Bad luck with SRAM Road Hydraulic?

[proletariandan]

My local shop just told me I have to replace a 2nd SRAM Hydraulic Road shifter because the master cylinder failed - both were unfortunately bought used, which I'm not doing again.

Am I just particularly unlucky or have other folks had similar issues? One of the reasons I switched to Hydraulic is because I thought it was more reliable but so far that isn't proving true...

Thanks,
Dan

[bikinchris]

I have had some fail in the shop. SRAM is good about warranty, but only to the original owner.

[rnhood]

If you want reliability stick with Shimano.

[R3awak3n]

If you want reliability stick with Shimano.

lol. read that post about the trip to Scotland and how he is on his second or third shimano hydro live or caliper or something.


Sram is very reliable, I have etap hydro for a couple thousand miles now (and the guy before me had it for a few two... been great. Also force so far has been flawless. Tons and tons of people running sram hydro with little to no problems.

[Clancy]

If you want reliability stick with Shimano.

Very broad statement. I’ve seen Shimano components fail.

Do you have faith in the shop? Two failing I would say is unusual unless they’ve been mistreated. Did they give you any specifics?

I have an older set of both Red and Rival hydraulic brakes and have had zero issues. Bleeding properly is key of course

[nickl]

lol. read that post about the trip to Scotland and how he is on his second or third shimano hydro live or caliper or something.


Sram is very reliable, I have etap hydro for a couple thousand miles now (and the guy before me had it for a few two... been great. Also force so far has been flawless. Tons and tons of people running sram hydro with little to no problems.

Found the opposite to be true. It's not uncommon to see serious, non-sponsored mountain bikers using Shimano hydraulic on bikes with SRAM derailleurs. On mtb forums complaints abound on SRAM hydraulics, esp regarding their using DOT 5 brake fluid vs Shimano and most others that utilize much less toxic mineral oil.

[R3awak3n]

Found the opposite to be true. It's not uncommon to see serious, non-sponsored mountain bikers using Shimano hydraulic on bikes with SRAM derailleurs. On mtb forums complaints abound on SRAM hydraulics, esp regarding their using DOT 5 brake fluid vs Shimano and most others that utilize much less toxic mineral oil.

was talking about road hydraulic... its very popular on gravel bikes, most that are running 1x are on sram and have heard very little complaints from people and I know at least 6 with it, maybe even more.

As far as DOT, sram uses dot 5.1 (superior to 5 afaik) and yes its more toxic than mineral but I think it gets a much worst rep than it should when it comes to how nasty it is. Bleed the brakes, use gloves, don't drink the stuff and you will be fine.

[nmrt]

do not agree with this based on my experience. I have had shimano xt and xtr brakes. both had finicky bite points. I would adjust it and then while braking coming down mountains, the bike point would change. Very frustrating. and the mtb forums i frequented, riders lamented the same thing about shimano brakes

then bought sram guide ultimates. and it was much better than the shimanos. eventually, i sold the sram and bought magura mt7. but that is another story.

currently running sram force hydraulic on my gravel bike. i find it is a joy to use!

Found the opposite to be true. It's not uncommon to see serious, non-sponsored mountain bikers using Shimano hydraulic on bikes with SRAM derailleurs. On mtb forums complaints abound on SRAM hydraulics, esp regarding their using DOT 5 brake fluid vs Shimano and most others that utilize much less toxic mineral oil.

[nickl]

do not agree with this based on my experience. I have had shimano xt and xtr brakes. both had finicky bite points. I would adjust it and then while braking coming down mountains, the bike point would change. Very frustrating. and the mtb forums i frequented, riders lamented the same thing about shimano brakes

then bought sram guide ultimates. and it was much better than the shimanos. eventually, i sold the sram and bought magura mt7. but that is another story.

currently running sram force hydraulic on my gravel bike. i find it is a joy to use!

Really, XT and XTR less consistent than others esp SRAM? My mountain biking friends will disagree but then set-up is key. That's my experience also not to mention superior reliability of Shimano in almost every area. But stick with Maguras at least they don't use DOT 5.

[quickfeet]

90% of mixed results in disc brakes have to do with how well they are bled and who did it imho.

[Mikej]

I have a bunch of team members who have to put their mtbs in the car with the air on so the sram brakes will work for a lap on hot days. I had 2 sets of OEM guides bad right off the bat, then the warranty brake levers locked up in the parking lot at the LBS.

[Gummee]

Welcome to being a beta tester.

M

[Clancy]

Found the opposite to be true. It's not uncommon to see serious, non-sponsored mountain bikers using Shimano hydraulic on bikes with SRAM derailleurs. On mtb forums complaints abound on SRAM hydraulics, esp regarding their using DOT 5 brake fluid vs Shimano and most others that utilize much less toxic mineral oil.

As mentioned, yes on MTB brakes. I’ve seen a handful of new Guide brakes fail after they re-engineered the brakes to overcome all the issues with the first generation. I wouldn’t run SRAM MTB brakes both for that reason and the other is they’re difficult to service. Shimano are superior in that aspect.

[proletariandan]

Very broad statement. I’ve seen Shimano components fail.

Do you have faith in the shop? Two failing I would say is unusual unless they’ve been mistreated. Did they give you any specifics?

I have an older set of both Red and Rival hydraulic brakes and have had zero issues. Bleeding properly is key of course

FWIW it is King Kog in Oakland - I don't have any reason not to trust them and they're very supportive of the bike scene here.

Both brakes weren't working properly - they didn't just tell me they needed to be replaced out of nowhere. The first one (came on my 2nd hand SC Stigmata) developed a bunch of play that was independent of the reach adjustment (ie it would just flop around farther than it should) and the second one wasn't pushing or retracting the pistons very well (I bought used on Ebay and had KK install it).

[tkbike]

I have a bunch of team members who have to put their mtbs in the car with the air on so the sram brakes will work for a lap on hot days. I had 2 sets of OEM guides bad right off the bat, then the warranty brake levers locked up in the parking lot at the LBS.

I have had two sets of XTR race calipers replaced under warranty because of piston failure in below zero weather. It’s a known issue with mineral oil and Shimano in the cold. I still have XTR’s on one bike and Guide Ultimates on another, when I ride in the cold it’s always the one with the Guides!

[benb]

Mineral oil used by Shimano is likely toxic too... don't try and use that as justification for Shimano being better. It's not like Shimano is using pharmaceutical stuff.

The main thing Shimano accomplishes with their proprietary brake fluid is making you buy their own proprietary brake fluid and removing any need to have their fluid certified by an outside company.

I love Shimano but this is one area I really don't like them and will probably continue to avoid their products.

We had a lot of trouble with my wife's MTB with Shimano hydro right out of the gate... the LBS was able to fix it all but it was certainly annoying... and the system isn't that great anyway on either power or modulation.

The road disc setups I've tried I didn't like Shimano either although there were always caveats that it must have been the setup or the pads were not properly bedded in or whatever.. still all those things add up to "no thanks not buying this bike!"

[Jaybee]

I have had two sets of XTR race calipers replaced under warranty because of piston failure in below zero weather. It’s a known issue with mineral oil and Shimano in the cold. I still have XTR’s on one bike and Guide Ultimates on another, when I ride in the cold it’s always the one with the Guides!

This is interesting to me. I've got XTR-985 on my fatty, but I' haven't been real happy with the performance. It seems pretty grabby on snow, even with 160 rotors, and I can't seem to get quite enough power on dirt, even with 180 rotors.

I much prefer the feel of the Guide RSCs I have on my trail bike, but I have that "SRAM will fail eventually" thing, (which is probably irrational - they've been great) in the back of my mind. Maybe I should try them out on the fatty?

[45K10]

I much prefer Shimano hydraulics to Sram that is for sure. Road and MTB, but for the most part I don't think you can wrong with either one of these now a days. When Sram first came out with road hydraulic those things were pretty crappy IMO.

I had some Magura's once, just once

[Clancy]

FWIW it is King Kog in Oakland - I don't have any reason not to trust them and they're very supportive of the bike scene here.

Both brakes weren't working properly - they didn't just tell me they needed to be replaced out of nowhere. The first one (came on my 2nd hand SC Stigmata) developed a bunch of play that was independent of the reach adjustment (ie it would just flop around farther than it should) and the second one wasn't pushing or retracting the pistons very well (I bought used on Ebay and had KK install it).


First one sounds like a bleed issue and or stuck piston seals, second one seals. Leaks in lines,bleed, pads, seals, all I’m sure a good bike shop that sells/services road disc would look for. Sounds like two unlucky used buys. No hurt in reaching out to SRAM, I’ve had excellent service but can’t think of a time where no proof of purchase could be had. Better to have the bike shop reach out although it’s asking them to go out of their way.

[sonicCows]

First one sounds like a bleed issue and or stuck piston seals, second one seals. Leaks in lines,bleed, pads, seals, all I’m sure a good bike shop that sells/services road disc would look for. Sounds like two unlucky used buys. No hurt in reaching out to SRAM, I’ve had excellent service but can’t think of a time where no proof of purchase could be had. Better to have the bike shop reach out although it’s asking them to go out of their way.

Do you find that bike shops are willing to commit to the overhaul that would fix these issues? Seems like shipping out for warranty is the simpler solution. Here's a video of the overhaul done on YouTube though
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqEHA2dRgqs

[proletariandan]

Do you find that bike shops are willing to commit to the overhaul that would fix these issues? Seems like shipping out for warranty is the simpler solution. Here's a video of the overhaul done on YouTube though
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqEHA2dRgqs

Yeah, since mine can't be warrantied it seems like the shop doesn't want to commit to the overhaul - which is maybe understandable because of the labor cost and it not coming with a warranty. Thanks for sharing that video though, really informative!

[Hilltopperny]

I have had two differnet sram mtn levers fail in the same fashion. Replaced with xt and never had a problem again.

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[shoota]

If you want reliability stick with Shimano.

Tell that to my Dura Ace crank arm that decided to crack and separate this morning.

[zzy]

I also doubt the master cylinder in 2 SRAM hydro shifters failed on you. The design is fairly simple and the master cylinder can be easily removed once you bleed the system. Relubing the cylinder and pistons usually takes care of it, and worst case is usually a blown oring. KK is a decent shop, but I'd get a second opinion.

[scoobydrew]

Agree with getting a second opinion. I bought my SRAM hydro road shifters used off a member on here and haven't had any issues with usage. I even had to disassemble them to replace the hoses with new ones. I do have to say that bleeding these from a dry reservoir was a major pain, but have had no problems since then.

On the other hand, my Yeti had a Shimano XT M785 lever with a faulty master cylinder a couple years back.

[semdoug]

My wife's cross bike with Rival hydraulic failed, both calipers seized against the rotors. Luckily, the bike was still under warranty and replacement was done for free plus about $45 for labor. In addition, Sram replaced all parts, levers and brakes with Force. We thought that was pretty decent service.

[Gummee]

Agree with getting a second opinion. I bought my SRAM hydro road shifters used off a member on here and haven't had any issues with usage. I even had to disassemble them to replace the hoses with new ones. I do have to say that bleeding these from a dry reservoir was a major pain, but have had no problems since then.

On the other hand, my Yeti had a Shimano XT M785 lever with a faulty master cylinder a couple years back.
Had a chance to speak with the SRAM rep for the area on Sat.

According to him, that SRAM have gotten more 'durable' over the last little bit. I can say the only 3 SRAM brake bleeds that have been successful EVER! have been within the last year or so.

M

[Gummee]

My wife's cross bike with Rival hydraulic failed, both calipers seized against the rotors. Luckily, the bike was still under warranty and replacement was done for free plus about $45 for labor. In addition, Sram replaced all parts, levers and brakes with Force. We thought that was pretty decent service.
...but should you have had to get your brakes warrantied and to live without them for however long it took? I take issue with the beta testing that SRAM seems to have inflicted on us in the rush to get stuff to market

M