Serotta or Not?

[oliver1850]

Been looking at this trying to decide what the heck it is:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/323979480769?ul_noapp=true

Seller seemed pretty sure that his father-in-law bought it new in the late 90s. Decal style and split cable stops fit with that era, but none of the other frame details say Serotta for me. I had Dave Kirk look at it and he thought it might be a Davis Phinney that's been updated and repainted. It does appear that the left chainstay is curved and the right is not, but all the Phinneys that I have seen have Campagnolo dropouts and the normal round Serotta brake bridge. This frame has a Silva brake bridge, and I suspect that the dropouts may be Silva as well. BB is English threaded, no typical Serotta serial number as far as the seller can tell. He hasn't pulled the fork.

Looks like a nice frame but I don't think it's a Serotta.

[e-RICHIE]

Those frame parts are lugs I designed for Takahashi Press in 1982.
I don't think Ben used these in house.
PS The seller has a beautiful living room built in bookcase.

ps

arrange disorder

:):):p
:):):p
:cool:;);)

[Ken Robb]

Been looking at this trying to decide what the heck it is:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/323979480769?ul_noapp=true

Seller seemed pretty sure that his father-in-law bought it new in the late 90s. Decal style and split cable stops fit with that era, but none of the other frame details say Serotta for me. I had Dave Kirk look at it and he thought it might be a Davis Phinney that's been updated and repainted. It does appear that the left chainstay is curved and the right is not, but all the Phinneys that I have seen have Campagnolo dropouts and the normal round Serotta brake bridge. This frame has a Silva brake bridge, and I suspect that the dropouts may be Silva as well. BB is English threaded, no typical Serotta serial number as far as the seller can tell. He hasn't pulled the fork.

Looks like a nice frame but I don't think it's a Serotta.

Is it your size?

[oliver1850]

Is it your size?

More or less, but even experienced cyclists don't measure accurately so it's the usual crap shoot.

[oliver1850]

Those frame parts are lugs I designed for Takahashi Press in 1982.
I don't think Ben used these in house.
PS The seller has a beautiful living room built in bookcase.

ps

arrange disorder

:):):p
:):):p
:cool:;);)

Thanks Richard. I was admiring the books and shelves as well.

How long were the lugs produced?

[oliver1850]

Those frame parts are lugs I designed for Takahashi Press in 1982.
I don't think Ben used these in house.
PS The seller has a beautiful living room built in bookcase.

ps

arrange disorder

:):):p
:):):p
:cool:;);)

Your post got me thinking about builders who had been at Serotta and Rob Stowe was the first to come to mind. I found this Stowe listing which looks to have the same dropouts as the ebay frame. I can't tell about the seat lug or BB shell.

https://cocosvariety.com/products/robert-stowe-custom-road-bike

[Ken Robb]

More or less, but even experienced cyclists don't measure accurately so it's the usual crap shoot.

I thought it looked a bit small when I enlarged the pix so I could read his tape measure.

[e-RICHIE]

Your post got me thinking about builders who had been at Serotta and Rob Stowe was the first to come to mind. I found this Stowe listing which looks to have the same dropouts as the ebay frame. I can't tell about the seat lug or BB shell.

https://cocosvariety.com/products/robert-stowe-custom-road-bike

I designed the three frame lugs on that frame referenced in the O.P.

ps

arrange disorder

:cool::cool:;)
;):cool::cool:
;):):rolleyes:

[oliver1850]

I designed the three frame lugs on that frame referenced in the O.P.

ps

arrange disorder

:cool::cool:;)
;):cool::cool:
;):):rolleyes:

Were the dropouts your design?

[e-RICHIE]

Were the dropouts your design?

No - not at all. Just the three lugs. And in 1982.

[oliver1850]

I thought it looked a bit small when I enlarged the pix so I could read his tape measure.

It wouldn't be ideal for me but my Match built Paramount is 56 square I think and I'm pretty comfortable riding it - though some would consider the build to be ugly. It's a long way from a fistfull of seatpost and a slammed stem. As long as top tube is in my range, I'll do what's required with the stem height/angle/extension to get myself in a comfortable riding position. That said, my saddle to bar drop varies at least as much as 8 cm among my bikes. I think my KHS 853 has more saddle to bar drop than the Schwinn. Although a "larger" frame, it has a shorter head tube.

[oliver1850]

No - not at all. Just the three lugs. And in 1982.

How long were the lugs available?

I thought the dropouts might be Silva, do you agree?

Really appreciate your input. I don't much of an eye for lug details.

[e-RICHIE]

How long were the lugs available?

I thought the dropouts might be Silva, do you agree?

Really appreciate your input. I don't much of an eye for lug details.

The dropouts are some generic pocketed types that many brands sold despite the parts coming from the same 3-4 casting houses.

[oliver1850]

The dropouts are some generic pocketed types that many brands sold despite the parts coming from the same 3-4 casting houses.

Thanks. That doesn't narrow the possible builders down any but I'm glad that I thought of Stowe and found one of his frames with the same dropouts. I'm going to have to look for some more examples - perhaps I can find another with those dropouts and your lugs.

[Ken Robb]

I thought you were more like me--taller and less flexible. :)

[oliver1850]

I thought you were more like me--taller and less flexible. :)

Some of my bikes would make you think that. I'm not all that tall but have knee pain if my saddle height is not abnormally high. I don't mind more than average saddle to bar drop, within limits.

[David Kirk]

What is the serial number of the bike?

dave