Who's had a tubeless tire blow-off (let's start a list)?

[proletariandan]

Hey y'all,

Curious who else has ever had a tubeless tire blow off while riding - I was lucky that it was on the rear in a safe spot but am trying to get to the bottom of why it happened to me so that it doesn't happen again in a less ideal situation. I've run plenty of tubeless tires (Schwalbe, Hutchinson, Maxxis, WTB, Terrene), used and new, swapped between rims (DT Swiss, Nox, Pacenti, Easton), and never had a blow-out so am hoping that some crowdsourcing can maybe save some teeth, heart-attacks, etc.

The safest answer is to never re-use a tire but that seems like a waste if we can be reasonably confident it is only a danger in certain circumstances.

Thoughts?
Dan

Tire/Rim Combo: Maxxis Rambler 700x40 EXO + Nox Skyline

Background:Went through a few Ramblers but I'm pretty sure I ran this one for a while as a front tire - potentially on a DT Swiss XR361 - before swapping it to the rear Skyline. The blow-off happened when I reinstalled it after it sat on the shelf for a while and after I ran it above 40psi for the first time (I think).

What happened: It blew off after 5 minutes of riding at 50psi. I'd mis-remembered the 45psi limitation of the Skyline so went home and reinstalled at 40psi. It then blew off after another hour. The tire looks fine visibly - after putting a tube in it finished a ride (50-60 miles, lower pressure) no problem.

What Nox said: The DT Swiss has a slightly larger bead diameter, which stretched out the tire. Try another layer of tubeless tape. <NO, THANKS

What Maxxis said: Waiting on a response.

[R3awak3n]

Hey y'all,

Curious who else has ever had a tubeless tire blow off while riding - I was lucky that it was on the rear in a safe spot but am trying to get to the bottom of why it happened to me so that it doesn't happen again in a less ideal situation. I've run plenty of tubeless tires (Schwalbe, Hutchinson, Maxxis, WTB, Terrene), used and new, swapped between rims (DT Swiss, Nox, Pacenti, Easton), and never had a blow-out so am hoping that some crowdsourcing can maybe save some teeth, heart-attacks, etc.

Thoughts?
Dan

Tire/Rim Combo: Maxxis Rambler 700x40 EXO + Nox Skyline

Background:Went through a few Ramblers but I'm pretty sure I ran this one for a while as a front tire - potentially on a DT Swiss XR361 - before swapping it to the rear Skyline. The blow-off happened when I reinstalled it after it sat on the shelf for a while and after I ran it above 40psi for the first time (I think).

What happened: It blew off after 5 minutes of riding at 50psi. I'd mis-remembered the 45psi limitation of the Skyline so went home and reinstalled at 40psi. It then blew off after another hour. The tire looks fine visibly - after putting a tube in it finished a ride (50-60 miles, lower pressure) no problem.

What Nox said: The DT Swiss has a slightly larger bead diameter, which stretched out the tire. Try another layer of tubeless tape. <NO, THANKS

What Maxxis said: Waiting on a response.

that would scare me away. Would probably not use those tires tubeless ever again.

[proletariandan]

that would scare me away. Would probably not use those tires tubeless ever again.

Yeah, I definitely won't be using that specific tire again and was kinda shocked that Nox even suggested it.

[bigbill]

I had run a tubeless tire (Schwalbe One 25mm) on SL23 and when that rim was replaced with an Easton R90, the tire would blow off the rim while inflating it. Around 70# it would start to unseat. New tire, no problems. Otherwise, no issues on my 4 sets of tubeless road wheels, 2 sets for my gravel bike, and MTB.

[joosttx]

I would be scared to have you mount a tire for me....

[Velocipede]

I still have Orange Seal on my ceiling from when a customer/buddy was doing his and it blew off. It went everywhere. About a year later he had the rim rip open due to toxic rot from the Stan's he'd been using for years.

[justaute]

Have been tubeless since 2014 (road/mtb/cx/gravel) and no issues so far...knock on wood.

[mtechnica]

I’ve only had tubeless MTB tires which to be honest were all less than 30psi. I’ve been interested in road tubeless but the pressure is a lot higher obviously.

[AngryScientist]

i think the key is seating the bead first with no sealant, and inflating to low pressure and checking the bead set very carefully. spin the wheel and make sure it's riding nice and straight and even and look at the beat against the rim all the way around. i think most cases of blow out are when there is a section of the bead that hasnt properly seated.

[jeho]

1 blowout in 3 years, i'd say thats pretty safe

[windsurfer]

1 blowout in 3 years, i'd say thats pretty safe

Really ? With tubes I have had 1 blowout in >50 years.

[justaute]

i think the key is seating the bead first with no sealant, and inflating to low pressure and checking the bead set very carefully. spin the wheel and make sure it's riding nice and straight and even and look at the beat against the rim all the way around. i think most cases of blow out are when there is a section of the bead that hasnt properly seated.

Agreed. Further, tubeless technology IMO has also meaningfully improved in the past few years in terms of bead, production quality, rim, etc.

[skiezo]

It almost sounds like using the same time on different brand rims is the key to tires blowing off.
I have last season, 7500 mile on tubeless and no issues but they were the same wheel set.

[mj_michigan]

Really ? With tubes I have had 1 blowout in >50 years.

I had only one blowout, some 3-4 years ago. Happened in the middle of the night. I went through the house looking for the source of the loud bang, but could not find anything. The next day I saw the tire blown off the rim. Still have no idea why it did not happened the day earlier while I was riding the bike.

[R3awak3n]

1 blowout on tubes, 0 blowouts on tubeless for me

[Dired]

This isn't exactly a blowout story, but I had both tires unseat after running over a flat piece of stone that was about 3-4" high, while going downhill. The impact I sustained would have taken me over had I been on tubes or at high pressure. Instead both tires instantly flatted with fluid spilling out and I just pulled over and dropped in some tubes. Miraculously no damage to anything.

[one60]

This isn't exactly a blowout story, but I had both tires unseat after running over a flat piece of stone that was about 3-4" high, while going downhill. The impact I sustained would have taken me over had I been on tubes or at high pressure. Instead both tires instantly flatted with fluid spilling out and I just pulled over and dropped in some tubes. Miraculously no damage to anything.



No doubt tubeless road set ups have their challenges but the adoption of the new ETRTO standards have been a big improvement in this regard.

IMHO, one significant advantage to tubeless tires is that they are more likely to remain on the rim than a clincher when flatting. Due to operator/user error (as in my fault) I had a tubeless tire flat on a steep down hill. But the tire remained on the rim (like a tubular!) and I was able to come to a stop w/o incidence. I doubt the outcome would have been the same with a clincher.

[rain dogs]

Never had a blow out, but I do have a question:

I was told that if you have a tubeless tire that blows off the rim, you should basically instantly trash it as soon as you get home, that the process of the blowing off the rim will damage the integrity of the bead (especially if overinflated) and it shouldn't be used again?

True? False?
Even if false.... maybe just good practice? I dunno?

[marciero]

Never had a blow out, but I do have a question:

I was told that if you have a tubeless tire that blows off the rim, you should basically instantly trash it as soon as you get home, that the process of the blowing off the rim will damage the integrity of the bead (especially if overinflated) and it shouldn't be used again?

True? False?
Even if false.... maybe just good practice? I dunno?

This is Jan Heine's recommendation. But a high volume tire blowing off at 50 psi is a lot different than a low volume tire blowing off at high pressure. If you really wanted to eliminate risk, you would not run road tubeless- skinny-ish tires at 60+ psi-at all. I had 650b x 48 blow off in the car on the way home after being "professionally" installed at the lbs about a year ago. My remiss in not checking the pressure. That tire was remounted and has been in service without issue since.

[oldpotatoe]

No doubt tubeless road set ups have their challenges but the adoption of the new ETRTO standards have been a big improvement in this regard.

IMHO, one significant advantage to tubeless tires is that they are more likely to remain on the rim than a clincher when flatting. Due to operator/user error (as in my fault) I had a tubeless tire flat on a steep down hill. But the tire remained on the rim (like a tubular!) and I was able to come to a stop w/o incidence. I doubt the outcome would have been the same with a clincher.

:banana:

[MikeD]

No doubt tubeless road set ups have their challenges but the adoption of the new ETRTO standards have been a big improvement in this regard.



IMHO, one significant advantage to tubeless tires is that they are more likely to remain on the rim than a clincher when flatting. Due to operator/user error (as in my fault) I had a tubeless tire flat on a steep down hill. But the tire remained on the rim (like a tubular!) and I was able to come to a stop w/o incidence. I doubt the outcome would have been the same with a clincher.


That's a function of the rim bed having a bead lock feature (and many tubeless rims don't) than the tire being tubeless.

[unterhausen]

I thought all tubeless rims had a channel to lock the bead.

My experience with Maxxis tires has led me to be somewhat suspicious of them. I have never had any trouble getting tubeless tires to seat until I got some Maxxis 40mm Velocitas. The bead is too big to really lock into the rim, which makes sealing up pretty tricky. I have also had maxxis refuse (there's a name for you) that were nearly impossible to seat right, thump thump thump.

[makoti]

Never had one blow off. Just got a "flat" on todays ride. First in about 1200 miles of riding (was getting them every 200 or so. Crazy). Did exactly what it was supposed to. Sealant sprayed out, hole sealed, rode home without stopping. Road wheels, 85psi.

[93KgBike]

Did you use soapy water to seat the tire? In general, is this a practice just for cars? Could it cause a tubeless tire to unseat?

Setup my 1st tubeless tire last night, 37c wtb riddler on 22mm int. rim width. Wondered about the residue - it took 40 psi with the solution to seat the tire...

[unterhausen]

the good thing about soapy water is it's only slippery until it dries out. Wouldn't cause a tire to come off, unless it happened right away. A good tubeless fit requires a well-made tire/rim. If there is any sloppiness, it can cause a tire to blow off. That's why the sloppy companies tend to make them too tight.

[BRad704]

I had a 25mm Schwalbe Pro 1 blow off on the trainer, in the living room, all over the couch and rug. [emoji87][emoji85][emoji86]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[one60]

That's a function of the rim bed having a bead lock feature (and many tubeless rims don't) than the tire being tubeless.


This may well be correct...I was referring to a hooked road tubeless rim.

While hookless rims may simplify the manufacturing process, I am not sure that hookless road rims offer the consumer any advantages, particularly given their maximum pressure requirements.

[marciero]

This may well be correct...I was referring to a hooked road tubeless rim.

While hookless rims may simplify the manufacturing process, I am not sure that hookless road rims offer the consumer any advantages, particularly given their maximum pressure requirements.

These are different. The bead lock feature is a channel on either side of the the rim bed. I was looking for a photo and came across this article (https://gravelcyclist.com/bicycle-tech/the-hookless-bead-rim-how-it-works-who-theyre-for-by-enve-composites/), from Enve, which argues that hookless is actually a better design for tubeless.

[Moyboy]

This article?

https://www.enve.com/en/journal/behind-the-product-the-hookless-bead-how-it-works-and-who-theyre-for/

[clyde the point]

I feel very fortunate in my tubeless experience. I always use tubeless rims and Orange seal. I don't use tubeless tires. I run Gravel Kings 28 mostly 95 rear 90 front. The only tire I had unseat was a 32mm Gravel King while the wheel was sitting in my garage. I had gone on vacation and when I returned part of the sidewall was off the rim. I tossed that tire. Thankfully nothing has happened on the road other than a flat/sealed/rode home. MTB have never had an issue.

[Clancy]

I feel very fortunate in my tubeless experience. I always use tubeless rims and Orange seal. I don't use tubeless tires. I run Gravel Kings 28 mostly 95 rear 90 front. The only tire I had unseat was a 32mm Gravel King while the wheel was sitting in my garage. I had gone on vacation and when I returned part of the sidewall was off the rim. I tossed that tire. Thankfully nothing has happened on the road other than a flat/sealed/rode home. MTB have never had an issue.


Not sure I understand.

You’re using non tubeless tires set-up on tubeless rims inflated to 90-95 psi?

[oldpotatoe]

Not sure I understand.

You’re using non tubeless tires set-up on tubeless rims inflated to 90-95 psi?

clyde the point-:)

[one60]

This article?

https://www.enve.com/en/journal/behind-the-product-the-hookless-bead-how-it-works-and-who-theyre-for/

One reason I am leary of hookless for road...Enve puts the onus on the end user to only use tires which are on Enve's list of acceptable tires AND never inflated above a specific pressure for each of those approved tires.

Enve implies the blow-off issue its the fault of the tire manufacturer's. But I've not seen any hooked tubeless rims come with similar requirements?

[Mark McM]

This article?

https://www.enve.com/en/journal/behind-the-product-the-hookless-bead-how-it-works-and-who-theyre-for/

The Enve article is interesting, but it glosses over certain facts to be able to jump to conclusions to support their products.

First, they state that the hooked sidewall rims were developed in response to kevlar beads replacing steel beads in clincher tires (kevlar beads are more flexible that steel beads). Then they point out that tubeless riims for other vehicles such as automobiles and motorcycles don't use hooked beads - but they don't mention that these applications rely on using (stiff) steel tire beads.

Then, the article claims that hookless beads create a more aerodynamic blending between tire and rim, by using misleading diagrams. They show a wide tire on a narrow hooked bead rim, and compare it to a narrow tire on a hookless rim, and claim that this "proves" that hookless rims are more aerodynamic. They ignore the fact that there is no reason that a hooked bead rim can have just as wide an external width and just as narrow an internal width as a hookless rim, allowing both types of tire/rim combinations to have the same aero profile.

The article does go over the manufacturing issues that favor the hookless design for carbon rims. But they won't admit that this is the true reason that they are promoting hookless rims, despite no other advantages (and some potential disadvantages) to hooked rims.

This is similar to situation a while ago, when Enve claimed that spoked aero wheels had less drag than solid disc aero wheels. They were likely aware that this wasn't true, and instead they were simply making this claim because they did not make solid disc aero wheels. But as soon as they started making solid disc aero wheels, they published articles claiming that they were faster than spoked aero wheels.

[benb]

These Enve articles just make me more and more sure that I'll never pay for their ridiculously overpriced wheels. So much marketecture/marketneering.

(Really I was pretty much sure of this after their debacle with sharp unfinished rims cutting wheels, but whatever...). How are we to trust them that they're making their rims so precisely as to work without the hook when they can't make them smooth enough to not cut tires??? They blame tire manufacturers but the thing is they have no control of tires since they don't make them... and their list of approved tires goes to a 404 not found. Bottom line if no one is standardizing & certifying both tires & rims together they can't push this stuff forward.

I have had several tubed tires blow off about 10 years ago but have never had a Tubeless tire blow off. All my tubeless usage is MTB though, with tire pressures < 40psi, usually 30psi or less. At the time I had blow offs I had bought some Vredstein Fortezza Tri-comp tires and I had Easton rims. Luckily I never had a blow off while riding.. there was some weird situation where I'd go for a ride and within 10 minutes of finishing the ride the front tire would explosively blow off the rim. I tossed all the tires, it sucked because I'd gotten multiple sets at a great price. I have never gone near another Vredstein tire.

I just gave up on tubeless on my MTB. Everything is such a mess with every bike manufacturer making up their own sketchy tubeless spec. My rims are UST, I had perfect experiences with UST certified tires but they are becoming less common. It's not worth the hassle.

I only run 65r/45f on 28c gravel kings on my gravel bike, with tubes. I just can't see tubeless being worth it on anything smaller than 40c and more realistically MTB.

Frankly I don't want to try tubeless w/Kevlar bead w/hookless rims at all. Crashing from a blowout is just so dangerous I don't care about any performance advantages.

The whole super expensive carbon rim/wheel industry is mostly abut selling very marginal gains at huge prices.. there is no way I'm going to pay those huge prices for marginal gains if there is any safety implication.

I've owned motorcycles.. the tires and beads are significantly more overbuilt & stiff compared to bicycle tires. No such thing as a foldable MC tire. And they not only have super stiff beads they have super stiff radial steel construction as well. Enve should not use vastly different tires to justify a vastly different rim design. Motorcycles also only use tire pressures in the MTB range, 30-40psi! Now way I'm going to trust some cotton-casing "open tubular" tire on a hookless bike rim just cause someone tells me it's OK on a motorcycle.

[Dromen]

I was going to buy some Nox wheels last year til i read their disclaimer that Rene Herse TL tires where a NO NO with their rims. Think there may have been couple others on the NO NO list. Even called them, it was confirmed.

Hey y'all,

Curious who else has ever had a tubeless tire blow off while riding - I was lucky that it was on the rear in a safe spot but am trying to get to the bottom of why it happened to me so that it doesn't happen again in a less ideal situation. I've run plenty of tubeless tires (Schwalbe, Hutchinson, Maxxis, WTB, Terrene), used and new, swapped between rims (DT Swiss, Nox, Pacenti, Easton), and never had a blow-out so am hoping that some crowdsourcing can maybe save some teeth, heart-attacks, etc.

The safest answer is to never re-use a tire but that seems like a waste if we can be reasonably confident it is only a danger in certain circumstances.

Thoughts?
Dan

Tire/Rim Combo: Maxxis Rambler 700x40 EXO + Nox Skyline

Background:Went through a few Ramblers but I'm pretty sure I ran this one for a while as a front tire - potentially on a DT Swiss XR361 - before swapping it to the rear Skyline. The blow-off happened when I reinstalled it after it sat on the shelf for a while and after I ran it above 40psi for the first time (I think).

What happened: It blew off after 5 minutes of riding at 50psi. I'd mis-remembered the 45psi limitation of the Skyline so went home and reinstalled at 40psi. It then blew off after another hour. The tire looks fine visibly - after putting a tube in it finished a ride (50-60 miles, lower pressure) no problem.

What Nox said: The DT Swiss has a slightly larger bead diameter, which stretched out the tire. Try another layer of tubeless tape. <NO, THANKS

What Maxxis said: Waiting on a response.