OT: Redwing boot quality RiP

[Duende]

With the recent boot thread, it’s clear folks here have some good knowledges on boots. What’s a good replacement for old school leather red wing boots?

Sorry to say, but after literally 40 years of being a customer, I am done. Another great American quality company loosing it’s credibility. I don’t know if they got bought or what happened, but their superbe leather has gone downhill. $400 pair of shoes and the leather is thinner, stretches out of form, and wrinkles.

Took them in, and the sales lady told me lots of folks are complaining.

Any good alternative recs out there? Thanks!

[false_Aest]

I've been using Belleville since college. They're wonderful if you don't mind the paramilitary look.

Danner has also been great ... but I haven't purchased from them in 5-7 years.

[kingpin75s]

Bummer to hear. Red Wing is pretty local to me and always had a great brand.

For quality boots, I like something in a Norwegian welt construction.

Peter Limmer & Sons make custom boots as well as have stock models. Great stuff.

https://www.limmercustomboot.com

[chunkylover53]

https://hebtro.co/product-category/footwear/

[gbcoupe]

Sorry to hear this. Have to say I've not noticed this yet. Been using them for 22 years. For me, the soles go way before the uppers and I'm not easy on them. Year round all weather use. Exposed to salt, dirt and grease. Often, crawling in gravel.
I'm due for a new pair in a few months. Hopefully they haven't gone cheap on quality. I'm lucky that I don't have to pay for them, or at least not much for top of the line.

[verticaldoug]

Does this include their heritage line too?

[saab2000]

Seems like Dr. Martens are the way to go forward.

https://dtpmhvbsmffsz.cloudfront.net/posts/2016/09/25/57e81d912599fed57b00bca2/m_57e81d922599fed57b00bca3.jpg

[fignon's barber]

Seems like Dr. Martens are the way to go forward.

https://dtpmhvbsmffsz.cloudfront.net/posts/2016/09/25/57e81d912599fed57b00bca2/m_57e81d922599fed57b00bca3.jpg


Agree. But you have to go up to the Heritage line that are still made in England. I have a pair still going strong that I bought in 1992. I've tried a couple pairs of their non-UK models, and the drop off in quality is noticeable.

[Duende]

Does this include their heritage line too?

The heritage line is what I’m referring to. The Beckman’s aka Gentleman Travelers.

Been using those models for the last 10-15 years. “Upgraded” to the Williston model this last go round.. as it was supposed to be the same leather, just a slightly different cut. More $$$ less quality. Went to the store to see if I should just go back to the Beckman model. And the leather on that model was not as good as it once was either. Thinner and I could tell, it would wrinkle too. :(

[gdw]

How do you intend to use them? Will they be used for hiking, backpacking, yardwork, etc or for general use around town?

[old_fat_and_slow]

Frye. Can be a bit on the spendy side.

[72gmc]

I don't have a pair, yet, but I'll recommend White's boots. They now sell several stock models from semi dress to work, and they say they are all rebuildable. Dad's had his Smokejumpers since he was a smokejumper in '68, White's rebuilt them at least once, and they have been his hunting boots all my life. Quality through and through.

[verticaldoug]

The heritage line is what I’m referring to. The Beckman’s aka Gentleman Travelers.

Been using those models for the last 10-15 years. “Upgraded” to the Williston model this last go round.. as it was supposed to be the same leather, just a slightly different cut. More $$$ less quality. Went to the store to see if I should just go back to the Beckman model. And the leather on that model was not as good as it once was either. Thinner and I could tell, it would wrinkle too. :(

I'll swing by the store in London on Carnby st. I grew up in MN, and swore by these but only really focus on the chukkas and iron rangers. I'll check it out if the workmanship or leather quality has gone down hill.

I'd hate to see this brand go the way of timberland.

[NHAero]

My Limmers were made in 1976. Been repaired and re-soled. The best!

Bummer to hear. Red Wing is pretty local to me and always had a great brand.

For quality boots, I like something in a Norwegian welt construction.

Peter Limmer & Sons make custom boots as well as have stock models. Great stuff.

https://www.limmercustomboot.com

[Duende]

I'll swing by the store in London on Carnby st. I grew up in MN, and swore by these but only really focus on the chukkas and iron rangers. I'll check it out if the workmanship or leather quality has gone down hill.

I'd hate to see this brand go the way of timberland.

They still look great. But if you’re familiar with the brands, you’ll find that the leather is not the same density. Stitching looks the same.

[Peter B]

Limmers, Whites, Russell Moccassin to name 3.

But my current pair of Red Wing 875s are holding up just fine. The crepe soles wear as fast as they ever did and I just had mine redone after a wee bit shy of a year's daily use. Local old skool cobbler had them back to me in excellent shape in 2 days for $70.

I had a pair several years ago that gave issues with stitching failures. Otherwise this current pair is going strong and looks to be on track to last about as well as the pairs I was buying for daily workwear 35+ years ago.

[54ny77]

had a pair of dynaforce's for several years, i beat the heck out of them on various construction and landscaping jobs and the steel toe saved my bacon on more than one occasion. held up well structurally, and gave 'em to one of the guys who worked with me. for whatever it's worth i went through a few other pairs of timberland workboots in that timeframe (to give a sense of how hard i am on boots). timberland quality today is about right for the weekend suburban lawn mower. in my opinion, for anyone else who needs to rely on them....they're pricey eventual throwaways. kinda like what you're saying about redwing. :mad:

that said, there used to be a model of timberland pro that was wonderful, had composite toe and anti-slip, anti-static sole. incredibly comfortable insole too, with memory foam. fairly light too (which matters). wish i had bought several pairs of those at the time (prob. 10-12 years ago at least), since when i wore through 'em (which took a few years), when i went to reorder they were no longer made.

[GScot]

Thorogood. I have a pair of 1892 roofers that are built like a tank, only a couple years in but I expect them to last decades with proper care. Next time I need general work boots with a wedge sole I'll buy their heritage line.

[Ken Robb]

Limmers, Whites, Russell Moccassin to name 3.

But my current pair of Red Wing 875s are holding up just fine. The crepe soles wear as fast as they ever did and I just had mine redone after a wee bit shy of a year's daily use. Local old skool cobbler had them back to me in excellent shape in 2 days for $70.

I had a pair several years ago that gave issues with stitching failures. Otherwise this current pair is going strong and looks to be on track to last about as well as the pairs I was buying for daily workwear 35+ years ago.

Many shoe experts recommend giving shoes/boots at least one day off between wearing to extend the lifespan of footwear. I guess time off lets the leather dry. I always did this with my rather "dressy" shoes that I wore for work and it seemed to work as I was able to resole them several times.

[scoobydrew]

Sorry to hear about that. My old pair of Red Wing 8111 (Iron Ranger) are holding up pretty well.

They're $$$, but check out Viberg, which are made in Canada with a storied heritage. The leather and stitching is fantastic. Not the same "workwear" aesthetic, but worth a look.

[Bruce K]

I’ve had good luck with both. Belleville and Bates.
They both have that military/law enforcement/first responder heritage and look but they are durable and provide excellent support.

Probably not 40 years worth....

BK

BK

[zzy]

Over a year later, my iron rangers are still like iron. Very tough break-in, but no quality issues to report. Excellent boots.

My Allen Edmonds, on the other hand, have become noticeably worse to the point when I took it up with them they just said that's natural handmade variation. Then I find out they've been recently outsourcing the initial construction out of the country, and finish them here just enough to call them MiUSA.

[Peter B]

Many shoe experts recommend giving shoes/boots at least one day off between wearing to extend the lifespan of footwear. I guess time off lets the leather dry. I always did this with my rather "dressy" shoes that I wore for work and it seemed to work as I was able to resole them several times.

Agreed. Just always been reluctant to drop ~$560 for two pairs every renewal. I do try to give them a break if they've gotten very wet. Fortunately I've been off the tools for a couple of decades so they don't see quite the abuse they once did.

[Plum Hill]

I live about seven miles from Belleville Boot, and mother worked there a couple of times, but my vote goes to Thorogood.
US made Danner has superb quality but they no longer fit my feet.

[Ttx1]

Bummer to hear. Red Wing is pretty local to me and always had a great brand.

For quality boots, I like something in a Norwegian welt construction.

Peter Limmer & Sons make custom boots as well as have stock models. Great stuff.

https://www.limmercustomboot.com

2nd - excellent suggestion, although not known for all the types of of footwear Redwing has historically offered. Definitely usable as workboots.

[HenryA]

Danner makes really good boots - I have multiple pairs. What will you use the boots for?

[merckxman]

I have a pair of French Heschung heavy duty lace up boots, have been excellent.

[Duende]

I had liked their heritage collection for use as nice everyday wear quality boots. No specific work activity or sporting use. Just like the vintage look and until recently the quality. I’m a less is more guy, so one pair of good boots serves me better than multiple pairs of other shoes.

[RFC]

What about something with more of a hiking boot design. For example, I've been wearing my Garmont Dragontail trail/approach shoes nearly every day for two years, including many rocky hikes, and they show virtually no wear. The Dragontail is a low cut boot/shoe, but Garmont also makes a range of higher boots with similar construction and Vibram soles.

[Birddog]

What about something with more of a hiking boot design. For example, I've been wearing my Garmont Dragontail trail/approach shoes nearly every day for two years, including many rocky hikes, and they show virtually no wear. The Dragontail is a low cut boot/shoe, but Garmont also makes a range of higher boots with similar construction and Vibram soles.

I've had decent luck with Garmont hiking/approach shoes for my work in construction. I'm lucky to get 6 mos service though. The soles are still good as is the stitching but they make my feet get tired so I cycle them through. I look for sales on STP or REI usually.

[HenryA]

I had liked their heritage collection for use as nice everyday wear quality boots. No specific work activity or sporting use. Just like the vintage look and until recently the quality. I’m a less is more guy, so one pair of good boots serves me better than multiple pairs of other shoes.

OK, Danner has a “style” line of boots that you might like. Otherwise look at the Danner Light or Light 2. There is some cross over there but to get the full goodness with a stout sole go with the above.

If you want real work boots they make them too, but it sounds like you are not looking that direction. Best I can tell you is try a pair and then if you love them watch for similar boots to go on sale. They have some good sales from time to time. If the boot is made on the same last, it’ll fit the same even if the name is different.

If you wear boots a lot, having two pairs and a Peet boot dryer will transform your life. Even with only one pair get the dryer. And look at their airthotic inserts. They don’t appear to be much at first but the difference is quite apparent when you actually wear them.

[Duende]

Thanks everyone! Some great help here. Think I’m going with the whites though, as they have a model almost identical to what I’m after. :)

[dzxc]

Im not "into" boots, but I was told I wear tennis shoes too much. On a friend's recommendation got some boots called Viberg, in brown. They're "service boots" and they look great. Ended up getting a second pair a couple weeks later in black "cordovan." Very happy with them, pick up a couple pairs of them. Only issue is each pair took a week to arrive.

[11.4]

Thanks everyone! Some great help here. Think I’m going with the whites though, as they have a model almost identical to what I’m after. :)

I had a pair of White Smokejumpers lace-to-toe boots bought in 1966 when I was twelve and after working my first fire line. I had to get another pair at 18 when I was full-size, and that pair served through over a dozen major forest fires, a couple floods, and years as an incident commander with FEMA (not my career but my sideline). I could wear them every day for a month and never had a problem. I bought a new pair this last fall and have already worn them through 31 days nonstop in California wildfires, which paradoxically meant they got soaked almost daily. Rub some new treatment in every few days after that kind of abuse and buff them out, use a brush and water to keep them really clean, and so far they haven't shown the slightest problem.

Do note that the Smokejumpers, especially the lace-to-toes, are an iconic boot for them and they're very proud of them. They do get the best leathers and the best boot makers. Some people I trust said that leathers are getting thinner because of how steers are being raised these days -- they get slaughtered as soon as they reach the requisite weight, where they used to get a few years before slaughter that toughened up their hides and thickened them a bit. Leather isn't always as good as it used to be and White buys the fully matured hides at a premium price for Smokejumpers. Not many people do that.

I've worn Wolverines, Redwings, Fryes, Danners, Ariats, you name it, plus all the major hiking lines like Zamberlan, Scarpa, Salewa, and so on. Boots have gotten more specialized and have changed their priorities a bit: The volume is in steel toed boots with non-skid soles because that's what commercial regs often require. Look at how many work boots are sold in the oilfield sector and it dwarfs the number that contractors or cabinetmakers might buy. Plus users in non-critical professions tend to want cheaper boots. An example is the crepe-soled Sears Craftsman mid-height -- it's a perennial favorite among contractors, concrete workers, and is almost always on sale for around $68. It lasts until the crepe is gone, doesn't crack, is comfortable, doesn't slip on wet roofing, and so on. Even loggers like them. Perhaps the telling point is when you look at bail-compatible crampon-accepting boots these days -- you have to go to true mountaineering boots to find recesses for crampon bindings and soles strong enough to support them.

[Duende]

I had a pair of White Smokejumpers lace-to-toe boots bought in 1966 when I was twelve and after working my first fire line. I had to get another pair at 18 when I was full-size, and that pair served through over a dozen major forest fires, a couple floods, and years as an incident commander with FEMA (not my career but my sideline). I could wear them every day for a month and never had a problem. I bought a new pair this last fall and have already worn them through 31 days nonstop in California wildfires, which paradoxically meant they got soaked almost daily. Rub some new treatment in every few days after that kind of abuse and buff them out, use a brush and water to keep them really clean, and so far they haven't shown the slightest problem.

Do note that the Smokejumpers, especially the lace-to-toes, are an iconic boot for them and they're very proud of them. They do get the best leathers and the best boot makers. Some people I trust said that leathers are getting thinner because of how steers are being raised these days -- they get slaughtered as soon as they reach the requisite weight, where they used to get a few years before slaughter that toughened up their hides and thickened them a bit. Leather isn't always as good as it used to be and White buys the fully matured hides at a premium price for Smokejumpers. Not many people do that.

I've worn Wolverines, Redwings, Fryes, Danners, Ariats, you name it, plus all the major hiking lines like Zamberlan, Scarpa, Salewa, and so on. Boots have gotten more specialized and have changed their priorities a bit: The volume is in steel toed boots with non-skid soles because that's what commercial regs often require. Look at how many work boots are sold in the oilfield sector and it dwarfs the number that contractors or cabinetmakers might buy. Plus users in non-critical professions tend to want cheaper boots. An example is the crepe-soled Sears Craftsman mid-height -- it's a perennial favorite among contractors, concrete workers, and is almost always on sale for around $68. It lasts until the crepe is gone, doesn't crack, is comfortable, doesn't slip on wet roofing, and so on. Even loggers like them. Perhaps the telling point is when you look at bail-compatible crampon-accepting boots these days -- you have to go to true mountaineering boots to find recesses for crampon bindings and soles strong enough to support them.

This cemented my decision. Thx for sharing! Great info

[Matt92037]

Whites are where it is at.

I have had 4 pairs of RW Heritages and for the price they are fine but for a couple bucks more Whites blow the RW out of the water.

I love Alden’s have 6 pairs but their prices are getting crazy.

Whites.....


I don't have a pair, yet, but I'll recommend White's boots. They now sell several stock models from semi dress to work, and they say they are all rebuildable. Dad's had his Smokejumpers since he was a smokejumper in '68, White's rebuilt them at least once, and they have been his hunting boots all my life. Quality through and through.

[verticaldoug]

I had liked their heritage collection for use as nice everyday wear quality boots. No specific work activity or sporting use. Just like the vintage look and until recently the quality. I’m a less is more guy, so one pair of good boots serves me better than multiple pairs of other shoes.

I stopped by the Redwing Store which had all the heritage shoes. The Williston are different in being a lined shoe and the single leather does feel thin. I am not a fan. However, the more traditional styles - blacksmith, iron ranger, Mocs all looked and felt the same.

I also saw a pair of the whiteboots semi-dress. Heavy as hell, but I am sure these are durable...

[72gmc]

Yes, Whites are heavier than other boots, but I also like the heavy doors on the Audis I’ve owned and I ride a steel bike that I’ve never weighed. I figure well-made stuff weighs what it weighs.

[dan_hudson]

Another vote for Danner. At least for construction style though they have a pretty broad catalog. I do back country construction and get a number of years out of a pair. Bonus points for the made-in-USA lineup if you're into that.

Coming from another former Red Wing wearer. RW's current versions just do not compare to what Danner offers circa 2019.


OK, Danner has a “style” line of boots that you might like. Otherwise look at the Danner Light or Light 2. There is some cross over there but to get the full goodness with a stout sole go with the above.

If you want real work boots they make them too, but it sounds like you are not looking that direction. Best I can tell you is try a pair and then if you love them watch for similar boots to go on sale. They have some good sales from time to time. If the boot is made on the same last, it’ll fit the same even if the name is different.

If you wear boots a lot, having two pairs and a Peet boot dryer will transform your life. Even with only one pair get the dryer. And look at their airthotic inserts. They don’t appear to be much at first but the difference is quite apparent when you actually wear them.

[Bentley]

I’ve got a pair, nice cordovan leather (horse leather not the color) and they are super nice. Super supportive to walk in all day

[skiezo]

I wear boots for work AKS work boots. I was a RW'er for years. They were the working mans boot for years. I wore them for well over 25 years as they lasted and the quality was great. Then about 6/8 years ago they changed their soles and I would get a split across the sole after a few months of use. RW would re-sole them for a cost of $80. That was not acceptable for a work boot that got wore for a few months.
I have switched to Thorogood boots and have never looked back. They do not take months to break in,are way more comfy for extended wear and last.
I buy two pair at a time and get a few years and a few re-soles out of each pair.
I wear mine for work(union pipefitter/welder) so they are wore hard.

[EricEstlund]

None of it matters if they don't fit. Go try a bunch on.

[chrismoustache]

+1 for Thorogoods.

I will also wear my bean boots for pretty much anything until it gets too humid in the summer.

The unlined version is made in usa, can be resoled, and don't cost an arm and a leg.

I ride flats on the MTB and commuter and I have no problem riding in them.