Wheels - pre-built or LBS?

[scottcw2]

I am curious if Paceline members buy their wheels pre-built from an online shop or have them built by their LBS.

What are the pros and cons of each option?

[Gummee]

Neither.

Unless your LBS has 'a wheelbuilder' like Old 'Tater.

*I* don't particularly like to spend the time building custom wheels for customers 'cause that's a few hours that can be spent on tune-ups that make more $$ for the shop.

Building custom wheels for me? That's different 'cause it's MY time, not shop time. I build wheels for me fairly frequently.

Me? I'd have em order a custom-built wheelset from QBP. The wheels I've ordered thru Q have been great.

HTH

M

[colker]

I like custom built... not for technical reasons but i empathize w/ ideas like one of a kind, hand made, replaceable components etc.. The more mechanical human tuned the bicycle the better it works for me.

[Tony]

I am curious if Paceline members buy their wheels pre-built from an online shop or have them built by their LBS.

What are the pros and cons of each option?

Both. I've had pre built wheels that were very true and some not true at all. Same with wheelbuilders, some true and some not.
I've learned over time that if you find a good wheelbuilder that's the way to go. It may cost more however they seem to stay true longer. There are several good wheelbuilders here one mentioned is Oldpotato.
I've had 9 sets of wheels built by this guy, some in the early ninety's and are still true! https://speeddream.com/about-daves-wheels.html

[Tony T]

I had a set of wheels by a well-known will builder that continually went out of true. I thought the problem was a bad rim, So this got me to try my hand at wheel building. I replaced the rim keeping the spokes and hub, and this went so well that I then build a complete set of wheels myself. This was a great learning experience and I got a lot of help from the guys here with suggestions for books and guides to use.

[ntb1001]

Have and use both...

Absolutely love any Campagnolo built wheel such as Eurus or Shamal, they’ve been bulletproof.
My Zipps have also been problem free.
I’ve also had a couple of pairs of wheels built up at the LBS with Campy Record 10 hubs that also are amazing.



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[echappist]

Both. I've had pre built wheels that were very true and some not true at all. Same with wheelbuilders, some true and some not.
I've learned over time that if you find a good wheelbuilder that's the way to go. It may cost more however they seem to stay true longer. There are several good wheelbuilders here one mentioned is Oldpotato.
I've had 9 sets of wheels built by this guy, some in the early ninety's and are still true! https://speeddream.com/about-daves-wheels.html

+1 to Signore Patata Vecchia. Ergott is another, though I don't think he builds wheels anymore.

The other things with prebuilt is that they may be true, but horribly out of balance when it comes to stress distribution. As such, I prefer to have things hand-built.

These days, I go with hand-built for rear wheels and self-built for fronts.

[Gummee]

I'll add to my earlier comments: Building a wheel isn't rocket science. If you can tune a derailleur, you can true and tension wheels.

Lacing is dirt simple for 2x and 3x no matter what it looks like. The only tricky bit is getting the logo on the hub lined up with the valve hole. ...and that seems to be ~4 spoke holes clockwise from the logo. Appx 2 o'clock as you're looking at the hub.

The first wheels will take for-freaking-ever. Subsequent wheels go faster and faster. One of my mechanics could go from a pile of spokes to a true and evenly tensioned wheelSET in about 30min. Me? Not so much 'cause I don't do it every day like we used to.

M

[zambenini]

Another for both. All my last sets have been custom because you have get exactly what you want (In my case, TB14 rims to purple WI hubs... Count me in. Turquoise Chris Kings to wide carbon Nexties? They rule.) But I would also love some DT Oxics or various Mavic wheels on a road bike, or a set of backup Crossmaxes on my MTB, if they are the right tool for the job.

[Blue Jays]

Both. Enjoy both handbuilts, factory, and hybrid.

My hybrid was replacing a cracked rear Campagnolo Shamal rear with new rim, new Campagnolo proprietary spokes, and expertly built by my superb mechanic. The front remains perfect all these years later.

[mulp]

I've only bought from factory and havent had a problem yet.

[biker72]

I've had one set of wheels built at my LBS. Campy Record hubs that lasted forever...until I sold the wheelset.

Through the years I've purchased 3 sets of Campy Zondas. Absolutely no problems with any of them. The one set I have left is a 2019 rim brake version with a Shimano freewheel.

The potential problem at the LBS is the wheel builder experience level. I know who the best builder is where I work. If I was not familiar with the mechanics at my LBS I'd try one of the builders on this forum.

[makoti]

Handbuilt, but never from LBS, and Enve factory. Most of my HB were done by me & as stated above, basic lacing patterns aren't hard. For a low spoke count set, I had it built by a pro - our own Old Potato

[quickfeet]

I’ve built well more than 200 wheels and still don’t really feel like an expert by any stretch. That being said, if you’re buying something high end, factory wheels are pretty awesome these days. Unless you’re having someone like Tater tot build them it can be hit or miss in my opinion.

[coachboyd]

Ergott is another, though I don't think he builds wheels anymore.



I'm pretty sure he's still building. He's ordering stuff from us still.

[CMiller]

I like custom built... not for technical reasons but i empathize w/ ideas like one of a kind, hand made, replaceable components etc.. The more mechanical human tuned the bicycle the better it works for me.

Same here, a lot of prebuilt wheels are so good now that custom is not the only way to get quality. I build my own now, and really enjoy the process.

[Mark McM]

I am curious if Paceline members buy their wheels pre-built from an online shop or have them built by their LBS.

What are the pros and cons of each option?

The pros of factory built wheels is that they can often be optimized for certain features (such as aerodynamics or weigth) by using proprietary components which have been designed specifically to work together. The downside is that wheels that need to use proprietary components often need special tools to work on (which most shops won't have), and often they can't be repaired at all after the wheels are discontinued by the manufacturer (which is often just a few years) due to parts unavailability.

The pros of handbuilt wheels is that there is often a wider range of customizability, being able to use hubs, rims and spokes selected for a particular application. These parts are more apt to use to use more traditional assembly/interface standards, increasing future maintainability. The downside is that they may not be able to be optimized to the nth degree for performance characteristics such as aerodynamics or weight. Since these wheels are customized, they often won't benefit from economies of scale, and may come at an extra cost over mass produced wheels (however, due to their maintainability, they can often be more economical in the long haul). One caveat here: As hand building wheels is becoming a lost craft, fewer and fewer LBS's have high quality wheel builders on staff, so it may behoove a buyer to go to a wheels specialist.

[Bob Ross]

All of the wheelsets I've ever bought were hand-built by a wheel specialist (Joe Young).

But since every bike I've ever bought came with a set of factory-built wheels, my collection is pretty evenly distributed between the two.

I've never had a set of wheels built by the LBS ...but I've had several sets re-built by the local shops.

[oldpotatoe]

I am curious if Paceline members buy their wheels pre-built from an online shop or have them built by their LBS.

What are the pros and cons of each option?

Haven't read through the entire thread but...
Hand built, assuming you have a great wheel builder at your LBS, will be, should be-
-designed specifically for you and your needs
-will use parts that aren't proprietary, unique to that wheel, that the manufacturer may not support
-those 'parts', being non proprietary, if available, will be cheaper
-the wheel, apples to apples, hub wise, may have a better hub set
-will weigh the same or less
-may cost less.

[oldpotatoe]

Neither.

Unless your LBS has 'a wheelbuilder' like Old 'Tater.

*I* don't particularly like to spend the time building custom wheels for customers 'cause that's a few hours that can be spent on tune-ups that make more $$ for the shop.

Building custom wheels for me? That's different 'cause it's MY time, not shop time. I build wheels for me fairly frequently.

Me? I'd have em order a custom-built wheelset from QBP. The wheels I've ordered thru Q have been great.

HTH

M

Thanks sir for the nice words.
IF you charge for your labor and pretty 'normal' margin on wheel parts, a wheel set is a good $ return for a shop. It took me about 2 hours to build a wheelset(uninterrupted)...we charged $70 per wheel labor. We also charged $150 for a tuneup...plus more $ for hub, spoke, rim...

QBP wheels were pretty good but you'd make more $ if you built them, labor $....:)

Plus, it's fun..enjoyed building wheels more than anything, still do.

[oldpotatoe]

Again, thanks for the nice words by y'all who are happy with my wheels.
Pretty sure Eric(Ergott) still building, he does great work as well.

:)

[deechee]

Have had factory wheels, but lately I just stick to wheels built up by my LBS. Technically he isn't local to me but its the shop I always go to.

Having two powertaps that keep rolling, its easier to change things up by having the shop rebuild them. Also, living in the north east, right now is dead time in the shop so they're happy to work on something that makes the time go by.

[palincss]

I am curious if Paceline members buy their wheels pre-built from an online shop or have them built by their LBS.

What are the pros and cons of each option?

My LBS happens to host a well-known custom wheel builder, Bill Mould (http://billmouldwheels.com/custom-wheels/). There's no way you'd find a set like my most recent pre-built. Front is a 32 hole SONDelux Widebody SL, 650B Pacenti Brevet rim; rear a White Industries MI-5 36 spoke 650B Pacenti Brevet rim. This is top-shelf stuff, basically a state of the art wheel set. The truly remarkable thing is, compared to the top-shelf roadie racing wheels Bill builds, this is a remarkable bargain: under a thousand dollars, when similar cost-no-option wheel sets he builds will, he said, cost two to three times as much.

[bigbill]

I like hand builts. I don't consider my Boyd wheels a factory set, I know actual humans in SC built them. My two Coconinos have wheels built by Steve as part of the deal. He recommends the build and I say "okay". I have a sweet set of potato wheels and a set from RT he built several years ago. I think the days of ordering a frameset and group from the LBS and having them build your wheels are long gone.

[Tony T]

There is something very satisfying riding on wheels that you built yourself :banana:

[teleguy57]

I've built a number of wheels for myself and a few for others. Was satisfying, but not enough that I'll continue to do so. Peter (OldPotatoe) has always done right by me in building/rebuilding quality wheels; I'm sure others who do so professionally and support the forum do as well.

I would ask a lot of questions of an LBS before having them build wheels for me. I don't want to be the customer whose wheels are part of someone's learning process, or who needs to make do with what's in stock or what's easily available.

Also a big fan of Campy factory wheels. Haven't had enough experience with other mfgs to have confidence recommending them.

[Gummee]

I've built a number of wheels for myself and a few for others. Was satisfying, but not enough that I'll continue to do so. Peter (OldPotatoe) has always done right by me in building/rebuilding quality wheels; I'm sure others who do so professionally and support the forum do as well.

I would ask a lot of questions of an LBS before having them build wheels for me. I don't want to be the customer whose wheels are part of someone's learning process, or who needs to make do with what's in stock or what's easily available.

Also a big fan of Campy factory wheels. Haven't had enough experience with other mfgs to have confidence recommending them.

Since Mavic Heliums first came out many moons ago, there've been fewer and fewer people actually building wheels. ...and it shows.

These days? Wheelsouttaboxes are what people want so that's what they go for. Whether wheelsouttaboxes are better is perception or reality, the days of 32/32 O4CD or MA40 wheels are over. ...despite MANY of the people that are riding wheelsouttaboxes needing the old school wheel for various (overweight!) reasons.

M

[teleguy57]

Since Mavic Heliums first came out many moons ago, there've been fewer and fewer people actually building wheels. ...and it shows.

These days? Wheelsouttaboxes are what people want so that's what they go for. Whether wheelsouttaboxes are better is perception or reality, the days of 32/32 O4CD or MA40 wheels are over. ...despite MANY of the people that are riding wheelsouttaboxes needing the old school wheel for various (overweight!) reasons.

M

Yes. My Chisolm's Custom Wheels (https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?p=2459464#post2459464)are Ailerons on Bitex, 32 3x f/r and are pretty much bulletproof. At the same time, my Bora One 35 tubular disc set feels very much the same, as did my rim brake Shamal tubulars... but I don't consider those wheelsouttaboxes but well-designed and built specialty products. And being a princess-and-pea type guy I do believe I could feel the difference between the Nemesis 32x3 on silver Chorus hubs and the Shamals.

[Ralph]

I use 32/32 custom wheels (Record hubs) on my JRA and travel bike. I weigh 155. Figure if I ever break a spoke while in some small town, can always pop into a LBS and get it repaired. Wonder how much longer that will be true? Do most bike shops still carry spokes to fix fairly standard wheels?

[zmalwo]

I rarely weigh more than 170lbs so I've never used any custom build wheels. all my wheels are either Shimano or Campagnolo.

[dancinkozmo]

for anyone in southern ontario, they build great wheels at Dundas Speed Shop.

[vincenz]

I’ve not found or needed a better builder than campy.

[lavi]

All of the wheelsets I've ever bought were hand-built by a wheel specialist (Joe Young).

Snip.




I have a set from Joe Young too. Have had them for over a decade (DT rims and hubs). Unmatched. Only out of vouge now with "old", narrow rim width. Not sure I can actually tell the difference. That said, a reputable local wheel builder should be able to do the same. As others have said, custom is great for getting what YOU want: this rim with this hub with this spoke count and this lacing pattern.

I probably "fit" the bill of sometimes avoiding factory and going with hand built at 6'2" ~190-200 lbs. However, I've been more than fine on many factory wheels. (Campy Shamal, Enve 4.5, Hed Ardennes SL (all in current rotation)(see what I did there)).

Probably no wrong answer.

[soulspinner]

Just call Ole Tater.

[guyintense]

One of my mechanics could go from a pile of spokes to a true and evenly tensioned wheelSET in about 30min. M

wheelSET? That's two wheels? At $50 to $60 a wheel that sounds like a profitable endeavor.

[Gummee]

wheelSET? That's two wheels? At $50 to $60 a wheel that sounds like a profitable endeavor.

Yeah, he could whip em out AND they were round and true.

Rarely had one come back for anything.

I don't remember what we charged, but this was the early 90s at a Performance so probably not enough.

M