Xmas thread about Amazon returns

[oldpotatoe]

Since it's the 'season', and I didnt know this..
NOT a discussion about online buying VS local..this for something I couldn't find locally.

BUT, ordered wrong ones(kid proof cases for ipad minis)..from amazon(1 day delivery, free)..wrong model. Return process started, bar code thing sent and...

return to any WholeFoods..what?? Pretty amazing, IMHO..No wonder brick and mortar is having a hard time..this is easier than returning something to Dillards.

[Elefantino]

We have a UPS store near the grocery store. We slap a return label on the box and drop it off. (There's also a Whole Foods about a mile away!)

Amazon makes it too easy.

[AngryScientist]

yea, they have some deal with whole foods.

if you shop there and show them your prime membership you get some WF discount too.

also, many of the WF around here have Amazon "lockers" where you can have stuff delivered to if you dont have secure place to take delivery. something to consider in "porch pirate" season/.

[Gsinill]

yea, they have some deal with whole foods.

if you shop there and show them your prime membership you get some WF discount too.

also, many of the WF around here have Amazon "lockers" where you can have stuff delivered to if you dont have secure place to take delivery. something to consider in "porch pirate" season/.

They own WF ;)

[rccardr]

They also have a deal with Kohl's.
Don't even have to wrap or box the returned item, just go to Customer Service. They bag, wrap and tag it, give you a receipt.
Boom.

[AngryScientist]

They own WF ;)

ha i forgot about that.

[tbike4]

Plus if you return to Kohl's they give you a 25% off coupon. Last week I made a return there and got a gift for the wife. Kohl's figures you are in the store already so buy something!!!

UPS store is just as easy for me since it is close by as well. I have used Amazon locker to pick up items when traveling since I do not always know where I will be on the day /time the package will arrive.

I had no idea how many people shop at Amazon until yesterday I was expecting a package, Castelli bibs- :) and my phone says it's 4 stops away. I went outside to meet the driver expecting him to hand me my package. It looked like he had deliveries for 1/3 of the condos where I live. :eek:

[makoti]

yea, they have some deal with whole foods.
.

They do, since they own them.

[Bentley]

That’s the deal

yea, they have some deal with whole foods.

if you shop there and show them your prime membership you get some WF discount too.

also, many of the WF around here have Amazon "lockers" where you can have stuff delivered to if you dont have secure place to take delivery. something to consider in "porch pirate" season/.

[Rpoole8537]

My wife recently ordered the wrong item and they did not charge for return shipping! Competition! I live in the middle of two small towns. It’s often difficult to find things locally. We do have a nice hardware and a locally owned lumber yard. But, for other things Amazon saves me time and money and I use prime.

[mulp]

Amazon has made returning so easy, sometimes I even feel guilty how easy it is.

[jc031699]

Since it's the 'season', and I didnt know this..

NOT a discussion about online buying VS local..this for something I couldn't find locally.



BUT, ordered wrong ones(kid proof cases for ipad minis)..from amazon(1 day delivery, free)..wrong model. Return process started, bar code thing sent and...



return to any WholeFoods..what?? Pretty amazing, IMHO..No wonder brick and mortar is having a hard time..this is easier than returning something to Dillards.



Kohl’s now too
Oops late to the party


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dancinkozmo]

whole foods=whole paycheck

[likebikes]

so does amazon own whole foods or something? it's a little unclear from the comments in the thread

[theboucher]

Always good to think about all the people who were exploited (https://nypost.com/2019/07/13/inside-the-hellish-workday-of-an-amazon-warehouse-employee/) along the way to make things easy for you when you shop at Amazon.

[shinomaster]

Unsubscribe from Amazon, as they are ruining our society.

[oldpotatoe]

Unsubscribe from Amazon, as they are ruining our society.

HA..as for who owns WF, Bezos owns both Amazon and WholeFoods.

Gotta ask how is Amazon "ruining 'our society'"...getting the popcorn.
Bet 'they' said the same thing when they first opened 'Super Markets'...
Buying via the internet has been around as long as the internet. There are plenty of things that may or may not be 'ruining our society', but Amazon ain't one of them, IMHO..
I’m not sure that Amazon is ruining our society but they are changing expectations and challenging the norm.

Absolutely..like oh so many movers and shapers in our history..like Henry Ford, like Andrew Carnegie, Bill gates, Steve Jobs, many others.

[madsciencenow]

I’m not sure that Amazon is ruining our society but they are changing expectations and challenging the norm.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[woolly]

For some returns I've seen it even easier that stated above. Start the return online, take the item to the local UPS store, collect receipt, done. Done even have to pack/box & label it, just hand them the item & let them scan your return code.

[shinomaster]

HA..as for who owns WF, Bezos owns both Amazon and WholeFoods.

Gotta ask how is Amazon "ruining 'our society'"...getting the popcorn.
Bet 'they' said the same thing when they first opened 'Super Markets'...
Buying via the internet has been around as long as the internet. There are plenty of things that may or may not be 'ruining our society', but Amazon ain't one of them, IMHO..


Absolutely..like oh so many movers and shapers in our history..like Henry Ford, like Andrew Carnegie, Bill gates, Steve Jobs, many others.




Maybe not society (yet), they have ruined brick and mortar retail and local economies and businesses and it will only get worse. Who doesn't like to walk into a store? Think of all the small towns Walmart has ruined. Plus they pay their employees terrible wages and they work in terrible warehouses filling your orders. AND, where does all the money go? Jeff Bezos. does he pay proper taxes? No. Does any of this commerce help your local economy? No. Wake up. Amazon is bad for America! Mail order used to be a thing when you couldn't find what you needed in your small town locally, like a Camagnolo group for example. Now it's just the norm to shop on a phone. Every day an Ontrack truck drops off packages at my neighbors house. How lazy. Like they can't stop at the local pet store to pick up dog food? No they get it delivered from Amazon. That sucks imho. I worked in a retail gallery for 20 years and watched all the business in Downtown basically close due to the World Wide Web.. It's sad.

[oldpotatoe]

Maybe not society (yet), they have ruined brick and mortar retail and local economies and businesses and it will only get worse. Who doesn't like to walk into a store? Think of all the small towns Walmart has ruined. Plus they pay their employees terrible wages and they work in terrible warehouses filling your orders. AND, where does all the money go? Jeff Bezos. does he pay proper taxes? No. Does any of this commerce help your local economy? No. Wake up. Amazon is bad for America! Mail order used to be a thing when you couldn't find what you needed in your small town locally, like a Campagnolo group for example. Now it's just the norm to shop on a phone. Every day an Ontrack truck drops off packages at my neighbors house. How lazy. Like they can't stop at the local pet store to pick up dog food? No they get it delivered from Amazon. That sucks imho. I worked in a retail gallery for 20 years and watched all the business in Downtown basically close due to the World Wide Web.. It's sad.

Nice rant BUT...

It's fine to single out Amazon but they aren't alone in this internet buying age. Taxes...Amazon isn't unique in this regard. What kind of computer are you using right now? THAT company pays little to no taxes too.
Is this rant about Wallmart or other big box stores or about online retailers?

Treat their employees poorly with low wages and awful conditions? Unemployment is lower that what is considered ‘full employment’ for a while. If the conditions are THAT bad, quit and find another job. ‘Work in terrible warehouses’, think you are indulging in a little inter web ‘fake news’(?) Have you ever been in an Amazon warehouse or personally talked to a Amazon warehouse employee?
QUOTE]basically close due to the World Wide Web.. It's sad[/QUOTE]

It IS the norm. Any retail anything that hasn't figured out how to use the internet for sales is going to be left behind.

I guess you had better slam almost every retailer in America then...Like it or not, it is the new reality.

[FlashUNC]

Plenty out there about how working in an Amazon warehouse is. It ain't great.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/time.com/5629233/amazon-warehouse-employee-treatment-robots/%3famp=true

https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/16/20696154/amazon-prime-day-2019-strike-warehouse-workers-inhumane-conditions-the-rate-productivity

https://www.businessinsider.com/amazon-employees-describe-peak-2019-2

And that's just 2019 stuff.

But sure, if there's anyone who needs defending it's the richest man on the planet.

[theboucher]

Nice rant BUT...

It's fine to single out Amazon but they aren't alone in this internet buying age. Taxes...Amazon isn't unique in this regard. What kind of computer are you using right now? THAT company pays little to no taxes too.
Is this rant about Wallmart or other big box stores or about online retailers?

Treat their employees poorly with low wages and awful conditions? Unemployment is lower that what is considered ‘full employment’ for a while. If the conditions are THAT bad, quit and find another job. ‘Work in terrible warehouses’, think you are indulging in a little inter web ‘fake news’(?) Have you ever been in an Amazon warehouse or personally talked to a Amazon warehouse employee?

It IS the norm. Any retail anything that hasn't figured out how to use the internet for sales is going to be left behind.

I guess you had better slam almost every retailer in America then...Like it or not, it is the new reality.


OK boomer.

I have spoken to people who work in Amazon's warehouses. I live in Seattle. It's that bad. You're out of touch.

[William]

OK boomer.

I have spoken to people who work in Amazon's warehouses. I live in Seattle. It's that bad. You're out of touch.


We aren't going to start with the name calling, you can make your point without it.





W.

[oldpotatoe]

OK boomer.

I have spoken to people who work in Amazon's warehouses. I live in Seattle. It's that bad. You're out of touch.

"I have read articles on the interweb and it's put comment here........

Seattle unemployment is 3.3%..Why don't these people go find another job if it's that bad?
I'm not trying to defend Bezos but like a lot of things, 'amazon/wallmart/putnameofbigretailer/manufacturerhere 'is ruining american society' smacks of ignorance rather than what is actually happening. In this capitalist society, if any retailer/manufacturer is THAT evil, is THAT bad, they would go under.
Why is Amazon successful?
If they are evil, what do you suggest? How does those who live on 'main street USA' afford toilet paper and tshirts when they are much more expensive, on their working poor wages?

My mother in law lived in Holly CO, if it wasn't for Wallmart in Lamar and places like Amazon, these rural farm and ranch workers, many of who work other jobs to make ends meet, would be in real trouble..it ain't Seattle.
The median household income in Holly CO., is $32,500, which is 48% lower than than the Colorado average and 41% lower than than the national average.

Had to look up 'boomer'..'baby boomer'?...don't see that as derogatory...I guess with a few more years under your belt, maybe someplace else except the rarified atmosphere of Seattle...I like luddite/cumudgeon more..look them up on yer 'puter'...:)

[Black Dog]

Maybe a real solution that works and has the data to back it up that is independent of the ideology that supports or rejects it is to raise the minimum wage and end some of the servitude of the working poor. A rising tide raises all ships etc... Since the maximum wage has been gone for a long time with the end of real progressive taxation on high income perhaps it's time to extend the windfall to those at the other end. Look at the progressive tax rates when the USA was at it peak in terms of wide speed prosperity during the post war boom. It will surprise many.

[tuscanyswe]

I dont think i have ever shopped from amazon but i might have since i do shop online a lot and may have forgotten. I dont intend to start either. Its a company i cant support.

[William]

Had to look up 'boomer'..'baby boomer'?...don't see that as derogatory...I guess with a few more years under your belt, maybe someplace else except the rarified atmosphere of Seattle...I like luddite/cumudgeon more..look them up on yer 'puter'...:)

It is the latest slang term generally used to denote a crotchety/intollerant/maybe even racist older person.

Unless you were being called a male kangaroo, but I don't think that was the intent.:)







W.

[Blown Reek]

Haven't Boomers been calling themselves Boomers forever? You can't call a Boomer a Snowflake, because that's reserved for the younger folks who Boomers refer to as such. Maybe Boomers are the real Snowflakes. Ugh. My head hurts.

[William]

Haven't Boomers been calling themselves Boomers forever? You can't call a Boomer a Snowflake, because that's reserved for the younger folks who Boomers refer to as such. Maybe Boomers are the real Snowflakes. Ugh. My head hurts.

Have you blown a reek???:banana: Is that like blowing a gasket?






W.

[unterhausen]

I'm certainly concerned about Amazon taking over, but then again, I buy from them all the time. If there is a reasonable local alternative, like there is with bike shops, I go there. Retail is getting it from both ends, they are being damaged by the internet and also from the finance industry slash and burn techniques.

[tuscanyswe]

I'm certainly concerned about Amazon taking over, but then again, I buy from them all the time. If there is a reasonable local alternative, like there is with bike shops, I go there. Retail is getting it from both ends, they are being damaged by the internet and also from the finance industry slash and burn techniques.

Its a bit like the chicken and the egg.

If one buys from them the reasonable local alternative will be less and less likely to exist in the long run.

[peanutgallery]

Amazon is killing regular big retail...after big retail ate local retail. Walmart, target and Kohl's are in a gutter fight with them. Next up is UPS and FedEx. Be fun to watch and the consumer will benefit

That being said, Jeff Bezos is the worst ski boot fitter that ever walked the earth. Because of Amazon/Ebay, specialty retail is going to be just fine. If you want knowledge etc, you still have to find it and pay for it. If you want a new toaster oven, Amazon works great. Skis?? Not so much. Is Amazon a market disruptor? Absolutely, but only for specialty retail joints that are not master of their domain. Pay too much for your storefront and not enough for your help? Just got catapulted out of a Tony Robbins seminar? You're going to suffer

[BobbyJones]

Amazon is killing regular big retail...after big retail ate local retail. Walmart, target and Kohl's are in a gutter fight with them. Next up is UPS and FedEx. Be fun to watch and the consumer will benefit


The consumer really only benefits in the short term, depending on what you consider benefits.

Does anyone wonder how this is all going to shake out?

Throughout American history, there have been dominant players that have shifted and shaped the future of our society, but often times something different / better comes along and they fall by the wayside.

Oftentimes, people get what they deserve. Or want.

The next 20 years should be interesting.

[peanutgallery]

Amazon might find out that they're a pretty good website that sells stuff. Maybe not so good at brick and mortar or delivery of the stuff that they sell

Does anyone wonder how this is all going to shake out?

Throughout American history, there have been dominant players that have shifted and shaped the future of our society, but often times something different / better comes along and they fall by the wayside.

Oftentimes, people get what they deserve. Or want.

The next 20 years should be interesting.

[FlashUNC]

"I have read articles on the interweb and it's put comment here........

Seattle unemployment is 3.3%..Why don't these people go find another job if it's that bad?
I'm not trying to defend Bezos but like a lot of things, 'amazon/wallmart/putnameofbigretailer/manufacturerhere 'is ruining american society' smacks of ignorance rather than what is actually happening. In this capitalist society, if any retailer/manufacturer is THAT evil, is THAT bad, they would go under.
Why is Amazon successful?
If they are evil, what do you suggest? How does those who live on 'main street USA' afford toilet paper and tshirts when they are much more expensive, on their working poor wages?

My mother in law lived in Holly CO, if it wasn't for Wallmart in Lamar and places like Amazon, these rural farm and ranch workers, many of who work other jobs to make ends meet, would be in real trouble..it ain't Seattle.


Had to look up 'boomer'..'baby boomer'?...don't see that as derogatory...I guess with a few more years under your belt, maybe someplace else except the rarified atmosphere of Seattle...I like luddite/cumudgeon more..look them up on yer 'puter'...:)

Amazon's Nationwide distribution centers and their appalling working conditions have little to do with the unemployment in the city that houses the corporate headquarters.

[oldpotatoe]

Amazon is killing regular big retail...after big retail ate local retail. Walmart, target and Kohl's are in a gutter fight with them. Next up is UPS and FedEx. Be fun to watch and the consumer will benefit

That being said, Jeff Bezos is the worst ski boot fitter that ever walked the earth. Because of Amazon/Ebay, specialty retail is going to be just fine. If you want knowledge etc, you still have to find it and pay for it. If you want a new toaster oven, Amazon works great. Skis?? Not so much. Is Amazon a market disruptor? Absolutely, but only for specialty retail joints that are not master of their domain. Pay too much for your storefront and not enough for your help? Just got catapulted out of a Tony Robbins seminar? You're going to suffer

Disagree. The INTERNET is killing big and small retail. I just did some internet/Xmas shopping.
Amazon, RedBubble, LEGO, CheapAsDirt, ATI, and....EBAY..

Local places didn't have the Legos I wanted, the Ruger 1022 gizmo, the Mossberg stock, the SuperHero T-Shirts, the Japanese marker set or the small Japanese purse for my daughter in law....
Small, local retail is failing in some ways as much as big, internet retail is succeeding...

Yes, speciality retail, the smart ones, will adapt and be just fine.

As far as those who transport this stuff..UPS and FedEx will be fine..
Amazon's Nationwide distribution centers and their appalling working conditions have little to do with the unemployment in the city that houses the corporate headquarters.

??Like I said, if the working conditions are 'appalling' at Amazon, then in Seattle, where there are jobs everywhere to be had, those people that are treated so badly can move to another job..If the unemployment was 10%, and it's all they could find, would be one thing but.....

[FlashUNC]

Amazon is in a lot more places than Seattle, particularly distribution centers with local economies that are nowhere near as dynamic and varied as Seattle. To hang the argument on Seattle's unemployment rate paints an incomplete picture of their massive workforce.

There's more than enough reading about how the warehouses are terrible workspaces. Read any of the links I posted earlier.

[oldpotatoe]

Amazon is in a lot more places than Seattle, particularly distribution centers with local economies that are nowhere near as dynamic and varied as Seattle. To hang the argument on Seattle's unemployment rate paints an incomplete picture of their massive workforce.

There's more than enough reading about how the warehouses are terrible workspaces. Read any of the links I posted earlier.

I only mentioned Seattle cuz 'theboucher' did...

I've read some..some 'may' be accurate and some 'may' be clouded by some personal issue the individual had.
I'm a current Amazon employee and I think the dude that wrote you that email was full of ****. This is a competitive culture and unlike companies with huge funding reserves or incredibly high margin business models, Amazon is at heart a retail company where margins are slim by the nature of our business. On account of that we need to work hard: people who can't compete are weeded out the same way they are in any other highly competitive company. Amazon's demonstrated success and explosive growth are indicative of our success in our corporate culture. It seems like this person wasn't cutting it.

That being said, what I've found from working here is that the culture is output oriented. If you are demonstrating success and getting your work done at a high level, they are actually extremely flexible about hours and I've found my quality of life here to be incredibly high. I work hard, certainly, but I also have a well balanced life and I love my job. I've also worked at Facebook and Google and this is by far the most rewarding and enjoyable job I've ever had.
Something that really surprised me was the large variety of people who started there. I met everyone from those who were aimless and just worked here seasonally to make some money then went back to doing nothing or bouncing around between other low paying jobs to people who were highly qualified professionals.
I finally left Amazon after it became clear that I would have to work 7-10 years just to get to the level at which I should have been hired.

https://gawker.com/amazon-insiders-tell-the-good-the-bad-and-the-ugly-1570866439

Kinda like the press Nike has gotten and still gets. I know a guy who works at the beaverton Campus, he's seen the Chinese factories first hand..the reporting is a little 'off', according to him.

Ya know, I'll bet your first day at Burger King ain't great either.

[tuscanyswe]

I only mentioned Seattle cuz 'theboucher' did...

I've read some..some 'may' be accurate and some 'may' be clouded by some personal issue the individual had.




https://gawker.com/amazon-insiders-tell-the-good-the-bad-and-the-ugly-1570866439

Kinda like the press Nike has gotten and still gets. I know a guy who works at the beaverton Campus, he's seen the Chinese factories first hand..the reporting is a little 'off', according to him.

Ya know, I'll bet your first day at Burger King ain't great either.

No its likely not, would you support that most of the worlds jobs were like Burger king? I sure would not if i could help it.

[FlashUNC]

Ya know, I'll bet your first day at Burger King ain't great either.

Burger King operates a workspace where you don't have to pee in a bucket because the bathroom is too far from your location to make it there and back to keep your rate numbers consistent.

So it ain't great, but you can at least take a leak without having it be detrimental to your job performance.

[zap]

There's more than enough reading about how the warehouses are terrible workspaces. Read any of the links I posted earlier.

Do you have first hand knowledge?

[FlashUNC]

Do you have first hand knowledge?

Ah the oldest way to discredit an argument.

[CMiller]

I don't get how we can slam Amazon for killing local business in the same forum where we talk every week about how local bike shops are shooting themselves in the foot. The issue with bike shops isn't unique, consumers are not just responding to convenience they are also responding to inadequate brick and mortar performance.

Amazon didn't start online shopping, they just did it better than any one else.

And yes - regulate them WAY more.

[kppolich]

Amazon does a lot of things well, but few to none great (AWS, and likely their hassle free returns)

When local business try to compete with Amazon they will lose if they try to beat them at their own game. They need to find 1 thing and simply be better and fill that niche while focusing on their customer base and working to grow that base. That could mean service/support, a great website with Q&A and videos, or in this case- easy returns. Example: I continue to support 2 local bike shops because their service department is always going above and beyond and because they'll also take their time to walk me through something I'm struggling with.

I maybe buy 1 or 2 items a year from Amazon, and it is solely because they have the best price on the new item that I want with 2 day shipping without Prime due to my location close to a fulfillment center.

Amazon warehouse working conditions probably aren't ideal long term. But if it put food on the table and lets you get by for a while go for it. If working in an Amazon warehouse is looking like a long term career for you, i'd try to work with the monster instead of against it.

[CMiller]

When local business try to compete with Amazon they will lose if they try to beat them at their own game. They need to find 1 thing and simply be better and fill that niche while focusing on their customer base and working to grow that base. That could mean service/support, a great website with Q&A and videos, or in this case- easy returns.

Totally agree!

[tctyres]

Just returned some rims that I bought by mistake. I needed MSW but ordered NMSW. Sent them back on my dime, actually 4.98, which isn't bad at all for sending rims back. That's a big box.

The problem comes in with the 20% restocking fee that some third parties charge. No where on the 3rd party website inside Amazon does it say there's a 20% restocking fee.

I feel a bit hoodwinked. :(

[Clean39T]

Amazon has completely changed Seattle, or at least contributed to the rapid change. I'm not here to say for good/bad/otherwise, just noting it based on my trip up there last week. We stayed in a super nice hotel, for a decent price given low demand late in the week, in a part of town that used to be a no-go after dark (or before really), and had an incredible meal in the restaurant that's housed in the 'spheres' that are part of the Amazon campus - https://www.seattlespheres.com/.... It was fun tooling around seeing how the city has changed since I lived/worked/studied there. If you haven't been in a while, go. And don't miss General Porpoise donuts (https://www.gpdoughnuts.com), Yalla (https://www.yallaseattle.com), or SeaWolf Bakers (https://www.seawolfbakers.com) :)

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

[unterhausen]

I don't get how we can slam Amazon for killing local business in the same forum where we talk every week about how local bike shops are shooting themselves in the foot.
funny thing is, when I go on amazon to look at bike parts, my LBS beats them every time. And I think that bike shops are not the kind of retail that Amazon can really kill that easily. I think bike shops are mostly in trouble because nobody wants to ride bikes right now. We need another bike boom. I think the good shops are in decent financial health. It's unfortunate that there fewer good shops than there should be.

[jtbadge]

Amazon is a terrible, terrible company, latest evidence:

The Atlantic: Ruthless Quotas at Amazon Are Maiming Employees
(https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2019/11/amazon-warehouse-reports-show-worker-injuries/602530/?fbclid=IwAR0KXwK2th8jpu8MVmtG5p6NXyzYAUM87NWFjq4Y lvguBCzsP9sqCx5cGs4)

"The expectations were precise. He had to pick 385 small items or 350 medium items each hour. One week, he was hitting 98.45 percent of his expected rate, but that wasn’t good enough. That 1.55 percent speed shortfall earned him his final written warning—the last one before termination."

"The company does instruct workers on the safe way to move their bodies and handle equipment. But several former workers said they had to break the safety rules to keep up. They would jump or stretch to reach a top rack instead of using a stepladder. They would twist and bend over to grab boxes instead of taking time to squat and lift with their legs. They would hoist extra-heavy items alone to avoid wasting time getting help. They had to, they said, or they would lose their jobs. So they took the risk.

Then, if they got hurt, they would lose their jobs anyway."

[Clean39T]

Amazon is a terrible, terrible company, latest evidence:

The Atlantic: Ruthless Quotas at Amazon Are Maiming Employees
(https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2019/11/amazon-warehouse-reports-show-worker-injuries/602530/?fbclid=IwAR0KXwK2th8jpu8MVmtG5p6NXyzYAUM87NWFjq4Y lvguBCzsP9sqCx5cGs4)

"The expectations were precise. He had to pick 385 small items or 350 medium items each hour. One week, he was hitting 98.45 percent of his expected rate, but that wasn’t good enough. That 1.55 percent speed shortfall earned him his final written warning—the last one before termination."

"The company does instruct workers on the safe way to move their bodies and handle equipment. But several former workers said they had to break the safety rules to keep up. They would jump or stretch to reach a top rack instead of using a stepladder. They would twist and bend over to grab boxes instead of taking time to squat and lift with their legs. They would hoist extra-heavy items alone to avoid wasting time getting help. They had to, they said, or they would lose their jobs. So they took the risk.

Then, if they got hurt, they would lose their jobs anyway."

While I don't doubt there is truthiness in that story, journalists in these times have been known to write what sells (gets clicks) --- and while I don't have any first-hand knowledge of any of this, I've read enough articles about the energy industry (what I do know about), from very reputable outlets, to know that the truth is almost universally stretched to fit the narrative that gets the story (and thereby the advertising dollars and palmares for the author) where it needs to be....

With everything, a grain of salt.

[tctyres]

Meanwhile, off topic
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-50556485
https://www.cnn.com/2019/11/19/business/allbirds-amazon-scrutiny/index.html

[415km]

I don't shop at Amazon and never will. Jeff Bezos is one of the richest people in the world and treats his employees in many ways I don't agree with.
I can shop local or order online from business that treat their employees better. Rivendell is a good example, they take good care of their employees and I'm happy to spend money with them. Of course there are possibly problems with some of their suppliers but as a consumer I can try to put my money where my mind and heart are. Not going to solve it all but I'm voting with my money what business model I want to support. The race to the bottom in retail is good for no one except the billionaire elite.
Personally I try to buy much less stuff in the face of the Amazon/super consumer movement. It's all future garbage anyways.
Give you and your family the gifts of time with each other and time outside.
Just my thoughts.....I know everyone won't agree and that's ok.

[shinomaster]

??Like I said, if the working conditions are 'appalling' at Amazon, then in Seattle, where there are jobs everywhere to be had, those people that are treated so badly can move to another job..If the unemployment was 10%, and it's all they could find, would be one thing but.....



Have you ever lived paycheck to paycheck? Have you ever been so trapped and stuck in a dead end job you have a hard time looking because you are too exhausted at the end of the day? It's demoralizing. You sound like the classic Republican; pull yourself up by your boot straps". Not everyone can do this. You seem to be unable to imagine that Amazon might fact be a terrible place in which to work. Some of these employees will of course leave and have- hence the stories of horrid conditions, but that's not the point. Why should they have to? Why can't Jeff make a decent, safe warehouse job? The simple answer is the bottom line. To be super-competitive he has to make his employees do a tremendous amount of work in a short period of time ( eventually robots will do this). If he's gonna run other companies out of business with lower prices, the saving have to come from someplace, right? Have you read about the industrial revolution? We're getting back to that place, and sadly after all the progress made in the last century.

[oldpotatoe]

Have you ever lived paycheck to paycheck? Have you ever been so trapped and stuck in a dead end job you have a hard time looking because you are too exhausted at the end of the day? It's demoralizing. You sound like the classic Republican; pull yourself up by your boot straps". Not everyone can do this. You seem to be unable to imagine that Amazon might fact be a terrible place in which to work. Some of these employees will of course leave and have- hence the stories of horrid conditions, but that's not the point. Why should they have to? Why can't Jeff make a decent, safe warehouse job? The simple answer is the bottom line. To be super-competitive he has to make his employees do a tremendous amount of work in a short period of time ( eventually robots will do this). If he's gonna run other companies out of business with lower prices, the saving have to come from someplace, right? Have you read about the industrial revolution? We're getting back to that place, and sadly after all the progress made in the last century.

Yes I have, during the entire time I was in college. Not stuck tho...on the way to something else.

You are not even close on my political leanings..to throw that one out there smacks of ignorance based on a few posts on a bike forum.

I've worked in a warehouse and it was big, poorly lit and cold..

I think you are singling out one guy cuz he's the biggest guy on the block that owns this huge business..not everybody 'hates' amazon, not every employee, not every retail customer. I've never been in a Amazon warehouse and I suspect neither have you. Could it be better? EVERY entry level job could be 'better'.

What kinda car do you drive, what kind of computer?..THOSE CEOs/owners ALSO control lots of big warehouses, pay poor wages, have 'terrible' working conditions and make many, many, MANY times more $ than their employees. Buy any stuff made in Asia? Start there.

As I said before, I am commenting on this internet heavy retail age..NOT on amazon or WM specifically.

Industrial Revolution? One of the things that came out of that was Unionization..I'm a BIG fan of that. I know that doesn't fit into your 'you sound like a republican', but Bezos isn't going to make big changes until he's forced to. You and a small % of people not using Amazon isn't going to do anything. Unionizing would..why haven't they? I suspect that if 90% of the USA warehouse workforce walked off the job during this black friday/WE, I'll bet it would get Bezos' attention...

https://theconcourse.deadspin.com/theres-never-been-a-better-time-to-unionize-amazon-1791126362

I get that you don't like Amazon and WallMart but don't start throwing 'you sound like a republican'..that's BS and outta line.

[peanutgallery]

I like it better when we argue about drilling holes in stems or cantilever vs disc

[killerrabbit]

I don't shop at Amazon and never will. Jeff Bezos is one of the richest people in the world and treats his employees in many ways I don't agree with.
I can shop local or order online from business that treat their employees better. Rivendell is a good example, they take good care of their employees and I'm happy to spend money with them. Of course there are possibly problems with some of their suppliers but as a consumer I can try to put my money where my mind and heart are. Not going to solve it all but I'm voting with my money what business model I want to support. The race to the bottom in retail is good for no one except the billionaire elite.
Personally I try to buy much less stuff in the face of the Amazon/super consumer movement. It's all future garbage anyways.
Give you and your family the gifts of time with each other and time outside.
Just my thoughts.....I know everyone won't agree and that's ok.

True that.

[tbike4]

Just in time for the holiday. This might chill out anyone that is wound too tight, in as little as 2 minutes. I'll take mine on mashed potatoes please.

https://kivaconfections.com/news/turkey-gravy

[FlashUNC]

Unionizing would..why haven't they? I suspect that if 90% of the USA warehouse workforce walked off the job during this black friday/WE, I'll bet it would get Bezos' attention...



1) Right to work states and the weakening of collective bargaining power over the last 50 years has made unionizing really, really hard and nigh impossible in many states, including not coincidentally places where Amazon has a lot of distribution centers.

2) People don't walk off because in some cases they cannot afford to. What happens when they walk off, Bezos cuts the warehouse staff loose and hires a new batch of people to go walk 20 miles a day on concrete? Let's not act like everyone participated in the coal miner or railroad strikes. Its a real sacrifice to step out of line, economically, socially and even physically. Some people don't feel comfortable doing that, nor should they have to.

[BobbyJones]

This thread had gotten me a little more curious so I did some internet poking around.

I found this read to be interesting and free from news sensationalism:
http://amazonemancipatory.com/

[zap]

edit

This thread had gotten me a little more curious so I did some internet poking around.

This thread brought back some memories. I worked on a production floor and stock room (started just above minimum wage) for a few years while I went to college at night.

The linked complaints are all too familiar and far from unique. A few may be legit.......supervisors who suck are a dime a dozen. The larger a business becomes the more difficult it is to manage.

[zetroc]

The death of retail is a huge, complex problem with numerous factors, of which the rise of Amazon is certainly a contributor.

But small businesses are also getting crushed in the vise of high housing costs for employees, which leads to wage pressures and high turnover. High housing costs (read: high land prices) go hand in hand with high prices for commercial real estate, which means higher rents and more retail vacancies. More and more this is a byproduct of consolidation in property holdings as large companies like Blackstone become owners of vast numbers of buildings across the country.

There isn't one solution, but it's naive to say that businesses are solely responsible for their own destinies and are doing commerce wrong. That's definitely not true in every case.

[Black Dog]

The death of retail is a huge, complex problem with numerous factors, of which the rise of Amazon is certainly a contributor.

But small businesses are also getting crushed in the vise of high housing costs for employees, which leads to wage pressures and high turnover. High housing costs (read: high land prices) go hand in hand with high prices for commercial real estate, which means higher rents and more retail vacancies. More and more this is a byproduct of consolidation in property holdings as large companies like Blackstone become owners of vast numbers of buildings across the country.

There isn't one solution, but it's naive to say that businesses are solely responsible for their own destinies and are doing commerce wrong. That's definitely not true in every case.

High commercial rent is a huge business killer. At some point the rent will have to be driven down when there is a glut of vacancies. Running a storefront is so hard with the rent overhead. This also presses down hard on wages as stores have a hard time paying decent wages when margins are razor thin and overhead is heavy. Crazy cycle.

[shinomaster]

I get that you don't like Amazon and WallMart but don't start throwing 'you sound like a republican'..that's BS and outta line.


You sir, are correct, and I owe you a big apology. I am truly sorry I was a jerk last night. I was all fired up, I am so full of despair over how the GOP has hijacked this country and deregulated everything they possibly can. And of course who suffers? The little people, the environment, animals, you name it. It's illegal to film what goes on in slaughter houses in some states. They are passing laws that will let them regulate themselves, just like in olden times. THe Jungle comes to mind.. Business can't regulate themselves when billions of dollars are at stake. Corruption is and always has been in human DNA. Power corrupts... Trump seemingly wants to undo any good thing Obama ever did just to be mean it would seem. Mitch McConnell is trying to re-brand Social security as an "entitlement" so they can take it away to pay for tax cuts on the super rich. I guess I see Jeff Bezos aligned with this mentality even if he doesn't know it yet. Amazon is growing and when will it end? I used to like Amazon and was a member but I saw something in it which seemed wrong to me, and so now I spend my money locally whenever possible. Fortunately I can do that in Portland still. FWIW I don't own a car and am using a 8 year old Lenovo laptop. I guess Asian assembly lines are expected to be sweat shops. I think we Americans are ruing the days when we sent all of out technology to China to save some bucks. How short sighted.
I guarantee that there are all kinds of people working in Amazon warehouses, not just kids right out of high school. Comparing an American job on American soil to a Chinese assembly line, isn't really fair imho. We are supposed to be better than that, at least we were for a while. Happy Thanksgiving. And peace.

[oldpotatoe]

You sir, are correct, and I owe you a big apology. I am truly sorry I was a jerk last night. I was all fired up, I am so full of despair over how the GOP has hijacked this country and deregulated everything they possibly can. And of course who suffers? The little people, the environment, animals, you name it. It's illegal to film what goes on in slaughter houses in some states. They are passing laws that will let them regulate themselves, just like in olden times. THe Jungle comes to mind.. Business can't regulate themselves when billions of dollars are at stake. Corruption is and always has been in human DNA. Power corrupts... Trump seemingly wants to undo any good thing Obama ever did just to be mean it would seem. Mitch McConnell is trying to re-brand Social security as an "entitlement" so they can take it away to pay for tax cuts on the super rich. I guess I see Jeff Bezos aligned with this mentality even if he doesn't know it yet. Amazon is growing and when will it end? I used to like Amazon and was a member but I saw something in it which seemed wrong to me, and so now I spend my money locally whenever possible. Fortunately I can do that in Portland still. FWIW I don't own a car and am using a 8 year old Lenovo laptop. I guess Asian assembly lines are expected to be sweat shops. I think we Americans are ruing the days when we sent all of out technology to China to save some bucks. How short sighted.
I guarantee that there are all kinds of people working in Amazon warehouses, not just kids right out of high school. Comparing an American job on American soil to a Chinese assembly line, isn't really fair imho. We are supposed to be better than that, at least we were for a while. Happy Thanksgiving. And peace.

No worries and I share your angst over the things you mentioned above. Very scary and depressing times these..much more so than in the last 2 crisis I was around for..VietNam and the Great Recession...

I was wrong in 2016, maybe I'll be wrong in 2020 but I think voter turnout and a recorded 'history', a track record, of the guy in the big chair will be his undoing..hope so.

Apology accepted, no worries and peace to you as well.