Gravel bike input?

[overmyhead]

Hi all,
After several years with my 2001 poprad I am considering coming into the modern age. I have been looking and have seen many variations on the gravel/multi use theme. I'd appreciate any input on what you all might recommend and why.
Here are my preferences;
Aluminum or cro-mo, carbon fork is fine.
Mechanical disc not hydraulic.
Fender & rack mounts would be great but not a necessity.
1x drivetrain. Rival seems to fit the bill.
Around $2000.

A bit of my backround;
I am 5.9, 150 lbs.
I do a couple of organized gravel rides each year but overall enjoy riding dirt roads and light trails - no mountain biking.
I don't race. I am fit but usually don't ride aggressively.
This bike will probably let me thin the herd by 2.
Everything that I have now has Campy. this will be my first foray into disc brakes and (probably) Sram.

I've seen so many options to date. Any personal favorites with details would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

[jtbadge]

Kona Rove ST is really nice for under budget.

http://konaworld.com/rove_st.cfm

https://images.konaworld.com/2019/med/rove_st.jpg

Steel frame/fork
Rival 1
Mechanical brakes
Fender + rack mounts
12mm thru axles front + rear
Tubeless ready 650b wheels with 47mm tires
3 sets of bottle cage mounts

The Sutra LTD is the same frame but with 700c wheels. It comes with Rival 1 Hydraulic, though.

[weisan]

Or a Salsa Journeyman

https://salsacycles.com/bikes/journeyman_650b/journeyman_sora_650

https://www.rei.com/media/a40c6816-07a3-4ce2-aa60-126df9a95038?size=784x588

[Bentley]

I’d buy a Crockett. I think you can do it for your price and have money left over, other alternative is Specialized Diverge, DSW ought to work for the money you have

Ray

[AngryScientist]

Since I am a massive Ritchey fan, my vote is the Ritchey Outback. I think you could build one out for inside your price range.

https://cdn.road.cc/sites/default/files/styles/main_width/public/ritchey-outback-riding-1.jpg?itok=PACdBFfP

[pinkshogun]

another Chapman...

[spoonrobot]

As a general recommendation I'd recommend you consider purchasing a frameset that uses a regular 1 1/8" steerer and normal headtube. The majority of the current crop of gravel bikes have 1 1/4" if not large steerers and this makes for an intolerably stiff ride, IME.

[robertbb]

Random suggestion... get a Giant Cross City. The alloy ones are actually really, really good.

[Clancy]

Why mechanical discs? For affordability? Hydros are so much better it’s not even a comparison TRP’s are the best of the mechanical disc brakes but still far below hydraulic.

If it wasn’t for tire size, rim brakes are equal to mechanical w/o the squeaky annoying noise.

Why someone hasn’t come out with a proper gravel bike with canti brakes is beyond me. I bet there’s a strong market for such

[thermalattorney]

Why mechanical discs? For affordability? Hydros are so much better it’s not even a comparison TRP’s are the best of the mechanical disc brakes but still far below hydraulic.

If it wasn’t for tire size, rim brakes are equal to mechanical w/o the squeaky annoying noise.

+1 Mechanical discs aren't an upgrade. Slapping a pair of CX8.4s on your Poprad will give you better braking

OP If you're worried about bleeding, take it to a shop the first time. It's an easy process but is definitely the kind of thing that requires some new tools and a desire to learn something new.

Good luck!

[oldpotatoe]

Why mechanical discs? For affordability? Hydros are so much better it’s not even a comparison TRP’s are the best of the mechanical disc brakes but still far below hydraulic.

If it wasn’t for tire size, rim brakes are equal to mechanical w/o the squeaky annoying noise.

Why someone hasn’t come out with a proper gravel bike with canti brakes is beyond me. I bet there’s a strong market for such

Marketeers everywhere would be getting out their pitch forks and torches..Would a well made GRoad bike work well with proper cantis, etc? Of course but the manufacturers are all in on discs....for better or ill. I just bought a Cleary 24inch Meerkat for by 8 year old grand daughter..if would be FINE with cantis but it has wet disc brakes.......:eek:

[overmyhead]

Thanks everyone,
You've given me a bit of research to do on this rainy afternoon.
As to the issue of mechanical discs - I have no issue with the cantis on my poprad. I usually try to work on my bikes myself as much as possible and I assumed that a mechanical disc brake would be a simpler fix if I had an issue.

Truth be told, I'm really on the fence with this. There are generally equal pros and cons to retiring the poprad. I have taken the drivetrain about as far as it can go with Campy - I'm not gaining much with a 1x except for shedding the pesky triple front derailleur and crankset. A Sram setup would be nice for a change of pace but the Campy has generally worked well. As I mentioned, I would probably let another bike out of the group besides the poprad. The new bike would most likely fulfill the uses of both. That would give me a little breathing room downstairs and cut down on my maintenance time.

Any more thoughts would be welcome.
Thanks again

[KonaSS]

Why someone hasn’t come out with a proper gravel bike with canti brakes is beyond me. I bet there’s a strong market for such

There are tons of canti brake bikes for cheap on ebay that suggest that there isn't much of a market here.

[KonaSS]

I realize you said 1x and mechanical brakes, but the Cannondale Topstone 105 bike is such a value that I think you should give it a look. (and I ride for a Specialized shop)

Especially if you are looking for this bike for multiple purposes, a 2x drivetrain will probably be beneficial.

[Bentley]

I think an upgrade is a good path. I love my Trek Crockett, but I have an IF Planet X that is equal to the challenge. I have SRAM 1X, rides great.

[marsh]

What is the limitation of the Poprad? I was thinking about upgrading from mine, but with CX 8.4's it stops on a dime. Wish it could fit bigger than 35c tires, but it's great for 95% of what I want to ride. If I need more cush I could just take out the 650b converted MTB.

https://i.imgur.com/Jsqio5Ul.jpg?1

[AngryScientist]

What is the limitation of the Poprad?

in my mind, the biggest thing that an "upgrade" would do better than the Poprad is weight.

i personally dont have any problems with rim brakes and older technology, and weight is not generally a big concern with a gravel bike, but if one is spending LONG days in the saddle and traversing over lots of elevation, a lighter bike WILL make a difference, no doubt.

the poprad is an iconic do-it-all bike that is super capable for what it is, but it's heavy. swapping to an alloy frame with carbon fork and more modern drivetrain and wheels is going to save a good chunk of weight, and that will be noticeable.

in my experience/opinion.

[overmyhead]

That's pretty much what I've been feeling. The poprad is great for a lot of what I do and has always served me well but on longer harder days it rides like what it is - a heavier, older steel bike with early cross ideas in the design. It doesn't help at all that I also travel "heavy" being one of those guys that has something for almost any situation in his seat bag. Don't get me wrong, it can be a great ride some days but also being and older cyclist now, the lighter rig is another advantage that I feel I should consider.

[marsh]

Got it. It is not great at carrying a load either, although I have a few tours on it.
Upgrade away, let me live vicariously threw you!

[overmyhead]

A lot of these fit the bill for most of my needs. Someone else that I know also recommended the crocket. One of the differences that I noticed with it is that Trek seems to have made an attempt to smooth those unsightly welds that I just hate.
Yesterday someone else mentioned the All City Gorilla Monsoon. Looks like a decent bike and fits most of my criteria but may not be much lighter than my poprad. Does anyone here have one?

[weiwentg]

...As to the issue of mechanical discs - I have no issue with the cantis on my poprad. I usually try to work on my bikes myself as much as possible and I assumed that a mechanical disc brake would be a simpler fix if I had an issue.

Truth be told, I'm really on the fence with this. There are generally equal pros and cons to retiring the poprad. I have taken the drivetrain about as far as it can go with Campy - I'm not gaining much with a 1x except for shedding the pesky triple front derailleur and crankset. A Sram setup would be nice for a change of pace but the Campy has generally worked well...

Campy Potenza has a hydraulic disc version. Not sure if that will allow you to stay within the original budget, but you can stay with Campy if you want.

[559Rando]

How much (and what size) tire do you want to run? Even at 6'1", I'm a big 650B evangelist (although I have a lot of 700C still and a 27" tandem) and the current crop of gravel bikes seem to use 47mm 650B, especially WTB tires as the platform. Is that what you want?

All that said, my buddy who is about 5'6" rides and loves his Fuji Jari with 700C WTB Resolutes. And the owner of my LBS when I lived in NorCal rode one, too and raved about. They each did various upgrades. My buddy out D/A 11s on his, the LBSer put a dropper post on his.

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

[overmyhead]

I’d prefer to stay with 700. So many tires...
I will look at the Fuji.
Thanks

[TheseGoTo11]

I like the Kona Rove suggestion. Seems like good fit here. I had considered that one myself earlier this year.

FWIW, I’ve had nothing but good experience with Avid BB7 and TRP Spyre mech disc brakes (multiple bikes with both). Hydros are better, but both are excellent brakes.

[fa63]

I will throw in the Marin Gestalt X10. My buddy's shop recently started carrying them, and it seems like a very cleverly designed bike at a reasonable price.

https://www.marinbikes.com/bikes/2019-pavement-drop-bar-beyond-road-gestalt-x10

[Stevemikesteve]

Very happy with my Rove ST. Definitely worth a look

[Gummee]

+1 Mechanical discs aren't an upgrade. Slapping a pair of CX8.4s on your Poprad will give you better braking

OP If you're worried about bleeding, take it to a shop the first time. It's an easy process but is definitely the kind of thing that requires some new tools and a desire to learn something new.

Good luck!

Even better: find a disc fork and try a mechanical disc, then a hydro disc and decide which you like better. Doesn't have to be a fancy fork...

M

[Moorecw]

Check out the Norco Search XR Steel. I picked one up for myself and my wife and have been very impressed with build and features. Has rack mounts, fender mounts and additional cage mounts on the fork. Very versatile from gravel racing to bike packing.

https://www.norco.com/bikes/dirt-dropbar/gravel/search-xr-steel/

[overmyhead]

Thanks I will take a look.

[Geeheeb]

I also love my Kona, a little loaded or not. I did have to replace the stem, seam and bars but otherwise love it out of the box:

http://i66.tinypic.com/34epb8m.jpg

my other gravely bike is a 2008 disc poprad that I love even more though...

[overmyhead]

Ah, if my poprad was a disc model that might sway the decision.

[overmyhead]

I noticed that the Specialized Sequoia hasn’t come up as a suggestion. Any reason?

[belopsky]

Perhaps I missed this but what does your Poprad weigh? The other suggestions here surely cannot be lighter than it? Gorilla Monsoon is a heavy bike. https://bikepacking.com/bikes/all-city-gorilla-monsoon-review/

Size 58 is 29 lbs

Kona Rove is heavier than the Poprad.

Sequoia isn't going to be lighter, either, but if you're a 56 there's one for sale for $900 on tarck..

[overmyhead]

That’s one of the issues on the pros & cons list. The poprad is a 55 and with cx tires and a triple crankset it weighs in at 22 lbs on the nose. I was looking at the monsoon but also though it was a pretty heady weight. Indeed an awful lot of these bikes that I have looked at seem to be heavy. Black Mountain Cycles MCD is a beautiful bike but the cost including shipping versus the benefit taints it a bit.

[happycampyer]

I think an issue you are going to have is related to budget. One can build a sub-18 lb disc all-road bike fairly easily these days, but not for $2K. I was at a LBS the other day and the stock Santa Cruz Stigmata was unbelievably light. I think it’s a bit over 18 lbs, and with some judicious upgrades, could easily get below 18 lbs.

Discs add weight, so the only way to keep the total weight down is to get lighter (i.e., more $$) discs, and shave weight in other areas (i.e., frame, wheels, other components). If the canti brakes are fine for you, you might want to consider a used titanium or aluminum bike with mid-reach brakes. These can be built into 18 lb bikes fairly easily, i.e., without carbon wheels, etc. I suggest used in order to keep the cost within budget. The market for these bikes isn’t as soft as the market for bikes with cantis, but with discs all the rage, they aren’t as popular as they were say 5 years ago.

[overmyhead]

Initially weight wasn’t a big issue for me. I assumed that coming into modern times a new bike (even a steel one) would surely be lighter than a 19 year old steel poprad. Not only was I wrong but I have found several to be heavier by much more than discs would account for. I think the root of this is that many of the companies are trying to put out a do all bike, road, dirt, cx, bikepacking etc. When they try to incorporate all that into a good as well as stylish bike it adds up. I don’t mind going a little heavier to get into 2019 but I want the big picture end result to be more plus than minus. That MCD looks like the real deal and people on here who have Black Mountain bikes seem to like them. It’s already over my planned budget though plus an additional 150 for shipping.

[trener1]

I am going to jump in here and recommend another bike to look at that I think is a great option but for some reason is mostly overlooked.

Check out the Jamis Renegade line, specifically the Exploit.
It ticks all the boxes that you are looking for Sram 1x etc... comes in exactly at your price point, only thing you might not like are hydro brakes but like others have already mentioned they sure are nice, or you can sell the hydros and put mechanicals on, and have a few extra $$ in your pocket
https://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/renegadeexploit.html

[overmyhead]

Thanks I will take a look.

[belopsky]

The expat version is cheaper and comes in mechanical

[MrCannonCam]

I will throw in the Marin Gestalt X10. My buddy's shop recently started carrying them, and it seems like a very cleverly designed bike at a reasonable price.

https://www.marinbikes.com/bikes/2019-pavement-drop-bar-beyond-road-gestalt-x10

I second this ^ the Gestalt is sweet. If I didn't love my Cannondale Slate so much I'd own one of these. The X11 model is right at your top point but hydro. Comes with a dropper post...The X10 model is a great build for the budget though. Room to upgrade wheels at that price.

My LBS carries Kona and their line is super. Great looking bikes and great price points. The aluminum Rove NRB at $1800 comes with 1x and mechanical brakes. Bike can run 650 or 700c. They come in some sweet colorways too.

Also noticed the comment about the Specialized Sequoia...I worked at an S dealer and sold a few (along with a few AWOL's) and they were tanks. Neat bikes but heavy heavy heavy. I test rode one and it felt like a slug

[jtbadge]

What brakes do you have now? It seems like you're pretty happy with the Poprad outside of braking.

If you're not dying to have a new bike, I'd say get a set TRP CX8.4 on eBay for $70 and be done with it.

[johnniecakes]

Why mechanical discs? For affordability? Hydros are so much better it’s not even a comparison TRP’s are the best of the mechanical disc brakes but still far below hydraulic.
Having ridden both recently I doubt in truly blind test anyone with reasonable hand strength could tell the difference. Hydro's have mechanical advantage in regards to lever force but modulation is equal in the right hands

[overmyhead]

I’m using Cane Creeks now and the braking has not really been an issue. My overall idea was to come into 2019 and current components - discs and a 1x drivetrain being the top two wants. I am starting to see now though that the gains aren’t what I thought they would be overall.

[R3awak3n]

Having ridden both recently I doubt in truly blind test anyone with reasonable hand strength could tell the difference. Hydro's have mechanical advantage in regards to lever force but modulation is equal in the right hands

I 100% can tell the difference btw hydro and cable, blind, riding backwards. More power again, disagree with modulation. The best thing about hydro is actually the modulation. Power is great but you can easily lock a bikes wheels with cantis and cable discs but cable disc lack modulation, also although better, you will still get hand fatigue on long descents, hydro much less since you can easily brake with 1 finger. Personally I am not a huge fan of cable discs. The only good thing about them is that you can spend less than a few hundred bucks and use the components you already have. Appart from that, they don't brake that much better than cantis, they are heavy and have all the negative things from disc brakes.


I bet someone already mentioned it but what about one of those sweet disc black mountain cycles?

And as far as weight goes, your poprad will be lighter than a lot of these bikes but being canti that is the reason, the disc poprad will probably weight 2 more lbs than your canti. My OPEN is about 18lbs, my Cielo is about 20lbs, they both ride fantastic... The Cielo does not feel heavy at all, on the contrary, I actually feel that its faster than the OPEN. That said, I would not want my bike to weight 30lbs. I had an elephant NFE, loved that bike but I like my OPEN that much more, its just more fun to ride, specially up hills.

If I was to spend $2000 all in I would be on the lookout here for something used, there was a sweet desalvo for not much more than 2k, campy hydro on it too. Otherwise I would save up some and get into a hakka MX or a Stigmata.

[AngryScientist]

Hey Rick, this just came across my inbox and i thought of you. looks like a lot of cool bike for the money.

https://www.cambriabike.com/products/bianchi-orso-105-2018

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0032/9023/4992/products/Orso_105_Singlespeed_Bike_-_2019_Military_Green_-_Red_2048x.jpg?v=1560935054

[benb]

The CX8.4 option is the cheap and easy thing but I guess you'd have to figure out what you actually want in a new bike.

The new bike is not going to be a revelation.

I have CX9s on my All City Space Horse. I've upgraded almost everything on it to 105 type level and it weighs between 25-27lbs depending on tires & whether or not the fenders and/or rack are on it. Not a light bike, but it's fine 99% of the time. Inexpensive stuff in this space is heavy because the bikes are trying to be jack of all trades and while you were happily riding the Poprad all the bikes got stupendously expensive.

There were tons of bikes with Cantis years ago. On the internet Cantis are still the best brakes, in the real world they are incredibly fiddly and the market decided they needed to die. Almost everyone in the real world has bad memories of Canti brakes in the 80s and 90s that didn't stop worth a damn and could never seem to be adjusted right.

I am a good mechanic IMO but the Cantis that came on my All City were indeed the most fiddly brakes I've ever owned. Even worse than the ones I had in the late 80s and 90s. The CX9s I have are also fiddly but it's easy to learn the recipe for how to keep them working well. It's just that just like Cantis you have to constantly adjust them as the pads wear to keep them working, constantly changing the main cable tension and then adjusting the spring tension to keep the brake centered. Nothing like a modern road rim brake where you just have to tighten a barrel adjuster as the pad wears and it works flawlessly the whole time.

Last time I tried Hydro discs on a road/gravel bike was 2016, they were still not very good IMO at that time, but still better than cable discs and cantis/V-brakes. If and when they get as good as MTB wet discs they'll revolutionize everything... I've had wet MTB discs for a long time and they have been the least hassle of any type of brakes I've owned. But compared to the Shimano Ultegra hydraulic discs I tried in 2016 the MTB brakes still seemed to be vastly more powerful with much better modulation and easier bleed procedures. (My experience with MTBs is bleeding almost never needs to be done.)

[sonicCows]

If you like the new bike and it makes you want to ride more, that should be a win!

A lot of folks here telling you to keep your old bike and upgrade to V-brakes, and that's fine. Bear in mind that discs have a weight penalty since the frame needs to be built up for thru axles and reinforced for the disc mounts, they'll also be a bit tougher to set up (compared to v-brakes at least). Vs will be light and an easy setup, but you get rim wear (esp on gravel) and braking performance impacted by wheels getting out of true.

I think it comes down to what kind of wear-items you want to deal with, and whether a new bike will inspire you to ride more. You mention you've had your bike for a while, so it's not like you're impulsively buying.

By all accounts Shimano R7020 (105-level hydro) shift and brake very well and for a price point below Rival if you want to consider that. Niner (lots of braze-ons), Orbea, and Giant (very sleek) all have nice aluminum options too.

There were tons of bikes with Cantis years ago. On the internet Cantis are still the best brakes, in the real world they are incredibly fiddly and the market decided they needed to die. Almost everyone in the real world has bad memories of Canti brakes in the 80s and 90s that didn't stop worth a damn and could never seem to be adjusted right.

I am a good mechanic IMO but the Cantis that came on my All City were indeed the most fiddly brakes I've ever owned. Even worse than the ones I had in the late 80s and 90s. The CX9s I have are also fiddly but it's easy to learn the recipe for how to keep them working well. It's just that just like Cantis you have to constantly adjust them as the pads wear to keep them working, constantly changing the main cable tension and then adjusting the spring tension to keep the brake centered. Nothing like a modern road rim brake where you just have to tighten a barrel adjuster as the pad wears and it works flawlessly the whole time.

[semdoug]

I have a Lynskey GR260 that I like a great deal. It has 105 with TRP mechanical discs. I paid $1850 for it during one of Lynskey’s clearance sales directly from their website. Lynskey also blows out frames on eBay.