OT Part A - Hanoi Hotel; Part B - Global Chef Knife

[keno]

Part A: My wife and I are going on a Backroads bike tour of Vietnam at the end of the year. We will arrive in Hanoi a few days before the tour starts. I am looking for a very good hotel, with an emphasis on comfort, service and location.

Part B: I am thinking of getting a Global chef's knife (8" or so) and looking for recommendations as to model and where to buy.

I'll appreciate any first-hand information on these topics.

Thanks,

keno

[gt6267a]

part b: after going feeling up the knives at many a cooking store, the global knives seem to be the advertsiing mofia of anthony b. not saying he is sponsored, but he loves those knives, i do not. for a chef's knife, i find my wustoff classic the best. very recently, i felt a knife called a nakiri made by shun, www.kershawknives.com, that was amazing. the only reason i did not by it is because the fondling was in philly and i had to fly home. this knife will be in my kitchen in the near future.

my personal pref aside, you need to feel the knife in your hand. if it feels good, go for it. if not, try another knife.

[BoulderGeek]

I've had a Global 8" Santoku for about five years, and I love it.

Not as stoked about their European style chef's knife.

Never heard about the Bourdain mafia, but you can count me in if there is one. Tony and I speak the same language.

[dave thompson]

part b: after going feeling up the knives at many a cooking store, the global knives seem to be the advertsiing mofia of anthony b. not saying he is sponsored, but he loves those knives, i do not. for a chef's knife, i find my wustoff classic the best. very recently, i felt a knife called a nakiri made by shun, www.kershawknives.com, that was amazing. the only reason i did not by it is because the fondling was in philly and i had to fly home. this knife will be in my kitchen in the near future.

my personal pref aside, you need to feel the knife in your hand. if it feels good, go for it. if not, try another knife.
Agreed. Good knives are like good saddles, lotsa personal preferences involved. You have to handle a variety to find one that 'fits'.

[sbornia]

my personal pref aside, you need to feel the knife in your hand. if it feels good, go for it. if not, try another knife.

+1

I bought a 3-piece Global set, and like how they feel. 8" chef's knife is light and nicely balanced. YMMV. Took a knife skills class at Sur la Table, and got to try a few different brands. Global fit best for me, so I bought the bread knife and steak knives later on.

Name that movie - "Second prize: set of steak knives."

[Louis]

Name that movie - "Second prize: set of steak knives."

Too easy Glengarry Glen Ross (sp?)

Third prize - you're fired !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dave thompson]

Too easy Glengarry Glen Ross (sp?)

Third prize - you're fired !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Nope. Third prize is a two week vacation in St Louis.

[DRZRM]

I personally don't like the globals so much in the hand. Before you do anything, try a Shun Classic, depending on hand size, really pretty much all you need is a Chef 10" (I have big hands). I also have the 8" Santoku and their tomato knife, but I could have gotten by with only the chef. I love that knife.

[Louis]

Nope. Third prize is a two week vacation in St Louis.

Well, it's the one thing that can top two weeks in Italy... :p

Hey Dave, have a good time.

[dave thompson]

Well, it's the one thing that can top two weeks in Italy... :p

Hey Dave, have a good time.
I will! Our DeRosas await!

[Ti Designs]

Part B: The long search for the perfect knife...

It's a hard subject for me, lost my first full Wustoff set when I broke up with a girlfriend, lost the second set in the divorce. I've had both the 9" and 10" Trident (now called Classic) and always felt a lack of control with the big heavy blade. I have a good friend at Kershaw, we're talking steel for my new knife set - some people do custom bikes, I do custom knives.

Kitchen knives are all about how you work and what fits in your hand. A few years ago I was looking for a graduation present for one of my riders. She loved to cook and could chop food faster than most food processors. The gift was to be a cutting board (2" thick end grain oak and maple with dovetailed ends) and a knife. I went in search of answers the right way. I went to a trusted sushi bar and started sending sake to the chefs. I found out that one of them had their bike stolen that day, so we talked bikes first. Then the conversation turned to knives. These guys have very strong opinions about knives, but the Global come up as a good knife for smaller and warmer hands.

As for use, it depends on how you work. Are you looking for a blade surface that doesn't stick to veggies? Do you need a blade that cuts straight in thick foods? (single sharpened blades tend no to) Do you roll across the blade or pull the blade more? Do you start cuts with the tip, or does a japanese style blade work better for you? I've always find that toying with a knife without really using it tells me nothing. More to the point, I don't really know if I like a knife until I've used it for a while - watch yourself work, figure out what would work best in your own hand.

There's got to be a Sawzall joke in this thread somewhere...

I've had a Global 8" Santoku for about five years, and I love it.

Not as stoked about their European style chef's knife.

Never heard about the Bourdain mafia, but you can count me in if there is one. Tony and I speak the same language.

[RIHans]

I spend 9-10 hours a day...no kiddin', with a knife in my hand. My weapon of choice would be the 8' French knife. Some like a 10"...I like an 8". Soligen steel works, or a nice Japan Global. The bottom line is...SHARP...like a razer. I have both in my knife rack, use both all the time...I keep 'um both sharp. Any chef will tell you, a dull knife, is a dangerous knife.
AS far as a knife to buy...I subscribe to a few trade publications, and the FORSCHNER knife brand is a good buy for the money...8" Chefs knife. You will be choppin' like a prep cook in no time!

[William]

I know a bit about knives too.....unfortunately it doesn't apply to cooking. I'll defer to Hans on this one. ;)



William

[hypnos]

Another vote for Shun cutlery. I've used knives by several makers and found Shun the best. A joy to use. I scored a three piece set on ebay for not much $$$. If you are buying just one knife, go for the 8 inch chef knife.

[shinomaster]

Find an old 10" Sabatier French steel knife, you know, the kind that gets rusty when you don't dry it. French knives have a great blade shape.

[deechee]

I use a Wustoff 8" too. Didn't like the handle of the Globals. I use some of the smaller Forschner/Victorinox knives and love 'em. My gf and I have have small hands and we like the weight; my sister has small hands too and uses a 10" wustoff classic. Santoku shape knives are nice too; been thinking of getting one but I probably have enough knives as is.

I'm also partial to the Heckels Twin Select chef's knives but I don't seem them much anymore so I never bought one (I used it one evening while cooking a big dinner with friends.)

[Ozz]

The 8" chef's knife is my most used knife in the kitchen....I use a Henckels Four Star, mainly cuz I given a Santuko Four Star about 20 yrs ago and decided to round out my set...If I was buying today, and would look at the Wusthof line first. Comparable blades...just more work goes into the handle and tang.

The Shun line has terrific blades. I recently picked up the Ken Onion Chef's knife...man is it sharp. It is great for slicing, but the blade is too curved for chopping lots of veggies at once. Still, it's a beautiful knife with a great handle. The steel seems very hard. I've had it a couple months now, and have only had to run it over steel a couple times. The attached picture doesn't really show off the "damascus" look steel pattern.

Global's look pretty techy, and are suppose to be nice, but I have never used one. Like "Ti Designs" said, you really need to use one for awhile to decide if you like the shape of the handle and the blade.

[Redturbo]

Check out AL MAR
http://www.almarknives.com/images/ALMAR2007.pdf#1617

[shinomaster]

Really, get a French knife. German knives are for Germans and sausages.

[shinomaster]

Scratch that...get a Chinese cleaver. It will out-perform any worthless Global santoku, or Messermeister, Henkles, or Wustof chefs knife. The one I have is from Chinatown in NYC bought in 1980 by my mom's friend Mr. Chan. He was a chef along with her in a three star restaurant in Elmira New York. This knife can slice, scoop, chop, mince, and turn tomato into a lotus flower (not by me). All those billions of Chinese can't be wrong atmo.

[JasonH]

The steel seems very hard. I've had it a couple months now, and have only had to run it over steel a couple times.

You really ought to steel your knives a few swipes every time you use them.

[92degrees]

Murray Carter. The knife will arrive sharp enough to split hair and is ground and heat treated to hold that edge and be easily maintained. Period.

http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/5412/52351le8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Too Tall]

Find an old 10" Sabatier French steel knife, you know, the kind that gets rusty when you don't dry it. French knives have a great blade shape.

Were we separated at hatching? My fav. knife is a Sabatier that my folks prolly purchased in the 60's. No kidding, a local guy used to come around in an old chevy panel truck with a big arse grinding wheel he had rigged to a motor and would jingle his way thru the 'hood. Everyone would bring out their knives and lawnmowers for him to work on...he'd return the knives to your door later in the day...that was when I was a kid. His son took over and is STILL driving the same old truck and is sharpening my knives...that's duhhh like 40 yrs. later!!!! Kewl.

The old high carbon Sabatier is a fairly soft metal and requires frequent edge straightening but what a heck of a knife. I've got the stainless version and it buhlows...it sharpens razor sharp but really does not hold that edge for long and I can not keep the edge up using the steel.

FWIIW I do dang near everything except make zest with a 10" Chef's knife. I dun get all the fancy stuff.

[Ozz]

You really ought to steel your knives a few swipes every time you use them.
Yeah, I know...I'm just not sure the steel I have (Henckels) is appropriate for how hard this blade is. The steel of the "steel", is supposed to be harder than the steel of the knife blade.

When I run my kershaw over my steel, it just glides over it...it doesn't feel like it is doing any honing. It's weird.

The blade is still like a razor... ;)

[shinomaster]

Too Tall..My mom got three Sabatier knives back aroung 1980, because it was the knife of choice in the restaurant she worked in. I Have a three year old Messermeister 8" chefs knife that is still like a razor having ony used a diamond steel on it a few times. I like the shape and the balance and weight of her knives better. I hope she gives them to me. :) Diamond steels rock.

[Kevan]

...the FORSCHNER knife brand is a good buy for the money...8" Chefs knife. You will be choppin' like a prep cook in no time!

recommended this knife over many others. No personal experience as yet.

I'm still using my Wilkinson self-sharping.

No...not really.

[shinomaster]

recommended this knife over many others. No personal experience as yet.

I'm still using my Wilkinson self-sharping.

No...not really.

Funny you say that. That cleaver in thet picture is a Forchner. It is nothing fancy but it's as sharp as you need it to be.

[Ozz]

Looky what I found regarding Shun knives:

What material is the honing steel made of?

To answer this question we need to address why this question typically comes up. The German philosophy has always been that the Rockwell (hardness) of the steel used for honing, needs to be higher than the Rockwell of the knife. The reason for this is that with their knives, they are not only straightening the edge but also deburring it, which actually removes some of the frayed metal. Our VG10 steel acts differently because, despite having a higher Rockwell, it is also more pliable, so we are not deburring the edge but simply straightening it. This negates the need for an ultra high Rockwell honing-steel.

Honing:

It’s very important to the life of your blade to keep your knife honed regularly. First and most importantly, you must understand that there is a difference between honing and sharpening your knives.

Honing is the act of maintaining your blade. It helps put your blade back into alignment to give you the best performance possible until such time as your knife needs sharpening.

Sharpening actually shaves metal off of the blade to put a fresh edge on the knife. If you hone regularly, you cut down on the need for sharpening, which extends the life of your knife.

Things to remember when honing your knives:

*Don’t use a diamond steel for honing. Diamond steels are for sharpening and should only be used by professionals.

*When using a honing steel, Shun blades must be placed at a 16-degree angle to the steel. Our Shun honing steels have a patented handguard with a 16-degree angle built in. All you have to do is line the blade up anywhere on the half-moon guard and the blade will be resting against the steel at the correct angle. Smaller blades can be lined up against the flat part of the handguard.

*Do NOT push too hard against the steel with the blade. A few light strokes on each side of the blade is all it takes to help maintain the edge.

Shino - please note comment about "diamond steels". :)

Chinese cleavers are cool....time to go shopping! :cool:

[shinomaster]

Yeah, you don't want to use a diamond steel every time you use a knife, as might with a regular steel.
To me a santoku is a compromise between a western chefs knife and a Chinese cleaver. They dont rock very well (no pun) and seem only good for slicing. A cleaver does everything. I can slice zuccini paper thin and scoop up a big pile pile with the cleaver, and nothing works better for mincing parsley.
I know shun makes a beautiful Damascus stye Chinese cleaver. ;)

p.s. make sure it has a curved blade. You can't rock a straight blade.

[shinomaster]

I really want one of these imho.

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.cutleryandmore.com/large/5290.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.cutleryandmore.com/details.asp%3FSKU%3D5290&h=362&w=600&sz=23&hl=en&start=10&um=1&tbnid=aWKf2XiH6WFkXM:&tbnh=81&tbnw=135&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dshun%2Bcle

[gt6267a]

http://www.cutleryandmore.com/details.asp?SKU=10502

i am wondering what you guys think of this knife. it seems like a very workable size. not quite a cleaver but ...

[Ozz]

Cool, but you really need to hold it to see if it is right for you. The classic Shun handle appears to be comfy for right-handers only...check out the profile in the link you provided.

Also, this appears to similar to a santuko, without the curved top of the blade. Sort of half-way between a cleaver and a knife. Not that this is bad, just don't expect it to chop well. Your knuckles will probably contact the cutting board. And frankly, you should slice rather than chop anyway. ;)

Knives are kind of like bikes....you need (want) lots of them for different purposes. Although just one (8" chef's) would do just fine. ;)

[shinomaster]

I guess it depends on what you want to use it for? How do you use a knife? THe funny thing about the Chinese cleaver is that it looks large but it's very nimble and balanced, same with a French chefs knife. It is funny, but people seem intimidated by larger knives yet they usually perfom better. I have a cute 6" henkles chefs knife that is great for small jobs, but it's kind of worthless if I want to slice up a bunch of mushrooms or zucchini. I think the knife you are looking at is for slicing veggies or sushi..? Not sure.

[gt6267a]

i think it is mostly for vedgies but might work for a little meat. my go to knife is a 8" wustoff classic chef's. i tried a santoku but find it does everything about half as well as the chef's so it sits in the block. my interest in the nakiri is to try something new and get a little diversity in the kitchen, though i might just learn again that my chef's knife is the business.

per the weight and handle or the nakiri, i have felt and liked it. though, oddly, i did not like that handle on their knives with less weight.

[hypnos]

The classic Shun handle appears to be comfy for right-handers only...check out the profile in the link you provided.

I'm a lefty and the Shun classic handle feels very comfortable.

[rwsaunders]

Dave Thompson turned me on to these. Was it in Okinawa Dave?

http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/2006/10/original_ginsu_knife_commercial_video/

[DRZRM]

This is a great knife, but it has an asymetric blade (sharpened at a steeper angle on one side than the other). For cutting through things that are thick it will migrate off line, so it's not really a cleaver. I think there is a place for it in many quivers, but it's not the all-in-one knive (for me that is the 10" chefs).

http://www.cutleryandmore.com/details.asp?SKU=10502

i am wondering what you guys think of this knife. it seems like a very workable size. not quite a cleaver but ...

[Louis]

:
....what to obsess over?

Clearly most of us obsess over bikes. Some of us obsess over stereos, others over watches, yet others over cameras and apparently some over knives. I do obsess a bit over bikes, but have relatively inexpensive but functional (sometimes, the stereo is intermittent) versions of the latter. I got my digital camera for free and haven't used my AE-1 in ages.

I'm guessing that the vast majority of folks can't obsess over everything in their life, because it seems to me that you'd go crazy.

So, how does one end up choosing the passions in his / her life? Is it purely random, or is there a pattern?

Louis

[Steve Hampsten]

:
....what to obsess over?
Is it purely random, or is there a pattern?

Louis

People like hand tools, and pointy shiny things - and knives are about the simplest pointy shiny hand tool in the world.

I cooked professionally for twenty years so that explains my love of knives, my favorites being my 25 year-old Sabatier carbon 9", any good German 10" and my Kershaw santoku and paring knife. You need an assortment and may as well try different brands.

A magnetic knife block will help keep thing organized and not crashing into each other - I have mine mounted in my knife drawer.

[keno]

to continue using my Henckels Professional "S" 8" chef's knife, at least for the time being. Based on what seems to be very sound advice to me, I would have to use a knife for a while in order to know if it is for me. Now, let's say that a good chef's knife comes in at about $100, more or less (and I did not find much in the way of bargains on ebay). Unless someone knows of a seller who gives a buy and try deal under which a knife can be returned, no questions asked, for a full refund, I'd have to spend a bundle to try out all of the good ideas submitted. So what I've got works decently and I'm no Eric Ripert so I'll continue with my current cutting edge.

While it may seem heretical, the excellent knowledge provided by many on knives and the same for my shotgun thread has provided far more useful information than to any I've submitted for bike-related information. I guess that I'm asking the wrong bike-related questions.

Thanks, again,

keno

[Marron]

Find an old 10" Sabatier French steel knife, you know, the kind that gets rusty when you don't dry it. French knives have a great blade shape.

If you didn't have the wisdom to buy and cherish a thin bladed carbon steel Sabatier knife back in the 70's start trolling ebay.

As an altenative you might swing by Dehillirion next time you're in Paris and pick up some of their eastern European knock-offs. They're nearly as good as the originals.