New Moots Womble 29er Sweet!

[noonan1970]

https://moots.com/bike/womble/?fbclid=IwAR0ahSUf1A84A0iBY-ypcracglF2NhaJyR-FDNkVw6jTNERCYt6UlbXoOb8

[Blue Jays]

Very nice. Cool find.

[nmrt]

Yup!
nice bike.
nice geo.
nice HT angle.
nice travel (140 mm)
nice tire clearance 29 X 2.6
what's not to like?
:banana:
Very nice. Cool find.

[rinconryder]

$8000 hard tail?

[Brusselsprouts]

Super cool! It's been awhile since a new mtn flavor has been released.

[Tavarez]

Woof, I can only imagine...

[Tony]

Yup!
nice bike.
nice geo.
nice HT angle.
nice travel (140 mm)
nice tire clearance 29 X 2.6
what's not to like?
:banana:

Rear suspension.;)

[morrisericd]

I was just about to post a link to this. My heart swoons! What a bike!

[oldpotatoe]

$8000 hard tail?

Even some plastic.

[JAGI410]

what's not to like?
:banana:

The price

[trener1]

$8000 hard tail?

Well, there are $11000 road bikes....

[avalonracing]

Well, there are $11000 road bikes....

Yeah but most road bikes don't get the sh** beaten out of them and are then worth 1/3 as much in nine months because the geometry is now considered "obsolete".

[DfCas]

Whats with the 75 degree seattube angle? Czn i get the saddle back like i do on my 72.5 road bike?

[crownjewelwl]

Whats with the 75 degree seattube angle? Czn i get the saddle back like i do on my 72.5 road bike?

allows the HT angle to be much slacker for descents...steep seattube angle helps keep your weight forward to offset the slackness on climbs...

dropper posts have changed mtb geo forever

[Jaybee]

Yeah but most road bikes don't get the sh** beaten out of them and are then worth 1/3 as much in nine months because the geometry is now considered "obsolete".

This one is already a little steep in the HA to be considered cutting edge. You can decide if that's a good or bad thing. I've found that slacker than 66 on a non-gravity bike is just a little much for me. Maybe mountain bike geo is starting to settle a little? I'm sure it's an amazing bike and everyone who gets one will be really happy. I'd probably choose something with rear suspension if i had that kind of coin for a new bike.

[Butch]

When looking at angles, note whether they are measured with sag. These are measured with 25% sag in the fork which will change the head by more than a degree compered to static. From working with REEB they measure without sag as do many of the other manufacturers.

[hellvetica]

That's a great looking hard tail.

And you won't ever get your $11k back from a plastic road bike. You'll recover more from a Moots any day of the week.

[d_douglas]

If I was loaded, I would definitely buy that. Grail mountain bike material!!

[Blue Jays]

Titanium has universally great properties and changing geometry preferences is pretty dizzying.
Taken as a whole this new Moots model looks like it could tackle a pretty broad spectrum of terrain.

[rinconryder]

reminds me of Niner's discontinued ROS 9

https://mbaction.com/bike-test-niner-ros-9/

[quehill]

I'd take that $8,000, buy one of these, upgrade it to full bling, and then invest the $4,000 I had left over in toilet paper and bread yeast. FTW.

https://polebicycles.com/polestore/product/taival/


...but you should probably ignore me and buy a full suspension.

Cheers!

[nmrt]

I currently ride a 65.5 deg HT angle hardtail. there is no way that would go to a lower HT angle (like the one in the Pole). Granted the unparalleled fun that can he had on such bike when the trail points way downward. But when the trails is flat and uphill, such low HT angles make the front end wander all too much. No fun!

my 2 cents.

I'd take that $8,000, buy one of these, upgrade it to full bling, and then invest the $4,000 I had left over in toilet paper and bread yeast. FTW.

https://polebicycles.com/polestore/product/taival/


...but you should probably ignore me and buy a full suspension.

Cheers!

[quehill]

I have a 140mm Pole Evolink. It weighs about a million pounds and it is, seriously, the best climbing mountain bike I've ever ridden. Especially on super steep and technical stuff. There's some gestalt something about the really long wheelbase and the really steep seat tube angle that makes that head tube angle work, not just good, but great.

Two negatives that I should disclose- you can't get the front wheel off the ground no matter how hard you try and it's a bear around a tight switchback. The payback for those negatives, however, is that it goes downhill over rough terrain at the speed of sound.

I currently ride a 65.5 deg HT angle hardtail. there is no way that would go to a lower HT angle (like the one in the Pole). Granted the unparalleled fun that can he had on such bike when the trail points way downward. But when the trails is flat and uphill, such low HT angles make the front end wander all too much. No fun!

my 2 cents.

[d_douglas]

Pushing the envelope of geometry doesnt always make a bike better. I had a 2015 Chromag Rootdown that looked extreme until they came out with the new geometry that was very long and slack.

I rode one to try it and I like the old one better - it seemed more of an all-rounder rather than one for pointing downhill. I love me a hardtail, but at the point that it is biased towards downhill, I agree that it might be better to buy a FS bike and just have fun.

I am also of the camp that 160mm travel FS bikes are overkill for 99% of people. I ride super technical terrain (rather poorly, I might add) on a 105mm travel Banshee and it is definitely the rider that causes havoc and puts me in danger :):banana:

[nmrt]

huh! who would've thunk that about the pole.
now you've got me interested. too bad they are pretty hard to throw a leg over without buying one.

I have a 140mm Pole Evolink. It weighs about a million pounds and it is, seriously, the best climbing mountain bike I've ever ridden. Especially on super steep and technical stuff. There's some gestalt something about the really long wheelbase and the really steep seat tube angle that makes that head tube angle work, not just good, but great.

Two negatives that I should disclose- you can't get the front wheel off the ground no matter how hard you try and it's a bear around a tight switchback. The payback for those negatives, however, is that it goes downhill over rough terrain at the speed of sound.

[pottshead]

The more that I see this bike the more I continue to like it. Reminds me of the Santa Cruz Chameleon I used to ride one the early to mid 2000s before everything moved to Taiwan, in terms of form and purpose.

[quickfeet]

I hate the mtb geo discussion. I have been riding MTB bikes for 20 years and usually get a new one or two every season because I like riding and trying new bikes. I have yet to hop on one that wasn’t awesome simply because of geometry. The internet police over on pinkbike take a dump on everything that doesn’t say Santa Cruz, pivot or yeti on the down tube now in the comments section of every bike launch.

To me being snooty about geo is a way for someone to feel superior, and it’s yet another barrier to entry of this sport giving people paralysis of making the wrong choice.

This moots is awesome if that is the type of bike you are after. If anyone buys one I’d like to know if it will clear 3 inch tires...

[laupsi]

I hate the mtb geo discussion.

To me being snooty about geo is a way for someone to feel superior, and it’s yet another barrier to entry of this sport giving people paralysis of making the wrong choice.



Thank you! And I’ll throw in; same is true for those dissing on price point. To each his/her own.

[laupsi]

Couldn’t help but post my version of over priced/bad geo, of which I absolutely love to ride. Even on ripper rugged trails of North Eastern WV.

[HenryA]

Nice bike, nice pic.

How's the bike, now that you've ridden it some?

[Jaybee]

I hate the mtb geo discussion. I have been riding MTB bikes for 20 years and usually get a new one or two every season because I like riding and trying new bikes. I have yet to hop on one that wasn’t awesome simply because of geometry. The internet police over on pinkbike take a dump on everything that doesn’t say Santa Cruz, pivot or yeti on the down tube now in the comments section of every bike launch.

To me being snooty about geo is a way for someone to feel superior, and it’s yet another barrier to entry of this sport giving people paralysis of making the wrong choice.

This moots is awesome if that is the type of bike you are after. If anyone buys one I’d like to know if it will clear 3 inch tires...

Who is being snooty about geo? There is discussion about geo and what different people like and don't like, but I don't see anyone saying the bike sucks or will ride like crap. It is an enthusiast bike forum, so we're going to discuss the minutiae. I don't think that's precluding anyone from joining the sport.

This place is, refreshingly, not pinkbike.

[slowpoke]

Pushing the envelope of geometry doesnt always make a bike better. I had a 2015 Chromag Rootdown that looked extreme until they came out with the new geometry that was very long and slack.


Have you seen Pink Bike's Grim Donut? :banana:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5cVPy2NbL4

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/video-the-grim-donut-part-2-the-right-amount-of-stupid.html

[quickfeet]

Who is being snooty about geo? There is discussion about geo and what different people like and don't like, but I don't see anyone saying the bike sucks or will ride like crap. It is an enthusiast bike forum, so we're going to discuss the minutiae. I don't think that's precluding anyone from joining the sport.

This place is, refreshingly, not pinkbike.

The first page has two comments about the geo being outdated. There is not such thing as outdated for brand new bikes. There is just the choices a company made. Discussing minutiae is one thing, using language that is disparaging is another.

I am not the OP but if I didn’t know much about bikes or geo and I posted something I really wanted only to be told the geo is old (as if this makes a bike unridable) it may give me pause about whether or not I wanted that bike, or maybe even felt dumb for liking it in the first place.

I may be touchy because other mtb areas of the Internet is just a dumpster fire of terrible opinions not based in reality, but arguing about geo is LAME.

[Jaybee]

The first page has two comments about the geo being outdated. There is not such thing as outdated for brand new bikes. There is just the choices a company made. Discussing minutiae is one thing, using language that is disparaging is another.

I am not the OP but if I didn’t know much about bikes or geo and I posted something I really wanted only to be told the geo is old (as if this makes a bike unridable) it may give me pause about whether or not I wanted that bike, or maybe even felt dumb for liking it in the first place.

I may be touchy because other mtb areas of the Internet is just a dumpster fire of terrible opinions not based in reality, but arguing about geo is LAME.

One of the comments on the first page is making light of the fact that MTB geo changes so quickly and the marketing is toward obsolete. The other comment is mine, in which I call the geo of the Womble not "cutting edge" but then make the point that cutting edge isn't for everybody, including myself. This isnt a value judgement, it's an objective fact - bleeding edge geo these days for a hard tail is something like 63 HA/78SA. I think that's the wrong bike for most riders who will never attack a descent with the speed necessary to make it work. The Womble is actually in a nice sweet spot for a trail hardtail based on my experience.

Geo is an important part of how a bike rides. I think it's ok to discuss on a bike forum.

[slowpoke]

I am not the OP but if I didn’t know much about bikes or geo and I posted something I really wanted only to be told the geo is old (as if this makes a bike unridable) it may give me pause about whether or not I wanted that bike, or maybe even felt dumb for liking it in the first place.

As someone who's only recent delved into mountain bikes, I think these discussions are good for learning.

Let's say your friend is about to buy an older Moots MootoX with a 72º HTA with 10-speed XTR for $4K. Are you going to let them go through with that foolish decision?

Like Jaybee said, most folks who ride mountain bikes would agree that early-2000s and older geo (NORBA) won't as easily as bikes with a 68º HTA or less. That doesn't mean older bikes are unrideable, but the person's just going to have to make up for it in attentiveness and skill.

[laupsi]

Nice bike, nice pic.

How's the bike, now that you've ridden it some?

if you're referencing the Mooto X YBB I can say the following:

long wheel base allows for stable and predictable ride; floats over most rough spots; rocks, roots, dips, etc..., plus 27.5x2.8 tires and w/the YBB there's just enough cush. somewhere in the middle to slow w/regard to climbing, but really goes down hill well; she's fast and "quiet", meaning there's not a lot of swaying and/or twitching. just point her and she goes. haven't ridden many of the new breeds out there, but based on what I know and have ridden, this bike ranks very near the top comparing many CC bikes.

put this bike under a super skilled rider and I'm sure there will be pluses and minuses to exchange. I also believe this bike would not slow them down on the appropriate terrain.

[Mikej]

I think the sta may be an actual due to the bend at the bottom for tire clearance due to shortened stays? That’s fun looking rig and to me a great deal at 8k$. Now the RSL mooto x geometry IS crap *** Moots...

[quickfeet]

One of the comments on the first page is making light of the fact that MTB geo changes so quickly and the marketing is toward obsolete. The other comment is mine, in which I call the geo of the Womble not "cutting edge" but then make the point that cutting edge isn't for everybody, including myself. This isnt a value judgement, it's an objective fact - bleeding edge geo these days for a hard tail is something like 63 HA/78SA. I think that's the wrong bike for most riders who will never attack a descent with the speed necessary to make it work. The Womble is actually in a nice sweet spot for a trail hardtail based on my experience.


My point is that there isn’t such a thing as “cutting edge” for geometry. There are specific design choices that are then weaponized to justify purchases for this brand or that brand. If a bike comes out this year with an “outdated” seat tube angle, it was a specific choice of that manufacturer. You don’t think they scrutinize their own bikes?

Let's say your friend is about to buy an older Moots MootoX with a 72º HTA with 10-speed XTR for $4K. Are you going to let them go through with that foolish decision?

You added 2 more reasons beyond geometry why they shouldn’t buy a bike. Geo would not be a consideration for me (so long as it fit me) if price was correct for the parts spec that was on it. Things like tire clearance and current component attachment platforms mean way more than geo, and usually that is what dictates the price of a used MTB.

[slowpoke]

You added 2 more reasons beyond geometry why they shouldn’t buy a bike. Geo would not be a consideration for me (so long as it fit me) if price was correct for the parts spec that was on it. Things like tire clearance and current component attachment platforms mean way more than geo, and usually that is what dictates the price of a used MTB.

You are correct. That was a poor example on my part.

My point is there's a Moots allure which causes folks new to mountain biking to overlook dated geometry because they don't know about "progressive" geo.

I can see geometry being a boring subject because some folks don't care for minutiae and it's harder to compare over the internet than tire clearance and parts specs. But geometry is just as important as fit. We know it when we ride an ill-fitting / ill-handling bike.

[peanutgallery]

A hardtail with 140mm is going to be a funny riding bike IMHO. No amount of geo will change that. The rear wheel doesn't move

100mm is racy
120mm is fun/ideal
130mm plus, a hardtail starts to feel a little weird/wallowy...and you get hammered as you go faster. Even ti doesn't help that

At that amount of travel, a full suss has a more balanced feel and just works better. Added bonus...it tames gaps and drops. The modern FS really dumbs down the technical stuff for the masses and makes mtb riding incredibly fun for a broad spectrum of users

[radsmd]

A hardtail with 140mm is going to be a funny riding bike IMHO. No amount of geo will change that. The rear wheel doesn't move

100mm is racy
120mm is fun/ideal
130mm plus, a hardtail starts to feel a little weird/wallowy...and you get hammered as you go faster. Even ti doesn't help that

At that amount of travel, a full suss has a more balanced feel and just works better. Added bonus...it tames gaps and drops. The modern FS really dumbs down the technical stuff for the masses and makes mtb riding incredibly fun for a broad spectrum of users

Exactly what I was thinking. You expressed it perfectly.

Loving the Mooto X RSL with 100 mm SC 32. If I’m riding something that needs more, then I’d take my FS.

[josephr]

for $8k, it needs a Lefty.