Campy 10 sp cassettes...

[Wanker]

Looks like I'll be buying my third campy cassette in about 9k miles! I'm quite anul about keeping my chains and cassettes lubed and clean. I have also replaced the chain(s) every 1200 to 1600 miles. My first cassette was a Record 10 sp and was replaced after about 3500 miles with a chorus cassette. Now this cassette is causing chain skip with new chain install. What's the deal!! Is this the norm? If not, what am I missing here? -

Six speeds rule!!!!!!!!!!

wanker

[Dude]

Yes that is the norm. Chains/cassettes will really only last 1500-3000 miles. You can either change the chain more frequently or make sure that the chain doesn't stretch (with a chain stretch tool) or ride your cassette until the chain and cassette stretch and ride that for 5000 miles.

[vaxn8r]

Are you using the all ti version or ti/steel? The ti wears the fastest, costs a bunch more and saves only about 30g over the combo.

I use 9 sp. Record and my ti/steel cogsets last at least 10K miles and I switch chains about every 3K miles or so.

[Serotta PETE]

I have used Campy 10 speed for about 8K miles over the years and have had better luck with cassette. Have over 4k on it. Yes I do change chains every 1500 to 2ooo miles (Whenever SPOKES thinks it is required.)


How are your cassettes wearing out? What has let you know they are worn out?


You mention that new chain skips when it is placed on a non-new cassette. This for me has been normal,. After about 50 mile, the chain and cassette become "use to working together" and no more skipping.


Big Mac had a post some time ago about going to cassette model below chorus - where each cog can be replaced separately. Typically all cogs do not wear out at same time. Ti cogs wear faster than steel and also if you ride lots in 12 or 16/18 these will wear faster than larger cogs.

Call Branford Bike - they sell separate cogs and have good info. THey also hae a web page with lots of specifics on cassettes.


Good luck. PETE

[Blastinbob]

I've had the same problem with new chains skipping on used cassettes. I end up putting the new chain on the bike with the newest cassette and using that, the less worn, chain on the older cassette.

[zap]

Strange?

I have over 1,500 miles on my '03 Record chain and just checked it w/my new Rolhoff chain checker using the Al wear indicator side and it still has plenty of life left.

On another bike I have a full Ti cassette with over 10k miles on it and it's on it's 4th Dura Ace chain. Never skipped.

Never lubed the chain on the above bikes. But then these bikes rarely see the rain either. Thats probably the difference.

Maybe all weather bikes need to be 9s (like my ti bike) or less in order to get decent mileage out of cogs & chains.

[Tom]

I have at least 8K miles on the Chorus 10 steel cassette, it just went to its third chain a week or so ago. I thought the BB was shot, the way it acted on uphills but a new chain and pulleys stopped all that. The pulleys probably weren't necessary but they're basically plastic running on bushings and for $20 what the hell.

[BigMac]

Which chain are you using? In my experience, the Campy 10UD chain is by FAR the best of the lot for Campy 10 drivetrain. Indeed, the 1st generation EXA10 chain from Campy was junk, you were lucky to get 1000 miles even with diligent cleaning and lubing. The IRD and Wipperman offer poor performance and durability, the Wipperman SS chain is all that and it is extremely prone to failure which can endanger rider health. How they are still selling a stainless steel chain is beyond me, that thing should be recalled. I have been told by engineers that stainless steel has very poor fatigue properties which is likely the cause for said failures. No matter the reason, I have witnessed several failures and many more with fractured links that would likely fail under continued usage.

The latest Campy 10UD chain should deliver 3500-4k miles of usage with "proper care". If you are using this chain and not receiving this kind of durability, consider altering care procedures. Campy is offering there own chain lube, its actually a synthetic lube with good durability in wet conditions, but it is not a 'dry' lube per say so dirt buildup can be problematic in dirt, dust or wind conditions. I personally use Dumonde Tech lube which I also use on motorcycle chains. I don't care to start yet ANOTHER chain lube debate, Dumonde works for me but it does require some care in applying as most folks seems to slather waaaaay too much lube of any kind on their chains and Dumonde is very prone to gunking up under excessive applications. The only rider I have known to blow through Campy cassettes as fast as your experience is a friend who was using Boeshield T9 as chain lube. Now I think Boeshield is a great product if used per its design -- a metal preservative developed by Boeing Aviation to protect steel tooling and machinery in Everett, WA marine air environment -- it works great as frame preserver sprayed inside tubes of steel frames, much better product than Frame Saver, imo. Boeshield is however NOT a lubricant, was never designed as such and should not be used as such. Shame on you Grant P. :no:

Cassette durability? Yes, the Ti cogs do wear 2 1/2-3x faster than hardened steel versions. You should still get min. 3k miles from a heavily used ti cog. The Campy steel cogs are extremely durable with proper care. 3500miles seems very premature for a steel cog. Consider changing maintainence procedures and/or lubes. I would also highly recommend the Centaur cassettes. Same tooth profile as all C10UD cogs, same hardened steel as Chorus and Record steel cogs, the difference being that only pos.1-2 utilize an aluminum riveted carrier. The R/C cassettes use at least 3 riveted pairs, the Centaur employs loose aluminum spacers between all cogs except that 1st pair. The advantage, besides durability and lower cost, is that an individual worn cog may be replaced while unworn cogs are not discarded. You'll need a modicum of care when disassembling a cassette but honestly a 5 year old could probably do it as the cogs can only fit on freehub spline in a single direction. The added benefit is the ease with which one can assemble custom gearing combos like an 11-29 if you were so compelled and had the legs of Nelson Vails. The only rules of import are that the inner position must be a riveted pair and the outer most cog is a dedicated unit with integrated spacer.

Now for someone in your position with a "worn" Chorus cassette? Well you have two options as I see it. You could identify the worn cog or cogs, replace that single riveted pair at cost of around $40 and you're set. Alternatively, you could start from scratch with a new Centaur cassette at cost of $80 knowing all 10 cogs are fresh and perfect. That call is yours. I would urge you to try some new maintainence procedures. Campy lube is much easier to apply than Dumonde Tech and is great for most conditions. I do believe you'll need to do more chain cleaning intervals with Campy lube as dirt build up will accelerate wear nearly as quickly as having no lube. The Dumonde rarely needs cleaning, but it must be applied very diligently.

Ride on! :banana: :banana: :banana:

[zap]

BigMac

Great post.

You are absolutely correct about SS chains. SS is weaker compared to steel used for quality chains. Darn, if the chain is properly lubed, it won't rust!!!!!

For custom Ti ratio's, check out Cycle Dynamics. Full 10s Ti for roughly the same price as regular Record 10s cassette. The only negative for some, individual cogs rather than carriers. But it shouldn't be to much of a problem with Campy's deep grooves.

[TmcDet]

is the Centaur cassette that your talking about last yrs model or this yrs? or did the cassette stay the same?

[Wanker]

Thanks for all your input Big Mac and all others.

If I have to replace the cassette, I'll go with the Centaur - as Big Mac suggests.
I use Finish line Dry lube for my chain and clean the chain, cassette,der. cogs and all other grimy parts with Simple Green then gently rinse with water. I completely dry all wet areas with a towel then blow dry with a hair dryer. Then I re-lube and wipe down. I wipe down and re-lube my chain between EVERY ride. I also wipe grime off (using no cleaner)the chain rings and cassette - between rides.
Should I see if the new chain adapts to the old cassette, as Pete M. suggests? Pete, the old chain and cassette were working just fine, I was just following a maintanence schedule of 1500 miles and toss the chain. Silly us, the shop guys and I didn't do a chain measure and tossed the old chain! Oh well.
Big Mac; I'm using the campy 10UD chain, which is the same as the one we tossed. Sounds like we we premature.

thanks,

wanker

[Serotta PETE]

Wanker, I find that mine (new chain-used cassette) adapt after about 50 miles. Key is to see which cog it skips on and then to make sure the cog teeth are in fact okay (no chips or REALLY worn).

I am far from mechanical, as SPOKES, will tell you, but this is the process that I have used with all my cassettes for years (no experience on a titanium cogset).

Most recreational riders prefer certain cogs and they get worn the fastest. Never seen anyone wear all cogs evenly (the engineers out there will probaly know why that is)

WIsh I had the discipline to religiously clean and lube my chain..my story is one lube about every 150 miles or after a heavy rain.

Big Mac and the gang are a wealth of knowledge....

Good luck PETE

[Kevin]

I have the all Ti Campy Record cassette on three bikes. The trick to longevity is you have to keep a close eye on the chain. I change the chains every 1,500 to 2,000 miles.

Kevin

[TmcDet]

BigMac do you know of a place to the buy the Centaur cassette for 80? I haven't been able to find it for less than 99...heck the local bike shop told me that their price was 99 for it and then they had to mark up ontop of that

[Birddog]

I've been looking around too, and the best I've found is here.

http://www.labicicletta.com/edatcat/us/tlsstore.cgi?user_action=detail&catalogno=US-CAMCASSCEN04

I've not used them though.


Birddog

[bfd]

For the *budget-minded*, Campy sells the loose cog Veloce cassettes in both 9 and 10 speeds.

The 9 speeds range from 12-23 to 13-28 and cost as low as $30.

The 10 speed ranges from 12-23-13-29 and 14-28, and cost as low as $65.

Both are "heavier" than comparable Chorus or Centaur, but just as durable and substantially cheaper....

[Pastashop]

www.totalcycling.com has 10sp 12-23 Miche Neo Primato cassettes for 30 GBP ($55)

Veloce 9 & 10sp sets with wider ratio choices are 40 and 50 GBP.

[TmcDet]

would a person be able to tell a difference if he went from a Chorus cassette to a Veloce cassette? Would the shifting still be the same?

Also what is the 10UD chain? Is this the new lighter chain that campy has out? The chain that I have on my bike is a C10 HD and it did not last long at all.

[bfd]

TmcDet asks:

<would a person be able to tell a difference if he went from a Chorus cassette to a Veloce cassette? Would the shifting still be the same?>

On my bike, I use mix Campy 9 spd drivetrain, the answer would be No. I switch between a 13x26 Record 9 cassette to a 13x28 Veloce 9 cassette on my Campy rear wheel, depending on the hill and my fitness level, and have NO problems shifting, and can't tell the difference. In fact, it shifts almost as good as my 12x27 Shimano 9 wheel.....

[bubba]

Yes that is the norm. Chains/cassettes will really only last 1500-3000 miles.
Boy is that some fairy tale. I know people theat get over 8000 per chain, change it out and get another 8 or more on the same casette. Another guy I know gets over 10,000 on record chains,but don't know if his casette is trahed then also. :crap: :crap: :crap: