Saw 300...So, am I becoming a prude.....

[William]

Or maybe just a responsible parent?

My wife and I were really shocked to see the number of young children that accompanied their parents to this movie. If you've seen it...and we loved it....you know that it's pretty graphic in the battle scenes and a bit of nudity and sex as well. We saw at least 8 or 9 kids that had to be in the 8 - 12 age range. One grandpa brought in two boys about 10. We figured that Gramps might have been duped into taking them, but once things got going he didn't leave. I know that when I was younger I would have tried to get into this movie. But as a parent, I'm kind of shocked to see the number of folks who apparently think it's just fine taking youngsters to a movie like this.

I'm left wondering?

Am I prudish? :confused:



William :rolleyes:

[toaster]

Happens all the time. Recently, a mom brought her son and daughter ages 5-9 years old to the last half of The Departed. The profanity and graphic shooting to the head scenes are permanently burned into their little brains, I'm sure.

Nice.

[Kevan]

but my 16 yr old, junior in high school, hanging with his senior pals, went and he thought it rocked. Even at age 16, as mature as Tucker behaves, I wondered if this film was appropriate. Problem is... by the time they start driving, not every hour or event is accounted for beforehand. He knows his parent's concerns and we try to discuss situations before they hatch. Still...

I saw the same grandpa taking his very young grandsons (6-8 yrs old maybe) to go see "Saving Private Ryan". Guess Pops wanted to share in the nostalgia.

[pjm]

I was in the video store the other day when I see a 9 year old with a copy of Borat in her hand go up to Mommy and say, can we get this, Pleeeeeease?
Mom says, I guess so. Boy were they in for a shock!

Then again, maybe not.

[oldfatslow]

And would agree that it was inappropriate for kids younger than 13. It was rated "R" not PG-13. It features a lot of graphic violence, consensual sex, as well as non consensual sex.

All that said, I enjoyed the movie as did my fifteen year-old. I would not have been comfortable had my 13 year old been there. Everyone needs to make their own calls on these things and talk to you kids about what they see.

[slowgoing]

My 11 year old son wants to see it. I saw it without him so I could decide for myself without relying on ratings/reviews/word of mouth. No way he will see it, at least for a few years. Great movie though.

[Ahneida Ride]

Hey William, it's real simple

The modern Media's message is: "Find a girl and do her, do her again,
then dump her and the do another."

After all, this is how real men behave. Sex sells ......

I unequivocally reject this indoctrination. :mad:
I am tired of it and I am not afraid to express my indignation in this
public format.

Proud to be a Prude .....

[Kevan]

puritanic no. I'd rather my children see an "R" rated love scene than a violent one.

We certainly are violent creatures at heart.

[DWF]

If you have any kid over the age of about 12, and probably less than that, in a public school, you are not and cannot, protect them from being exposed to anything. Violence, sex, drugs, or otherwise. You can equip them with the information they need to make good choices but these days they have incredible access to the complete smorgasboard of human vice.

IMHO, the best you can do is to maintain lines of communication and talk openly & frankly about any subject that comes up. If you really want to stay current, watch South Park with your kids. Every social taboo or issue you could ever think of will come up and be dealt with in a surprisingly even handed fashion. Extremes will be skewered mercilessly but the message always comes back to the middle. No, I'm not kidding.

[gt6267a]

I kind of thought it was a chick flick.
Unrealistic 10 foot tall fantasy g-d-wanna-be-alla-barbie char, check
Unrealistic oiled men in speedos with capes, check.
Independent woman killing a man who wronged her, check.
Minimal dialogue and lots of music montage, check.
High contrast film, check.
Did I mention the naked men? check.

The one part of this movie which really left me thinking they missed the mark, where was the char development? Where was the activity that had me thinking, I give a carp about these people? It never happened. When all those guys kicked the can, there was not a wet eye in the audience. They just turned the lights on and we left.

Is there not a story of heroic people that did not get told? Or, said another way, did not get told in an entangling way? Sad.

I am going to agree with Kevan and take it a bit further. The impression of the battle scenes, especially ones where we don’t care about the chars lives is much worse for wear than a little hard-core kissing.

[Ozz]

I kind of thought it was a chick flick.
Unrealistic 10 foot tall fantasy g-d-wanna-be-alla-barbie char, check
Unrealistic oiled men in speedos with capes, check.
Independent woman killing a man who wronged her, check.
Minimal dialogue and lots of music montage, check.
High contrast film, check.
Did I mention the naked men? check.

The one part of this movie which really left me thinking they missed the mark, where was the char development? Where was the activity that had me thinking, I give a carp about these people? It never happened. When all those guys kicked the can, there was not a wet eye in the audience. They just turned the lights on and we left.

Is there not a story of heroic people that did not get told? Or, said another way, did not get told in an entangling way? Sad.

I am going to agree with Kevan and take it a bit further. The impression of the battle scenes, especially ones where we don’t care about the chars lives is much worse for wear than a little hard-core kissing.

Ummm.....the movie was an adaptation of a Frank Miller graphic novel (aka comic book). I believe the purpose of the film (imho) was visual stimulation rather than story telling....although it was (loosely) based on the battle of Thermopylae. It would be interesting to see (which I have not), like a train wreck or house fire is interesting to watch.... :cool:

Fwiw - the History Channel did a pretty interesting show a couple weeks ago about the Spartans, Greek and Persian society and the people and events leading up to Thermopylae.

BTW - if you want to see a good movie with similar storyline set during Vietnam see Go Tell the Spartans (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0077617/)

[wooly]

:D Call me conservative, but I saw that flick with my 16 yr old and would never take my younger ones to see it. I remember when Jurassic Park first came out. My wife and I sit down and notice that this dad has his 6 year old daughter with him. Early in the movie, she's screaming bloody murder because she's scared and the dad's telling her to close her eyes and be quiet. NICE! Fast forward. My wife and I are watching 40 year old virgin and there's a family with their 9-10 year old son. The dads laughing his butt off and covering the kids eyes when the sex scenes are playing. Not like there's any moaning or anything. :confused:

I just don't get some parents.

An yes, I think you can protect your kids with stuff like this. I would never watch Southpark with my 6 year old and try to explain some of the cr@p that goes on in that show. Admittedly, if I catch a scene when my kids are sleeping, I'll enjoy the pure over the top obsurdity of it. But kids grow up too fast these days anyway. Why rush it.

Rant over. Also, forgive me for attending some of these films :D .

[72gmc]

I don't think you are a prude, William. I think kids are seeing way too much, way too soon these days--but like Archibald said (he's still here?!) the genie is out of the bottle.

Re 300: I've taken no end of grief in the office for daring to say that it could have been better. I read the comic, I knew what it was and wasn't, but even with its limitations it could have been much better with a competent editor. It smelled of editing-by-storyboard, and had nowhere near the storytelling power of the comic.

[gt6267a]

I know it comes from a comic book, but that does mean poor char development is cool? sometimes, what works in a book does not work in a movie. better to take a little poetic license then make crap. and yes, i said it, i was not impressed by 300 and feel no need to acquire the dvd. on the other hand, i watched van wilder the rise of taj this weekend and it was pretty funny. not as good as old school, but still a tasty flick.

[vandeda]

Ahneida .... Thank you!!! Man, at just leaving my 20's, that attitude seems to be the predominant one of my age group, and man the younger generations seem to be even worse :-/

I hate to see what a "family" will look like in another decade. There will be no need for a family tree ... you flat out won't be able to map one

As for me, I couldn't see taking a teen to it other than 17 and beyond ... Younger minds just aren't as developed as we'd like to think they are. They still are in fact kids.

So I wouldn't say you're a prude William, just a shrinking number of people with a bit of sense.

d

Hey William, it's real simple

The modern Media's message is: "Find a girl and do her, do her again,
then dump her and the do another."

After all, this is how real men behave. Sex sells ......

I unequivocally reject this indoctrination. :mad:
I am tired of it and I am not afraid to express my indignation in this
public format.

Proud to be a Prude .....

[Ozz]

I know it comes from a comic book, but that does mean poor char development is cool? sometimes, what works in a book does not work in a movie. better to take a little poetic license then make crap. and yes, i said it, i was not impressed by 300 and feel no need to acquire the dvd. ....
We agree....I am thinking the producers/director were too focused on the "look" of the film, they forgot the story....too bad cuz it is a historically heroic event worth telling. :)

OT - William, you are not a prude....no way should young children should go to that movie. It's is obvious from the trailers what it will be like...sheesh.

BTW - I remember being apalled when viewing "Pulp Fiction" and some mom had a 5 year old there....at least he was running up and down the aisles and not watching the film. :rolleyes:

[BumbleBeeDave]

I don't think you're a prude at all.

Unfortunately, just about nothing I see like this incident surprises me anymore. It all just seems to be part of a general coarsening of American society these days. It seems just about anywhere I turn I see an increasing sense of entitlement, arrogance, and selfishness. That's coupled with constantly decreasing civility, respect for anyone or anything, and number of people or institutions willing to take responsibility for anything except having increased the shareholder's profits. It's the same general attitude we've seen described here on the forum countless times with drivers in their huge SUV's who seem to think it's our duty--and everyone else's--to get out of their way because they can't be bothered to hang up their cell phones and watch where they're driving.

To take Ahneida's example, I don't think it's anything new to have young men having the "macho" attiude that you're a real man if you f*** as many girls as possible. What seems to be new is the shrinking number of parents who are willing to take the responsibility to teach their sons that it's not the right attitude to have. It's also the lack of control that many parents have over what their kids see and do. How can you adequately teach your son to have respect for women when there's 12 year olds running around the mall in their Brittany Spears outfits with their pants pulled down so far you can see their pubic hair? How can you teach your son respect when he goes to basketball practice and the "music" blaring out of the coach's boom box may well feature a rap artist chanting about how he's going to "slap da' b*tch up" because she would'nt put out fast enough for his taste?

Now saying the above really makes me feel old and codgerly, and I try to have some context. I'm 48 years old in 2007. If I were 48 years old in 1950 would I still have this attitude--that over the past 30 years American civility and principles have gone down the tubes? Yeah, probably. But when so many parents seem to see nothing wrong with letting everyone raise their kids EXCEPT them, then it's goin' downhill fast, folks . . .

BBD, studying to be a professional codger.

[fierte_poser]

An yes, I think you can protect your kids with stuff like this. I would never watch Southpark with my 6 year old and try to explain some of the cr@p that goes on in that show. Admittedly, if I catch a scene when my kids are sleeping, I'll enjoy the pure over the top obsurdity of it. But kids grow up too fast these days anyway. Why rush it.

Rant over. Also, forgive me for attending some of these films :D .

My thoughts exactly. Many parents give up too easily when trying to counter what the media wants to shove into their children's minds.

[DWF]

:D Call me conservative, but I saw that flick with my 16 yr old and would never take my younger ones to see it. I remember when Jurassic Park first came out. My wife and I sit down and notice that this dad has his 6 year old daughter with him. Early in the movie, she's screaming bloody murder because she's scared and the dad's telling her to close her eyes and be quiet. NICE! Fast forward. My wife and I are watching 40 year old virgin and there's a family with their 9-10 year old son. The dads laughing his butt off and covering the kids eyes when the sex scenes are playing. Not like there's any moaning or anything. :confused:

I just don't get some parents.

An yes, I think you can protect your kids with stuff like this. I would never watch Southpark with my 6 year old and try to explain some of the cr@p that goes on in that show. Admittedly, if I catch a scene when my kids are sleeping, I'll enjoy the pure over the top obsurdity of it. But kids grow up too fast these days anyway. Why rush it.

Rant over. Also, forgive me for attending some of these films :D .
No one said a 6-year old should be watching South Park. You gotta' have some judgement. My point is that you have to know what you're kids are "into" or being subjected to when they're not with you...like at school. Once a kid is in middle school, you better believe that the veil of ignorance & innocence is being stripped from them. You can stick your head in the sand or you can acknowledge it and deal with it as you deem appropriate. You can't "protect" them from it. Nobody says you have to give up or condone it. Like I said, keep the lines of communication open and discuss frankly and openly anything that comes up.

[davids]

Too many parents let their kids make the decisions, whether it's by succumbing to a tantrum or attempting to divert one. I'd put a lot of people (who I otherwise respect) in this group.

Too many other parents don't even think about it, and treat their kids like they're small adults.

Lots of people are amazed at how thoughtful, polite, and respectful our daughter is. She wasn't born that way - She was raised that way. And a small part of that is that her parents tell her when something is not appropriate for her, and she is expected to honor our decision.



As far as 300... Based on what I've read, it's a two-dimensional cartoon come to action-porn life, with a homophobic subtext. The Boston Globe's Wesley Morris said it better than I can:

Much has been made of the allegorical potential of "300." Could Leonidas be some President Bush stand-in? Might the Persians be, well, the current Middle East? The movie could be all things to all people. For me, the fight is unfair. "300" is about a bunch of hot white metrosexuals -- those pecs, those abs, that hair -- against a million freaky nonwhite club kids. In other words, the gays. King Xerxes's hangout is full hookah-puffers, derelicts, and girls making it with girls (let's call them lesbians). His army is full of monsters seemingly from the Troma Films creature shop.

The dreaded Xerxes himself appears to be a 9-foot-tall Yul Brynner . His skin glitters. His head is totally shaved. His nails are manicured. His body is pierced and gold chains run from his scalp to his ankles. It's Yul, the mystical Miami nightclub version! During their big mano-a-mano attempt at negotiation, Xerxes tells Leonidas nothing would bring him more pleasure than for the Greek king to kneel down before him in submission. Leonidas recoils. So did the dudes next to me in the theater when Xerxes started to make his move.

According to this outrageously flagrant movie, the Spartans didn't just die for Glory, Duty, and Destiny. They died to keep the Hot Gates from turning into another gay disco.

p.s. I saw The Host (http://www.hostmovie.com/) a few weeks ago. Freaking awesome (except for the soundtrack. But, hey.) I'll take my daughter to see that when she's 16, atmo.

[sspielman]

Hey William, it's real simple

The modern Media's message is: "Find a girl and do her, do her again,
then dump her and the do another."

After all, this is how real men behave. Sex sells ......

I unequivocally reject this indoctrination. :mad:
I am tired of it and I am not afraid to express my indignation in this
public format.

Proud to be a Prude .....

Well, you and I are on a losing team. The Culture War is lost....

[weisan]

We are responsible for our children. Period.

The world is run amok by sin. Period.

We are kept alive by grace alone. Period.

He has overcome the world. Period.

[norman neville]

looking. sin city looked cool. i thought 300 was pretty funny more than anything. way over the top gay. there'll be a sin city 2, apparently. grindhouse appears to be pretty much a cartoon.

[jhcakilmer]

Personally, I think they're are very few worth wild movies out there......I mean very, very few!!

I can condone violence if it is for a constructive purpose, such as in Flags of our Fathers, or The Departed. Most of the other movies just have violence, as the basis of the entire plot line. So many of the movies these days are completely 1 demensional.....300 being one of them!

If I'm going to take my son to see a movie, I will make sure he can learn something.....if I want to do something entertaining, there are a million other things I can do with them........like take them for a ride, hiking, fishing, performing arts, symphony, multitude of other sports (BB, soccer, Baseball).....the list goes one. Not exactly spending quality time when sitting in a movie.

Just my 0.02

[sg8357]

The Iranian gummint is jumping up and down yelling about how the "300" is slagging the reputation of the Persians. The Iranians are blaming the US gummint, claiming the "300" is Yankee propaganda. Nice to see cultural cluelessness is a two way street.

The Greek tourist board is complaining that nowhere in Greece is that dark and dreary looking. (film was made against a blue screen in Blighty)

The reason the "writing" is so bad, is the agent tasked with getting the screen rights from Herodotus, couldn't find him in the LA phone book.

Note, I only read the review in the New Yorker, which from the sounds of things is more entertaining than the movie.

Scott G.

[grey poupon]

...

[wooly]

No one said a 6-year old should be watching South Park. You gotta' have some judgement. My point is that you have to know what you're kids are "into" or being subjected to when they're not with you...like at school. Once a kid is in middle school, you better believe that the veil of ignorance & innocence is being stripped from them. You can stick your head in the sand or you can acknowledge it and deal with it as you deem appropriate. You can't "protect" them from it. Nobody says you have to give up or condone it. Like I said, keep the lines of communication open and discuss frankly and openly anything that comes up.

Don't get me wrong. I understand that kids will encounter a lot of stuff in school that, as a parent, you cringe. Unfortunately, I've met (briefly) people that let their "6 year old watch Southpark". Be it 6, 7, 10, 11, etc, it's all pretty sad. This is not on topic, but the way that my wife and I chose to deal with the situation was to send our kids to private (catholic) school. Sure, you deal with many of the same issues but i feel that the scale it tipped a bit more in parent's favor.

I look at my kids and I hope they/we can maintain their innocents as long as possible. I even joke about sending my kids to the monestary :rolleyes: .

[William]

My wife and I enjoyed it for what it was...an over the top, comic book movie. Would we take our 8 and 6 year old to it, not on your life. I know who the people are who did the fight choreography for the film so that was really my main interest, but I still enjoyed watching it. That doesn't mean that we don't like the opera, broadway shows, classical music, the New Yorker, or National Geographic because we do. Be careful about pigeon holeing people. But that wasn't really my point. It was a comment on bringing young kids to such a show.

I agree with some of you that there is a lot of sex and violence out there and you can't protect your kids 24/7, but that doesn't mean we should serve it up either. I've been around both sides of the tracks so I know what potential is out there. I have no illusions about being able to shield my kids from it completely. We let them know that there are dangerous people out there, what to watch out for, and possible outcomes. All we can do is be responsible and raise our kids the best we can. To hope and trust that when those difficult choices come along, that they will make the right choice. Keeping dialog open and honest is one of they keys. Try to teach them about respect and empathy for others, but at the same time to by wary and not be taken advantage of either. I don't believe in shielding kids from everything and making them think the world is nothing but lollipops and rainbows, but there is a time and a place for everything. I just didn't think that 300 for the under 12 crowd was it atmo.






William

[wtex]

Some folks thought that Wild Hogs did so well its opening weekend as under 17s were buying tix to it and then diving into the 300 theater.
What may be most regrettable is that people will come away thinking that the Spartans were defenders of freedom. They were defenders of their way of life, big difference. As to the freedom angle, the Helots would say, 'eh, not so much.' I guess Zach Snyder decided to go the Michael Bay route and get all jingoistic with this.