Who is building in the spirit of Dario?

[scottcw2]

I know that the Pegoretti brand is still a going concern, but what current builders are making frames in the same spirit of pushing boundaries of material, paint, and that unquantifiable je ne sais quoi that made Dario’s bikes special?

[FlashUNC]

Pegoretti.

I'd add Gaulzetti to that list too.

[eurodude]

I would add Legor

[martl]

Festka, Sarto, Zullo...

[Ttx1]

Amaro, Cherubim, and we cannot fail to mention Richard Sachs.

[Peter P.]

To me, there was nothing special in the construction and materials of Dario's frames. It was ALL in the paint, and for that he was to be recognized.

Find a builder whose artistry has as much character.

I agree with the Festka suggestion above. There's not much else out there.

[AngryScientist]

I know that the Pegoretti brand is still a going concern, but what current builders are making frames in the same spirit of pushing boundaries of material, paint, and that unquantifiable je ne sais quoi that made Dario’s bikes special?

if the question of who is pushing the boundaries of materials, i think English should be in consideration. with regard to constantly evolving and pushing new innovative finishing designs, the first people that come to mind are Firefly.

to me, what made dario special is his personal history of making racing bikes for professionals, and he took that experience to the table of his later career cool bikes for which he used them as a canvas for his artwork. it was the whole package of dario that made his creations something special.

with that in mind, i agree that Craig Gaulzetti deserves a mention here. He's not swinging the torch himself, but his racing history informs the bikes he is designing, and he is defining what he wants to see with varying carbon layups, specific geometries, etc. I give him much credit for continuing to evolve and put cool bikes under riders that appreciate them.

[Elefantino]

Find a builder whose artistry has as much character.
Rody Walter at Groovy Cycleworks may not concentrate solely on racing rigs like Peg, but his bikes scream character.

[OtayBW]

DeRosa/Bixxis?

[rwsaunders]

From my limited front porch view, it seems like Dario was able to funnel his skills, ideas, artistic energy and unique personality into a collective in the way that he assembled a team of builders, painters and front office folks, all working through a distributor to help define, evolve and continually expand the brand. Dale Chihuly the sculptor and glassblower comes to mind when drawing a parallel in another field.

In some sense, I think of Vanilla, Fetska, Baum and Firefly following a similar, yet uniquely different pathway in terms of working as a collective. Iconic solo builders like Peter Weigle, Darrell McCulloch and Nick Crumpton never seem to rest on their laurels regardless of market trends and their queue lines. I also think that nobody comes close to laying it all on the line for the world to see, in terms of questioning their own existence and forcing their own evolution to occur like Richard Sachs.

Some of the folks that I mentioned like Darrell McCulloch and Richard Sachs had strong, personal ties to Dario and collaborated with him as well...birds of a feather and peer respect at the highest level for sure.

[jimoots]

Ricky Feather

[bigbill]

Dave Cheakas repainted my BLE five years ago. Still love how it rides. It's round welded tubes, but what tubing he used and where it was used has influenced a generation of builders.

[Blown Reek]

To me, there was nothing special in the construction and materials of Dario's frames. It was ALL in the paint, and for that he was to be recognized.

Find a builder whose artistry has as much character.

Landshark is the new Pegoretti.

[simonov]

Pegoretti.

I'd add Gaulzetti to that list too.

What he said. The Pegoretti workshop is going strong. What's more in the spirit of a Pegoretti than a Pegoretti made by the people who have been making Pegorettis for a while now?

If that doesn't capture the spirit enough for you, nothing will. You're better off picking a builder for their own unique identity and not looking for a handing of the torch, so to speak, that never occurred.

[thunderworks]

IMO, Dario's work was artful and beautiful (most of the time at least), but I really don't think he pushed any functional design boundaries or material boundaries. He positioned himself as an artist whose medium was bike frames. I suspect he had a really good grasp of geometry, but don't know that from personal experience. I've never ridden one of his bikes.

I think there are probably numerous builders who work similarly - some well known, some not - Baum, Vanilla, Dave Anderson, Kirk come to mind. In Des Moines, Ia, there a guy who has been building for over 40 years that most bikies have never heard of - Jeff Bock. I think his work aesthetically is the best traditional, lugged steel bike work ever . . . But practically no one knows him.

To answer the op's question, I think there are lots of really (really!) good builders for bike enthusiasts.

[Mike V]

Rob English

[timto]

Second Rob English pushing boundaries...

I feel a brand that gets little attention is Cyfac. Similar to Pegoretti- they have a history in the pro peloton. They are also capable in many materials, are a small shop and are very innovative too - they have been regular participants in the newly re-invigorated Concours de Machines event in France.

Also one of the coolest bikes here (imho) is fignon's barber's Proxidium.

[veggieburger]

...pushing boundaries of material

As someone who knows little about Pegs (other than the unique paint), how did they push the boundaries of material? Genuine question here.

[scottcw2]

My understanding is that Dario almost single handedly kept steel viable when alu and carbon were the new darlings. He worked with Columbus to develop new steel tubes when everyone else was moving to other materials.

I may be off here, but wasn't Dario one of the pioneers of OS tubing?

[kingpin75s]

To me, there was nothing special in the construction and materials of Dario's frames. It was ALL in the paint, and for that he was to be recognized.


Based on even my one experience building a Peg for a friend, I would disagree on this.

The interface of the chain stays alone to the bottom bracket are unique, I believe, and show a deep attention to function and detail. Maybe others do it, but I have never seen the stays flared the way Dario did to create an even stronger contact between stays and BB for drivetrain stiffness.

That one example alone was enough to impress upon me that his work was elegant, purposeful and grounded in function. The paint is nice too.

[rallizes]

Quoting jerk on the Pegoretti Marcelo...

Pegoretti Marcelo: Again- we all know the story. This guy introduced tig welding to the pro peloton and ushered in the era where pro-bikes were as perfect as they ever got- the pro race bike did not yet have to first and foremost be a retail product for mass-consumption. Bike frames were still made specifically for the individual pro and often even the individual parcourse. Working with Excel, and dedacciai and later colombus- Pegoretti built the best metal race bikes in an era where riders were faster and more demanding on equipment than anytime before or since. Big money means this Marcelo will never be raced in the TDF- but it's still the ultimate steel race bike Dario made for the likes of Indurain- only with even more advanced materials, no constraints in terms of aesthetics and even more experience building great bikes. My bikes owe a lot to the era where tig welded steel and aluminum frames were the best in the world- I look at a Marcelo and I know that is still the case.

[rwsaunders]

My understanding is that Daria almost single handedly kept steel viable when alu and carbon were the new darlings. He worked with Columbus to develop new steel tubes when everyone else was moving to other materials.

I may be off here, but wasn't Dario one of the pioneers of OS tubing?

https://www.richardsachs.com/frame-building-materials/

Excerpt from the link above...In 2004, working in tandem with Dario Pegoretti, and collaborating with Columbus in Italy, a design for a new tube set became a reality. The concept was to create the first 21st Century steel tube set specifically designed for artisan framebuilders who chose lugs as their joining process. PegoRichie tubing entered the vernacular by 2005. In 2011, an even larger version of PegoRichie ÜOS (Über OverSize) tubing was added to the line, along with Sax Max lugs, bottom bracket shells, front derailleur braze-ons, and a 28.6mm fork crown sized for 27mm ÜOS fork blades.

...and lugs...

https://veloaficionado.com/blog/darrell-mcculloch-from-llewellyn-custom-bicycles-spills-the-beans-on-how-he-got-started-building-custom-bikes

You've collaborated with Dario Pegoretti on a lug set? The last frame lug set I designed and produced was a joint collaboration with Dario Pegoretti. I use these lugs in the Llewellyn “Cadenzia” frame set and Dario uses them in his "Day is Done” model.

[jamesdak]

Dario get's my love too even though I don't own a true bike of his. But I do own several Giordana's and it's well established that he helped the owner of Gita design these. I have around 25-30 steel bikes in my house I ride right now with another dozen or so that have passed through in the past decade or so. The Giordana XL Super is still my favorite and just has something to the ride quality that is so appealing. I did 130 solo miles on it last Saturday and finished feeling stronger than I ever have on any shorter century ride and honestly could have kept on going. The bike is amazing and I contribute this wholly to Dario's input.

[Climb01742]

Dario’s knowledge went far deeper than paint. I doubt anyone, ever, built more frame with his own hands for pro riders than he did, and heard back what worked and didn’t. I saw the build sheets. His hands on knowledge may only have been rivaled by Ugo and Ernesto.

[FlashUNC]

Dario’s knowledge went far deeper than paint. I doubt anyone, ever, built more frame with his own hands for pro riders than he did, and heard back what worked and didn’t. I saw the build sheets. His hands on knowledge may only have been rivaled by Ugo and Ernesto.

Let's not forget Faliero Masi. His client list ain't exactly chopped liver.

[Climb01742]

Let's not forget Faliero Masi. His client list ain't exactly chopped liver.

Very fair and true. I’m sure I forgot others.;)

[thwart]

To me, there was nothing special in the construction and materials of Dario's frames. It was ALL in the paint, and for that he was to be recognized.


With all due respect, you need to ride one of his bikes. And if you already have done so over a period of time, well...

I just disagree.

[FlashUNC]

With all due respect, you need to ride one of his bikes. And if you already have done so over a period of time, well...

I just disagree.

In fairness I used to have the same silly, bad take on it. I thought the head tubes were goofy and the tube shaping just weirdly ostentatious and the names totally over the top. It's just steel right?

Then I rode one and realized what kind of idiot I'd been.

[scottcw2]

Also, is anyone familiar with Officine Mattio? https://officinemattio.com/?lang=en

[Heisenberg]

spirit...tubes. dario. yep.

from a material/tech perspective: baum comes to mind, though they play in the ti world primarily. prova on the steel side.

from the paint side...dunno. haven't seen anything since that's really at the same level, from a creative perspective.

dario did more for metal bikes than almost anyone in the past 40 years. while his paint is what got the attention, it was his tech push that kept metal bikes viable and relevant. go ride a pegorichie bike if you don't believe me.

[Ryun]

I'd say Bixxis/ Doriano DeRosa
round tubes
large chainstays
Just doesn't have the artistic paint

[jtbadge]

Hate 'em, or love 'em... Speedvagen.

[paredown]

In fairness I used to have the same silly, bad take on it. I thought the head tubes were goofy and the tube shaping just weirdly ostentatious and the names totally over the top. It's just steel right?

Then I rode one and realized what kind of idiot I'd been.

"Show me a man who hasn't changed his mind, and I will show you a man who hasn't got one."

(Forget who, but semi-famous and it has stuck with me.)

I would have been on the Pegoretti bus if I'd had the means--if only to try and see what the fuss is about.

My sense of Dario's work though is that he had an almost unequaled chance to build a lot of bikes for pros, sometimes in a hurry, and got to a point where he just knew where stuff should go for balance, usability responsiveness. The aesthetics were an overlay--underneath they were machines for going fast, matched to individual riders who asked him 'I want a bike that feels like X--or does Y well' or 'can you tweak this I want a little more Z when I'm descending'--whatever the request. And he could translate that into a finite thing--a tool for racing.

[82Picchio]

Festka, Sarto, Zullo...

Zullo pre-dates Dario. If the styles are similar, then Dario built in Zullo's style.

[82Picchio]

Landshark is the new Pegoretti.

Stop it. Land Shark has been around forever. Andy Hampsten won the 1988 Giro on a Shark. Slawta paint jobs were crazy before Dario ever picked up a paint brush or a paint gun.

[colker]

I'd say Bixxis/ Doriano DeRosa
round tubes
large chainstays
Just doesn't have the artistic paint

This^

[Peter P.]

Landshark is the new Pegoretti.

I was going to suggest Landshark in my original post, but to me it seems that after he stopped building steel frames, the colorful finishes stopped, too.

:(

I also have to agree with the other mentions for the Speedvagen (https://www.speedvagen.com/) frames, Llewellyn (http://www.llewellynbikes.com/), and the recently posted Mercian (https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=241851).

[Rudy]

IMO, Dario's work was artful and beautiful (most of the time at least), but I really don't think he pushed any functional design boundaries or material boundaries. He positioned himself as an artist whose medium was bike frames. I suspect he had a really good grasp of geometry, but don't know that from personal experience. I've never ridden one of his bikes.

I think there are probably numerous builders who work similarly - some well known, some not - Baum, Vanilla, Dave Anderson, Kirk come to mind. In Des Moines, Ia, there a guy who has been building for over 40 years that most bikies have never heard of - Jeff Bock. I think his work aesthetically is the best traditional, lugged steel bike work ever . . . But practically no one knows him.

To answer the op's question, I think there are lots of really (really!) good builders for bike enthusiasts.

Jeffrey Bock Custom Cycles is located in Ames, IA. Follow on FB. Outstanding framebuilding and paint. An Ephgrave resto is currently featured.

[mhespenheide]

English and Engin, by my vote -- in terms of single builders who push the boundary.

[martl]

Zullo pre-dates Dario. If the styles are similar, then Dario built in Zullo's style.

true but it wasn't the question who came first. Zullo built very fine, but quite conventional bikes for a long time. His work recently reminds me of Dario because he sticks to steel and does nice graphical paintjobs.

[classtimesailer]

Our planned trip to Italy included a made for me Pegoretti in consultation with Dario. Alas, an emergency appeared and burned those earmarked dollars. If we plan a similar trip in the future, I think I visit Cinelli and get the XCR. The spirit is Italian. No?

[colker]

The correct answer is... no one!
Dario Pegoretti was unique. There are great frame builders out there. They all have a bicycle in common... but that´s all.
Buy buy buy.
This thread is obscene; it´s one year of the passing of an original master and great human being w/ many friends in this site.

[scottcw2]

This thread is obscene; it´s one year of the passing of an original master and great human being w/ many friends in this site.

How is this thread obscene? I admire Dario’s talents and I am looking for recommendations of similar talents.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: