So just what is this place- The Serotta Forum?

[Sandy]

Just what is this place we refer to as the Serotta Forum? Is it simply one of the many message boards the exist within the internet community, just one of the myriad of sites devoted to so many different interests? Or does this place possess something that is special, seldom found elsewhere?

Perhaps because of my limited exposure to the internet and my own limited personal experiences, I may be wrong in my evaluation, but I truly find this place special.

Where can someone post a thread about personal issues and get such compassionate, sensitive, caring and insightful advice? The warmth and genuine concern are most obvious. Ask a question about cycling, no matter how insignificant, and replies will abound, given in a most friendly and helpful manner. Somehow, posts are almost always well thought out, with superior content, articulated in an easy to read and understood manner.

Off topic threads seem to generate very meaningful and helpful replies, as somewhere within the forum exists expertise in most every field of interest. Ask a question, and appropriate responses will readily appear.

I would feel very comfortable in purchasing items from almost anyone who posts regularly on the Serotta Forum, and would be most willing to pay well before delivery as members here seem to possess integrity and a sense of what is fair to both the purchaser and the seller.

So what makes this place so special? Very simply- the people who comprise it. We are most fortunate to have a diversity of people, with different perceptions, needs, experiences, knowlege base,....But it doesn't matter, as somehow we all blend harmoniously into a genuine group of caring, warm, sensitive, compassionate, and helpful people- We are friends and most of us have never met. Perhaps, Ben Serotta has an influence here, although he does not post.

Bottom line, I am most grateful to you that are part of this wonderful place, we call the Serotta Forum. You have genuinely added beauty and richness to my life and I am grateful to so many of you. If I can ever help any of you, please let me know. Bless you all!


Sandy

[e-RICHIE]

i think sandy-issimo gets it atmo.

[Ahneida Ride]

:banana:
Brilliant Sandy! So ture. I thank all for tolerating me and getting me out of
Bi Cycle Diapers. This place is really special. You make it that way Sandy.

:p ;) :D :banana: :banana:

[Bill Bove]

One of my favorite bike shops in the winter. a place where many of us would meet after work on a cold, dreary night and talk about bikes and solve of the worlds problems too. There was a wide diversity of chareters who frequented that shop, I've even reconnected to a few of them here on the forum. Some of them had better jobs and more money than some of the others but we were all equals in the shop, brought together by both the bike and our host who owned the shop. For hours we would talk about everything and nothing. And come back the next day to do it all over again.

That shop is still open 1500 miles to the north of me and I try to make my own shop resemble that one in as many ways as possible. I will consider myself successful when I think I have done that no matter what side of the first million it happens at.

[stevep]

One of my favorite bike shops in the winter. a place where many of us would meet after work on a cold, dreary night and talk about bikes and solve of the worlds problems too. There was a wide diversity of chareters who frequented that shop, I've even reconnected to a few of them here on the forum. Some of them had better jobs and more money than some of the others but we were all equals in the shop, brought together by both the bike and our host who owned the shop. For hours we would talk about everything and nothing. And come back the next day to do it all over again.

That shop is still open 1500 miles to the north of me and I try to make my own shop resemble that one in as many ways as possible. I will consider myself successful when I think I have done that no matter what side of the first million it happens at.

frank says hello.
watch the celtics in 07/8
they got some new tall dude.

[barry1021]

I'd sticky that--no better welcome mat than that post.
b21

[Fixed]

Just what is this place we refer to as the Serotta Forum? Is it simply one of the many message boards the exist within the internet community, just one of the myriad of sites devoted to so many different interests? Or does this place possess something that is special, seldom found elsewhere?

Pehaps because of my limited exposure to the internet and my own limited perosnal experiences, I may be wrong in my evaluation, but I truly find this place special.

Where can someone post a thread about personal issues and get such compassionate, sensitive, caring and insightful advice? The warmth and genuine concern are most obvious. Ask a question about cycling, no matter how insignificant, and replies will abound, given in a most friendly and helpful manner. Somehow, posts are almost always well thought out, with superior content, articulated in an easy to read and understood manner.

Off topic threads seem to generate very meaningful and helpful replies, as somewhere within the forum exists expertise in most every field of interest. Ask a question, and appropriate responses will readily appear.

I would feel very comfortable in purchasing items from almost anyone who posts regularly on the Serotta Forum, and would be most willing to pay well before delivery as members here seem to possess integrity and a sense of what is fair to both the purchaser and the seller.

So what makes this place so special? Very simply- the people who comprise it. We are most fortunate to have a diversity of people, with different perceptions, needs, experiences, knowlege base,....But it doesn't matter, as somehow we all blend harmoniously into a genuine group of caring, warm, sensitive, compasionate, and helpful people- We are friends and most of us have never met. Perhaps, Ben Serotta has an influence here, although he does not post.

Bottom line, I am most grateful to you that are part of this wonderful place, we call the Serotta Forum. You have genuinely added beauty and richness to my life and I am grateful to so many of you. If I can ever help any of you, please let me know. Bless you all!





Sandy

+1

well said bro
cheers :beer:

[shinomaster]

I heart Sandy and the Serotta owners forum, as well as all of the friends I have made here both real and imaginary.

[Elefantino]

The only downside is that I have met so few of you.

I agree with Sandy. A great, great place. It's the only Web site (other than the NYTimes) that I go to every day that I'm on a computer, without fail.

I find it fun, silly, touching, honest and, above all, informative.

:banana:

[eddief]

all sarcasm aside for one second, it is an interesting place, and a good community.

i don't tend to join much and most would not have me anyway, but here i feel at least 25% accepted.

i enjoy the bike conversations, but really appreciate those times when i get to pose a question and then learn from the intelligences of the rest of the individuals in this unique group...from all over the damn place.

[Ginger]

all sarcasm aside for one second, it is an interesting place, and a good community.

i don't tend to join much and most would not have me anyway, but here i feel at least 25% accepted.

i enjoy the bike conversations, but really appreciate those times when i get to pose a question and then learn from the intellegences of the rest of the individuals in this unique group...from all over the damn place.

With a K eddie...with a K

Sandy, thanks for the reminder.
I've met many nice people through the forum, and hope to meet many more.
Ginger

[thwart]

I'd sticky that--no better welcome mat than that post. +1 on that.
This place has a vibe like no other internet bike site... well, at least none I'm aware of. :D

Many thanks for support/sponsoring it go to Ben, and all the Serotta folks.

[ti_boi]

We are all different -- but we all love to ride -- and that is good enough for me. :beer:

[Too Tall]

Super Speical Sailing Sandy Serene Sometimes Silly.

By your leave SIR!

[hansolo758]

Just what is this place we refer to as the Serotta Forum? Is it simply one of the many message boards the exist within the internet community, just one of the myriad of sites devoted to so many different interests? Or does this place possess something that is special, seldom found elsewhere?

Perhaps because of my limited exposure to the internet and my own limited perosnal experiences, I may be wrong in my evaluation, but I truly find this place special.

Where can someone post a thread about personal issues and get such compassionate, sensitive, caring and insightful advice? The warmth and genuine concern are most obvious. Ask a question about cycling, no matter how insignificant, and replies will abound, given in a most friendly and helpful manner. Somehow, posts are almost always well thought out, with superior content, articulated in an easy to read and understood manner.

Off topic threads seem to generate very meaningful and helpful replies, as somewhere within the forum exists expertise in most every field of interest. Ask a question, and appropriate responses will readily appear.

I would feel very comfortable in purchasing items from almost anyone who posts regularly on the Serotta Forum, and would be most willing to pay well before delivery as members here seem to possess integrity and a sense of what is fair to both the purchaser and the seller.

So what makes this place so special? Very simply- the people who comprise it. We are most fortunate to have a diversity of people, with different perceptions, needs, experiences, knowlege base,....But it doesn't matter, as somehow we all blend harmoniously into a genuine group of caring, warm, sensitive, compasionate, and helpful people- We are friends and most of us have never met. Perhaps, Ben Serotta has an influence here, although he does not post.

Bottom line, I am most grateful to you that are part of this wonderful place, we call the Serotta Forum. You have genuinely added beauty and richness to my life and I am grateful to so many of you. If I can ever help any of you, please let me know. Bless you all!


Sandy

This post epitomizes it: knowledgeable, thoughtful, kind, people post here. When things get ugly (and they do sometimes), thankfully, it is uncommon.

[coylifut]

this is my favorite on line place to visit. I've met Zank, Myette, Shino, Manet, Ginger and Too face-to-face and have met many more of you virtually. Great folks all of 'em and I look forward to meeting many more of you. Perhaps NAHBS will make that so.

[Bud]

+1 on what others have said. Even when I don't visit the forum for a week or so, I still feel welcomed (once I get caught up...). I like it here and I learn a lot. Plus most of you folks are entertaining.

[Kevan]

didn't you?

I suppose you're wondering how I knew. Well, for one, the front hedge in your yard has been clipped back. And the second clue...all the squirrels are falling from that tree closest to your kitchen's vent. And they don't care.

I'll be right over.

[Sandy]

didn't you?

I suppose you're wondering how I knew. Well, for one, the front hedge in your yard has been clipped back. And the second clue...all the squirrels are falling from that tree closest to your kitchen's vent. And they don't care.

I'll be right over.

I hope so! The land mines have been ready for months!! :) :)



Sensitive Sandy

[Kevan]

He loves me.

[xlbs]

keeps me smiling and interested and challenged and...well, all of you understand...

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . for cutting to the heart of the matter in a non-threatening, non-judgemental way. It's a way I've got to confess I've been jealous of occasionally.

The forum has always reminded of my favorite table at my favorite local bar--if I had one. At this table, no matter what time of the day or night, you can always find some cycling buddies who will enjoy hearing about your latest ride, your latest neat equipment discovery--or commiserate when your health goes south, your kids don't pay attention to you any more, or your wife walks out.

The friends at this table never kick you when you're down, never judge you unfairly, and give you the benefit of the doubt when you've had a bad day and you're feeling grouchy. When you put your foot in your mouth, they gently help you pull it out. When they disagree with you, they do it in a respectful, courteous way. They don't taunt you, make sarcastic fun of your misfortune, or use the occasion to build themselves up by tearing you down. And when a new guy or gal wanders in wearing his cycling cap or those skin shorts with the thin spot, they make him or her welcome, buy them a beer, and wait till they can discreetly point out that maybe it's time to replace those shorts without embarrassing the newbie in front of the group

Sandy is one of those people that does all of the above, and inspires us to treat him and others the same way. If I get a bit grouchy, uppity, or self-righteous sounding at times, it's because I'm thinking that some people here seem to have forgotten how we should really treat each other--with courtesy, graciousness, and the Golden Rule.

Group hug. :D

BBD

[Steevo]

This is a great place for so many reasons. I've learned so much about bikes and other stuff from all the generous folks who contribute here. Reading the forum (almost) daily has influenced my cycling life immeasurably. I'm a long-time lurker, but it really feels like its time to participate (what the heck).

Since first visiting the Forum years ago, this place has influenced my cycling life in many ways I bought a Fabulous Ferrous Fierte (alliterative apologies), planted my arse on a comfy Brooks saddle, the wheels are a perfect-for-me set of Ergott-built wheels, and my wool-sensitive skin is getting used to a nice Merino jersey. When the ride is over, the wonderful Forum-inspired tomato & cucumber salad(House of Osman) is the best. All this great stuff is Forum influence. And there's so much more...

So thanks to all of you for sharing your knowledge and humor and selves.

[MarleyMon]

Y'all seem like pretty decent folks.
Plus you like bikes.

[Steve Hampsten]

Unlike a TV show, we don't always laugh, cry, and learn a little bit about ourselves each week.

But it's still a great party. Thanks for letting me crash it so often!

[Fixed]

you sir are a honored guest

[PBWrench]

Sandy -- thank you for putting this experience into context and wrapping it with a bow. I'm embarassed to admit how much time I invest (never waste!) on this site. I'm a fairly busy guy, but I guess I keep on returning because I enjoy the knowledge sharing, gentle ribbing, great advice and total drivel -- in short - hanging with friends. Thanks everyone for making this fun.

[rounder]

I stumbled on this place while trying to figure out what to do with a frame I got...and then decided that this is sort of like an on-line bike shop where everyone hangs out while watching somebody build a bike. Then, realized that this site was more than that..itsa way of life.

[vaxn8r]

I bumped into this place about 4 years ago. Since then I've ridden with at least 6 people who I first met on this forum. I also bought my Legend on this forum. Those are the kind of things that set this place apart.

[Louis]

The friends at this table never kick you when you're down, never judge you unfairly, and give you the benefit of the doubt when you've had a bad day and you're feeling grouchy. When you put your foot in your mouth, they gently help you pull it out. When they disagree with you, they do it in a respectful, courteous way. They don't taunt you, make sarcastic fun of your misfortune, or use the occasion to build themselves up by tearing you down. And when a new guy or gal wanders in wearing his cycling cap or those skin shorts with the thin spot, they make him or her welcome, buy them a beer, and wait till they can discreetly point out that maybe it's time to replace those shorts without embarrassing the newbie in front of the group

Dave, you're setting the bar pretty high, IMO. I think the place you describe is the "Happy Forum in the Sky," not something we are likely to find on this plane. Don't forget, one person's taunt is another's witty repartee. However, one can always hope...

Louis

[swoop]

it's nice to have a place where i can clearly not know what i'm taking about and yet still say it anyway.

[William]

I've met some great people here. Some in person, many more virtually. Those I've subjected my mug to....

Ahneida Ride
Bradford
Beungood
Zank (Mike Zanconato)
Molly22
Keno
Too Tall
Coylifut
Bruce K
Ginger
csb-Manet-?
Climb
Gob
davids
Stevep
Sandy
kevan
BBDave
Ben S.
Richard Sachs (Does throwing Twizzler bits at him from the sidelines of the Cross Natz count????) ;)

I know there are more of you but I'm not the best with names...faces I remember...and I do remember you. Many others I have met on-line through correspondence and buying & trading goods. Good friends abound.

I participate on a couple of other forums (different topic) and none of them hold a candle to this place in breadth of knowledge, warmth and sharing.


William

[Bruce K]

I don't know of another place where you could anounce a vacation and have people jump up and say "Come ride with me. I'll pick you up at your hotel." or "I'll meet you at..." or "Don't bother to bring your bike, I'll loan you mine." or "hey who's going to ..., let's all get together" and THEY DO.

Or how about david's thread of the damaged bike where he got loaner offers?

Despite our occassional flames, rants, or dis's (sp?) this is a pretty amazing group of folks who generally exhibit outstanding cameraderie, generosity, and a pretty good sense of humor.

I mean hey, look how many folks have ridden with me! Now THAT takes a sense of humor! ;)

BK

[Tom]

I learn a lot around this place about a lot of things other than bikes. Economics, technology, cars... the list goes on... and an awful lot about psychology. This'd be a good study for some undergrad psych major, I bet.

[djg]

It's a warm and thoughtful post, Sandy.

Here's the thing: although the Internet's a great way to find info (and noise), and a great way to communicate with folks I know, I don't typically think I actually get to know folks just by chatting on the Internet. I have, however, met in person folks I've met on this particular board, and it turns out that sometimes, things -- and people -- are just as they seem. Sandy's a virtual mensch because he is, in fact, a mensch.

[e-RICHIE]

It's a warm and thoughtful post, Sandy.

Sandy's a virtual mensch because he is, in fact, a mensch.
he makes me plotz daily atmo.

[OldDog]

Your a good and wise man Sandy.

Now, no more mushy talk. I'm thinking of starting a virtual dog walking service, any advice from the forum pals?

Campy romps over Sram.

Anyone know where I can get a good deal on a '62 Simplex front changer.

Man, I cannot stand the LBS's.






:D
:banana:

[BumbleBeeDave]

Dave, you're setting the bar pretty high, IMO. I think the place you describe is the "Happy Forum in the Sky," not something we are likely to find on this plane. Don't forget, one person's taunt is another's witty repartee. However, one can always hope...

Louis

. . . then there will be no bar--and the lowest common denominator is not one I want to live by.

BBD

[Dave B]

I cannot express in words the importance of the virtual friendships I have made here. I expressed my families financial difficulties here before we told our actual family.

With the compasion of many so abundant, this forum offers us a place to call home...in a manner of speaking. no matter where I am in the country or state of mind, this place goes on with and with out me.

Serotta gets kudos for continuing to keep it open for us, but for all members, the lurkers and essential personalities this place remains alive. The kind of alive that encourages and defends our lifestyles and passions.

I am a perfect example of someone who has benefited from kindness as i have met no one in person, but the many emails, PM and posts have enriched my life so that I can look at tings with a more positive perspective.

Thak you all for this place and especially Sandy for your thoughts and wonderful way of looking at life.

El Presidente

[Archibald]

. . . then there will be no bar--and the lowest common denominator is not one I want to live by.

BBD
http://spencepublishing.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/dysfunction_1.jpg

[Len J]

let me say that I like this forum.

But, I don't think it's all that different than other forums I frequent.

Just like other forums, their are really classy posters and real jerks. The forum is a microcosm of the real world. Their are safe people & not so safe people. Their are posters with a chip on their shoulder and posters that live humility.

What is unique about this forum IMO is the bike expert knowledge base. It seems more "concentrated" here than elsewhere.

I've ridden with posters from this forum as well as others......people that turn up for these rides tend to be those whose persona IRL most closely match their internet persona. I've never been disappointed in the Internet people I've met IRL....no matter the forum.

Obviously (From this thread) YMMV.

But that's my take.

len

[Bud_E]

he makes me plotz daily atmo.

I'm kvelling as we sit here.

+1 to Sandy's thoughts. This forum, warts and all, is an amazing resource for cycling and non-cycling topics and has an amazing range of personalities. Even when it gets a little "contentious" I often learn something -- it's all part of life.

[e-RICHIE]

I'm kvelling as we sit here.

+1 to Sandy's thoughts. This forum, warts and all, is an amazing resource for cycling and non-cycling topics and has an amazing range of personalities. Even when it gets a little "contentious" I often learn something -- it's all part of life.
have a glass of tea and some mandel bread atmo.

http://media.npr.org/kitchen/mandel200.jpg

[Your_Friend!]

Friends! This Is The Best Song _Ever_! Please Enjoy! (http://youtube.com/watch?v=ne7fPpxAnuM)


Friends!


It Always Makes Me

Happy _And_ Sad!

At The Same Time!

Love,
Your_Friend!

[e-RICHIE]

was that pre-bubbles i did not see him in the video atmo -

http://www.mjsite.com/images/mjbubbles.jpg

[Bud_E]

have a glass of tea and some mandel bread atmo.

http://media.npr.org/kitchen/mandel200.jpg

I'll bring the Mah Jongg tiles.

[barry1021]

have a glass of tea and some mandel bread atmo.

http://media.npr.org/kitchen/mandel200.jpg

at a stop on the Farm Ride in Northampton MA a few week ago. A little hard to swallow in the heat, but man it was just almost as good as my late mother's

b21

[davids]

Well put, Sandy.

And I can't tell you how pleased I am to see CG and RS wandering back in from time to time. The bar is higher (pun intended) with them here.

[e-RICHIE]

it's a mitzvah for us too atmo -

http://hotbread.net/family/storylinks/bar%20mitzva3.jpg

[Nick H.]

Sorry to interrupt the self-congratulatory waffle, but this is far from the best cycling forum. There's too much unmerited *****iness, sniping, sarcasm and bullying and a ton of misguided misinformation. I was particularly dismayed by the responses given to Mikki when she was asking for advice about setting up a business recently.

[Your_Friend!]

Sorry to interrupt the self-congratulatory waffle, but this is far from the best cycling forum. There's too much unmerited *****iness, sniping, sarcasm and bullying and a ton of misguided misinformation. I was particularly dismayed by the responses given to Mikki when she was asking for advice about setting up a business recently.


Silly Nick!

Everybody Knows

The Best Waffles

Are Made In Belgium!


Love,
Your_Friend!

[davids]

Nick,

Which forum(s) do you believe to be better?

...and I was so sorry to read that your Ottrott has been stolen! To put it mildly, that sucks.

[Nick H.]

Thanks. The rate of bike theft over here really brings me down.

anothercyclingforum.com is streets ahead of other fora. The quality of information and writing is unmatched and the standard of debate is very high. Disagreements never, ever descend into personal attacks, and the mutual support for people's personal problems is intelligent and constructive. It's only a small place, but 61 of the members are doing PBP right now. They are even handier than Sheldon Brown.

[e-RICHIE]

another cyclingforum.com is streets ahead of other fora. The quality of information and writing <cut>.

i always wondered how that place got on. i posted there
since 2003 or so. it seems like the same 7-8 guys all the
time and through the ages; coap, erik, sandi, jimbo and
others. it's almost like a salon or, better yet - a private
email cc field chain letter. i mean that in a good way atmo.
it's like a library room!

[Sandy]

Sorry to interrupt the self-congratulatory waffle, but this is far from the best cycling forum. There's too much unmerited *****iness, sniping, sarcasm and bullying and a ton of misguided misinformation. I was particularly dismayed by the responses given to Mikki when she was asking for advice about setting up a business recently.

Would you please direct me to that thread, if possible. I would like to read it. I know that we are not perfect here and it does get out of hand sometimes, but seldom, I believe.


Sandy

[Nick H.]

It's become much busier lately after welcoming refugees from bikeradar.com (formerly cyclingplus.co.uk) where there have been a few fireworks.

ACF is very quiet right now because so many of the regulars are in France. Next week it will be bursting with war stories - I can't wait!

[e-RICHIE]

It's become much busier lately after welcoming refugees from bikeradar.com (formerly cyclingplus.co.uk) where there have been a few fireworks.

ACF is very quiet right now because so many of the regulars are in France. Next week it will be bursting with war stories - I can't wait!
i think the place was at its heyday back when anvil bikes sponsored the
shebang atmo. i'm not just sayin' that because don is my muse, i really
mean it atmo. when he underwrote it the place seemed to have a beat
that has not appeared since. again - don't construe that as a criticism;
i do like it over there atmo.

[fiamme red]

i always wondered how that place got on. i posted there
since 2003 or so. it seems like the same 7-8 guys all the
time and through the ages; coap, erik, sandi, jimbo and
others. it's almost like a salon or, better yet - a private
email cc field chain letter. i mean that in a good way atmo.
it's like a library room!He's referring to this atmo:

http://www.anothercyclingforum.com/index.php.

[Nick H.]

Are we talking about the same forum? www.anothercyclingforum.com I don't remember Anvil Bikes' involvement. But I haven't been there for ever. The place is mostly Brits, but run by an American - I'm not sure why a Colorado framebuilder would want to sponsor it! Or do I have the wrong Anvil Bikes?

[e-RICHIE]

He's referring to this atmo:

http://www.anothercyclingforum.com/index.php.


Are we talking about the same forum? www.anothercyclingforum.com I don't remember Anvil Bikes' involvement. But I haven't been there for ever. The place is mostly Brits, but run by an American - I'm not sure why a Colorado framebuilder would want to sponsor it! Or do I have the wrong Anvil Bikes?
ohmyfreaking god so many forums so little time atmo.
apologies to the rim guy, and nick, and mikki, and bb dave, and andrew atmo...

[Nick H.]

Would you please direct me to that thread, if possible. I would like to read it. I know that we are not perfect here and it does get out of hand sometimes, but seldom, I believe. Sandy

I've searched for it, but can't find it. Maybe Mikki deleted it? She hasn't posted here for a while, and I wouldn't blame her for giving up on the place. She asked for help but a lot of people piled in and ripped her to shreds - it seemed like schoolyard bullying or good old-fashioned sexism to me. Very strange behaviour for a country which takes pride in entrepreneurs who try, fail, and try again.

[Sandy]

Thanks for the attempt. A poster does not have the ability to delete a thread. Perhaps Serotta itself deleted the thread as they may not have liked some of the responses and the direction the thread was headed.

I am sorry that you do not really enjoy the forum, and particularly so for the reasons that you have mentioned. I have received remarkable support, sensitivity, concern, and insightful help when I brought up personal situations. I have made friends here that I have met and friends here that I have never met. I used to be a loner and emotional cripple. Cycling helped open up a new world to me and the Serotta Forum simply expanded it greatly, not so much by cycling content, but by personal relationships and insight I have gained through the wisdom, experiences, and genuine help from others.

I hope you spend more time here and have a better experience. There really are some genuinely wonderful and caring people who frequent this place.


Sorry Sandy

[Nick H.]

Thanks. I appreciate it.

Judging from this I think James must have deleted that whole thread. http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=31779 I think Mikki deserves a few apologies by PM.

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . but THIS one has not been.

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=31298&page=1&pp=15

Mikki posts photos of her new bike, makes a few observations--and the same people who piled on her in the other thread start giving her sh*t in this one, too! There are even a few obvious references to the other thread where she simply asked for help in thinking of possible names for a bike business she and her husband were considering starting.

This sort of stuff has absolutely no place here, yet when I call someone out for it there always seem to be a few others who jump in to re-affirm how they thrive on the "edginess" of it all and tell me I'm the problem for saying something. Very unfortunate . . .

BBD

[Your_Friend!]

. . . but THIS one has not been.

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=31298&page=1&pp=15

Mikki posts photos of her new bike, makes a few observations--and the same people who piled on her in the other thread start giving her sh*t in this one, too! There are even a few obvious references to the other thread where she simply asked for help in thinking of possible names for a bike business she and her husband were considering starting.

This sort of stuff has absolutely no place here, yet when I call someone out for it there always seem to be a few others who jump in to re-affirm how they thrive on the "edginess" of it all and tell me I'm the problem for saying something. Very unfortunate . . .

BBD


Bumble Bee Dave!


Sometimes The World Is That Way! (http://youtube.com/watch?v=ne7fPpxAnuM)



Love,
Your_Friend!

[dirtdigger88]

I hope this helps Dave-

http://www.trizle.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/08/motivator2705629-thanksflickmotivator.thumbnail.jpg

you ARE one of the cool kids . . . like it or not

Jason

[e-RICHIE]

atmo - (http://youtube.com/watch?v=U8TnhNxKNlU)

[pdxmech13]

Catanza gets it

[mosca]

anothercyclingforum.com is streets ahead of other fora. The quality of information and writing is unmatched and the standard of debate is very high. Disagreements never, ever descend into personal attacks, and the mutual support for people's personal problems is intelligent and constructive. It's only a small place, but 61 of the members are doing PBP right now. They are even handier than Sheldon Brown.
I've noticed a difference in the nature of the discourse on some of the British forums I've visited, as opposed to US-based fora. The British style seems to get contentious very quickly, but issues are usually resolved quickly as well. The Brits don't seem to fear apology and seem far more willing to concede a point, as opposed to us Yanks who will often defend an untenable position to the bitter end.

It reminds me of a situation I observed during a visit to London a few years ago. A man who had apparently been accused of some infraction by a police officer (bobby?) was actually having a somewhat heated but also civil discussion with said officer regarding the situation. I was a little surprised to see some level of mutual respect from both participants - trying to "discuss" something in this manner with an American cop is a fruitless exercise in self-abuse as far as I can tell.

Anyhoo, all this is just my long-winded way of saying that maybe we can learn a thing or two from our British "compatriots", yes?

[oracle]

this place - is a part of the real world (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2007/08/21/nytfrontpage/082107POD_index.html), which laughs at the petty, irrelevant whining (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2007/08/21/world/20070821_HURRICANE_index.html) about who is cool and who is not. Furthermore, it is offended. (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2007/08/17/world/20070817_PERU_index.html)

[swoop]

i say things here to folks in the familiar (using the venacular of an informal coversation like i do with my bike buddies) and with the same tone i do in real life over coffee. it's a freaking bike forum. the advice tends to be good and or bad and sincere. you work it out for yourselves. usually its funny or interesting and at best.. passionate.

no apologies from here.

[dave1215]

I've noticed a difference in the nature of the discourse on some of the British forums I've visited, as opposed to US-based fora. The British style seems to get contentious very quickly, but issues are usually resolved quickly as well. The Brits don't seem to fear apology and seem far more willing to concede a point, as opposed to us Yanks who will often defend an untenable position to the bitter end.

It reminds me of a situation I observed during a visit to London a few years ago. A man who had apparently been accused of some infraction by a police officer (bobby?) was actually having a somewhat heated but also civil discussion with said officer regarding the situation. I was a little surprised to see some level of mutual respect from both participants - trying to "discuss" something in this manner with an American cop is a fruitless exercise in self-abuse as far as I can tell.

Anyhoo, all this is just my long-winded way of saying that maybe we can learn a thing or two from our British "compatriots", yes?

yes!!!, http://youtube.com/watch?v=pDat9zdw7Gs&mode=related&search=

[mosca]

yes!!!, http://youtube.com/watch?v=pDat9zdw7Gs&mode=related&search=
Oh man - there goes my productivity for the afternoon.

Actually this forum most often reminds me of this:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=y05EmK66Gsk

[1centaur]

At the risk of losing the whimsical edge, this forum is both what Sandy says and what BBD says. The key to enjoying it is avoiding the threads that wander off in pointless or worse directions. Its strengths are average age and experience, which increase the information quotient and tend to keep the compassion level higher than in many forums, but age and experience also lead to a cantankerous "I'm right, GD it!" attitude that precludes much critical self examination, some of it needed (pictures to follow no doubt). One of the joys of getting older is moving past such self examination, which is why older people tend to retreat into familiar cocoons (more pictures?). That habit is antithetical to the nature of forums, and so we get unresolvable conflict.

I have my opinions, others have theirs', and that twain aint a gonna meet. Steel and carbon fiber, mikki and the gang, Campy and Shimano. In the end, in this setting, it does not matter if you are right. Take the good and leave the bad. There's a lot more of the former, and that's why I hang around.

[hansolo758]

At the risk of losing the whimsical edge, this forum is both what Sandy says and what BBD says. The key to enjoying it is avoiding the threads that wander off in pointless or worse directions. Its strengths are average age and experience, which increase the information quotient and tend to keep the compassion level higher than in many forums, but age and experience also lead to a cantankerous "I'm right, GD it!" attitude that precludes much critical self examination, some of it needed (pictures to follow no doubt). One of the joys of getting older is moving past such self examination, which is why older people tend to retreat into familiar cocoons (more pictures?). That habit is antithetical to the nature of forums, and so we get unresolvable conflict.

I have my opinions, others have theirs', and that twain aint a gonna meet. Steel and carbon fiber, mikki and the gang, Campy and Shimano. In the end, in this setting, it does not matter if you are right. Take the good and leave the bad. There's a lot more of the former, and that's why I hang around.

+1

[Bud_E]

+1 to the last several posts. That about sums it up for me.

[Fixed]

bro i always listen to swoop he gets paid for this stuff . it free here .
:beer: cheers

[Avispa]

...but this is far from the best cycling forum. There's too much unmerited *****iness, sniping, sarcasm and bullying and a ton of misguided misinformation....

Agreed, and I consider myself one of the offenders at times. But I don't think there is or there should be a "best forum competition".

I wonder, however, what kind of response this post would have gotten here at the Serotta Forum:

http://www.anothercyclingforum.com/index.php?topic=37804.0

The opinions and responses on that matter given at the ACF surely are so nice to read!!!

;)

A!

[Bruce K]

I think we talked about this a while ago.

Why not start another thread and let's see what happens this time?

BK

[Nick H.]

Rather you than me! Anyway, I'm fairly busy with the ACF thread. I wouldn't have started it in any other forum. We have now broached the subject of risk compensation theory and are wondering whether our opinions are too entrenched to be worth discussing. As you can see, the forum owner (Sam) has politely alerted us of the need to exercise restraint http://www.anothercyclingforum.com/index.php?topic=37804.225. Things will heat up when the PBP heroes return - at the moment we are all nervously following their battles with gales and rainstorms here http://www.anothercyclingforum.com/index.php?topic=38774.240

[gt6267a]

I very much enjoy the forum. I spend a great deal of time here and enjoy my virtual friends. One of these days, I will move to a place of greater population and am looking forward to meeting many of you face to face.

Per the flame wars, I think on the internet one must have some thick skin and remember it is all for fun. One of the ironies of the Serotta forum is that because the people here are caring, generous, and friendly; it is a safe space where most of the time one gets by with calf skin gloves and is able to leave the thick rawhide gloves for other places. Then, when a roughish moment comes along here, people seem to get slammed. To me this is as much because their hair was down as because they actually got slammed. Once hurt in their safe space, people get a little crazy, and, like any environment, once things start spiraling out of control … that said, even when things do get prickly around here, I think it resolves itself reasonably. A great example of why people are able to wear their calf skin gloves and let their hair down …

[tch]

let's be honest. Just like in real life, there are some real jerks (not just THE Jerk) here. A lot of time, who they are depends on who you are. But it's a fact.

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . Per the flame wars, I think on the internet one must have some thick skin and remember it is all for fun.

. . . some people's idea of "fun" consists of demeaning, insulting, or taunting others. I think that's largely because of the perceived anonymity of the online environment. Certain individuals believe they can excercise their anger or prejudice without accountability and get away with it. And that's where many or the problems here originate . . .

Just. Be. Nice. You'd think it would be a simple thing to do, but some just can't seem to master it . . .

BBD

[e-RICHIE]

atmo the problems here are quite small when juxtaposed
against all the goodwill and info disseminated. afaiac, the
biggest problem here is the continued chat about the few
small problems that exist. let it go atmo.

[Dave B]

atmo the problems here are quite small when juxtaposed
against all the goodwill and info disseminated. afaiac, the
biggest problem here is the continued chat about the few
small problems that exist. let it go atmo.


Word!

[Archibald]

. . . some people's idea of "fun" consists of demeaning, insulting, or taunting others. I think that's largely because of the perceived anonymity of the online environment. Certain individuals believe they can excercise their anger or prejudice without accountability and get away with it. And that's where many or the problems here originate . . .

Just. Be. Nice. You'd think it would be a simple thing to do, but some just can't seem to master it . . .

BBD
Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries, now go away before I taunt you a second time! <--that's a joke, I have no idea of your parents attributes.

Seriously BBD, aren't you making a mountain out of a molehill? It seems like you're intent on trying to provoke every thread into proof of your own accusations.

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . I speak up. I'll keep speaking up when insensitive people heap scorn on newbies or people like Mikki who ask reasonable, innocent questions. You're always free to disagree with me. I just don't agree with those who seem to think that this is a place where it's OK to insult people. Judging by the number of PM's I've gotten, I'm not the only one who feels this way.

And "provoke every thread . . . "? That's a pretty sweeping generalization. :rolleyes:

BBD

[93legendti]

Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries, now go away before I taunt you a second time! <--that's a joke, I have no idea of your parents attributes.

Seriously BBD, aren't you making a mountain out of a molehill? It seems like you're intent on trying to provoke every thread into proof of your own accusations.

This place is many things, mostly great things. But, I can't understand why this is a place where a forumite can have 3 or more different screen names and have a running dialogue with himself. Can you tell me why that is Don?

[swoop]

this reminds me, moreonbikes.com is having a sale. you can buy vanilla stickers and put them on your cannondale or any old thing you stick together,
they're great, the stickers dont have any adhesive, the just use passive agressiveness to stay on.


enjoy.

[Ginger]

Alright kids.

Please go back and read Sandy's first post on the thread.

Happy thoughts,
Ginger

[Louis]

people like Mikki who ask reasonable, innocent questions

The "online bike shop" question was reasonable?

That touched one of the most raw nerves around - LBS vs. online merchant, something that even the most newbie participant on the forum should have realized. I would not set up Mikki as my paragon of innocence.

Louis

[William]

http://www.peacesymbol.org/myspace/peace_symbol_6_l.gif

Or else.....

[Archibald]

This place is many things, mostly great things. But, I can't understand why this is a place where a forumite can have 3 or more different screen names and have a running dialogue with himself. Can you tell me why that is Don?
Well, both Don & Archibald laugh at your hypocrisy for posting this anonymously as 93Legendti. :banana: :banana: :banana:

Then we'd inform you that neither Don or Archibald are anonymous for any practical purposes, and while we may be two peas in a pod, there is no other. Why don't you pose your concerns to the mod and have them check it out?

[BumbleBeeDave]

Or are you really also Archibald . . . and Sandy . . . and Kevan . . . and Smiley . . . and Serotta Pete . . . and ME! :rolleyes:

Oooh, my poor head is reeling! :eek:

BBD

[93legendti]

Well, both Don & Archibald laugh at your hypocrisy for posting this anonymously as 93Legendti. :banana: :banana: :banana:

Then we'd inform you that neither Don or Archibald are anonymous for any practical purposes, and while we may be two peas in a pod and there is none other. Why don't you pose your concerns to the mod and have them check it out?

Don, you forgot Jmekill and DWF.

[Archibald]

. . . I speak up. I'll keep speaking up when insensitive people heap scorn on newbies or people like Mikki who ask reasonable, innocent questions. You're always free to disagree with me. I just don't agree with those who seem to think that this is a place where it's OK to insult people. Judging by the number of PM's I've gotten, I'm not the only one who feels this way.

And "provoke every thread . . . "? That's a pretty sweeping generalization. :rolleyes:

BBD
What happens when an unstoppable force meets an immovable object?

[William]

Or are you really also Archibald . . . and Sandy . . . and Kevan . . . and Smiley . . . and Serotta Pete . . . and ME! :rolleyes:

Oooh, my poor head is reeling! :eek:

BBD

BBDave, there is no one else on this forum but you, me, and all my aliases...

"e"? Me.
Archi? Me.
Sandy? Me.
Roy? Me?
Ahnieda Ride? Me.
Too Tall? Me.
Everyone else? Me me me me....

When I run out of meds...is when the forum starts heading south.


Just saying (SoCalSteve? Me)



William ;)

[swoop]

if anyone is having real feelings evoked online.. all that's going on is that there's too much meaning being derived from what's happening online and its a good sign that one should click off and go engage something in the flesh.

this is just info, opinion, play, and sweet trivial matters. it literally doesn't matter... and if it does.. that is the problem. which means the problem is the dude staring you back in the mirror. listen to him.. go do something real that doesn't involve a tv screen or monitor.

[fiamme red]

Don, you forgot Jmekill and DWF.I thought jmewkill was someone else?

http://www.kirkframeworks.com/PhotoGalleryowners.htm (see top bike)

[Archibald]

Don, you forgot Jmekill and DWF.
That's rich! So you're a moron and a hypocrite? DWF is Don, i.e., not separate. Here's a hint, the "DWF" are initials. JMewkill is a ~real~ person who is not I. Let me spell it out for you: He has separate DNA, his parents have no relation to my parents, he lives on the other side of the country, there are forum members from that side of the country that know & ride with him. So, that still leaves two. Anything else you can find in there :butt:?

[e-RICHIE]

short sleeve dress shirts are an oxymoron atmo.
discuss.

[Your_Friend!]

Friends! Please Listen! (http://youtube.com/watch?v=CMN8_i3e4Lk)


I Hope This Helps!


Love,
Your_Friend!

[swoop]

short sleeve dress shirts are an oxymoron atmo.
discuss.

oxymoronbikes.com

[Steve Hampsten]

short sleeve dress shirts are an oxymoron atmo.
discuss.

what else would you wear with a clip-on necktie?

[e-RICHIE]

what else would you wear with a clip-on necktie?
horror of horrors atmo there is only one kind of tie - and it's the striped
variety and only if the stripes descend from the heart atmo. wearing
such neckwear shows excellant breeding (http://www.flickr.com/photos/77448006@N00/413404175/) atmo -

[jbrainin]

short sleeve dress shirts are an oxymoron atmo.
discuss.

Short sleeve dress shirts are not so much as oxymoron as an anachronism.

[oracle]

i think that it is fair to say that if you fall into the category of:

having between 4 and 7 thousand posts

having a sense of territorial ownership for a 'place' that is neither 'real' nor 'yours' per se

having a need to consistantly inform others how you think they should be living in that 'place'

having the need to consistantly participate in the very conversations which you claim to wish to avoid

lacking the ability to step back with regard to issues that you find highly critical or topical


such a person would be well served by turning off the computer for an extended period of time and re-discover the joy that is life in the real world, where people have eyes, names, histories, et cetera. confusing that place for this place is something that i find somewhat depressing.

[taz-t]

BBDave, there is no one else on this forum but you, me, and all my aliases...

"e"? Me.
Archi? Me.
Sandy? Me.
Roy? Me?
Ahnieda Ride? Me.
Too Tall? Me.
Everyone else? Me me me me....

When I run out of meds...is when the forum starts heading south.


Just saying (SoCalSteve? Me)



William ;)

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

taz (not taz)

[William]

I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

taz (not taz)


Coo coo cachoo!


William

[fiamme red]

horror of horrors atmo there is only one kind of tie - and it's the striped
variety and only if the stripes descend from the heart atmo. wearing
such neckwear shows excellant breeding (http://www.flickr.com/photos/77448006@N00/413404175/) atmo -Brooks Brothers were the ones who introduced stripes descending from the right, they say. But that's not true:

http://www.bensonandclegg.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=55_58

[e-RICHIE]

Brooks Brothers were the ones who introduced stripes descending from the right, they say. But that's not true:

http://www.bensonandclegg.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=55_58
it's not necessarily a british club and public school thing atmo...
http://www.businessweek.com/1999/99_46/b3655202.htm
i prefer the eenie iteration of the english rep tie atmo.

[SWorks4me]

The ORACLE has spoken....


(nice post)


i think that it is fair to say that if you fall into the category of:

having between 4 and 7 thousand posts

having a sense of territorial ownership for a 'place' that is neither 'real' nor 'yours' per se

having a need to consistantly inform others how you think they should be living in that 'place'

having the need to consistantly participate in the very conversations which you claim to wish to avoid

lacking the ability to step back with regard to issues that you find highly critical or topical


such a person would be well served by turning off the computer for an extended period of time and re-discover the joy that is life in the real world, where people have eyes, names, histories, et cetera. confusing that place for this place is something that i find somewhat depressing.

[William]

The ORACLE has spoken....


(nice post)

The Oracle was an older women who baked cookies.


Just sayin'



William

[Tom]

Wait until there's a long running argument. Pick a side, the one you think needs the most encouragement and support.

Send the person "supportive" and "encouraging" PMs every time it seems like the argument is dying down.

Sit back and enjoy the madcap fun that ensues!

[djg]

what else would you wear with a clip-on necktie?

At the very least, a pair o' shorts please.

[cadence90]

what else would you wear with a clip-on necktie?
It depends on the context of course, but if you're going to NAHMBS I say lederhosen, just to be sure to stand out. No beret, of any kind, though. HTH!

[e-RICHIE]

It depends on the context of course, but if you're going to NAHMBS I say lederhosen, just to be sure to stand out. No beret, of any kind, though. HTH!
post of next month atmo.

[cadence90]

post of next month atmo.
Dude, not fair!
Are you saying, all over the internets, that I have a 1-month waiting list?
Harsh!
:)

[Ginger]

what else would you wear with a clip-on necktie?
Hopefully a shirt, because a clip-on clipped to chest hair is just tacky...tacky above a clip-on clipped to a T-shirt, but still below a strap-on.


I'm so confused...So Swoop and the Oracle are the same person? (Same post, different words, both make total sense...)

[93legendti]

That's rich! So you're a moron and a hypocrite? DWF is Don, i.e., not separate. Here's a hint, the "DWF" are initials. JMewkill is a ~real~ person who is not I. Let me spell it out for you: He has separate DNA, his parents have no relation to my parents, he lives on the other side of the country, there are forum members from that side of the country that know & ride with him. So, that still leaves two. Anything else you can find in there :butt:?

Easy, easy. OK, you have only 2 forum names...Read swoop's post:


if anyone is having real feelings evoked online.. all that's going on is that there's too much meaning being derived from what's happening online and its a good sign that one should click off and go engage something in the flesh.

this is just info, opinion, play, and sweet trivial matters. it literally doesn't matter... and if it does.. that is the problem. which means the problem is the dude staring you back in the mirror. listen to him.. go do something real that doesn't involve a tv screen or monitor.


Remember, it is all fun. Go for a ride. Enjoy the day.

[Sandy]

I have an idea. How about let's stop the bickering. It only makes it worse by causing an emotionally charged negative response which perpetuates the bickering. It is certainly not consistent with the basis of my initial post. Obviously, when I made my initial post, I realized that differences exist and personalities and perceptions sometimes conflict- that being here and everywhere else.

If the back and forth negativity continues, maybe the thread should just be closed.


Sandy

[Dave B]

If the back and forth negativity continues, maybe the thread should just be closed.


Sandy



No Way! The thread is good, it is exactly what people need. This forum is a good thing for many of us. Yeah there have been spats recently, but it is time we move on. No one needs to focus on stuff in the past as nothing can be taken back. If we simply agree that no one wins then all is good.

Your intentions were pure and that is what this place is. From time to time people will be offended or hurt, but they also can be rewarded and helped. It is up to us to act with some class and responsibility. This is how this thread began and it needs to refocus that way. We simply need to curb the direction towards your intentions.

[manet]

what else would you wear with a clip-on necktie?

ac/dc

[davids]

. . . some people's idea of "fun" consists of demeaning, insulting, or taunting others. I think that's largely because of the perceived anonymity of the online environment. Certain individuals believe they can excercise their anger or prejudice without accountability and get away with it. And that's where many or the problems here originate . . .

Just. Be. Nice. You'd think it would be a simple thing to do, but some just can't seem to master it . . .

BBD
. . . I speak up. I'll keep speaking up when insensitive people heap scorn on newbies or people like Mikki who ask reasonable, innocent questions. You're always free to disagree with me. I just don't agree with those who seem to think that this is a place where it's OK to insult people. Judging by the number of PM's I've gotten, I'm not the only one who feels this way.

And "provoke every thread . . . "? That's a pretty sweeping generalization. :rolleyes:

BBD
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/22/Plants_and_Birds_and_Rocks_and_Things.jpg Track 4, atmo.

[mosca]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/22/Plants_and_Birds_and_Rocks_and_Things.jpg Track 4, atmo.
Track 18 imho

[Nick H.]

I'm about ready for Track 13.

[oracle]

what would the world be without agon- the agonistics of one man against another- to show everyone the order of precedence among men, just as no two other things on earth are alike?
how could any of us alive know quality if competition and personal combat did not let all the world know who embodies excellence and who merely manages mediocrity?

[William]

what would the world be without agon- the agonistics of one man against another- to show everyone the order of precedence among men, just as no two other things on earth are alike?
how could any of us alive know quality if competition and personal combat did not let all the world know who embodies excellence and who merely manages mediocrity?

Odysseus, OLYMPOS

[Sandy]

This thread has grown legs and the legs are heading in different directions. Hope the head is following somewhere, somehow.


Humpty Dumpty

[manet]

ac/dc

the mighty angus young

[davids]

the mighty angus young
Scott Miller owns this thread.

http://www.popularnoise.org/events/c2c/images/fr-scottmiller.jpg

[oracle]

15 reasons that the 'problems' here are neither 'real' nor 'important'. in particular, i like # 13: i am trying not to visualize the most prolific among us posting away on the forum..... (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2007/08/22/nytfrontpage/082207POD_index.html)

[Needs Help]

So just what is this place- The Serotta Forum?

A place where the members of an entrenched jewish cabal rip on anyone they feel like and then periodically pat each other on the back and proclaim what swell people they are?

[Bud_E]

A place where the members of an entrenched jewish cabal rip on anyone they feel like and then periodically pat each other on the back and proclaim what swell people they are?

*** ?

[DfCas]

i always wondered how that place got on. i posted there
since 2003 or so. it seems like the same 7-8 guys all the
time and through the ages; coap, erik, sandi, jimbo and
others. it's almost like a salon or, better yet - a private
email cc field chain letter. i mean that in a good way atmo.
it's like a library room!


Its cycingforum.com and I still spend alot of time there. Over half the threads now are off topic but there is a lot of quiet,very deep cycling knowledge there.We are pretty much inbred now,but thats OK since I'm from West Virginia.

[Richard]

Needs Help -- your name says it all.

[Louis]

Some people obviously Need More Help than others...

NH, you just can't keep that side of you down for long, can you? Give it time and it eventually shows up.

Are there any other groups you care to attack? Don't let us stand in the way of your bigotry - let your true self show and let it rip.

Louis

[Your_Friend!]

Needs Help!


Please Read This!

Link! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech)


Thank You,
Your_Friend!



And This!

Link! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_group)

[wfu_dh]

frank says hello.
watch the celtics in 07/8
they got some new tall dude.

Yo' Dude!

He is the BIG Ticket, aka Kevin Garnett. He's the real deal. Enjoy our franchise player!

Cheers from MN,

WFU :crap:

[Skrawny]

A place where the members of an entrenched jewish cabal rip on anyone they feel like and then periodically pat each other on the back and proclaim what swell people they are?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VF2XN4GMsY8

[djg]

A place where the members of an entrenched jewish cabal rip on anyone they feel like and then periodically pat each other on the back and proclaim what swell people they are?

***?

I guess sometimes it takes a village, and sometimes it just takes a village idiot.

[e-RICHIE]

this thread has gone borderline icky* atmo.
e-MENACHEM©™®


* icky is a united nations term.

[big shanty]

I'm not jewish, but I play one over the blitsbriv.

[Dave B]

Well, Sandy...I still say it was a great thread in the beginning.

I also think people are crossing lines. Too many folks are being disrespected in childish ways.

This battle people people are fighting has no winner.

People are losing patience with certain attitudes......



just imagine what Serotta thinks of this.

If the plug is pulled, it would be a shame.



What is this place?????


Folks this is a place to learn, love, and share.

If you cannot do those then....well..................

[Fixed]

bro this place is ben's house let 's respect it he is a good host let's not trash his house and leave ..imho
cheers

[Serotta_James]

I don't understand how threads like these get out of hand...
It's a cycling forum.

[Elefantino]

I think we have explored personal attacks enough in this thread.

Someone close it.

That way I can get in the last word.