Tire rotation opinion

[dekindy]

I thought I had this all figured out. After reading lots of information on tire rotation, I thought my strategy would be to not rotate tires. When the back tire wore out I was going to move the front tire to the back and put on a new front tire. I recently saw a strategy that I had not read before.

A guy suggested replacing the rear tire and the front tire when they wear out. He said that the ratio was 3 rear tires per front tire. This would be simpler since I would not have to dismount two tires everytime a tire needs replacing.

Also, does removing the front tire weaken the side wall any or is having the best tread on the front the most important?

I am using GP4000 tires if that is of importance.

I have a worn out rear tire and a new tire already purchased and waiting to go on the bike so I am trying to decide now.

Thanks.

[Wiley J]

The problem with just replacing the backs is the front gets pretty old by the time the tread wears out. I like having fresh tires on the front. A rear blowout on a fast descent is easier to control than a failure on the front.

[Too Tall]

I don't see any common sense in this. If a tyre is worn to the point you are not comfortable using it any longer why would you continue using it by moving the tyre to another wheel???? Just replace your rubber as need. Maybe I'm out of touch or just a little touched in the head :rolleyes:

[Wiley J]

You're not out of touch, I'm paranoid. When I move a tire from the front to the back, they usually look like they are hardly used.

[soulspinner]

I don't see any common sense in this. If a tyre is worn to the point you are not comfortable using it any longer why would you continue using it by moving the tyre to another wheel???? Just replace your rubber as need. Maybe I'm out of touch or just a little touched in the head :rolleyes:


+1

[Sandy]

I don't think that the initial thread suggested using a worn out tire anywhere.

I don't rotate tires. If a tire wears out, I simply replace it. If the front tire is still in excellent/ very good condition, then even if you put a new tire on the rear, the rear will soon wear to the wear level of the front tire. Some say to throw away a worn rear tire and then put the front tire on the rear and the new tire on the front as it is more important to have an excellent tire on the front than on the back. But front and rear tires wear differently, I would think.

I say just replace whatever tire wears out when it wears out, BUT always be sure that the front tire is in excellent of very good condition. I replaced my rear Continental GP 4000 tire at about 1600-1700 miles. The front now has about 2700 miles and still has life left. I do look at it often, just to be sure that it is ok.


My wife is thinking about replacing me..... :)


Sandy

[BumbleBeeDave]

You are definitely irreplaceable! :p

BBD

[Sandy]

You are definitely irreplaceable! :p

BBD

So, Bee Man, if that is the case, why am I seeing 20-25 applications in the mail each day addressed to Spouse Replacement?? :rolleyes: :)


Sad Spouse Sandy

[palincss]

I don't rotate tires. If a tire wears out, I simply replace it. If the front tire is still in excellent/ very good condition, then even if you put a new tire on the rear, the rear will soon wear to the wear level of the front tire. Some say to throw away a worn rear tire and then put the front tire on the rear and the new tire on the front as it is more important to have an excellent tire on the front than on the back. But front and rear tires wear differently, I would think.

I say just replace whatever tire wears out when it wears out, BUT always be sure that the front tire is in excellent of very good condition.


The easiest way to make sure you always have the best tire on the front is to always put the new tire on the front, move the old front tire to the back, and discard the worn out back tire.

Yes, it does mean removing two tires. However, that's not a big deal and it doesn't damage the tire -- especially if you've learned how to remove and install tires without using tools.

[benb]

I never take any chances... when the rear goes they both get replaced new.

This is what I learned motorcycling, this is what every tire company says to do, this is the safest thing to do.

The cost is trivial when you consider the safety.

I can never understand how cyclists who spend so much money on other items & invest so much of their time & spirit can possibly want to try and save money on the most important safety item on the bike.

One bad tire related crash will erase all the savings you've accrued over your entire lifetime by skimping on tires.

But yah if you're going to to play with fire put the new tire on the front!

[onekgguy]

Yes, it does mean removing two tires. However, that's not a big deal and it doesn't damage the tire -- especially if you've learned how to remove and install tires without using tools.

Every now and then i come across something I've never tried and maybe this is one of those times. Are you saying it's possible to remove and install my Michelin Pro 2s on a Ksyrium rim without tools? I have a difficult enough time using one tire lever. Maybe there's a trick here that I haven't seen. Thanks.

Kevin g

[vaxn8r]

Every now and then i come across something I've never tried and maybe this is one of those times. Are you saying it's possible to remove and install my Michelin Pro 2s on a Ksyrium rim without tools? I have a difficult enough time using one tire lever. Maybe there's a trick here that I haven't seen. Thanks.

Kevin g
For Mavics I need one lever to get it off. No tools to reinstall. If it's a Campy wheel, then I need blasting powder ;)

[vaxn8r]

FWIW, I've never rotated tires. This thread sounds a bit superstitious. Who's having front tire blowouts from not rotating? I generally get about 3-4K miles on a front tire and then replace it when it begins to look bad or old or whatever. Rears get replaced about every 1.5K though YMMMV because of rider weight and style of riding and whether or not the tire is cut.

[dekindy]

I don't think that the initial thread suggested using a worn out tire anywhere.

I don't rotate tires. If a tire wears out, I simply replace it. If the front tire is still in excellent/ very good condition, then even if you put a new tire on the rear, the rear will soon wear to the wear level of the front tire. Some say to throw away a worn rear tire and then put the front tire on the rear and the new tire on the front as it is more important to have an excellent tire on the front than on the back. But front and rear tires wear differently, I would think.

I say just replace whatever tire wears out when it wears out, BUT always be sure that the front tire is in excellent of very good condition. I replaced my rear Continental GP 4000 tire at about 1600-1700 miles. The front now has about 2700 miles and still has life left. I do look at it often, just to be sure that it is ok.


My wife is thinking about replacing me..... :)


Sandy

The Continental tires have the two dimple wear indicators on the tread. Do you generally replace them before these disappear, when they disappear, or just use your judgment and don't worry that they are no longer visible?

[Louis]

Unless a sidewall cut or other such catastrophic damage occurs I just ride my tires until they wear through the rubber and I'm uncomfortable with the amount of thread showing. I then replace the worn tire and leave the other as is.

On my "everyday" bike I currently have an ancient whitewall Avocet Fasgrip on the front and a blackwall Avocet Carbon Fasgrip on the back. I started with two whitewalls, wore through the one on the back, put on a first blackwall on the back, wore through that and am now on my second blackwall, (i.e. third tire on the back) while the front is still going strong.

If I were to toss the front every time I replaced the rear I'd be spending a heck of a lot more on tires...

Louis

[11.4]

The old measure about rotate-to-the-rear was started when tire materials were much cruder than they are today -- they deteriorated rapidly from exposure to sun, rain, and air and by the time the rear wore down, the front frankly looked pretty crappy. Things of course have changed.

If you ride tubulars, you don't really want to be pulling tires off just to rotate them to the rear, so they are a pretty good test bed for tire replacement practices. I find I usually go through two and occasionally three tires on the rear before I replace a front tubular. However, I always check for cuts and other damage and if anything arises, or if the tire happens to be a repair job, it gets pulled and moved to the rear. I also move a tire if I had to do a skid stop and have created a flat spot on a front tire, or if the front tire simply wasn't a particularly even mounting and is bumpy or weird in any way. The latter step is a cost-saving one -- I'll let the rear wheel wear out a patched tubular, a slightly bumpy one, etc. None of this applies to race tires or to track tires -- they are always replaced because it's a waste of money to travel to a race and then have tire problems, plus that's a dangerous time to have a tire problem.

Frankly, I don't think there's any particular rule to follow except to check your tires. Hence, different opinions voiced above both make sense and are also excessively strict. Just check your tires. It doesn't hurt a clincher to move it from front to rear, and it gives you the opportunity to inspect it carefully for cuts, bead damage, etc. So if you have a tire on the front that you wouldn't really throw away but you need to change tires anyway, especially if the problem is mostly to do with environmental aging (sun, rain, air) then I'd certainly put it on the rear. Of a training wheel, of course. But I would judge every tire on its own merit.

And by the way, why change tires out religiously but keep using the same inner tubes with twelve patches on them, or with chronic leaks around the valve stem base? I see riders who change tires religiously but when they flat, their inner tubes are like the underwear that your mother warned you about.

[palincss]

Every now and then i come across something I've never tried and maybe this is one of those times. Are you saying it's possible to remove and install my Michelin Pro 2s on a Ksyrium rim without tools? I have a difficult enough time using one tire lever. Maybe there's a trick here that I haven't seen. Thanks.

Kevin g

Yes, there most definitely is a trick to removing tires without tubes. I struggled for over 20 years with tight tires, then saw somebody take a tire off without using levers at all, and was gobsmacked. It was so simple.

Here's what you do: first, let all the air out. Then go all the way around the tire with your hands, pinching the sides of the tire together. The object is to push the beads inwards, so they fall off the little shelf they're sitting on down into the "well".

Then grab a section of tire with both hands and push it off the rim to the back. The object here is to get both beads off the rim. Once you get that first section off, just follow up, going all the way aound the rim until the whole thing is off.

I can't say it works on Pro2Race w/Kysyriums, because I've never tried it on that combination. But what could it possibly hurt to try?

[97CSI]

When I move a tire from the front to the back, they usually look like they are hardly used.+2

[Bud_E]

...

I can't say it works on Pro2Race w/Kysyriums, because I've never tried it on that combination. But what could it possibly hurt to try?

Yep -- I do it all the time no problem both on and off... and I use that tire/wheel combo. Just takes leverage -- and it doesn't hurt to grunt and cuss and swear when you get to that last little bit :D

[Peter P.]

Rear tires wear more frequently than front tires because they see torque loads from pedalliing forces.

I rotate my front tire to the rear and replace the front tire with a new one because my front tires last so long, they will fail from dry rot before they wear out, and to me that means I didn't get maximum mileage out of it.

[Bill Bove]

Sometimes I put four or five patches on a new tube before I put it in a tire :confused: Being the "bike shop guy" on a ride everybody has to stand around and watch as I change a flat, I love the look on their faces when they see all the patches on my tube :D "What! You own a shop, you don't get free tubes?" "Just keeping prices down for you" ;)

[toaster]

No rotation here.

The rear tire wears out due to mileage or tread damage or both. The front wears out more from age and tread damage than from mileage.

If you move a front tire to the rear it will be worn out faster than if you just left it on the front and changed to a new rear.

Just replace the front when it needs it and the rear as it wears out.

To me the rear and front tires have completely different forces acting upon them that I don't even consider rotation.

[Too Tall]

Yes, there most definitely is a trick to removing tires without tubes. I struggled for over 20 years with tight tires, then saw somebody take a tire off without using levers at all, and was gobsmacked. It was so simple.

Here's what you do: first, let all the air out. Then go all the way around the tire with your hands, pinching the sides of the tire together. The object is to push the beads inwards, so they fall off the little shelf they're sitting on down into the "well".

Then grab a section of tire with both hands and push it off the rim to the back. The object here is to get both beads off the rim. Once you get that first section off, just follow up, going all the way aound the rim until the whole thing is off.

I can't say it works on Pro2Race w/Kysyriums, because I've never tried it on that combination. But what could it possibly hurt to try?

Heehee, sounds like you are ready for a flat tyre changing race :) This is a blast, we used to do it in the winter time. No rules other than you must start with a pumped up tyre and finish with at least 30 lbs. pumped and nu pinched tube.

[djg]

+ 1 for 11.4. It matters that you have a good tire on the front, and decent tires front and rear. It doesn't matter that your front tire is better than your rear tire (neither tire actually knows what the other one looks like). I check my tires, and I change them -- one by one -- when it seems like a good idea (or when I've had a bit of bad luck and have to). I don't worry about rotating them.

[Nathanrtaylor]

The Continental tires have the two dimple wear indicators on the tread. Do you generally replace them before these disappear, when they disappear, or just use your judgment and don't worry that they are no longer visible?

Those are wear indicators? I thought they were some sort of casting defect.

You learn something every day.

[pdmtong]

Yes those two dimples on conti 4000S are wear indicators. I confirmed with the rep at sea otter and also called highway two. they reminded the tire will "square off" long before the dimples wear down (or is it "up") and that is fine. all tires evenutally square. they also said dont over inflate...these like 100-110 better than 120psi

[jpw]

This would only apply to an expedition-type bike, but you could have a fork with the same axle spread as the rear, build two rear wheels (both with sprockets) and then keep swapping the wheels around. Perfectly balanced tyre wear.

[54ny77]

tire replacement is so plebian. just replace the bike. much easier, and better for the economy.

[happycampyer]

tire replacement is so plebian. just replace the bike. much easier, and better for the economy.At the opposite extreme, if you are truly concerned about the evenness of tire wear, you should rotate your tires every week and, if you go on a really long ride, mid-ride. That way your tires will wear out more or less evenly and can be replaced at the same time.

[Louis]

I don't know about you guys, but I rotate my tires every time I ride.

Anything else is just too much drag.