Record 10 front derailleur alignment/replacement

[mwynne]

While doing a bit of regular maintenance I noticed that my front derailleur is a bit bent. Wondering if there's any good guidance out there on the specs/tolerance of the cage, is it worth trying to bend into alignment, is it fine, should it be replaced, etc.

Any insight appreciated! (I can grab better photos if a particular angle/measurement/etc would help)

Also, was there a version from this era that was compact-oriented? I'm running 46/30 chainrings and have been getting more dropped chains than usual.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50260719152_f776116794_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jznjKj)

[Hindmost]

Yeah, I've seen that before; I'm not entirely sure it's bent. Which derailleur, 8, early 10-speed?

[mwynne]

Yeah, I've seen that before; I'm not entirely sure it's bent. Which derailleur, 8, early 10-speed?

Oh yeah? The "tail" end looks somewhat bowed to me, but I don't have the background/another one to compare.

Early 10s I think, see below.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50260956582_8cb0f74e5f_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jzoxjW)

[zmudshark]

I just looked at one I have, and it was perfectly straight. I would undo the screw and use a crescent wrench to bend both sides straight.

[Ralph]

If it works good, I would use it as is.

[mwynne]

If it works good, I would use it as is.

I've been having some shifting issues - obviously could be set up, but I think that's pretty good - so I wanted to check just in case.

[boywander]

OP- unless you had an obvious impact to it, it's not that easy to bend it. The drop chain issue is more of an adjustment of the limit screw or proper alignment to the chainrings.

That said, it doesn't look bent at all. The tail in is design to compensate from chain rub.

Sent from my LG-M322 using Tapatalk

[Spaghetti Legs]

I’m using a regular FD on my 8 speed Record with a 46-30 IRD. I get a rare chain suck but no drops. If you want compact, those are designated CT ( Record CT) and have a big inner plate.

I would just straighten the bend in yours with a set of pliers

[Mark McM]

If you are talking about the outward bow towards the tail of the derailleur, that's part of the normal design for Campagnolo 10spd derailleurs. The derailleur cage is intended to be wider at the back than at the front.

What kind of shifting problem are you having?

There was a 10spd "compact" derailleur, but a "standard" derailleur normally works fine with compact cranks. But you aren't using a compact crank, you are using a sub-compact. With braze-on derailleurs there is often a problem lowering the derailleur far enough to shift well with a sub-compact. The 10spd "compact" derailleur reaches lower, so if you can't get your "standard" derailleur low enough, a "compact" derailleur might help.

[Hindmost]

After a trip to the garage, looking at a couple of Veloce, Chorus, an 8 Record, and a 10 Record fd--they all have a little bend in the tail, some more than others. Campagnolo definitely put it there. I would be surprised if the lack of straightness with your derailleur would cause any significant problem.

[mwynne]

Thanks all, I appreciate the knowledge and physical checks! Sounds like

Since I took the derailleur off for the photos I took my time with the re-install and set up from scratch, so I'll see how it goes on my next ride. Likely just user error!

[oldpotatoe]

While doing a bit of regular maintenance I noticed that my front derailleur is a bit bent. Wondering if there's any good guidance out there on the specs/tolerance of the cage, is it worth trying to bend into alignment, is it fine, should it be replaced, etc.

Any insight appreciated! (I can grab better photos if a particular angle/measurement/etc would help)

Also, was there a version from this era that was compact-oriented? I'm running 46/30 chainrings and have been getting more dropped chains than usual.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50260719152_f776116794_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jznjKj)

First, how was it working? It looks fine. I don't see how operating it could cause it to bend inward like that.
And for dropped chains, sounds like turning it a little more tail in, nose out would make it less 'aggressive'.

[mwynne]

First, how was it working? It looks fine. I don't see how operating it could cause it to bend inward like that.
And for dropped chains, sounds like turning it a little more tail in, nose out would make it less 'aggressive'.

The most noticeable issue was periodic dropped chains when downshifting (usually when I was climbing and already in a pretty large cog). Hoping my re-install and set up is better this time.

[cmg]

If you decide to reuse align the backside of the cage parallel with the small chain ring and have the front of the cage go over the larger chain ring with the space of a dime between them. The front of the cage won't be parallel with the larger chain ring but the goal is to push the chain on to larger ring from the smaller with the back of the cage and if the rear is parallel the less likely of dropping the chain on to the frame. the rear of the cage could be set to a closer tolerance, closer to the smaller ring. who cares what the front looks like.

The majority of my cages look like yours. I suspect they all will eventually look like that.

[mokofoko]

I checked my campy 10 Record TI/carbon FD and it has similar bending. The full groupo (and bike it's attached to) were essentially untouched before I got my hands on it. No shifting issues.

[chismog]

There was a 10spd "compact" derailleur, but a "standard" derailleur normally works fine with compact cranks. But you aren't using a compact crank, you are using a sub-compact. With braze-on derailleurs there is often a problem lowering the derailleur far enough to shift well with a sub-compact. The 10spd "compact" derailleur reaches lower, so if you can't get your "standard" derailleur low enough, a "compact" derailleur might help.

The CT version definitely works better for compact setups, in my experience. Worth getting. I recently got a new Veloce CT 10s for about $14.

[Mark McM]

And for dropped chains, sounds like turning it a little more tail in, nose out would make it less 'aggressive'.

Peter, I think you have that backwards - tail in, nose out makes the front derailleur more aggressive (more tending to push the chain beyond the sprocket). For dropped chains, you want to the rotate the derailleur more tail out, nose in.

Another insurance for dropping chains to the inside is using an chain catcher device. First found on MTBs, then cyclo-cross bikes, these are now found on many a pro racer's road bike:

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0017/2693/9234/products/066fe108f0e5c5f71671f430a8afd4b7eca91856_39becaeb-295c-43e0-af4d-a40c05ea85d3_480x480.jpg?v=1552445935

[carpediemracing]

My preferred chain drop catcher is the N-Gear Jumpstop. It is much more robust, doesn't move well (even when you want it to, like when you're installing it), and basically bombproof.

I have one on my round tube bike and I purposely adjust my front deraileur to dump the chain past the ring. This way I get pretty solid shifts down, even under some level of pressure.

(On my non-round tube bike I have a K-gear or whatever it's called. Definitely not the same.)

http://sprinterdellacasa.blogspot.com/2009/02/equipment-n-gear-jumpstop.html

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_TbmplkIYLx8/SZGEQb4ryeI/AAAAAAAABtM/BKvQcG0fZDY/s800/mount2.jpg

[oldpotatoe]

Peter, I think you have that backwards - tail in, nose out makes the front derailleur more aggressive (more tending to push the chain beyond the sprocket). For dropped chains, you want to the rotate the derailleur more tail out, nose in.

Another insurance for dropping chains to the inside is using an chain catcher device. First found on MTBs, then cyclo-cross bikes, these are now found on many a pro racer's road bike:



He's missing the small ring when coming off the big ring, meaning the front of the front der is pushing the chain off too aggressively, too nose in..Why, if the chain is sluggish coming off the big ring but good coming off the small ring, you gently bend the nose toward the small ring.

[Mark McM]

He's missing the small ring when coming off the big ring, meaning the front of the front der is pushing the chain off too aggressively, too nose in..Why, if the chain is sluggish coming off the big ring but good coming off the small ring, you gently bend the nose toward the small ring.

The aggressiveness of the shift has to do with more than just pushing the chain off one chainring, the derailleur cage also plays a role in guiding the chain on its way to the next chainring. One side of the derailleur cage is responsible for pushing the chain toward the other ring and the other side of the cage also plays a role in keeping the chain from going too far.

The chain primarily contacts the nose of the derailleur cage when on the large ring, and the tail of the chainring on the small ring. If the derailleur is aligned tail in, then the outer cage plate acts as a ramp to push the chain inward as it descends from the big ring, and the inner plate acts as a ramp to push the chain outward as it rises from the small ring to the large ring. If the derailleur is aligned too tail inward, the cage will push the chain too far inward as the chain descends from the big ring, which can cause the chain to drop to the inside; and the cage can push the chain too far outward as the chain rises from the small ring, which can cause the chain to drop to the outside. In addition, if the tail is too far inward, the opposite cage plate will be too far inward at tail and outward at the nose to be able to as a "stop" to keep the chain from going to far

The opposite can happen if derailleur is aligned with the tail too far outward, because the natural ramp of the cage is int he wrong direction. For example, when shifting from the small ring, the reverse ramp can cause the chain to move away from the big ring as the chain rises, so the chain has trouble catching the big ring.

So if the derailleur action is too aggressive, and the chain tends to shift past the chainring (in either direction), it usually best to align the derailleur a little ore tail out. And if the shifting is slow, then it is usually best to align the derailleur a little more tail in.