IT - Custom vs. Fierte IT frame

[Tommasini53]

A question for the crowd.
I have a Fierte steel frame that I really like. It fits very well. I've owned many fine Italian frames and the Fierte is a winner for me.

My question is.... If I decide to try one of Serotta's IT frames (carbon/Ti combo) what would be the benefits of paying the extra $$ for a Nove or Ottrot over the stock IT Fierte. The geometry of the custom frame would be very much the same as the stock Fierte.

Any opinions??? I'll bet there are opinions out there.

If you own a IT Fierte, I'd like to hear from you, especially if you can compare it to a steel frame. thanks all. :banana:

[swalburn]

I'm curious what the input on this thread will be as well. I also have a fierte, and I'm thinking about adding another frame. I've been doing a little racing, and fast group rides and am looking at something with a racier geometry. The short list includes the Orca, the Soloist, the R3, and a Tarmac Pro. I love my serotta and want a concours or Nove. I think I may be priced out though. I do really like the idea of being able to have tubes picked for me based on my weight. I'm really looking for something that has a lot of pep to it, and has a shorter chainstay. I'm curious how a stock Fierte IT compares to a Nove or something else. In reality, I think deep down I know I don't NEED a new bike, but nonetheless, I'm pretty sure I will be adding one in the next couple months. Right now I'm leaning towards the Tarmac Pro because of price and I haven't had a chance to demo a Nove. Additionally, it will be a nice complement to the Fierte.

[Tommasini53]

Swalburn: just an FYI if it helps.. I've been racing for many years and the geometry of the Fierte has been great for racing, so don't think you have to change frames just for racing.

I'm curious what the input on this thread will be as well. I also have a fierte, and I'm thinking about adding another frame. I've been doing a little racing, and fast group rides and am looking at something with a racier geometry. The short list includes the Orca, the Soloist, the R3, and a Tarmac Pro. I love my serotta and want a concours or Nove. I think I may be priced out though. I do really like the idea of being able to have tubes picked for me based on my weight. I'm really looking for something that has a lot of pep to it, and has a shorter chainstay. I'm curious how a stock Fierte IT compares to a Nove or something else. In reality, I think deep down I know I don't NEED a new bike, but nonetheless, I'm pretty sure I will be adding one in the next couple months. Right now I'm leaning towards the Tarmac Pro because of price and I haven't had a chance to demo a Nove. Additionally, it will be a nice complement to the Fierte.

[benb]

Is there really much of a difference? I think chasing faster/racier handling by buying a different bike is a bit of a lost cause if your existing bike fits OK.

The custom bike might ride better do to the tube differences, fitting a little better, etc.. but it shouldn't handle all that much faster.

The difference between a "stable" Fierte and a "twitchy" Cannondale or the "racy" HSG is only about 1/2 degree of Head Tube Angle and a small difference in rake and Trail. Serotta doesn't list the wheelbases but the differences are not enormous there either. Comfort/Endurance road bikes only have 1-2cm of wheelbase difference from "Crit" bikes if you compare the same sizes.

The biggest improvement in handling speed is probably just going to come from concentrating on your turn in, getting comfortable with counter-steering like a motorcycle, etc.. Even a 30lb mountain bike will flick over very quickly with some solid pressure on the inside bar.

About the only real meaningful difference is the bottom bracket drop.. the racier bikes will give you a small amount of greater cornering clearance. But it's not that significant... unless you're a top racer barely anyone is pedaling hard through the corners at large lean angles. Heck if you're a new Cat 4/5 and you are not scared of scraping an occasional pedal you're in better shape then 90% of the field as most 4/5 racers leave huge amounts of corner speed sitting on the table.

[seanw]

benefits of going custom with the nove or ottrot,other than the custom geometry, would be custom drawn tubes for your weight, riding style. also "better" ti and carbon. nove or ottrot i think would be a bit more snappy. i guess only the buyer can say if those things are worth the extra money. ive not ridden the nove or the fierte yet. have put a few miles on the ottrot and its gotta be the smoothest bike i have ever ridden while still being performance oriented. personally, i prefer the legend st ride over the ottrot. just felt like it had better acceleration than the ottrot. if i could only afford one!!

hope this helps,
sean

[swalburn]

I know the Fierte is completely capable race bike, I just got the itch for something different as a complement. I am a larger rider (190 lbs), and looking for something specifically designed for a larger rider. That is really the appeal of going custom. Ther Fierte has been outstanding so far, but I'm curious what other bikes have to offer with a set of shorter beefier chainstays, and tubes spec'ed for my weight. Obviously, I can't get that with some of the other brands I've mentioned. They are essentially off the rack bikes, but it is a lot easier to get a test ride so one would know how they will ride. When I bought my Fierte, I was unable to test ride it as it was just frameset, and it worked out perfectly. The fitter did a outstanding job. The problem is I'm getting fitter and stronger and I really can't get my bars any lower. I'm basically out of spacers under my stem. Also, I'm down about 30 lbs from when I bought it (and down from 316 lbs a couple years ago), and I will be refit before I purchase another bike.

[benb]

There will be a difference but it's mostly feel and not a quantifiable difference in time saved even on a course like a crit where you're making 4-5 sharp turns every mile.

The difference may make you feel good though.. get a really short-wheelbase bike with a cut-out seat tube, etc.. and the handling will make you "feel" faster, but it just won't make any significant difference in your speed as your own ability to break, steer, choose a line, and pedal as close to maximum lean angle as possible will be a much more important component.

How much saddle->bar drop do you have right now? You could try going with a bar with a greater drop... or just concentrate on riding in the drops more if you're not already. If you're racing you should be in the drops as often as possible when you're exposed to the wind.

[barry1021]

I know the Fierte is completely capable race bike, I just got the itch for something different as a complement. I am a larger rider (190 lbs), and looking for something specifically designed for a larger rider. That is really the appeal of going custom. Ther Fierte has been outstanding so far, but I'm curious what other bikes have to offer with a set of shorter beefier chainstays, and tubes spec'ed for my weight. Obviously, I can't get that with some of the other brands I've mentioned. They are essentially off the rack bikes, but it is a lot easier to get a test ride so one would know how they will ride. When I bought my Fierte, I was unable to test ride it as it was just frameset, and it worked out perfectly. The fitter did a outstanding job. The problem is I'm getting fitter and stronger and I really can't get my bars any lower. I'm basically out of spacers under my stem. Also, I'm down about 30 lbs from when I bought it (and down from 316 lbs a couple years ago), and I will be refit before I purchase another bike.

Outstanding!!
B21

[davids]

I don't own a Fierte IT, but I do own a "stock" '05 Nove, and I get the strong impression that the Fierte IT is a very similar bike.

Comparing the ride to a steel bike, I'd say that the Nove is both stiffer (laterally and at the bottom bracket) and has a softer ride. That's the magic of the Serotta carbon/Ti mixes, atmo. It has a very distinct personality, and you'll either love it, or stick with steel.

If you don't need custom geometry, I'd test the Fierte IT and HSG IT in your size, and pick the one you like the best. The Fierte IT and HSG IT may be my favorite bikes in the Serotta line right now!

As far as I'm concerned, most of us mere mortals shouldn't be telling the experts what we want - We should be choosing the (expert) design that we like the best.

Search the forums for posts from me with Fierte IT or Nove in them, and you'll find my longer diatribes on this subject.

[93legendti]

A question for the crowd.
I have a Fierte steel frame that I really like. It fits very well. I've owned many fine Italian frames and the Fierte is a winner for me.

My question is.... If I decide to try one of Serotta's IT frames (carbon/Ti combo) what would be the benefits of paying the extra $$ for a Nove or Ottrot over the stock IT Fierte. The geometry of the custom frame would be very much the same as the stock Fierte.

Any opinions??? I'll bet there are opinions out there.

If you own a IT Fierte, I'd like to hear from you, especially if you can compare it to a steel frame. thanks all. :banana:

I think custom may involve more than just geometry, since with an IT frame Serotta has a choice of several different stiffnesses for the carbon as well as the ti.

[swalburn]

I got my weekly reality check. I just came back from my group ride. 47 miles at 22.5 with some nice hills. The Fierte was flawless. I took my first pull with the A group. There is another guy with a Fierte. He was one of the strongest in the group. Once again I get reminded that the bike is fine, it is the motor that needs some work (although it was pretty darn good tonight). I rode well, and am looking forward to being lighter and stronger.

[05Fierte TI]

Swalburn, you posted the following

The problem is I'm getting fitter and stronger and I really can't get my bars any lower.

Are you using a -17 degree stem on the bike. If not, that would allow you to get the bars lower than the somewhat standard 84 degree stem. FSA and Richie both make a -17 stem

Cheers!

[swalburn]

Nope, right now I'm using a Thomson -10 stem. I still have 1 cm of spacers so I could cut a little more. I rode in my drops a lot tonight. I'm very very comfortable on the bike. The bike worked great. I may pick up a new stem, but there is no point doing anything until I get re-fit.