dumbo question #2: nipples on tubeless ready rims

[eddief]

i saw a set of Ritchey wheels today. tubeless-ready and no holes in the bed into which to insert spoke nipples. these are normal jbend spokes. how do they get the nipples in there and what happens if you need to replace a spoke?

[oldpotatoe]

i saw a set of Ritchey wheels today. tubeless-ready and no holes in the bed into which to insert spoke nipples. these are normal jbend spokes. how do they get the nipples in there and what happens if you need to replace a spoke?

Not sure but either the rim is threaded for a proprietary spoke nipple or they are fished thru the rim with a steel inset and magnet to the nipple hole. Like Campagnolo or Fulcrum.

[eddief]

seems like building wheels with this type of rim would double the labor time involved.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiF5ouOokIc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL-de9maci4

probably not this way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPjkrm_Z6sU

[oldpotatoe]

seems like building wheels with this type of rim would double the labor time involved.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiF5ouOokIc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL-de9maci4

probably not this way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPjkrm_Z6sU

Yup..BUT, I'd bet he could take a screwdriver and 'push' the center of hub spacer over and use a screw driver to smack out the old bearings..maybe not tho PRETTY lame, kill some $5 bearings and gotta replace the WHOLE HUB!!:eek:

BTW-I've re-laced a Campag wheel using the nipple insert and magnet..altho time consuming, not really hard...

[MikeD]

i saw a set of Ritchey wheels today. tubeless-ready and no holes in the bed into which to insert spoke nipples. these are normal jbend spokes. how do they get the nipples in there and what happens if you need to replace a spoke?


They thread in a short steel spoke stub/end into the nipple and use a strong magnet, from what I've read.

I don't know about Ritcheys, but my Shimano and Mavic wheels without spoke holes in the rim bed have special nipples that screw into the rim.

[P K]

Still have the little magnet that came with my Fulcrum wheels (don't have the wheels anymore though)

[Mark McM]

I wonder how they manage installing nipples on high production wheels? Is it all done by hand (using one of the methods already mentioned)? If so, how much does it add to the production costs? For standard wheels there are automated machines that can be used to quickly install the nipples, but I don't see how nipples can be installed in this tubular rims by machine.

[eddief]

they could extrude the rim in two steps; first inner circumference closest to the hub, then stick the nipples in the holes, and then seal the bed layer over the nipple holes? that sounds crazy, doesn't it.

I wonder how they manage installing nipples on high production wheels? Is it all done by hand (using one of the methods already mentioned)? If so, how much does it add to the production costs? For standard wheels there are automated machines that can be used to quickly install the nipples, but I don't see how nipples can be installed in this tubular rims by machine.

[oldpotatoe]

I wonder how they manage installing nipples on high production wheels? Is it all done by hand (using one of the methods already mentioned)? If so, how much does it add to the production costs? For standard wheels there are automated machines that can be used to quickly install the nipples, but I don't see how nipples can be installed in this tubular rims by machine.

There's a video somewhere where a Campagnolo or Fulcrum wheel is assembled/laced.
Quite fast, hub on a stand in middle, with spokes inserted, then around the rim, from valve hole to hole in rim..Pretty sure all Campag.Fulcrum laced by hand and then nipples tightened and hand finished.

And here it is..'How's it Made'..lacing starts at 3:06..It doesn't appear much slower than any hand laced wheel..yes, some wheelbuilding machines faster but the decent ones still hand finished.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYUOLGEPw9Q

[Hindmost]

Final tensioning is done by machine? Interesting. Do you suppose there's a tension gauge used in that process somewhere?

[Mark McM]

There's a video somewhere where a Campagnolo or Fulcrum wheel is assembled/laced.
Quite fast, hub on a stand in middle, with spokes inserted, then around the rim, from valve hole to hole in rim..Pretty sure all Campag.Fulcrum laced by hand and then nipples tightened and hand finished.

And here it is..'How's it Made'..lacing starts at 3:06..It doesn't appear much slower than any hand laced wheel..yes, some wheelbuilding machines faster but the decent ones still hand finished.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYUOLGEPw9Q

Interesting video. From the video, it appears that installing the nipples takes a bit longer than for standard rims. It only takes a few seconds extra per nipple, but any extra time adds labor cost, so over thousands of wheels it can add a hefty sum. Still, it's probably only an extra dollar or two per wheel, and gets lost in the final cost to the consumer.

It's not clear to me how the spoke tension is being measured. However, I know the Holland Mechanics wheel building machines can be programmed to tighten the nipples to a preset torque. Perhaps the Campagnolo machine is also using nipple torque to judge spoke tension (much like how torque wrenches are used set bolt tension on stem bolts, for example).