New Wheels for my New Bike - help, please!

[thejen12]

Now that I have my new custom bike all set up, it's time to get some new wheels (the poor thing is riding my old, mismatched Mavic/Ultegras). Here are my "wants" - please feel free to critique them and make suggestions. Also, I have a local wheel builder here, but he is going through some tough stuff right now and may not have time (or desire) to build these wheels (building wheels is a small part of his business), so I'd appreciate contact info for some of the masters I've read about in this forum.

I weigh about 125 lbs. and am not a power rider. I ride recreationally (hopefully centuries), commute (nice roads), and plan to do an organized (sagged) tour about once a year. I have muscle problems in my upper back that make me sensitive to vibration, so I don't want something harsh-riding. I also don't want something with fancy, weirdo parts such that if I break down in out-back Iowa on a tour, I can't fix it or replace it easily. I like to climb, so appreciate light weight where it meets the above criteria.

Rims: 700C Clincher. Don't want aero, don't want to have to use a long valve-stem. Silver. I'm thinking 28-hole front and rear for lighter weight (I'm riding 32-hole now). I was thinking of Aerohead rims, does that sound good? I don't know how deep they are, if they require a long valve-stem.

Hubs: I really really want Chris King hubs because I want the bling of the mango color. My bike was already painted to match, since I have a mango headset and spacers. Any reason not to get them, other than I know D/A would cost less?

Spoke nipples: I have a Mavic Reflex clincher, probably machine built, with aluminum nipples that I've been riding for 10 years as a front wheel without a problem (I don't think it's even needed truing, if so, only once.) Any reason not to go with aluminum nipples on the front? And, I guess brass on the back, just for durability?

Spokes: Don't want bladed, I ride in too many cross-winds. I have a back wheel built with the really skinny Revolution spokes that I like, but I don't think you can get them any more. I guess I'd stick with something similar.

I know nothing about patterns such as two-cross, three-cross, etc. I don't think I really need to know, since someone else would be building the wheel, but I'd be interested in suggestions all the same. It's fun to learn something new.

By the way, I plan to run Conti GP 4000 tires, 25mm - the yellow ones look perfect on my bike!

Thanks for any suggestions,

Jenn

[saab2000]

My only concern is the Chris King hubs. I am sure they are nice, but the buzzsaw/machine gun/airhammer/swarm of bees/B-1 bomber flying overhead/top fuel dragster amount of noise when coasting would concern me.

Coast past a cemetery with those things and you might wake the dead.

OK, now I really am going riding.... :D

[cpg]

I'd go with DT hubs and rims. Find a good wheel builder. Forgive me if you've already mentioned it but got pictures of the new ride?

Curt

[SoCalSteve]

My only concern is the Chris King hubs. I am sure they are nice, but the buzzsaw/machine gun/airhammer/swarm of bees/B-1 bomber flying overhead/top fuel dragster amount of noise when coasting would concern me.

Coast past a cemetery with those things and you might wake the dead.

OK, now I really am going riding.... :D

The new ones are much quieter.

Just sayin'

[thejen12]

I'd go with DT hubs and rims. Find a good wheel builder. Forgive me if you've already mentioned it but got pictures of the new ride?

Curt
I'm embarassed to take her picture with mismatched wheels, but here is a link to the frame pictures I posted from the NAHBS (it wouldn't let me post the same picture here). http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=26878

Jenn

[Smiley]

Talk to Ergott or Jeremy and they of all people will convince you that King Hubs are NOT the way to go. Please if you go to a custom builder like Jeremy , don't tell they how to do it , the beauty in their creativity is to give them your weight riding style and budget and let them be creative with the end result. It has worked for me many times over and for the clients I have sent Jeremy's way

[Dave B]

You already know what you want! A beautiful set of Mango Kings on a Mavic Open Pro's (not aero and doesn't weigh anything at all).

Whatever you do, DO NOT listen to anyone talk you out of Kings due to the noise! It sounds glorius! Your bike will not be finished until you put kings on it! :D


Check this out to understand how much you NEED these! Ignore the crazy high brifters, they have been sorted out!

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=27000&highlight=crown+jewel

[thejen12]

Talk to Ergott or Jeremy and they of all people will convince you that King Hubs are NOT the way to go. Please if you go to a custom builder like Jeremy , don't tell they how to do it , the beauty in their creativity is to give them your weight riding style and budget and let them be creative with the end result. It has worked for me many times over and for the clients I have sent Jeremy's way
Smiley,

Can you give me their contact info? PM me, if you don't want to post it here. Thanks!

Jenn

[thejen12]

You already know what you want! A beautiful set of Mango Kings on a Mavic Open Pro's (not aero and doesn't weigh anything at all).

Open Pro was my first thought, but they don't have 28-hole in silver.

I take it you're happy with your CK hubs? Not too noisy? You were SHOUTING a bit, are you sure they're not too noisy? ;)

Jenn

[rdparadise]

I don't have any experience with CK so I can't comment on his hubs. Based on what you're telling us here, I would recommend Mavic Open Pro, 32 spoke, with Dura Ace hubs. You could get titanium spokes if you require a softer ride.

Good luck and enjoy the ride. I checked the pics and the frame is beautiful. I think you'll love the S & S couplers if you plan to travel with your bike much.

Bob

[Dave B]

Open Pro was my first thought, but they don't have 28-hole in silver.

I take it you're happy with your CK hubs? Not too noisy? You were SHOUTING a bit, are you sure they're not too noisy? ;)

Jenn


Sorry I was coasting I couldn't hear you about the beautiful nosie of angry bees that were behind me! :p

[Bill D]

I've got a rear wheel that I built with a Chris King hub laced to a Velocity Aerohead rim (28-hole, 2x). I'm with the Pres: I actually like the swarm-of-bees sound of the CK freewheel mechanism. Not everyone does obviously, so you should listen to one to see if you like it or not before you spend the $$. I've got maybe five thousand miles on this wheel (~150 lbs. on mostly good roads), and I've had zero problems with it.

You might also want to take a look at the DT rims, which are quite nice.

-bd

EDIT: I forgot to point out that neither the Velocity Aerohead nor the DT 1.1 require special tubes. Standard-length valve stems work fine with both.

[thejen12]

I've got a rear wheel that I built with a Chris King hub laced to a Velocity Aerohead rim (28-hole, 2x). I'm with the Pres: I actually like the swarm-of-bees sound of the CK freewheel mechanism. Not everyone does obviously, so you should listen to one to see if you like it or not before you spend the $$. I've got maybe five thousand miles on this wheel (~150 lbs. on mostly good roads), and I've had zero problems with it.

You might also want to take a look at the DT rims, which are quite nice.

-bd

EDIT: I forgot to point out that neither the Velocity Aerohead nor the DT 1.1 require special tubes. Standard-length valve stems work fine with both.
Thanks for the good info, Bill D.

Actually, I have listened to one wheel with a CK hub, and it didn't seem nearly as loud as my riding buddy's Velomax Ascent wheel. I didn't mind the noise at all, in fact, I kinda liked it. :p

DT 1.1 rims were on my short list, too. If you had to build that wheel over again, would you stick with the Aerohead, or try the DT? Just curious. I think the Aerohead are spec'ed a tiny bit lighter, but I don't know if one is supposed to be higher quality than the other.

Jenn

[Smiley]

Smiley,

Can you give me their contact info? PM me, if you don't want to post it here. Thanks!

Jenn


Jeremy Parfitt at 505 983-4241 , Ergott is on the members list under that name. Good luck

[chuckred]

DT 1.1 rims were on my short list, too. If you had to build that wheel over again, would you stick with the Aerohead, or try the DT? Just curious. I think the Aerohead are spec'ed a tiny bit lighter, but I don't know if one is supposed to be higher quality than the other.

Jenn

I have Aeroheads on C Record Hubs - very nice riding, noticably stiffer than my generic Torelli rims. I'm not sure, but I would think the Open Pros would give you the more plush, comfortable ride it sounded like you were looking for?

But, the Aeroheads do come in lots of colors!

[thejen12]

I have Aeroheads on C Record Hubs - very nice riding, noticably stiffer than my generic Torelli rims. I'm not sure, but I would think the Open Pros would give you the more plush, comfortable ride it sounded like you were looking for?


Good point, Chuckred,

I've mostly ridden the Mavic Reflex clinchers, and, more recently, an Open Pro rear that replaced my Reflex rear. But OPs don't come in 28-hole in silver, that's why I had kinda ruled them out.

Any opinions on the forum about the ride comfort between Mavic OP, DT Swiss 1.1, and Velocity Aerohead rims? I was thinking they'd all be pretty similar.

Thanks, Jenn

[saab2000]

I won't say anything more about hubs..... :D

As far as rims go, there I have an opinion. But take it with a grain of salt. I weigh more than you and probably ride a bit more aggressively.

On two of my bikes I have the following setup:

-Campagnolo Record Hubs - 28F/32R
-Velocity Aerohead rims - Offset (OCR) rear rim (creates better, more even tension)
-DT Revolution spokes in the front, DT Revolutions on the rear with 14/15/14 guage on the drive-side.
-Brass nipples

I used to have open pro rims. The Velocity rims feel stiffer to be honest, though this could be due to the offset rear and the fact that I have the thicker spokes on the rear drive side. I used to use all DT Revolutions. The wheels are nice and are almost as nice as my Campagnolo Nucleons.

The Campagnolo hubs are no longer available with 28 holes in the front, so if that is a priority you will have to go with another manufacturer. There are many nice ones. I think White Industry hubs look especially nice.

I built my own wheels. But the other builders mentioned have good reputations. Take the advice of the others too. Let the builder have a say in deciding what you need. As far as comfort goes, mine are fine.

I have no opinion on the spokes, but the expert wheelbuilders here might. Shimano Dura-Ace hubs are a well-known excellent product as well.

[thejen12]

I used to have open pro rims. The Velocity rims feel stiffer to be honest, though this could be due to the offset rear and the fact that I have the thicker spokes on the rear drive side.

When saab2000 says the Velocity rims feel stiffer, does that also mean "harsher"? Or would the lacing pattern and/or tire selection dictate alot of that? (Sorry, I'm new to this wheel stuff. :confused: ) Because I don't mind accelerating fast, which is what I think of when I think of stiff, but I don't want to get beat up on a century that might run across rougher roads.

Thanks! Jenn

[saab2000]

Stiffer in this sense does not mean harsher. I mean it in a sense of lateral stiffness when climbing hard out of the saddle.

The most comfortable wheels I have ever owned are pictured here. They are Ambrosio tubular wheels. I picture them so you can see that they are box shaped. This will likely have the most 'give' in terms of absorbing road shock. They are also scarce these days and besides, they are tubulars, which I don't think is what you are looking for.

As far as more or less high-performance clinchers, you are not going to find many modern, box-section rims. Most have some kind of higher vertical profile. The Velocity aerohead is not an uncomfortable rim, or stiff in a bad sense.

I hope that helps clarify things.

The rims with the deep V might have some less vertical compliance. With that in mind, tire selection will ulimately have more of an effect on comfort.

[Dave B]

Another thing to remember with your weight, you can play a bit with tire pressure. Pump is up to 120+psi and it will ride harsh but faster. Get it to 90 to 100 psi with your weight or possibly a bit lower and the tires will act a lot different (more squish can/could = more forgiveness)and have a tiny bit more rolling resistance, but not enough to slow the mo!

Think of it like icing on the cake. Decent wheel build (with Kings of course :D ) and some nice tires with the right amount of pressure, and you may feel like you are in Caddy!

[thejen12]

As far as more or less high-performance clinchers, you are not going to find many modern, box-section rims.
Thanks for the pic. My husband has some old Fir clincher rims that look like that that he loves.

Jenn

[thejen12]

Another thing to remember with your weight, you can play a bit with tire pressure. Pump is up to 120+psi and it will ride harsh but faster. Get it to 90 to 100 psi with your weight or possibly a bit lower and the tires will act a lot different (more squish can/could = more forgiveness)and have a tiny bit more rolling resistance, but not enough to slow the mo!
Yeah, I had a great ride last night on my Mavic/Ultegra wheels with Michelin PR2 25's pumped up to about 80-85 lbs. each - I felt like I could roll over anything and still feel comfy! I hope I can get a similar ride with the GP 4000s in 25's. Both those tire choices are new to me, I'm trying to find my new favorite tire. (The yellow Conti's sure look great on my bike, so I hope they win ;) )

Jenn

[vaxn8r]

After looking at your frame with the couplers, atmo the mango is gonna get old. Silver DA hubs would look classy for a long long time and would compliment the couplers. Plus there are none better than DA, CK included.

[medici]

Rims: 700C Clincher. Don't want aero, don't want to have to use a long valve-stem. Silver. I'm thinking 28-hole front and rear for lighter weight (I'm riding 32-hole now). I was thinking of Aerohead rims, does that sound good? I don't know how deep they are, if they require a long valve-stem.

Hubs: I really really want Chris King hubs because I want the bling of the mango color. My bike was already painted to match, since I have a mango headset and spacers. Any reason not to get them, other than I know D/A would cost less?

Thanks for any suggestions,

Jenn

Jenn:

You do get around here!

I have a pair of King hubs that had to be replaced. CK claimed that I shouldn't have had them tied and soldered. Welllllll . . .
The replacements have been fine. Perhaps it's because I got one of
their first hub sets.

Karl and Jenny P. both have CK wheelsets and they've held up very well.

I hated the noise at first, especially since I had one of the first pair, but grew to love it. Not a problem. Have you listened to Hugis?

Otherwise I'd recommend Phils if you can get past the weight and price. They're really my favorite handbuilt wheelset. Very smooth, solid, and
comfortable.

Pete

[thejen12]

As far as more or less high-performance clinchers, you are not going to find many modern, box-section rims. Most have some kind of higher vertical profile.

What about the Velocity Razor rim? It's a box-type rim with eyelets, but 43g heavier than the Aerohead rim. I guess that would be about 10% heavier. Would it be 10% more comfortable? :confused:

Jenn

[thejen12]

Thanks for the feedback on the CKs, Pete!

This forum is great! LeRoy loves his Phil Wood hubs, too.

Jenn

[Bill D]

DT 1.1 rims were on my short list, too. If you had to build that wheel over again, would you stick with the Aerohead, or try the DT? Just curious. I think the Aerohead are spec'ed a tiny bit lighter, but I don't know if one is supposed to be higher quality than the other.

I actually do have a set of wheels built with the DT 1.1 rims. I got those from Mike Garcia of Odds and Endos (http://www.oddsandendos.com), whom I found through recommendations of this forum. He was very easy to work with, had very reasonable prices and makes a darn good wheel. FWIW, those are built with a Speedcific rear hub, a White Industries front hub and bladed spokes. (Note: Call him if you want a quote; he's not that into email. And he can get you anything, whether it's on his website or not.)

I'm not sure I'm much of an authority on the relative merits of Aeroheads vs. the DT 1.1. My wheels with the DT 1.1's seem slightly stiffer, but I imagine that's because of the bladed spokes vs. the Revolution spokes of my Aerohead wheels. I doubt there are any major differences in how the two rims ride. I can't compare to Open Pros because I haven't ridden much on those. As someone else pointed out, the Velocity rims are available in a lot more colors and drillings, but it sounds like you don't want colors. The DT rims have little wear indicators in the braking surface, which seems nice in theory, though I only have a few thousand miles on them, so I'm not sure how important those might be in practice. And the DTs have eyelets, though I personally have had no problems with building or truing the non-eyeleted Aeroheads.

Long story short, if color/drilling isn't an issue, pick the ones you think look cooler or the ones you can find more cheaply because they'll both make very light, versatile, durable wheels (assuming a decent wheelbuilder, of course).

-bd

[spincycle]

Jenn,

Here's a good thread on hubs. You can find a couple of posts by Ergott on hubs and wheel building in general.

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=16375