Where does Genius stand in Columbus steel hierarchy?

[colker]

I understand it was made for tig welding. Or was it fillet? Seems like the frames built w/ it are light in 1800grs range and come w/ unicrown forks . Overall the bikes are pretty but i don´t know if those stays and forks allow for 700x28 tires like on the slx era bikes.
It was used on mtbs as well.
Anyone has/ had a genius tubing bike?

[Spaghetti Legs]

Top end mid-90's tubing. My wife's Tommasini Tecno Extra is Genius.

[CO_Hoya]

Discussion on PL from 2007 on hierarchy of Columbus tubing, including Genius, and applications (link (https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=36043)).

Most relevant bit:
Genius - Genius tubing was first introduced in 1991.
Made from Nivacrom steel, Genius tubing was the first of the Columbus tube sets to introduce "mega oversized" tubes. Genius tubing saves weight by only butting portions of the tube that are under the greatest stress. Using Genius tubing, we select from 3 different sets to accommodate small, medium and large riders. Genius tubing can be constructed using lugged or luggless techniques. Columbus offers special Genius lugs to match this tube set. Genius tubing makes for an excellent road or track bike. Please click on the tube decal to see our standard set.

<snip>

Redux so far...

EL/OS - is it in between?, the best compromise?
Genius - good for light weight riders and climbing
Max - good power delivery for monster pedallers but heavy lug... also there is the lugless

[Velocipede]

Genius was the highest-end of the Columbus tubing range when it came out. It was thinner and lighter than EL/OS. It was really intended to be tig-welded. Lugs added weight. There were many Genius frames weighing in around 1500 grams. I had a Genius Bianchi Martini Racing mountain frame at one point. You could feel how light it was. The fear of Genius was how thin it was. EL/OS was more of the workhorse tubeset which is why it was so popular.

Eventually Foco/Focus became the highest-end tubeset Columbus offered after Genius. That was early 2000's. Bianchi was the first to use it in a mass-production frame- Bianchi Nth Power road bike. It was a 15 pound steel road bike that came out in 1991/2

[muz]

Let's go back in time: https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=133504

[Ozz]

Was it Ibis that had "Moron" tubing? In contrast to Genius??

IIRC, it was for tig welding as it had "more on the ends".:rolleyes:

[gbcoupe]

Genius was the highest-end of the Columbus tubing range when it came out. It was thinner and lighter than EL/OS. It was really intended to be tig-welded. Lugs added weight. There were many Genius frames weighing in around 1500 grams. I had a Genius Bianchi Martini Racing mountain frame at one point. You could feel how light it was. The fear of Genius was how thin it was. EL/OS was more of the workhorse tubeset which is why it was so popular.

Eventually Foco/Focus became the highest-end tubeset Columbus offered after Genius. That was early 2000's. Bianchi was the first to use it in a mass-production frame- Bianchi Nth Power road bike. It was a 15 pound steel road bike that came out in 1991/2

My Corratec Formula Futura is Genius with Max fork. Fillet brazed... and not at all light. Does have some extra tubes though.

It'll be up on the block in the classified section shortly.

[rwsaunders]

https://www.steel-vintage.com/blog/2014/02/an-overview-about-columbus-steel-tubes/

[Carl Strong]

I built a lot of frames with Genius and loved it. Here is the little bit I recall off the top of my head:

Genius was the top-of-the-line for Columbus when it was new. It was very thin with what they called "differential butting". The butts at the front of the TT and DT were not radial, they stretched out in the high-stress areas. They were also thicker in the area where the bottle bosses are located...and maybe the front derailleur although I don't remember for sure.

Genius wasn't all that durable and it didn't take much to buckle a tube. Foco came along later and it was heat-treated and much more robust. Ultimately Columbus reduced or eliminated the heat-treating of the Foco and Foco morphed into what we call Life today.

[colker]

I built a lot of frames with Genius and loved it. Here is the little bit I recall off the top of my head:

Genius was the top-of-the-line for Columbus when it was new. It was very thin with what they called "differential butting". The butts at the front of the TT and DT were not radial, they stretched out in the high-stress areas. They were also thicker in the area where the bottle bosses are located...and maybe the front derailleur although I don't remember for sure.

Genius wasn't all that durable and it didn't take much to buckle a tube. Foco came along later and it was heat-treated and much more robust. Ultimately Columbus reduced or eliminated the heat-treating of the Foco and Foco morphed into what we call Life today.

Cool. Thanks! I remember the diamond shape DT on Foco bikes. And tall chainstays.

[Carl Strong]

Cool. Thanks! I remember the diamond shape DT on Foco bikes. And tall chainstays.

To this day I don't think it gets any better than the Foco.

[colker]

To this day I don't think it gets any better than the Foco.

I see Nemo on new bikes... but not Foco.

[tbike4]

A timely thread as I just got back from 15 miles on my Tommasini Tecno Extra.
Very nice ride and I just ignore the unicrown fork. The frame is light and so am I so we get along well. Thin steel in places for sure so gotta be careful. There is part of a lug at the seat cluster which looks nice, the rest is tig welded. It has an actual 25 tire and don't think anything bigger would fit. Had it for 5 years so that is saying something. Several groups on it, 6800 now and some 50mm carbon hoops.

[rwsaunders]

To this day I don't think it gets any better than the Foco.

Carl...I had one of your Foco-based frames a few years back...had to sell it as the fit was a tad too small for me. Not your fault...second hand frame that I received as a well-intended gift. I climbed better on that particular bike than any bike I've owned before or after...not sure why.

[Carl Strong]

Carl...I had one of your Foco-based frames a few years back...had to sell it as the fit was a tad too small for me. Not your fault...second hand frame that I received as a well-intended gift. I climbed better on that particular bike than any bike I've owned before or after...not sure why.

It's hard to beat. Sorry the fit didn't work for you.

[Hakkalugi]

Was it Ibis that had "Moron" tubing? In contrast to Genius??

IIRC, it was for tig welding as it had "more on the ends".:rolleyes:

Yes, and it rides wonderfully. I have 4 Ibis frames, and each seems to actually have a different tubeset, all labeled MoreOn. One is Dedaccai, two are Tange, and the other isn’t branded, but has a stainless drive chainstay.

[colker]

Yes, and it rides wonderfully. I have 4 Ibis frames, and each seems to actually have a different tubeset, all labeled MoreOn. One is Dedaccai, two are Tange, and the other isn’t branded, but has a stainless drive chainstay.

I have a mojo w/ dedacciai more on. Very smooth bike.

[mhespenheide]

Was it Ibis that had "Moron" tubing? In contrast to Genius??

IIRC, it was for tig welding as it had "more on the ends".:rolleyes:

I'm pretty sure the "MorOn" tubing used by Ibis was making fun of Tom Ritchey's Logic tubing, at least as far as I vaguely remember from a far-distant interview in Mountain Bike Action. Seems like there was a little north-bay south-bay rivalry going on at the time and Scott Nicol was tweaking Tom Ritchey's nose and making fun of Tom's proclivity to add some marketing-speak names to all of his products and advancements.

[colker]

I'm pretty sure the "MorOn" tubing used by Ibis was making fun of Tom Ritchey's Logic tubing, at least as far as I vaguely remember from a far-distant interview in Mountain Bike Action. Seems like there was a little north-bay south-bay rivalry going on at the time and Scott Nicol was tweaking Tom Ritchey's nose and making fun of Tom's proclivity to add some marketing-speak names to all of his products and advancements.

Moron x Genius.... makes sense.

I still have the Ibis but these days i am more inclined to Ritchey´s steel than Nicol´s carbon bikes.

[sw3759]

To this day I don't think it gets any better than the Foco.

Hi praise indeed :)

[Wakatel_Luum]

Eventually Foco/Focus became the highest-end tubeset Columbus offered after Genius. That was early 2000's. Bianchi was the first to use it in a mass-production frame- Bianchi Nth Power road bike. It was a 15 pound steel road bike that came out in 1991/2

I have the magazine that the Nth Power Bianchi was featured, I’m fairly certain it was actually built with a tubeset that was the precursor to MiniMax with a Mavic groupset, Kingsberry seatpost, Arctos Ti stem etc...

[Velocipede]

I have the magazine that the Nth Power Bianchi was featured, I’m fairly certain it was actually built with a tubeset that was the precursor to MiniMax with a Mavic groupset, Kingsberry seatpost, Arctos Ti stem etc...

The May 1991 issue of Bicycling it was featured in. Here's a link to a mountain bike made with it also.

https://www.pedalroom.com/bike/bianchi-nth-reparto-corse-celeste-41598