AMP human lotion

[Tickdoc]

have we discussed this here yet?

I hear good things and wonder if it would help with sorenes/cramping?

Sounds like it would be worth a shot....err a rub.

https://amphumanperformance.com/

[FlashUNC]

A magic cream that you rub on and suddenly do amazing things?

Snake oil sure has gotten sophisticated in their pitches.

[Tickdoc]

A magic cream that you rub on and suddenly do amazing things?

Snake oil sure has gotten sophisticated in their pitches.

Normally, yes, I would agree...but when it sweeps so many high caliber athletes and nearly the entire Peloton it peaks my interest.

Surely someone here has tried it?

[benb]

I am amazed this doesn't have CBD in it...

[Dr Luxurious]

Make your own.
It's essentially hand lotion with baking soda and menthol.
It must have a pretty high ph with the soda and lye which, yeah, would neutralize (lactic) acid IF it makes it into the muscles.
Give it a shot. Definitely can't hurt you.


Menthol (0.5%), sodium bicarbonate (baking soda), water, isopropyl palmitate, lecithin, poloxamer 407, palm kernel oil, alcohol denat., benzyl alcohol, coconut oil, jojoba seed oil, caprylic/capric triglycerides, sodium hydroxide, fragrance

[berserk87]

It's gotta be the jojoba seed oil that's the magic in the sauce.

I'm just joking, of course. I can't imagine what substance in this concoction would make any difference.

[sitzmark]

Tried it earlier this month for PITM150 (Pain in the MASS 150miles/12k vert). No noticeable difference from last year ... except that I didn't have time to train this time. 10+% grades suffered appropriately from lack of training, but overall performance and after-event condition was same. Some quad soreness and stiffness developed post-ride for first 30-60 minutes, then pretty much gone after a couple of hours. Same as last year.

Haven't used AMP since PITM - not sure if I will again. Kind of a smelly, slimy mess to apply. Maybe there's some benefit (based on science) at full-tilt for highest level competition, but for recreational level I sensed nothing. Received a couple of emails promoting a new formulation in the works - think it is a kickstart project. I'm not personally motivated to buy in, but a change from the current slimy formulation would be a better experience.

[RailTrailRacer]

If the stuff wasn't legit, the pros wouldn't be using it. The sodium bicarb can help buffer lactic acid. It looks interesting, to be honest, maybe I'll give it a try.

[glepore]

Tried it, and can't separate the placebo effect from reality. Not to say something wasn't going on, but it might have been between my ears.

One thing that does seem to work is Sportlegs. Was turned on to this thru Selene Yeager's podcast, and without a doubt it helps. Good day in a bottle.

[FlashUNC]

If the stuff wasn't legit, the pros wouldn't be using it.

Lol.

[berserk87]

If the stuff wasn't legit, the pros wouldn't be using it. The sodium bicarb can help buffer lactic acid. It looks interesting, to be honest, maybe I'll give it a try.

I seem to recall a famous old black and white photo of some pros riding and smoking, because it allegedly "opened up the lungs". Pros do some legit things and some that are just spook science. They have for years (see for reference: Breathe Right Strips, beet juice, amphetamines). That's not necessarily a litmus test for anything.

Conversely, aero bars were once thought ridiculous by pros.

I was one of the first riders in my area to ride Speedplay pedals. I recall having several local strong racers ridiculing them and saying "the pros don't use them". Well, they do now. What pros do and don't do shouldn't control your independent thought.

[gasman]

There’s zero scientific reason it should do anything positive for your performance. The placebo effect will give you a positive effect for almost anything you study when you aren’t actually making objective measurements. The pros say they feel faster so let them use it. If you want to use it , no worries. Almost certainly it won’t improve your performance.

[Hellgate]

If the stuff wasn't legit, the pros wouldn't be using it.

That's awesome! They get paid to ride bikes, and are paid to endorse products.

Remember when cigarettes were "good for you?"

[SlowPokePete]

The placebo effect

is real.

SPP™

[sitzmark]

There are a few double blind, peer-reviewed studies (San Diego State U and third party IIRC) that generated quantitative (blood level lactate / HR) and qualitative data which suggest some correlation to performance gains and improved post-activity recovery following advanced anaerobic activity.

I don’t challenge the data and conclusions of the study, but I also didn’t perceive subjective levels of benefit from my use of the product. Certainly not “magic sauce” at my level. ... not that I expected it to be ...

[berserk87]

There are a few double blind, peer-reviewed studies (San Diego State U and third party IIRC) that generated quantitative (blood level lactate / HR) and qualitative data which suggest some correlation to performance gains and improved post-activity recovery following advanced anaerobic activity.

I don’t challenge the data and conclusions of the study, but I also didn’t perceive subjective levels of benefit from my use of the product. Certainly not “magic sauce” at my level. ... not that I expected it to be ...

I wonder what the efficacy rate is versus the placebo in these studies?

[nooneline]

I wonder what the efficacy rate is versus the placebo in these studies?

https://amphumanperformance.com/pages/studies

higher blood lactate levels
lower HR for same workload
reduced muscle soreness
increased time to exhaustion

[oldpotatoe]

If the stuff wasn't legit, the pros wouldn't be using it. The sodium bicarb can help buffer lactic acid. It looks interesting, to be honest, maybe I'll give it a try.

Unless they were paid to 'use it'....and the 'pros' do that all the time..

I remember a pic of Indurain with an Acocet computer on his bike..w/o any wire attached(before wireless)...cuz...$...:)

[2LeftCleats]

If I’m understanding the study cited in the promotional literature correctly, results were better with cheap oral supplement than this topical product. The best result was with 0.3 gm/kg. Typical pill size is 650 mg, meaning it would require 20+ pills for a 50 kg rider. But the 0.4 gm/kg study resulted in slightly less rise than the 0.3 gm study, so perhaps you don’t need so many pills. Maybe before paying for this product, try a few bicarbonate pills and fix your heartburn in the process.

[RailTrailRacer]

That's awesome! They get paid to ride bikes, and are paid to endorse products.

Remember when cigarettes were "good for you?"

Lest you all think of me as some kind of gullible fanboy, I realize athletes are paid to use products. My point was that if you see a widespread use of a product (across multiple teams, as I understood this to be), then it is more than just sponsorships driving use. Would a small cream company really have the resources to go sponsor a bunch of teams? maybe, but I doubt it.

[gasman]

From the study:


Heart rate and RPE were significantly (p<0.05) lower for TSB compared to placebo at the 15-min mark of the 1-hour time trial, but not at other time points. When TSB was applied, lactate was higher (p<0.05) after the high-intensity ramp, sprint and 5-min time trial series (10.8±3.2 mmol/L versus 9.7±3.1 mmol/L for TSB and placebo, respectively). Similar effects were not observed after the 1-hour time trial. Significance was not reached when examining performance differences (p>0.05).



This is a very small study with only 20 athletes. Two previous studies showed better effects with oral bicarbonate as 2leftleats mentioned.
The effects seem to be small and only applied to short efforts and weren't positive for the 1 hr TT efforts. Most bike races are longer than 15 minutes.
It may be that further research show a positive effect but I wouldn't waste my money.

[colker]

Endorsed by Hannibal Lecter.

[Hellgate]

Lest you all think of me as some kind of gullible fanboy, I realize athletes are paid to use products. My point was that if you see a widespread use of a product (across multiple teams, as I understood this to be), then it is more than just sponsorships driving use. Would a small cream company really have the resources to go sponsor a bunch of teams? maybe, but I doubt it.Sure, that makes total sense now. Thanks for the clarification [emoji106]!

[berserk87]

https://amphumanperformance.com/pages/studies

higher blood lactate levels
lower HR for same workload
reduced muscle soreness
increased time to exhaustion

Thanks for posting the link.

My next question is: what's the margin of error? I didn't seen this posted in the reports. If the margin of error is noted, please let me know.

If the margin of error matches the documented difference between the cream and the placebo (which it could - the benefits were not much better than the placebo), what are we looking at?

So while all of the above claims may be true according to the study, it ain't by much, and without knowing the margin of error, it's hard to accept the results. And as gasman mentioned, it's a very small sample size.

In the second study, the only difference between the control lotion and the alleged super lotion was sodium bicarbonate. Baking soda is the magic ingredient.

[RailTrailRacer]

Baking soda is the magic ingredient.

That is legit. Old endurance athlete trick was to drink sodium bicarb and let it buffer the acid produced in the muscles during a race. It often had some unpleasant digestive side effects.

There are plenty of drugs that are dosed transdermally today. In other words, don't dismiss this out of hand just because baking soda is used to keep your fridge smelling good.

[David Tollefson]

Dmso...

[soulspinner]

Interesting thread:)

[glepore]

That is legit. Old endurance athlete trick was to drink sodium bicarb and let it buffer the acid produced in the muscles during a race. It often had some unpleasant digestive side effects.

There are plenty of drugs that are dosed transdermally today. In other words, don't dismiss this out of hand just because baking soda is used to keep your fridge smelling good.

Yes, bicarb is a known quantity. It does work, but makes most feeling sick. I don't know whether the transdermal amp lotion works, as I said upthread, but it is cool that they have tech in the pipeline to do a consumer level patch...

[berserk87]

That is legit. Old endurance athlete trick was to drink sodium bicarb and let it buffer the acid produced in the muscles during a race. It often had some unpleasant digestive side effects.

There are plenty of drugs that are dosed transdermally today. In other words, don't dismiss this out of hand just because baking soda is used to keep your fridge smelling good.

Fair enough. The fancy marketing to act like it's something more than this is the hilarious thing though.

The DMSO comment takes me back to the mid-80's. Forgot about that stuff.

[Alaska Mike]

I clicked on the link and found that at my current number of workouts a week, I would go through 3 tubes a month, at $35 a tube.

Um, no.

[berserk87]

I clicked on the link and found that at my current number of workouts a week, I would go through 3 tubes a month, at $35 a tube.

Um, no.

Wow! That ain't cheap.

[gasman]

Looking further.

The journal article is an online only journal. Supposedly peer reviewed but I couldn't find a list of the reviewers, which most major journals publish once a year. The "testimonials" are from non-academic sources. Trainers/coaches mostly.

Buffering anaerobic metabolism has some proven small benefit but I don't think this stuff will do a thing for most of us. We aren't sprinting on the track.

[FlashUNC]

Looking further.

The journal article is an online only journal. Supposedly peer reviewed but I couldn't find a list of the reviewers, which most major journals publish once a year. The "testimonials" are from non-academic sources. Trainers/coaches mostly.

Buffering anaerobic metabolism has some proven small benefit but I don't think this stuff will do a thing for most of us. We aren't sprinting on the track.

I go anaerobic going over a speedbump in a parking lot, so there may be some value here.

[gasman]

I go anaerobic going over a speedbump in a parking lot, so there may be some value here.


Then this is for you !!!!!!

[MattTuck]

Now, if you cobranded with Nair, you might have something.