to endanger, death resulting.

Pamela J. Hurst, 59, was arrested on a warrant yesterday afternoon at her home at 17 Danielle Ave., Westerly, Charlestown police Lt. Jack Shippee said.

The police say Hurst was driving her Buick Rendezvous south on Route 1 around 4 p.m. Tuesday when she veered into the breakdown lane, striking a bicyclist traveling in the same direction near Kings Factory Road.

The bicyclist, Frank J. Cabral, 41, of 90 Sheffield St., Warwick, was pronounced dead at the scene. The police say Cabral was staying at a cottage on Matunuck Beach Road and had decided to go for a ride.

Witnesses said Hurst left the road about 200 feet north of where Cabral was cycling, Shippee said. The SUV had damage to the front hood, windshield and roof on the driver’s side, he said.

Hurst was treated at Westerly Hospital and released and showed no signs of intoxication, Shippee said.

“We’re not sure why she drifted out of her lane of travel,” Shippee said.

The speed limit along that stretch of road is 50 mph.

Hurst was released yesterday on $25,000 cash bail and is due in District Court, South Kingstown, today.

Phone calls to Hurst’s home were not answered yesterday.

[Tom]

A couple of years ago I was giving my wife a ride from where she worked to where her car was being fixed. I was at a stop sign at a side street stopped waiting to take a right turn onto the main street, watching left as the cars went by. After the cars cleared I was about to take off and just glanced to the right. A kid on his bike flashed in front of me, passing from my right to left, he was going at least 15-20 down the left hand sidewalk. If I hadn't looked he'd have run right into my fender or I'd have run right over him. It can be that close. You have to be wide awake, look both ways and watch your mirrors. Which reminds me...

Three incidents. The other day I was on Union Street in heavy traffic and two guys, one with CBRC shirt, rode up behind and through the traffic on the right and then cut over to take a left. Not a problem, I do that all the time, but the issue here was that they were doing a very poor job of matching traffic speed. Pass, fall behind, repass, fall behind... I was watching them but I wonder how many other drivers were aware of them or knew what to expect. Me, I would have found a big aerodynamically poor car and drafted off it. They had to keep slowing to make it between traffic and around parked cars. The other day I followed a Jeep Cherokee at 30 and practically never had to turn the pedals. I drive an Element, I have no idea why they didn't just fall in line. When they took the left, there was tire smoke from a guy coming the other way.

So, third incident, this morning. A busy road, commuter traffic all ways, I'm waiting for a light at a crossroads. I look left and see traffic backed up around the corner, all patiently taking their turn at the left. Around the corner comes a guy driving the shoulder, I watch him for maybe 100 yards as he passes what, 10-15 cars on the right. Not uncommon, many people do that and then shoot the straight. Dicey if some guy is going straight, too, but most people are turning left so they play the odds. No turn signal or anything, but when he got to the turn, he just turned left too and forced his way in. I started laughing. It was such a wonderfully ******* move. He looked so startled when I rode up to his window and read him his license plate.