FD adjust perplexing me

[cgolvin]

Super Record 11 FD.
It works beautifully, reliably moves the chain up and down the chainrings.
Then last week I noticed that the outer cage is roughed up…when moved all the way outboard (4 clicks) it's rubbing slightly against the crank arm.
No problem, small adjust on the limit screw just enough to prevent contact, looks good…
Won't shift up. Small adjust, shifts fine…contacts crank arm.
The difference in these two adjustments is quite small, between a quarter and half turn of the limit screw. WTH?
Cable tension seems right.
If I trim one click after upshifting there's no rub (chain or crank).
Any suggestions?

[Dave]

Depends on the year. 2009-21014 or 2015+ ? The newer shifters only have 3 clicks. They setup quite differently. Neither has a trim click after shifting to the big ring. Move the lever through all clicks and it should be in right position.

Campy has a video on the newer drivetrain setup.

[dddd]

Small adjustment of the hi limit screw to prevent the outer cage plate from rubbing the chain should have been a loosening of the hi-limit screw, so are you sure that it was the hi-limit screw that you adjusted???

[cgolvin]

@Dave: sorry, should have specified -- pre-2015 (white label).

Small adjustment of the hi limit screw to prevent the outer cage plate from rubbing the chain should have been a loosening of the hi-limit screw, so are you sure that it was the hi-limit screw that you adjusted???

The lower of the two, closer to the chainrings. To make sure it was having the desired effect, I trimmed the shifter one click, did the adjust, then pushed up a click to see that it was no longer contacting the crank arm.

Was following the Campy directions (https://www.campagnolo.com/media/files/035_234_User_manual_11-speed_front%20derailleur-%20Campagnolo.pdf), which says that if it doesn't shift up either the limit screw's off or the cable's too loose, which doesn't seem the case (since it shifts correctly with the limit adjust).

[oldpotatoe]

Super Record 11 FD.
It works beautifully, reliably moves the chain up and down the chainrings.
Then last week I noticed that the outer cage is roughed up…when moved all the way outboard (4 clicks) it's rubbing slightly against the crank arm.
No problem, small adjust on the limit screw just enough to prevent contact, looks good…
Won't shift up. Small adjust, shifts fine…contacts crank arm.
The difference in these two adjustments is quite small, between a quarter and half turn of the limit screw. WTH?
Cable tension seems right.
If I trim one click after upshifting there's no rub (chain or crank).
Any suggestions?

Put chain on big cog, small ring. Adjust front der so it's about 1.5-2mm above big ring and parallel to big ring. Inner limit screw so that the chain just tickles inside fder cage..attach inner wire TIGHT..push thumb button down while pulling inner wire TIGHT. THEN, turn inner limit screw out a wee bit..this makes the inner wire even tighter and moves the front der cage in so the chain doesn't touch the cage.

Shift to small cog..outer limit screw out(too much)..shift gently..while pedaling(bike in stand)..1-2-3 clicks..chain should go up to big ring..3 clicks..then turn outer limit screw in just so it TOUCHES the stop..not uber tight.

Don't think the inner wire was tight enough..

[oldpotatoe]

Depends on the year. 2009-21014 or 2015+ ? The newer shifters only have 3 clicks. They setup quite differently. Neither has a trim click after shifting to the big ring. Move the lever through all clicks and it should be in right position.

Campy has a video on the newer drivetrain setup.

2015 plus still have I think 6-7 clicks(SR/Record/Chorus)..BUT has a 'stop' to limit thumb button travel to 3 clicks.

[Vientomas]

Put chain on big cog, small ring. Adjust front der so it's about 1.5-2mm above big ring and parallel to big ring. Inner limit screw so that the chain just tickles inside fder cage..attach inner wire TIGHT..push thumb button down while pulling inner wire TIGHT. THEN, turn inner limit screw out a wee bit..this makes the inner wire even tighter and moves the front der cage in so the chain doesn't touch the cage.

Shift to small cog..outer limit screw out(too much)..shift gently..while pedaling(bike in stand)..1-2-3 clicks..chain should go up to big ring..3 clicks..then turn outer limit screw in just so it TOUCHES the stop..not uber tight.

Don't think the inner wire was tight enough..

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but what is the "inner wire"? I'm setting up an 11 speed Super Record FD and have the same set up issues.

Thanks.

[Dave]

The 2015+ levers only have three clicks. If you detach the cable and start with the thumb button all the way down, there are two two trim clicks that pull small amounts of cable and one long travel click to make the shift to the big ring. There are no more clicks available.

The older levers need 3 clicks to operate a double FD, but have 6 to operate a triple. Some people may use 4 clicks if they don't have a cable tension adjuster.

[oldpotatoe]

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but what is the "inner wire"? I'm setting up an 11 speed Super Record FD and have the same set up issues.

Thanks.

Innerwire=derailleur cable..

[Vientomas]

Innerwire=derailleur cable..

Ok, thanks!

[benb]

On top of the limit screw make sure the outer portion of the cage is parallel to the rings.... or whatever spec Campy issues for rotation of the derailleur around the axis of the seat tube.

[cgolvin]

Put chain on big cog, small ring. Adjust front der so it's about 1.5-2mm above big ring and parallel to big ring. Inner limit screw so that the chain just tickles inside fder cage..attach inner wire TIGHT..push thumb button down while pulling inner wire TIGHT. THEN, turn inner limit screw out a wee bit..this makes the inner wire even tighter and moves the front der cage in so the chain doesn't touch the cage.

Shift to small cog..outer limit screw out(too much)..shift gently..while pedaling(bike in stand)..1-2-3 clicks..chain should go up to big ring..3 clicks..then turn outer limit screw in just so it TOUCHES the stop..not uber tight.

Don't think the inner wire was tight enough..

Thanks Peter. Only part not clear to me (at least, until I try it) is the piece I underlined above. I interpret you to mean this, but please correct:
Attach cable TIGHT.
Push thumb button down (cage shifts in), slightly loosen securing nut then pull cable even tighter.

Also, can I achieve part of this effect by loosening the downtube adjuster before starting the setup then using it to further tighten the cable?

[Dave]

Detach the cable completely. Screw the cable tension adjuster in most of the way, so you can apply more tension, as needed. Push the thumb button all the way down, so there are no more clicks left. With the chain on the little ring and largest sprocket, adjust the little ring stop screw until there's a tinkle of chain contact. Reattach the cable, pulling it tight. Then try making the shift to the big ring. If should only take 3 clicks. 4 clicks means the cable tension is a little low, so increase tension to make the shift in 3 clicks. If you apply too much tension, you might get chain rub on the cage, when you're on the little ring and largest cog. If the chain goes past the big ring, then the big ring limit screw needs tightened a little. If there's chain rub, loosen it a little.

[jc031699]

Small adjustment of the hi limit screw to prevent the outer cage plate from rubbing the chain should have been a loosening of the hi-limit screw, so are you sure that it was the hi-limit screw that you adjusted???



He said rubbing the crank arm


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[oldpotatoe]

The 2015+ levers only have three clicks. If you detach the cable and start with the thumb button all the way down, there are two two trim clicks that pull small amounts of cable and one long travel click to make the shift to the big ring. There are no more clicks available.

The older levers need 3 clicks to operate a double FD, but have 6 to operate a triple. Some people may use 4 clicks if they don't have a cable tension adjuster.

Triple 11s and Ultrashift? No such animal..Altho Campag still made 'Comp' stuff in triple in 2009, no 'triple' levers with Gumby shaped levers(11s/10s UltraShift)..yes, you 'could' make it work, I've done it. Powershift, 2011, yes, triples.

[oldpotatoe]

Thanks Peter. Only part not clear to me (at least, until I try it) is the piece I underlined above. I interpret you to mean this, but please correct:
Attach cable TIGHT.
Push thumb button down (cage shifts in), slightly loosen securing nut then pull cable even tighter.

Also, can I achieve part of this effect by loosening the downtube adjuster before starting the setup then using it to further tighten the cable?

No..while pulling on der cable, just push the thumb button down as it takes a little more slack put of the cable..thumb button is as far down as it will go already..trying to take as much slack out of the cable as possible..why adjust inner limit with the chain touching inner cage of front der..pulling on cable, THEN turning the limit screw OUT a bit..to make it even tighter and get the cage away from the front der..

[cgolvin]

No..while pulling on der cable, just push the thumb button down as it takes a little more slack put of the cable..thumb button is as far down as it will go already..trying to take as much slack out of the cable as possible..why adjust inner limit with the chain touching inner cage of front der..pulling on cable, THEN turning the limit screw OUT a bit..to make it even tighter and get the cage away from the front der..

D'oh…I read "big cog small ring" and thought "big ring small cog". Now makes total sense (of course you wouldn't set the cable tension on the big ring, duh).

thanks much

[fignon's barber]

Has your fd moved out of alignment? I use one of these little plastic campag alignment tools ut-fd120.

[cgolvin]

Has your fd moved out of alignment? I use one of these little plastic campag alignment tools ut-fd120.

Pretty certain that alignment is fine; I have one of those tools as well and will double check when I put the bike on the stand to do the adjust.

I think OP's right that it's a cable tension issue.

thanks

[djdj]

In my experience, the back half of the cage should be parallel to the chainring and white line on the tool. Yours looks a little off.

Campag has a great instructional video on their site. It shows the post-2015 group, but the setup method would be the same for an earlier group. Basically what Potato described, but with video.


Edit, sorry Fignon, I thought your post was from the original poster.

[cgolvin]

Perfect function restored…thanks OP! (others too)

[oldpotatoe]

Perfect function restored…thanks OP! (others too)

Pleasure...:)