The recent Peloton ad controversy ...

[XXtwindad]

This came across one of my feeds recently ...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/think/amp/ncna1096106

Evidently, the new Peloton ad has been accused of being sexist, heteronormative, and classist. As a personal trainer, the idea of an already thin woman striving to become even thinner is really problematic. And it certainly would seem to enforce gender archetypes. Not sold on the "classist" critique.

If Peloton has determined that the a majority of their audience identifies as affluent suburban women, how do you target them effectively?

Interesting to note that Peloton offered no apology.

[oldpotatoe]

This came across one of my feeds recently ...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/think/amp/ncna1096106

Evidently, the new Peleton ad has been accused of being sexist, heteronormative, and classist. As a personal trainer, the idea of an already thin woman striving to become even thinner is really problematic. And it certainly would seem to enforce gender archetypes. Not sold on the "classist" critique.

If Peleton has determined that the a majority of their audience identifies as affluent suburban women, how do you target them effectively?

Interesting to note that Peleton offered no apology.

PUH LEEZE!!

pelOton

:eek:

[David Tollefson]

Change is not always physical...

[dbnm]

The only people I know who own a Peloton bike just happen to be wealthy white women.

[fiamme red]

This was linked on Gothamist yesterday: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/aesthetics-101/201912/disgraced-peloton-husband-speaks-out.

This is still one of the funniest things I've seen on Twitter: https://twitter.com/clueheywood/status/1089699762331217920.

[DrewK]

https://twitter.com/clueheywood/status/1089699762331217920?lang=en

[charliedid]

Peloton loves the faux exercise machine hysteria.

[charliedid]

The only people I know who own a Peloton bike just happen to be wealthy white women.

I hope you sent them txt/emails shaming them for their obtuse perpetuation of class and elitism. And for ruining their children.

Imma start a punk rock band and call it...

You guessed it.

[commonguy001]

https://twitter.com/clueheywood/status/1089699762331217920?lang=en

This is probably the best twitter thread I've ever seen. thanks for sharing

saw the commercial in question and didn't think too much of it but I'm not their target audience either. I do know one person who has one and she actually uses it all the time. She's also not a cyclist and has no interest in riding a bike outdoors which is funny because she literally lives on a rail trail.

[Blue Jays]

Peloton does not need to apologize for anything.
Never bend a knee to the crazed rage mob. Ever.

[fignon's barber]

I've been trading this stock for the last couple weeks, so I've been following this ad controversy pretty closely. I think the ad was poorly hatched because it overestimated the sophistication of the bulk of the target market. The ad's real intended message is the woman challenging herself with the classes, and her family supporting her, as the Peloton program is challenging. The whole " exercise is only for losing fat" crowd doesn't get the message. Add in the Woke cancel culture crowd, and you have a recipe for disaster.

[AngryScientist]

whaaaaaa haha!


Sometimes I’ll move the Peloton bike into our gallery so I can spend time with my half gay husband while he reads Architectural Digest wearing combat boots

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx98423VsAIgNfg.jpg

[oldpotatoe]

whaaaaaa haha!




https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx98423VsAIgNfg.jpg

What is she watching? A episode of 'this is us'?

[redir]

I think it's a terrible commercial but I just watched it again, twice, and I didn't see one indication that this already thin women was trying to get thinner. That was manufactured by the outrage culture. And how do we not know that she hinted at some point to her husband that she wanted a Pel(o)ton (for Old Potatoes sake) and her husband was a bang up dude and got her one?

[shoota]

As a personal trainer, the idea of an already thin woman striving to become even thinner is really problematic.

And precisely where in the ad did they say she was trying to get thinner? Maybe, and this is going to be a crazy statement, skinny people like to work out because it feels good.

If they had used a fat person they would've been absolutely BLASTED for fat-shaming. Just more proof you can't please the rage mob.

[shoota]

And how do we not know that she hinted at some point to her husband that she wanted a Pel(o)ton (for Old Potatoes sake) and her husband was a bang up dude and got her one?

Oh haven't you heard? Every middle aged white man (especially if he has money) is an abusive Devil whose sole purpose in life is to propagate the patriarchy and keep other people under his foot while he laughs his evil laugh.

[AngryScientist]

As a personal trainer, the idea of an already thin woman striving to become even thinner is really problematic.

serious question:

i am, by most standards, thin.

if you saw me riding my bicycle - would you simply assume that the reason i was riding it was to become thinner?

[Mark McM]

I've been trading this stock for the last couple weeks, so I've been following this ad controversy pretty closely. I think the ad was poorly hatched because it overestimated the sophistication of the bulk of the target market. The ad's real intended message is the woman challenging herself with the classes, and her family supporting her, as the Peloton program is challenging. The whole " exercise is only for losing fat" crowd doesn't get the message. Add in the Woke cancel culture crowd, and you have a recipe for disaster.

^^^Mostly this.

As noted above, transformation isn't always physical. Unfortunately however, the commercial was poorly written and/or edited, leaving too much open to interpretation. Into that void, many people have put their own pre-conceptions (and mis-conceptions), so many of the criticisms say more about the mindsest of the critics than it does about Peloton.

I've notices that some of the recent airings of the commercial have been re-edited, and omit the ending where the videos are being watched by the husband, and put more emphasis on the "journey" of the wife.

Of course, there is still the open debate about whether or not Peloton is some type of cult ...

[Drmojo]

whaaaaaa haha!




https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx98423VsAIgNfg.jpg

what is half gay
slur?!!?!
now that is more offensive than housewives exercising

[adub]

It must upset the new PC crowd that I actually select my own rage rather than letting the raged masses on the interwebz select it for me. It's so outrageous!

[benb]

Listened to an interesting NPR show last night about how our current culture (big blame to Twitter & Facebook) removes all ability to discuss issues with nuance.

If your identity matches a particular pattern you must be 100% offended by the Peloton ad, you must express outrage. If you show nuance it makes you have an identity crisis. This controversy is a perfect example of what the show was about.

Meghan Daum was the author of the book being discussed.

https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1982129336?tag=onpointbooks-20

[old_fat_and_slow]

‏

Sometimes I’ll move the Peloton bike into our gallery so I can spend time with my half gay husband while he reads Architectural Digest wearing combat boots.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx98423VsAIgNfg.jpg

What does "half gay" mean? I thought it was you are, or you ain't.

[Blue Jays]

Having a sunny, upbeat, and generally humorous outlook on life is clearly lacking these days!

[bthornt]

1697989666

[Mzilliox]

how is it that thin people are trying to get thinner, and not simply maintaining their physique and feeding their addictions? i can tell you right now, there is nothing about this hobby I do to make me thinner. i dont want to be thinner, i want to gain 5 lbs. if i were on a peloton, would i be trying to lose weight?

this is dumb, they are marketing to whoever wants to buy it.. dont like the add? dont buy the thing.

next

[fiamme red]

‏


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx98423VsAIgNfg.jpg

What does "half gay" mean? I thought it was you are, or you ain't."Metrosexual" (does anyone use that term any more?) would have made more sense here.

[texbike]

There's always SOMETHING to be outraged about. Personally, I'll save my blood pressure spikes for something more concerning.

TThis is still one of the funniest things I've seen on Twitter: https://twitter.com/clueheywood/status/1089699762331217920.

OK, this Twitter feed is awesome!

We have several friends that have Pelotons. And yes, they are all affluent white women that are mostly thin. They have them because they all found driving 10-20 minutes to Soul Cycle or other spin classes and dropping $20-$30 per class several times a week just didn't make sense when they could have easy access to a Peloton in their house and accomplish the same goals. The cost (which I personally feel is a bit ridiculous) seems to be worth it to them for the convenience.

Texbike

[charliedid]

‏


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx98423VsAIgNfg.jpg

What does "half gay" mean? I thought it was you are, or you ain't.

LOL one thing is for sure...."you ain't"

[zap]

Just wait for the Peleton ad featuring a lady driving up in her Mercedes AMG wagon..................

[charliedid]

When I first read that Twitter feed a while back I laughed for days.

The post in question being one of the funniest things I have read in a loooong time.

Gold

[Hellgate]

I'm outraged that her saddle is set up incorrectly! Peloton should be setting the example for others, pathetic...

[kevinvc]

I read a good twitter thread last night about this that made a lot of sense. Their opinion is that this is really bad copy writing for a number of reasons, one of which is that it's unclear what role the viewer is in the ad. Their point is that the ad creates a sense of unease in the viewer that is difficult to nail down and viewers are trying to figure out why. They are assigning the usual triggers, such as sexism, as a way of trying to articulate it.

I think this argument makes sense. When I watched the commercial, my impression was that it was weird and uninspiring, but not exactly why.

Here's the thread (https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1202723256408535040.html).

[AngryScientist]

I read a good twitter thread last night about this that made a lot of sense. Their opinion is that this is really bad copy writing for a number of reasons, one of which is that it's unclear what role the viewer is in the ad. Their point is that the ad creates a sense of unease in the viewer that is difficult to nail down and viewers are trying to figure out why. They are assigning the usual triggers, such as sexism, as a way of trying to articulate it.

I think this argument makes sense. When I watched the commercial, my impression was that it was weird and uninspiring, but not exactly why.

Here's the thread (https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1202723256408535040.html).

i think this is spot on!

also, the nike commercial in there is good!

[Blue Jays]

"...Just wait for the Peloton ad featuring a lady driving up in her Mercedes AMG wagon..."
That she drove across the country with her friends just to return to their Peloton exercise bicycles. :banana:

[echappist]

Just wait for the Peleton ad featuring a lady driving up in her Mercedes AMG wagon..................

in the snow, heading up to her secluded chalet in Vail, CO. She, being the non-conformist, brought her Peloton stationary trainer to complement/supplement the skiing

[Burnette]

I've been fit for most of my adult life and work out and ride a lot. The gyms I have frequented over the years are patronized by fit people too, maintaining what you have or to stay where you're at requires activity for aome.

Thin people can benefit from cardio workouts as well as strength training. You don't have be fat to benefit from excercise. Surely some of us have at some point been off the bike awhile and gained maybe just a few pounds but lost quite a bit of aerobic capacity. You get winded easier and experience a loss of energy. Staying active is good for the body even if you're not obese.

There's thin people who need the workout, driving a truck or working in an office, you sit all day. Running, biking, walking and swimming, getting the heart rate up and exercising the heart and lungs is good for all.

IMO we currently live in a professionally offended culture now. Recently an over weight person started running and put it on social media. Many responded positively, only to get berated by the person who put it out there. How dare they judge them and and who needs your well wishes.

You can't win in this environment. You could post that puppies are cute and start a war. Which breed is best, animals should be free, cats are the meow and there's a dog hater in the back.

[shoota]

I read a good twitter thread last night about this that made a lot of sense. Their opinion is that this is really bad copy writing for a number of reasons, one of which is that it's unclear what role the viewer is in the ad. Their point is that the ad creates a sense of unease in the viewer that is difficult to nail down and viewers are trying to figure out why. They are assigning the usual triggers, such as sexism, as a way of trying to articulate it.

I think this argument makes sense. When I watched the commercial, my impression was that it was weird and uninspiring, but not exactly why.

Here's the thread (https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1202723256408535040.html).

That makes a ton of sense.

[Brian Smith]

what is half gay
slur?!!?!
now that is more offensive than housewives exercising

The twitter post was meant to be an insensitive jest, and was multiply character-limited.
Posting here has fewer limits, and I'm not sure if you're just trolling, but the "housewives exercising" bit can go both ways, so to speak.
:fight:

Does anyone know if the Peloton bike is ANT+ FE-C capable? Also, I'm in the market for a used Peloton, ideally in the west side of central Florida, in case anyone is aware of one on offer or is holding...

[texbike]

If Peleton had been smart, they should have done an ad with Baby Yoda riding the bike. How could anyone be offended by that? ;)

Texbike

[Kirk007]

Perhaps everyone online getting there chamois in a bunch over this advert should try more exercise and less screen time, maybe then they would understand what the woman is trying to convey (even if inarticulately).

ATMO those who are so upset about this ad have "woke" on the wrong side of the bed. There are plenty of serious issues to be upset about; this Peloton add ain't one of them.

[Lewis Moon]

The only people I know who own a Peloton bike just happen to be wealthy white women.

Like it or not, that's the new American business model: Target sales to the wealthy. That's where the money is, and those are the folks willing to pay a premium markup for prestige.

[DRZRM]

I love that folks are trying to write backstory (maybe she asked for a Peloton) to justify a commercial. Also that you are Whatabouting (https://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/but-what-about) to make a comparison of equality between a company trying to increase its sales through a commercial and a comedian's use of "half gay" to critique that commercial. They can't be held to the same standard.

If you are a publicly traded company (or privately held for that matter) and your commercial pisses people off so much that you need to re-edit out the end of the commercial and your company loses more than 10% of its value (https://www.forbes.com/sites/elanagross/2019/12/05/peloton-stock-is-down-more-than-10-following-backlash-about-sexist-ad/#6b58daba3bbb), they are down over a billion dollars after raking in increased sales over the Black Friday weekend, than you have real issues.

Why exactly should you "Never bend a knee to the crazed rage mob. Ever"? How do you afford to ignore that mob, in capitalism or in democracy?

There is some NSFW f-bombs in it, but this was a very funny response/parody, now viewed almost 4 million times. Sometimes a backlash is well deserved.

https://twitter.com/evaandheriud/status/1201610153549848580

Edit: And kevinvc, thanks for the link, that was a spot on analysis.

[redir]

Yes the bit about copywriting is spot on. I never saw that Mary Poppins thing too hahahahha that's fantastic.

[echappist]

This came across one of my feeds recently ...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/think/amp/ncna1096106

Evidently, the new Peleton ad has been accused of being sexist, heteronormative, and classist. As a personal trainer, the idea of an already thin woman striving to become even thinner is really problematic. And it certainly would seem to enforce gender archetypes. Not sold on the "classist" critique.

If Peleton has determined that the a majority of their audience identifies as affluent suburban women, how do you target them effectively?

Interesting to note that Peleton offered no apology.

There are two points raised by your post: the first is whether it is offensive, and the second is concerned with optimal targeting strategy.

For the former, it is not any more offensive than the ad copies they put out previously. The apparent assumption of many is that the sole reason someone lithe and limber hops on the stationary trainer is to get more lithe and limber, but as many of us here know, after a certain point, it's just all maintenance. As for heteronormative, this is its largest target audience; aka, playing it safe and obtaining the most audience reach. I'm also not sure how classicism comes in, as that usually requires interaction between people of different social classes. This is an ad centered on two (seemingly well-to-do) people, and there is no more classicism than what is generally exhibited by most ads targeting the upper middle class.

Your latter point is a bit different, as it is concerned with consumer psychology. Given your clientele and success working with said clientele, you probably know better than anybody else here how this demographic should be targeted when it comes to fitness and exercise. Also, how dare you leave out the affluent urban dwellers in their $1M downtown flats? :p

Jest aside, the targeted demographic is, by and large, one that is upwardly mobile and buys into the ideas of meritocracy and constant improvements in many aspects of life, never mind that the former isn't always operative, and the latter isn't possible after certain gains have been made. But ad copies aren't there to appeal to logic and reason, they are there to stoke the reptilian brain and stroke the ego of the target audience. Here (by here, i'm referring to all Peloton ads and the like), the message seeks to confirm the steps and dedication the target audience has taken to achieve its present standing (via the general poshness of the setting of the various ads, but without anything that immediately screams conspicuous consumption) and to remind the target audience of the potential self-actualization one may attain with the purchase (maintenance of that lithe and limber physique if one is already there, or as a goal that is worth the sweat and dedication for those who are not). It is essentially intimating: buy this, and you, too, can have this fabulous, Instagram-worthy lifestyle that you deserve. To some of us, it's nothing more than a stupid Jedi mind trick, but prevalence of such ads suggests that it does work.

A while back, I wrote, to the consternation of many, that this is all just a modern take of that cliché (originally coined by a vain Nazi sympathizer) that [one] can never be too rich or too thin. While the execution of this particular ad spot may have been off, that its general message doesn't stray too far from the normal script for items intended for the consumption of the upper middle class should say all there is to say about effective targeting.

I should also note that Peloton's ads are quite different from that from Zwift. As I have access to Eurosport, I see quite a few ads for Zwift. Zwift's ads are much more focused on the actual product (rather than the ambience) and is best described as a bit quirky. It shows different cyclists pedaling in what is best described as a green-room style interior, with a narrator shouting at the cyclists to chase various in-game characters, including the avatar of G(eraint Thomas), who gives the audience a wink. Corny and quirky.

[Bostic]

My wife bought a cheap $200 exercise bike and uses an old iPad with the Peloton app. So while I'm on my Kurt Kinetic struggling up the 15% grade at Radio tower or Alpe du Zwift in my 50x11 I hear the instructor's voice from the iPad yelling.

"I JUST NEED YOU TO GIVE ME 10 SECONDS. FORGET ABOUT CADENCE!"

There is no chance that instructor is going at max effort because they wouldn't be able to talk, much yet yell at you.

I've seen that commercial several times, but I guess it didn't register anything either postive nor negative with me.

[wildboar]

deleted

[Ozz]

yeah....I think the copy in the ad was the problem. And that Peloton is a lighting rod for outrage....sort of like electric cars. Some people are just gonna hate for what it represents....maybe makes them feel bad about themselves?

I discussed the ad with a woman I work with (sample of 1, not wealthy or white) and she said she totally identified with the woman in the ad....busy, little spare time, wants to fit in some time to work out, not sure how to do it, feels bad she can't time for herself, etc.....nothing to do with losing weight or such.

[shoota]

I love that folks are trying to write backstory (maybe she asked for a Peloton) to justify a commercial. Also that you are Whatabouting (https://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/but-what-about) to make a comparison of equality between a company trying to increase its sales through a commercial and a comedian's use of "half gay" to critique that commercial. They can't be held to the same standard.

If you are a publicly traded company (or privately held for that matter) and your commercial pisses people off so much that you need to re-edit out the end of the commercial and your company loses more than 10% of its value (https://www.forbes.com/sites/elanagross/2019/12/05/peloton-stock-is-down-more-than-10-following-backlash-about-sexist-ad/#6b58daba3bbb), they are down over a billion dollars after raking in increased sales over the Black Friday weekend, than you have real issues.

Why exactly should you "Never bend a knee to the crazed rage mob. Ever"? How do you afford to ignore that mob, in capitalism or in democracy?

There is some NSFW f-bombs in it, but this was a very funny response/parody, now viewed almost 4 million times. Sometimes a backlash is well deserved.

https://twitter.com/evaandheriud/status/1201610153549848580

Edit: And kevinvc, thanks for the link, that was a spot on analysis.

Because you can't please the outrage mob. Literally everything is wrong. And you can afford to ignore them because they are the loud minority. The rest of us that watched the commercial and immediately didn't give a crap about it didn't go onto social media to make a big stink about it. Also, that parody wasn't funny in the slightest. So, again, I don't get it, but it's been fascinating to watch the social experiment unfold in real time.

[redir]

I would add that often times when it appears that an ad is targeting an upper class demographic they are really also targetting the lower class in the hopes to make them feel upper class.

Pardon me sir do you have any Grey Poupon.

[Blue Jays]

"...Peloton does not need to apologize for anything.
Never bend a knee to the crazed rage mob. Ever..."

"...Why exactly should you "Never bend a knee to the crazed rage mob. Ever"?
How do you afford to ignore that mob, in capitalism or in democracy?..."

Companies should never bend because the perpetually-offended rage mob will find something else to crybully about.
It is not like these folks will accept the "apology" and immediately get their credit cards out to to purchase a Peloton.

[jlwdm]

I know quite a few people, men and women, who have Peloton bicycles. Some are couples who ride together and some ride on the road also. One couple has the treadmill also. These people really like them and get a lot of great exercise this way. Nothing wrong with that.

I don't get the complaints about the ad.

Jeff

[DRZRM]

Or....maybe wrong things are wrong, and folks who refuse to see problematic patriarchal patterns are really the crazed mob. Let me guess, when people talk about white privilege, women being paid less than men who do the same job, or a minimum wage that allows full time workers to live under the poverty line they are snowflakes and delicate flowers?

This is about the marketing at a company, who they targeted, how they perceive and present their target audience, and the real measurable damage they have done to their company and those who invested in it. It's not about who works out, whether they are thin, or whether they use a Peloton trainer.

No need to respond, I'm all done with this thread, it's exhausting reading ya'll taking offense to people actually identifying offensive things.



Because you can't please the outrage mob. Literally everything is wrong. And you can afford to ignore them because they are the loud minority. The rest of us that watched the commercial and immediately didn't give a crap about it didn't go onto social media to make a big stink about it. Also, that parody wasn't funny in the slightest. So, again, I don't get it, but it's been fascinating to watch the social experiment unfold in real time.

[echappist]

I would add that often times when it appears that an ad is targeting an upper class demographic they are really also targetting the lower class in the hopes to make them feel upper class.

Pardon me sir do you have any Grey Poupon.

You may very well like to think that, I couldn't possibly comment :p

https://oqgakw.by.files.1drv.com/y4mLy5LcjvAeXYPUncW68wtZkQzlhDf1PHn7AQgTxaoe9tuLUY JaG1ISsIcMoMNd0dGkC3fWE5dDnjM4IoBiDodjq3LkzX2vbGvK tRTd_ETzepq1KZYQwzCVMiYSsC9KEDejdW60FOKA0jBP2UkNeY 7xuXuPXKHHeEOhzuN31Rss8br5ZY6TF0AFEAIQfddc9VOVbuaL k6IXxZgfAQUA-N8DA?width=660&height=478&cropmode=none

and to echo your point; having someone with patrician mannerisms to hawk a sh**e car that is a Rover

[FlashUNC]

It's lazy, it's dumb, it's 25 years ago and it picks at the continually festering wound of class divide that's only getting wider in the Western world.

Wellness and health is only for the rich after all.

[Kirk007]

No need to respond, I'm all done with this thread, it's exhausting reading ya'll taking offense to people actually identifying offensive things.

Well that's one approach - I'm right, your wrong and I'm taking my ball home with me.

Just because you and others may be offended by the Peloton advert doesn't mean the offended are more aware than those who don't have a problem with the add. Its equally if not more likely that there's just a different perspective. Has someone appointed a Czar of political correctness who gets to announce on high what is offensive and what is not? Maybe I missed that memo. Or maybe its that some of us are working so hard on existential crises like climate change that there's simply no energy or bandwidth to be outraged over a company trying to sell its high end product to its target audience.

Your other issues referenced are real and no folks bringing light to them are not snowflakes. I suspect many pushing back on the Peloton add outrage take those issues seriously, I know I do, while still thinking the tempest over the Peloton add is lame.

[XXtwindad]

what is half gay
slur?!!?!
now that is more offensive than housewives exercising

This is flat out hysterical!

[XXtwindad]

There are two points raised by your post: the first is whether it is offensive, and the second is concerned with optimal targeting strategy.

For the former, it is not any more offensive than the ad copies they put out previously. The apparent assumption of many is that the sole reason someone lithe and limber hops on the stationary trainer is to get more lithe and limber, but as many of us here know, after a certain point, it's just all maintenance. As for heteronormative, this is its largest target audience; aka, playing it safe and obtaining the most audience reach. I'm also not sure how classicism comes in, as that usually requires interaction between people of different social classes. This is an ad centered on two (seemingly well-to-do) people, and there is no more classicism than what is generally exhibited by most ads targeting the upper middle class.

Your latter point is a bit different, as it is concerned with consumer psychology. Given your clientele and success working with said clientele, you probably know better than anybody else here how this demographic should be targeted when it comes to fitness and exercise. Also, how dare you leave out the affluent urban dwellers in their $1M downtown flats? :p

Jest aside, the targeted demographic is, by and large, one that is upwardly mobile and buys into the ideas of meritocracy and constant improvements in many aspects of life, never mind that the former isn't always operative, and the latter isn't possible after certain gains have been made. But ad copies aren't there to appeal to logic and reason, they are there to stoke the reptilian brain and stroke the ego of the target audience. Here (by here, i'm referring to all Peloton ads and the like), the message seeks to confirm the steps and dedication the target audience has taken to achieve its present standing (via the general poshness of the setting of the various ads, but without anything that immediately screams conspicuous consumption) and to remind the target audience of the potential self-actualization one may attain with the purchase (maintenance of that lithe and limber physique if one is already there, or as a goal that is worth the sweat and dedication for those who are not). It is essentially intimating: buy this, and you, too, can have this fabulous, Instagram-worthy lifestyle that you deserve. To some of us, it's nothing more than a stupid Jedi mind trick, but prevalence of such ads suggests that it does work.

A while back, I wrote, to the consternation of many, that this is all just a modern take of that cliché (originally coined by a vain Nazi sympathizer) that [one] can never be too rich or too thin. While the execution of this particular ad spot may have been off, that its general message doesn't stray too far from the normal script for items intended for the consumption of the upper middle class should say all there is to say about effective targeting.

I should also note that Peloton's ads are quite different from that from Zwift. As I have access to Eurosport, I see quite a few ads for Zwift. Zwift's ads are much more focused on the actual product (rather than the ambience) and is best described as a bit quirky. It shows different cyclists pedaling in what is best described as a green-room style interior, with a narrator shouting at the cyclists to chase various in-game characters, including the avatar of G(eraint Thomas), who gives the audience a wink. Corny and quirky.

I always appreciate your thoughts, Jim.

[azrider]

whaaaaaa haha!

Quote:
Sometimes I’ll move the Peloton bike into our gallery so I can spend time with my half gay husband while he reads Architectural Digest wearing combat boots



https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx98423VsAIgNfg.jpg

Dammit....................i just spit out my coffee. :p:p:p

[XXtwindad]

serious question:

i am, by most standards, thin.

if you saw me riding my bicycle - would you simply assume that the reason i was riding it was to become thinner?

A very interesting question with a complex answer. I'll try to be as brief and concise as possible.

If I saw you (Nick) at a gym I would assume you're probably an athlete. Most likely a runner or a cyclist. But the subject and men and weight is not burdened with misogynist history. I had a female client who once told me that going to the gym "is like being in a war." For her (and assumedly other women) the constant "measuring up" was soul sucking. A fruitless and never ending battle.

The fitness industry is a real mess. It peddles false archetypes and snake oil remedies. To Jim's (echappist) point, none of my clients are the archetypal Peleton crowd. I don't find training that type of client (the "I just want to lose five pounds" crowd) very productive on many levels.

But my target audience is different than Peleton's. That, seemingly is their target market. Are they responsible for rectifying a false archetype? I don't think so.

[XXtwindad]

It's lazy, it's dumb, it's 25 years ago and it picks at the continually festering wound of class divide that's only getting wider in the Western world.

Wellness and health is only for the rich after all.

Is the commercial picking at those scabs or actually buying the bike itself? That's an awfully big burden to lay at the feet of a home exercise equipment company.

[William]

This ad and the responses it evokes reminds me of the TAT...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-IO3eQ-0sI


As commented on already, a lot of the responses seem to be made with a tie to what one brings to the table.






W.

[AngryScientist]

A very interesting question with a complex answer. I'll try to be as brief and concise as possible.

If I saw you (Nick) at a gym I would assume you're probably an athlete. Most likely a runner or a cyclist. But the subject and men and weight is not burdened with misogynist history. I had a female client who once told me that going to the gym "is like being in a war." For her (and assumedly other women) the constant "measuring up" was soul sucking. A fruitless and never ending battle.

The fitness industry is a real mess. It peddles false archetypes and snake oil remedies. To Jim's (echappist) point, none of my clients are the archetypal Peleton crowd. I don't find training that type of client (the "I just want to lose five pounds" crowd) very productive on many levels.

But my target audience is different than Peleton's. That, seemingly is their target market. Are they responsible for rectifying a false archetype? I don't think so.

Thank you for the thoughtful response. Your perspective is different than mine, and we learn from listening to perspectives that differ from ours.

[sitzmark]

Peloton does not need to apologize for anything.
Never bend a knee to the crazed rage mob. Ever.

Yup. People need to get a life and worry about themselves/family and stop neurosing over the universe that does not involve them. If they don't want a Peloton or can't afford one - relax and let it go. Life is too short.

Physically the ad targets two key customer types - a fit/active woman who is motivated to exercise and/or a less fit woman who aspires to same. No reason the ad can't engage the interest of a male as well. Way too much idle time on people's hands to make this a national issue.

[azrider]

https://i.imgflip.com/3inali.jpg

[unterhausen]

All I ever saw was people making fun of the ad, and then I saw a batch of articles about how people were outraged by the ad. Which seemed like twisting the real response people had to the ad. Since that started happening, I have definitely seen a lot of outrage over the fact that people were purported to be outraged. There definitely is an outrage culture in that sense, people outraged that other people might be offended by something.

[XXtwindad]

https://i.imgflip.com/3inali.jpg

That's pretty damn funny.

[Hellgate]

https://i.imgflip.com/3inali.jpgCoffee just shot out my nose! Before you know it "The Peloton" will have killed Kenny.

[FlashUNC]

Is the commercial picking at those scabs or actually buying the bike itself? That's an awfully big burden to lay at the feet of a home exercise equipment company.

The commercial is selling the product.

Sorry it's a big burden, but that's at the feet of every wellness company that markets exclusively to the affluent.

The subtle message in everyone of these ads is only the people who can afford these products deserve the ability to be healthy.

[XXtwindad]

The commercial is selling the product.

Sorry it's a big burden, but that's at the feet of every wellness company that markets exclusively to the affluent.

The subtle message in everyone of these ads is only the people who can afford these products deserve the ability to be healthy.

What about an ad by Moots? Or an ad featuring a fit rider on any other high end custom bike? Are they responsible for bridging the gap in the class divide?

[William]

The commercial is selling the product.

Sorry it's a big burden, but that's at the feet of every wellness company that markets exclusively to the affluent.

The subtle message in everyone of these ads is only the people who can afford these products deserve the ability to be healthy.

No, every company has a target niche in the economic spectrum. Just because a company targets more affluent buyers (cyclists included) doesn't mean they are telling people who can't afford their products to get stuffed.





W.

[AngryScientist]

you know who Peloton needs in the Marketing Department?

Stallone and Chuck Norris.

That's who.

The internet would literally explode.

https://www.bladescout.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/chuck-norris-fact.png

[Hawker]

This was linked on Gothamist yesterday: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/aesthetics-101/201912/disgraced-peloton-husband-speaks-out.

This is still one of the funniest things I've seen on Twitter: https://twitter.com/clueheywood/status/1089699762331217920.

Absolutely HILARIOUS!! And Peloton is loving it...but they won't admit to it.

[XXtwindad]

This.

Peleton can only aspire to be this puerile....

[makoti]

The ad is clearly offensive. The writing is bad. The acting is bad. The camera work is bad. The first bit where she's nervous & later when the instructor says her name (reminded me of watching Romper Room, when the "teacher" looks through the mirror and call out random names & yours MIGHT be one of them), cringe.
The rest is pure conjecture on what was meant. Hubby thought she was fat? Didn't see that. She did? Didn't see that. Maybe she asked for it? Maybe. Time pressed & this allowed her to get the workout she wanted in? Again, maybe.
Some of the comments here are more troubling than the ad. "Anger mob"? Really?

[Robot870]

Ive seen this ad 1000 times and never thought to be offended - Guess I was busy living my life.....SMH

[echappist]

snip

Dear mods, as pointed out by @xxtwindad, how can this post (post #29, offensive image removed) be considered not to run afoul of the following line of the user agreement (emphases added)


The Paceline Forum Rules of Conduct

The Paceline forum is intended to be your virtual neighborhood tavern or coffeehouse, open 24/7, where you can always have a seat and find fellow cycling enthusiasts from all over the world willing to share information, fellowship and good times discussing subjects of mutual interest.

• The Golden Rule: "Don't be a jerk." Keep in mind that whatever you say here may be read by other Forum members of almost any age or gender from anywhere in the world, with different cultures, politics, religions, and beliefs. Is it something you would not be comfortable saying to any of those forum members in person? If not, then it should probably not be said here, either.

• Advertisements: You may not advertise other websites, via posts, PMs, or signatures. The purpose of this rule is to prevent spammers from abusing our forum.

• Links: Links to potentially offensive websites are not to be posted to The Paceline Forum, and will be removed at the sole discretion of the moderators. Links to subjects being discussed are always welcome.

• Objectionable Content: You may not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-oriented, hateful, threatening, or otherwise in violation of any law.

[AngryScientist]

Dear mods, as pointed out by @xxtwindad, how can this post (post #29, offensive image removed) be considered not to run afoul of the following line of the user agreement (emphases added)

agree 100%

[93KgBike]

too much 'locker room' in this thread from those old enough to be better

[jtbadge]

While we're quoting the rules:

• The Golden Rule: "Don't be a jerk." Keep in mind that whatever you say here may be read by other Forum members of almost any age or gender from anywhere in the world, with different cultures, politics, religions, and beliefs. Is it something you would not be comfortable saying to any of those forum members in person? If not, then it should probably not be said here, either.


Literally everything in this thread.

If your voiced reaction to someone calling out harmful imagery/language/stereotypes is just going to be "I can't believe they are they so mad, arrggh!!!" maybe consider that every person has had their own life experience. People of privilege shouting down others is tiresome and obnoxious.

[Hawker]

Ive seen this ad 1000 times and never thought to be offended - Guess I was busy living my life.....SMH

Hmm, that's why we need the internet. So in our busy lives we have somewhere to go to be told what we should be offended about. Where do I send my $?!

[buddybikes]

Boy times have changed, remember Bicycling had Bell helmet ad in 1980s with Rebecca Twigg just having 2 Bell helmets covering her upper woman parts....

[saab2000]

you know who Peloton needs in the Marketing Department?

Stallone and Chuck Norris.

That's who.

The internet would literally explode.

https://www.bladescout.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/chuck-norris-fact.png

This is awesome.

I read about the “offensive” ad a few days ago and the Op/Ed piece was full of conjecture and assumptions. I can’t muster the energy to get offended by any of this. If potential customers are offended they can buy something else. Most people here probably aren’t potential customers but if there are Peloton owners here, good for them.

[AngryScientist]

While we're quoting the rules:



Literally everything in this thread

disagree

[joosttx]

I've been trading this stock for the last couple weeks, so I've been following this ad controversy pretty closely. I think the ad was poorly hatched because it overestimated the sophistication of the bulk of the target market. The ad's real intended message is the woman challenging herself with the classes, and her family supporting her, as the Peloton program is challenging. The whole " exercise is only for losing fat" crowd doesn't get the message. Add in the Woke cancel culture crowd, and you have a recipe for disaster.

Their financials are shady too. A couple years age their CFO was arrested for embezzlement. I still can’t square their finances.

[Robot870]

I actually liked the ad - A good looking woman in my age bracket is not gonna scare me off!

[texbike]

Peleton can only aspire to be this puerile....

I learned a new word today. Thank you! ;)

Texbike

[fignon's barber]

Their financials are shady too. A couple years age their CFO was arrested for embezzlement. I still can’t square their finances.

Yeah, and I don't like the idea that the founder is the CEO. But subscription companies make good growth stocks.

[azrider]

While we're quoting the rules:



Literally everything in this thread.


https://media.giphy.com/media/14smAwp2uHM3Di/giphy.gif

[jpritchet74]

I don't understand how so many people are offended by things these days. Way too sensitive.

Sticks and stones, right?

[GOTHBROOKS]

not nary a macro out there thats as offensive as this thread.

[jtbadge]

not nary a macro out there thats as offensive as this thread.


https://y.yarn.co/f7d2fce8-41c3-41be-a96f-fe9d5d8429aa_screenshot.jpg

These hot takes are sucking my will to live!

[redir]

I'm surprised their stock took such a big hit. I guess so much for 'There is no such thing as bad publicity.' Of course maybe now's the time to buy some back.

[Ti Designs]

I don't own a Peloton, nor have I ever done any of their classes. My opinion on this matter is invalid.

[FlashUNC]

What about an ad by Moots? Or an ad featuring a fit rider on any other high end custom bike? Are they responsible for bridging the gap in the class divide?

Look at you putting two and two together.

Yes, cycling is every bit as classist and elitist. Every 5 o clock shadowed white dude on a 12k high zoot carbon bike in an ad sends a strong implicit message of who this is for and, by extension, who it's not for.

Are they responsible for bridging the class divide? No. But its a worthwhile question what high end bike manufacturers are doing to be more inclusive and bring in more people across the economic spectrum. We want all people on bikes right?

[belopsky]

This thread really got derailleured

[jpritchet74]

This thread really got derailleured

post of the day

[joosttx]

Look at you putting two and two together.


That equals four. (Just so we are all on the same page)

[Jef58]

I'm not sure how we got to this point in our society that an obscure ad for an obscure niche product is so offensive. Was there subliminal messaging that I missed ? I know a lot of females who, do not like to ride a bike alone, feel intimidated riding with men, and even working out around other people. So the alternative is a home fitness machine that could work for a certain demographic.

We have been a target of advertising for everything we buy like it or not...ignore the white noise and we'll be a whole lot happier in life.

[rallizes]

Look at you putting two and two together.

Yes, cycling is every bit as classist and elitist. Every 5 o clock shadowed white dude on a 12k high zoot carbon bike in an ad sends a strong implicit message of who this is for and, by extension, who it's not for.

Are they responsible for bridging the class divide? No. But its a worthwhile question what high end bike manufacturers are doing to be more inclusive and bring in more people across the economic spectrum. We want all people on bikes right?

do you generally support high end bike manufacturers that are working to bridge the class divide?

[XXtwindad]

Look at you putting two and two together.

Yes, cycling is every bit as classist and elitist. Every 5 o clock shadowed white dude on a 12k high zoot carbon bike in an ad sends a strong implicit message of who this is for and, by extension, who it's not for.

Are they responsible for bridging the class divide? No. But its a worthwhile question what high end bike manufacturers are doing to be more inclusive and bring in more people across the economic spectrum. We want all people on bikes right?

Peloton has identified a market that is willing to pay a certain price for their bikes. Their ads target that market. Seems perfectly rationale to me. The same with custom frame builders.

That being said, if I ever see you on your high zoot carbon Gaulzetti, I will not think you're elitist or classist. Unless you grow a hipster mustache. That really gnaws at me...

[fiamme red]

Look at you putting two and two together.

Yes, cycling is every bit as classist and elitist. Every 5 o clock shadowed white dude on a 12k high zoot carbon bike in an ad sends a strong implicit message of who this is for and, by extension, who it's not for.

Are they responsible for bridging the class divide? No. But its a worthwhile question what high end bike manufacturers are doing to be more inclusive and bring in more people across the economic spectrum. We want all people on bikes right?Now you can wear Rapha's indoor training line while riding your Peloton. :rolleyes:

https://www.rapha.cc/us/en_US/indoor-training/category/indoor-training

[FlashUNC]

do you generally support high end bike manufacturers that are working to bridge the class divide?

Of late, yeah. Wider tent benefits all of us.

[FlashUNC]

Peleton has identified a market that is willing to pay a certain price for their bikes. Their ads target that market. Seems perfectly rationale to me. The same with custom frame builders.

That being said, if I ever see you on your high zoot carbon Gaulzetti, I will not think you're elitist or classist. Unless you grow a hipster mustache. That really gnaws at me...

Feel free. The guillotines came for the well to do in France for a reason.

If we more openly talked about class in the country rather than pretending we're all just middle class with a stroke of luck away from being Scrooge McDuck, then we might have more honest conversations about these kinds of issues.

I'm well off enough to afford an expensive ass carbon Gaulzetti. I also realize our hobby in particular and society as a whole is not functioning well when people in my demographic are the only ones the industry is going after.

Pelotons a symptom. The disease is a helluva lot deeper.

[AngryScientist]

not nary a macro out there thats as offensive as this thread.

see here's the thing Goth:

Plenty of people are contributing to this thread with thoughtful opinions, context and perspective.

entering the thread and posting nothing buy stupid, offensive images about how the thread sucks are not helpful.

if you've got something to say, by all means, let us hear it in an adult, articulate manner, otherwise, don't bother posting worthless content here.

[bigbill]

Meh, no different than the luxury car ads. Or even better, the GM ad where the husband or wife buys the other one a $60K vehicle for Christmas. Were those ads offensive to anyone?

[zap]

Yeah, and I don't like the idea that the founder is the CEO. But subscription companies make good growth stocks.

If it is sustainable. At some point people will get bored with Peleton. After all, it is just a modern take of an indoor "bicycle" exercise machine.

[AngryScientist]

The subtle message in everyone of these ads is only the people who can afford these products deserve the ability to be healthy.

but that's just conjecture, is it not?

first off, i agree the ad is poorly done and generally a little confusing, but is it not possible that someone without the means to buy a peloton and subscription sees the ad and is inspired by some emotional driver to go join the local YMCA and take some spin classes?

to me it is possible that there is no hidden subtle message that exercise is only for the elite. to me it is possible that the message is that busy working mothers can find time to work out and feel better through physical activity.

we see commercials with people gifting their rich girlfriends lexus's every christmas, i dont think the message there is that driving is only for the rich - is it?

not being argumentative, just continuing the conversation.

[mtechnica]

Hot take: My girlfriend said the ad “seems super stupid” and agreed that the twitter memes are funny. Neither of us are offended by the commercial or the memes.

[FlashUNC]

but that's just conjecture, is it not?

first off, i agree the ad is poorly done and generally a little confusing, but is it not possible that someone without the means to buy a peloton and subscription sees the ad and is inspired by some emotional driver to go join the local YMCA and take some spin classes?

to me it is possible that there is no hidden subtle message that exercise is only for the elite. to me it is possible that the message is that busy working mothers can find time to work out and feel better through physical activity.

we see commercials with people gifting their rich girlfriends lexus's every christmas, i dont think the message there is that driving is only for the rich - is it?

not being argumentative, just continuing the conversation.

The Peloton is literally on what must be a $10k cedar pedestal that wouldn't look out of place in a throne room. The Lexus commercial always has the car driving up to a mansion that looks like it appears on some estate. It's a double edged message -- if you own this, you've made it -- and conversely if everything in the commercial looks like nothing you've ever seen in your life -- this is not for you.

So yes, for the Lexus commercial, its absolutely sending the signal this is either for the rich or someone who wants to be perceived is rich. It's Ad 101.

If they wanted a working moms message, it would be a vastly different commercial. But that's not the customer they want, and that's symptomatic of a much, much larger structural problem.

[Mikej]

Since WM doesn’t sell them I’m skeptical too ������ That would mean The Peloton IS for everyone!!!

[andrew+]

All I ever saw was people making fun of the ad, and then I saw a batch of articles about how people were outraged by the ad. Which seemed like twisting the real response people had to the ad. Since that started happening, I have definitely seen a lot of outrage over the fact that people were purported to be outraged. There definitely is an outrage culture in that sense, people outraged that other people might be offended by something.

This is a critical part of the consolidation of the right: the left, or often more accurately: liberals, are irrational, "triggered," "outrage mob" etc. It predates the internet, but social media has made it much more effective because it is so easy to gather evidence of individuals posting knee-jerk reactions. Any criticism of the status quo, any anger, any cultural critique of traditional norms is easily portrayed this way, and that negative identification is at the heart of the contemporary right.

The ad is jarring, awkward, and creepy. I see why people hate it, but i'm not "offended" by it. It also seemingly unwittingly very clearly expresses some of the most grating elements of the class divide in the US. It's a goldmine for a contemporary right-populist politician.

[sitzmark]

...
If we more openly talked about class in the country rather than pretending we're all just middle class with a stroke of luck away from being Scrooge McDuck, then we might have more honest conversations about these kinds of issues.
...
Pelotons a symptom. The disease is a helluva lot deeper.

Happening ... just look around. Maybe not as openly and honestly as necessary but there's a dialogue going on at the national level. Even so, the system isn't designed for everyone to have equal means, so there will likely always be products and services that some can afford and others cannot. Skews political from there so....

Can't see why (how) is it the responsibility of a high end cycling company to bring in more people across the economic spectrum? There are innumerable ways for people with lesser means to engage in cycling without the assistance of Peloton or merchants like them.

Ignoring that there are 5 o'clock shadowed dudes "of color" (I hate that term - just dudes as far as I'm concerned) who have the means to ride a 12k zoot carbon bike is missing reality. Happily they exist. That's not to ignore the realities of inequity and compounded prejudice woven into the fabric of the country/world.

Excoriating a company for not solving the ills of the world when they're just trying to say give your active wife a spin bike for the holidays is counter productive. Some times people just need to back off and focus on real problems.

[Blue Jays]

Good grief.
Should companies be mandated to erect billboards coast-to-coast even where their likely clientele will never ever see them?

I do not lose sleep over not seeing something likely not of interest to me, anyway.
When I see advertisements for $500,000 diamond necklaces, my non-envious response is, "Wow, that is cool. How sparkling and beautiful.".

Then I flip the page without even another thought. Easy-peasy.

[Matthew]

It's the world today. EVERYTHING offends someone somewhere.

[azrider]

Then I flip the page without even another thought. Easy-peasy.

This is the perfect analogy to describe what a non-SJW looks like.

In similar fashion. When I see Mercedes ads, or clothing advertisements in GQ or MensHealth magazines showcasing some dude with perfectly manicured hair, square jaw, cheesy grin and throwing a football (Burberry scarf $500, TAG Watch $10,000, Jeans $600, Himilayan Spun Artisan Wool sweater $1200, Gucci slip ons $1000) I giggle to myself and I turn the page.

It absolutely BAFFLES me that someone would take the time to cry foul and express "deep concern this is sending the wrong message"........GTFOHWTS

People who're getting their panties in a wad over this need to serious get over themselves.

[andrew+]

That's interesting, because when I see criticism of something that I'm neutral about, I also ignore it. And you seem very upset that others are criticizing it. I wonder why?

[blindwilly]

Is there anyone here that is genuinely offended by this ad? is it possible to recognize that that ad is awkward and potentially alienating without it being offensive. I don't even understand what "group" this ad is purportedly offending. It all comes across as virtue signaling to me.

[redir]

This is a critical part of the consolidation of the right: the left, or often more accurately: liberals, are irrational, "triggered," "outrage mob" etc. It predates the internet, but social media has made it much more effective because it is so easy to gather evidence of individuals posting knee-jerk reactions. Any criticism of the status quo, any anger, any cultural critique of traditional norms is easily portrayed this way, and that negative identification is at the heart of the contemporary right.

The ad is jarring, awkward, and creepy. I see why people hate it, but i'm not "offended" by it. It also seemingly unwittingly very clearly expresses some of the most grating elements of the class divide in the US. It's a goldmine for a contemporary right-populist politician.

The last several months I've been reading about how one certain nation's troll farms work and how adept they are at tapping into Americas culture war to divide us. I would not be surprised not one single bit if they hopped on this controversy and are inciting little subtle messages around it right at this moment. Of course Peloton is an international company but this outrage seems to be mostly unique to US. In short what I have learned is that when something happens and you think to yourself, 'ya just can't make this stuff up,' you actually can.

[azrider]

That's interesting, because when I see criticism of something that I'm neutral about, I also ignore it. And you seem very entertained that others are criticizing it. I wonder why?

Ha....fixed that for ya there professor ;)

[peanutgallery]

Forget all the other stuff, that lady needs a serious bike fit. Her saddle is too low and too far forward - head tube is way too tall, fix it and she'll lose like another pound for next year (sarcasm)

Those things do not have an adjustable reach. Had to break that news to my sister in law who's barely 5 feet tall. They do sell like thicker pipe insulation that zip ties on that can help. I fit her as best I could but I found the design to be kinda lame...but what do I know. All about subscriptions and IPOs, pretty sure not a lot is actually about a person and their personal growth

https://images.app.goo.gl/scxX6Zs2b13JNFxp6

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2019/12/04/14/21813096-0-image-a-25_1575469574525.jpg

[parris]

Offended??? ME?! I dismissed the commercial until I heard the buzz about it. Then i watched it closer and WAS offended... by the overacting and typical cheese factor of the commercial but thats about it...

It's no better or worse than the Chevy commercials that show "real" peoples reaction to the latest Chevy. Or how about this gem... "he went to Jared"! How about the number of commercials that show one half being SO MUCH SMARTER than the other? Etc etc etc.

They're ad's put out there to part us with our money.

[Drmojo]

This is flat out hysterical!

I thought so
No need for homophobia

[GonaSovereign]

I'd love to read the creative brief.

It's not hard to be tone deaf, but generally enough eyes on a creative concept will catch the dumb stuff. (I've been saved by an objective third party in the past.) That said, a client can push something through if they insist.

Edit - there are nine pages of comments in this thread, and a zillion more across the internet. Mekanism's certainly met its impressions target....good or bad.

[XXtwindad]

I thought so
No need for homophobia

Just to be clear: I thought the Twitter meme was hysterical. No offense, of course. :)

[William]

...The Lexus commercial always has the car driving up to a mansion that looks like it appears on some estate. It's a double edged message -- if you own this, you've made it -- and conversely if everything in the commercial looks like nothing you've ever seen in your life -- this is not for you.

So yes, for the Lexus commercial, its absolutely sending the signal this is either for the rich or someone who wants to be perceived is rich. It's Ad 101.

If they wanted a working moms message, it would be a vastly different commercial. But that's not the customer they want, and that's symptomatic of a much, much larger structural problem.

Yes, Ad 101. All advertising is meant to invoke a precieved need for something you don't have...so you will buy. If you can't afford that Lexus they offer Toyota. If you can't afford the Infinity, they have the Nissan. Can't afford the Acura, they offer the Honda. Can't afford the Caddilac, then there is Chevy, Lincoln - Ford etc... The Mercury Montaineer and the Ford Explorer are the same thing, one was just targeted at consumers with more dollars to spend and willing to do so. Companies with the means and infrastructure can afford to offer different lines of products to different demographics.

Many others who do not have that infrastructure can't afford to offer things to every demographic...hence the discussion a while back about craftsmanship and being able to survive making it a business. If you are going to make things that cost less, then you need to be able to have the volume to support the costs of materials, labor, and overhead with enough left over to pay yourself and your employees (which you will need to produce in volume). If you are a small business and can't afford the costs of tooling up and the means to pay wages to employees then you better be targeting a customer base that can support your expenses and efforts. We all know custom bicycles is one thing that falls into this category. It has to be a demographic that can support your work and efforts.

Every company can't be diverse enough to be all things to all consumers.








W.

[andrew+]

Ha....fixed that for ya there professor ;)

Sure fooled me - I'll let others read your writing and draw their own conclusions as to your mental state.

Regardless of what's going on with your emotions, the point stands, and your posts are some of the clearest examples of this "controversy" being sustained as a vehicle for right-wing identity consolidation through defining the others as irrational, etc. In your own words: those "BAFFLING" "SJW's" who "have their panties in a wad" etc. etc.

Edit: Okay, as per below I'll stop posting about this now. I don't have anything else to add beyond this perspective on what these controversies "are" and how they function politically.

[William]

Let's keep thing away form the right wing/left wing accusations...







W.

[FlashUNC]

Many others who do not have that infrastructure can't afford to offer things to every demographic...hence the discussion a while back about craftsmanship and being able to survive making it a business. If you are going to make things that cost less, then you need to be able to have the volume to support the costs of materials, labor, and overhead with enough left over to pay yourself and your employees (which you will need to produce in volume). If you are a small business and can't afford the costs of tooling up and the means to pay wages to employees then you better be targeting a customer base that can support your expenses and efforts. We all know custom bicycles is one thing that falls into this category. It has to be a demographic that can support your work and efforts.

Every company can't be diverse enough to be all things to all consumers.

W.

Certainly, but when you look at categories like health and wellness as a whole -- and Peloton fits in that category -- there is very little interest in anyone who's not stinking gobsmacking rich. If you've got enough money, there's plenty on the GOOP mailing list or another boot camp gym or spin class that'll happily part with your money.

Which is where the Peloton commercial and the product as a whole, is a symptom rather than the disease. Why are people upset about it?

Because it's yet another product in an industry that bends over backwards to cater to rich people to ensure the already rich skinny heteronormative woman stays rich and skinny, while not insignificant portions of the public are facing real issues around access to healthcare, healthy food and the kinds of services that would help with their own wellness. Checked out a Y Membership lately? Even those aren't cheap.

To position it as simply "Well Peloton does a thing and it's their customer base so what's the big deal?" whistles by the graveyard of the much larger issue. Where you see a commercial, there's a very real "Let 'em eat cake" whiff to the entire industry Peloton's in, and yes, the commercial probably the most in-your-face and emblematic part of the issue.

And yeah, I'd throw high zoot bikes in the same bucket. The industry as a whole, whether you make custom bikes or mass produce, does a garbage job appealing to all segments and trying to widen the tent. The answer the industry's landed on instead is selling the same existing deep pocketed customers 10 different micro-niche bikes than bothering to think about how to widen their customer base and appeal to broader audiences without breaking the bank.

That commercial is still dumber than a bag of hammers from a company without even the slightest bit of self-awareness.

[Kirk007]

Because it's yet another product in an industry that bends over backwards to cater to rich people to ensure the already rich skinny heteronormative woman stays rich and skinny, while not insignificant portions of the public are facing real issues around access to healthcare, healthy food and the kinds of services that would help with their own wellness. Checked out a Y Membership lately? Even those aren't cheap.



So how far do we go? Do we require Peloton to market to a target audience that can't afford its product or give Pelotons to YMCAs and community centers?
Do we outlaw commercials for McDonalds and Ho Hums because they are unhealthly and likely target the demographics that are polar opposites of Peloton? Does Patagonia get a thumbs up or thumbs down for its reuse and recycling marketing campaign and its millions of dollars contributed to environmental causes or do they get slammed too because most of their models are white, healthy and have enough income to buy expensive gear? Do we pass new SEC regulations that every publicly traded company must devote 20% of its gross revenues to doing social good?

We can't even get people on board anymore with requiring manufacturers to be responsible corporate citizens and not crap all over the environment; Trump eviscerates the EPA and everything else and far as I can tell not a single voter gives a damn other than those who hate Trump already for a multitude of issues.

As long as quarterly earnings are the bellwether for corporate success I don't see how you change corporate behaivor to address social issues unless you provide real monetary incentives, likely from the government one way or another, either positive like subsidies or negative like regulations, forcing change.

Product boycotts don't seem to get it done and I doubt a moment of social media hysteria is going to do it either. I wish they did work; it would make my day job a lot easier.

[Seramount]

would like to have a poignant comment about another expensive indoor torture device targeted for trendy yuppie puppies, but coming up short...

guessing that most buy one, use it a few times, and then just hang their laundry on it.

file under Bowflex / Nordic Track toys that are collecting cobwebs...

[PQJ]

Haven’t seen the ad and don’t know a lick about it other than the outrage it seems to have generated. Never ridden a Peloton and likely never will. But boy howdy have they monetized a niche segment. Kudos to them. If only I could figure out how to monetize the associated outrage.

/drive by

[XXtwindad]

Certainly, but when you look at categories like health and wellness as a whole -- and Peloton fits in that category -- there is very little interest in anyone who's not stinking gobsmacking rich. If you've got enough money, there's plenty on the GOOP mailing list or another boot camp gym or spin class that'll happily part with your money.

Which is where the Peloton commercial and the product as a whole, is a symptom rather than the disease. Why are people upset about it?

Because it's yet another product in an industry that bends over backwards to cater to rich people to ensure the already rich skinny heteronormative woman stays rich and skinny, while not insignificant portions of the public are facing real issues around access to healthcare, healthy food and the kinds of services that would help with their own wellness. Checked out a Y Membership lately? Even those aren't cheap.

To position it as simply "Well Peloton does a thing and it's their customer base so what's the big deal?" whistles by the graveyard of the much larger issue. Where you see a commercial, there's a very real "Let 'em eat cake" whiff to the entire industry Peloton's in, and yes, the commercial probably the most in-your-face and emblematic part of the issue.

And yeah, I'd throw high zoot bikes in the same bucket. The industry as a whole, whether you make custom bikes or mass produce, does a garbage job appealing to all segments and trying to widen the tent. The answer the industry's landed on instead is selling the same existing deep pocketed customers 10 different micro-niche bikes than bothering to think about how to widen their customer base and appeal to broader audiences without breaking the bank.

That commercial is still dumber than a bag of hammers from a company without ev en the slightest bit of self-awareness.


True. It was really tone deaf. But the rest of your argument is pretty specious. Is it incumbent on the artisanal furniture maker to make IKEA level tables? The health crisis won't be solved by Peloton making a lower end bike. That's silly.

[jpritchet74]

[/B][/I]Is it incumbent on the artisanal furniture maker to make IKEA level tables? The health crisis won't be solved by Peleton making a lower end bike. That's silly.

Or like saying that Rolls Royce needs a budget model?

I just don't understand the outrage. People like different things and can afford different things. Back in the day when you saw something outside of your price bracket you might work hard to save the money for it - now I think that we are just supposed to be outraged.

[vincenz]

Not sure what the issue with the ad is. It’s corny as hell, but pretty inoffensive. Internet People get worked up over nothing.

Obviously they are trying to target a certain demographic. It’s mostly about image. But it’s no different from selling hot yoga pants ala lululemon or lingerie ala Victoria’s Secret. The only thing different is the price point. Because it’s expensive, therefore people get worked up over it? Maybe they should picket all the luxury goods companies while they’re at it.

[charliedid]

[QUOTE=peanutgallery;2629361]Forget all the other stuff, that lady needs a serious bike fit. Her saddle is too low and too far forward - head tube is way too tall, fix it and she'll lose like another pound for next year (sarcasm)

Those things do not have an adjustable reach. Had to break that news to my sister in law who's barely 5 feet tall. They do sell like thicker pipe insulation that zip ties on that can help. I fit her as best I could but I found the design to be kinda lame...but what do I know. All about subscriptions and IPOs, pretty sure not a lot is actually about a person and their personal growth

It's not a bicycle it's an exercise machine and I think I want one.

[parris]

This thread and whatever outrage the commercial has spawned has done a few things as far as I can see.

I remembered they had a couple of funny commercials for last years Christmas season. The wife "found" the Peloton bike that her husband got for her as a gift and was psyched so the rest of the commercial had her sneaking out to the shed in the days leading up to the holiday where the reveal was the bike and she and the family are super happy. The companion to it is the husband doing the same thing. Cheesy? Of course it was. The thing though is that it was an advertisement that's remembered a year later. The music was a remake of Queens Crazy Little Thing Called Love.

The other thing that I see this latest ad doing is for good or bad the Peloton company is getting a lot of free publicity. I've seen several other commercials from them as well as other fitness machine companies and they ALL to a similar extent follow the same basic formula.

The thing that the thread has done for me personally is it's gotten me to remember several ads and brands from over the years. I'll list a few and if interested add to the list.

The quality goes in before the name goes on.
Nothing runs like a Deere.
Be a Pepper Too
He does exist. They do exist. Uh Santa...
You meet the nicest people on a Honda.
Quality is Job 1.
Bud-Wei-Ser.

And many more.

[Malinois]

omg

https://twitter.com/vancityreynolds/status/1203118775815622664

[djg21]

omg

https://twitter.com/vancityreynolds/status/1203118775815622664

That is too ironic and too funny. “To new beginnings!”:)

[charliedid]

omg

https://twitter.com/vancityreynolds/status/1203118775815622664

haha

[jpritchet74]

omg

https://twitter.com/vancityreynolds/status/1203118775815622664

that's fantastic!

[rowebr]

omg

https://twitter.com/vancityreynolds/status/1203118775815622664

I must be a little slow...had to watch it twice but now I get it!

[54ny77]

gold!:banana:



This is still one of the funniest things I've seen on Twitter: https://twitter.com/clueheywood/status/1089699762331217920.

[redir]

I must be a little slow...had to watch it twice but now I get it!

I'm way slower. Dmanit! I don't get it. What did I miss? LOL

[oliver1850]

Just wait for the Peleton ad featuring a lady driving up in her Mercedes AMG wagon..................

Or blowing by you at 193 mph.

[Blue Jays]

Posters twisting themselves into pretzels and accusing others of not being "good stewards to the greater society" all because some company somewhere is selling expensive stationary bicycles to people who wish to buy them...had best be pedaling around on a tan, gold, brown, and yellow rusty 1981 Huffy Santa Fe or they ain't keepin' it real!

:banana:

https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5315/5898314683_b83c483fb8_z.jpg

[BobbyJones]

After reading every post in the thread (boy oh boy some of you can pontificate) I needed to see what all the fuss was about so I watched the ad.

I'm trying to figure out ANY of the outrage.

This whole new culture of empowerment / victimization reminds me of the joke about the guy who can't stop thinking about sex and goes to a Psychologist. Here's a link (http://www.bouldertherapist.com/html/humor/MentalHealthHumor/rorschach.html) to a tame version, but please do not click through if you are offended by Psychologists, Sex, the phrase "Making Love", heterosexuals or rorschach tests.

[djg21]

I'm way slower. Dmanit! I don't get it. What did I miss? LOL



It looks to be the same actress, who slammed the glass of gin.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sitzmark]

It is more than ironic that the cost of a Peloton bike ($2,400ish) is the same as the average smoker spends on cigarettes every year. (Peloton subscription is $460 annually.)

There are socioeconomic issues in the world, but I can't reconcile the logic of how $2,400 for a spin bike by an affluent family has come to represent the height of "classist consumption" and yet burning up $2,400 of tobacco (which is mostly a lower socioeconomic phenomenon) doesn't equate to a luxury expenditure. Millions of people smoke … 50 million in the USA. For their health it would be much better if $2,400 was actually an unobtainable expense.

Wading through the moral outrage of tone deafness, classism, and all the rest, what I would find tone deaf and objectionable is if Peloton actively targeted people who don't have disposable incomes capable of supporting $2,400 without compromising important basic needs. Based on the ire generated over Peloton’s advertising content, unethical targeting is certainly not an issue.

[uber]

Should I be outraged that Porsche does not make a 500 HP Carerra that I can afford? Is Patek Phillipe equally at fault for not producing a manually wound chronograph for under $50k? I don't understand the outrage for successful companies making products for people who can afford them. I don't share the belief that companies are responsible for making products for every price point to include every consumer. I can't afford many things that other people can. I don't blame them, boutique product manufacterers or anyone else. Ok. I, waiting for the thunder.

[oldpotatoe]

The ad is clearly offensive. The writing is bad. The acting is bad. The camera work is bad. The first bit where she's nervous & later when the instructor says her name (reminded me of watching Romper Room, when the "teacher" looks through the mirror and call out random names & yours MIGHT be one of them), cringe.
The rest is pure conjecture on what was meant. Hubby thought she was fat? Didn't see that. She did? Didn't see that. Maybe she asked for it? Maybe. Time pressed & this allowed her to get the workout she wanted in? Again, maybe.
Some of the comments here are more troubling than the ad. "Anger mob"? Really?

BUT..geeez, 75 posts here, the ad was even on NBC news...and altho PelOton is responding, like the anti Rapha 'hate mail', they are getting great exposure and I'll bet their sales sure haven't gone DOWN because of this 'episode'..

BUT, it's an 'ADVERTISEMENT'...gotta look pretty deep for ME to find this or any other ADVERTISEMENT, really, truly 'offensive'...

The ones that make men look like idiots(most are, let's be honest:)), 'could' twist me knickers but..they are ADVERTISEMENTS, not comments on middle east peace or breakthroughs in heart disease treatment..They are talking about an exercise bike fer farge's sake..:eek:

For UBER, right above..agree 100%..
Is Patek Phillipe equally at fault for not producing a manually wound chronograph for under $50k?

$50K? Chump change..

How about $300,000(read that right..)??:eek:

[saab2000]

Should I be outraged that Porsche does not make a 500 HP Carerra that I can afford? Is Patek Phillipe equally at fault for not producing a manually wound chronograph for under $50k? I don't understand the outrage for successful companies making products for people who can afford them. I don't share the belief that companies are responsible for making products for every price point to include every consumer. I can't afford many things that other people can. I don't blame them, boutique product manufacterers or anyone else. Ok. I, waiting for the thunder.

Stop making sense!

[merlinmurph]

As a personal trainer, the idea of an already thin woman striving to become even thinner is really problematic.

This is an oft repeated comment about the ad, yet nowhere in the ad does it mention that. As a personal trainer, I'm sure you're aware that people do exercise without wanting to lose weight.

[woolly]

It is more than ironic that the cost of a Peloton bike ($2,400ish) is the same as the average smoker spends on cigarettes every year. (Peloton subscription is $460 annually.)

There are socioeconomic issues in the world, but I can't reconcile the logic of how $2,400 for a spin bike by an affluent family has come to represent the height of "classist consumption" and yet burning up $2,400 of tobacco (which is mostly a lower socioeconomic phenomenon) doesn't equate to a luxury expenditure. Millions of people smoke … 50 million in the USA. For their health it would be much better if $2,400 was actually an unobtainable expense.

Wading through the moral outrage of tone deafness, classism, and all the rest, what I would find tone deaf and objectionable is if Peloton actively targeted people who don't have disposable incomes capable of supporting $2,400 without compromising important basic needs. Based on the ire generated over Peloton’s advertising content, unethical targeting is certainly not an issue.

Should I be outraged that Porsche does not make a 500 HP Carerra that I can afford? Is Patek Phillipe equally at fault for not producing a manually wound chronograph for under $50k? I don't understand the outrage for successful companies making products for people who can afford them. I don't share the belief that companies are responsible for making products for every price point to include every consumer. I can't afford many things that other people can. I don't blame them, boutique product manufacterers or anyone else. Ok. I, waiting for the thunder.


Agree - a lot of sense in these two posts.

The good news is that I've been working so much that I haven't actually seen the ad - had to do a quick interweb search to find it (the bad news is that I've been working so much that I hadn't inadvertently seen the ad live at least once already).

Like many others here, I just don't get the outrage. While I can acknowledge that some others were offended, I struggle to make the connections to the actual content I saw in the ad. To me, it seemed a huge amount of assumption & conjecture to be necessary to make the leap to "outrage".

We have a Peloton bike. We really like it. We got one because my wife wanted one, and initiated the idea. Prior to purchase I came to terms with the fact that it wasn't really cycling, or training for cycling. They're not selling that, they're selling a spin-bike. Actually that's not even correct, they're selling at-home spin classes. So be it. Yes, they seem expensive, but we didn't buy it as a status or luxury item, we bought it to save money in the long run over in-person spin classes, for the time saved, and for the increased convenience that would hopefully help lead to doing more workouts than we otherwise would. And after having it right at one year, I look back on the workout stats & can say it's done those very things. Based on the number of classes between the two of us combined, the cost-per-class is around half what it would have been done at the local "studio", at what I would roughly estimate double the convenience. I have no doubt that even if the cost was a wash, I would have skipped more opportunities if I was required to spend the time to drive to the studio for the class at a scheduled time, rather than just suck it up & hop on at home when it best fit my schedule. So yeah, I don't get the cost-slant on the angst - that should be pointed more at the over-priced studio's than this. We met our goal of *saving* money on spin classes with this.

IMO, the ad is cheeseball and poorly executed. But some of the nuances of it that seem to be driving the outrage, I just don't get.

That anxious look on the wife's face? I remember my wife having that same look the first couple of times she tried it. And remember, she's the one that initiated the idea & had to convince me to get on board. These pedals are different than on her road bike - tight, and difficult to get out of. She wasn't sure what to expect from the machine itself - it doesn't freewheel, will it buck her off? Will the whole contraption just go flying out the window if she does something wrong? All understandable first-time anxiety, but none of it driven by me brow-beating her to exercise more, or be fitter/thinner/whatever, or any of the other things that the outrage group seems to be suggesting is happening to the wife in the ad. She *might* have had some potential buyers-remorse anxiety too, since it is a non-trivial many-month, commitment, but I had already become a fan & quite happy with our purchase.

And the super-cheesily-executed part where they say her name? Yeah, in the "live" peloton classes they do that, quite similar to an actual in-studio class. And that works for some people. I remember my late great friend who was a super-fit cyclist & long-distance runner, who had done dozens of marathons all around the world - sometimes he would wear a shirt with just "Jeff" across the chest. He said because when he was in that last quarter of the run and at-risk for mentally hitting the wall, just hearing some stranger in the crowd yell his name would help push him forward. For some, a 30-minute class might be their marathon right now, and having that personal touch may help boost them forward. So yeah, I'm not going to criticize them for trying to include that in the ad, even though their attempt to do so seems poorly-executed.

There is more about the ad, but I've rambled on too much already. Again, I seek to understand those that are outraged from the ad itself, but I'm just not getting it. I personally find it a bit irresponsible for others to so readily jump to some of these "why" conclusions - they seem to be filling in very large gaps with whatever their own biases or anxieties may be - not what is actually being presented in the ad.

But I have to thank those that have contributed to this thread. It's mostly been a good, thought-provking conversation. And with some well-needed humor too. Ryan Reynolds should provide the forum a kickback, because that click-through has pushed me over the edge to try a bottle of that Aviation gin. :)

[Matthew]

I'm offended Geico uses a cartoon gecko. But wait, a real one would animal cruelty. I'm offended I'm not part of the "Chevy family." I'm offended Progressive mimics children of the corn. I'm offended my cologne doesn't magically wisk me away to on exotic locale to swim with Jennifer Lawrence. Pisses me off Arby's has the meats. I'm vegan. As Taylor says, you need to calm down. Maybe she actually asked for the fu&×ing thing. And enjoys using it. And wants to be in better shape. And maybe she does want to lose those last few pounds. I know I'd like to lose a few extra mid season.

[makoti]

BUT..geeez, 75 posts here, the ad was even on NBC news...and altho PelOton is responding, like the anti Rapha 'hate mail', they are getting great exposure and I'll bet their sales sure haven't gone DOWN because of this 'episode'..

BUT, it's an 'ADVERTISEMENT'...gotta look pretty deep for ME to find this or any other ADVERTISEMENT, really, truly 'offensive'...

The ones that make men look like idiots(most are, let's be honest:)), 'could' twist me knickers but..they are ADVERTISEMENTS, not comments on middle east peace or breakthroughs in heart disease treatment..They are talking about an exercise bike fer farge's sake..:eek:

For UBER, right above..agree 100%..


$50K? Chump change..

How about $300,000(read that right..)??:eek:

When I stated the ad was clearly offensive, it was BECAUSE the writing/acting/camera work was bad, not the content. Should have been more clear in my sarcasm.

[Matthew]

They should come out with a new ad where the wife gives her fat slob of a loser husband a peloton to make all those offended feel better about the other ad. See if there is any uproar over that one.

[AngryScientist]

Some good discussion, but i think we've reached the end of the line on this one.

cheers.