Rene Herse Juniper Ridge 650B x 48

[R3awak3n]

Could not resist after I got the email this morning so I ordered a pair.

Anyone try a pair yet? I am not convinced they will ride great on the road but interested to try and see how ok they are on the road and how great they are on gravel. I have been running gravel king slicks and they have been great but sometimes I do like a bit more grip in gravel. The GKs are pretty good on pavement, unlike the WTB byways which I absolutely hated the ride of.

[weisan]

I haven't tried one yet but at first glance, it looks like a Bruce Gordon RockNRoad in a wider 650b version or perhaps a Switchback Hills with improved gravel handling and protection.

[adampaiva]

I bought a pair too. They will be my trail-heavy-route tires, unless they are close to as good as advertised on pavement then maybe they will just stay on there full time.

I had tried the Soma Cazadero in 650x42 and liked them reasonably well but knew I really wanted them to be 48 mm. I like my 42mm slicks more than when I tried the 48 mm SBH's, but for rougher riding the extra volume with the extra tread will (hopefully) be a treat.

[R3awak3n]

yeah, I liked my 42mm slicks over 48s for pavement but really appreciated the extra width on dirt to I kept the 48s on, hopping the knobs work decent on pavement because would love to just keep em on that wheelset set up tubeless and keep my 700c wheel for more road oriented stuff.

Did you get the EL or just the standards? I will definitely have them at the cross mountain crusher and farmers

[adampaiva]

I went with standard. I don't intend on being gentle with them. haven't tried any Compass el's yet but I'm already worried enough about am I going to get a bunch a flats. Maybe next go-round when I need new slicks.

[Hilltopperny]

If these are anything like the Steilicoom Pass tires they should roll pretty well over pavement and dirt/gravel.

I haven't really given these a look yet, but they sound great. I have a set of SBH that I haven't tried along with the SK GK in 48mm and some Soma Grand Rando Sl 42mm that I'm debating for the Farmers Daughter.



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[SlowPokePete]

Interesting comment about the Byways...that's what I have on there now.

Farmer's Daughter on my mind...feeling like the Byways don't really have any more of an "effective" tread than the Terrevail Ramparts I have (but haven't tried yet), but there's no knob to those at all. I know the Byways don't do much but slide in the few muddy spots I encounter on the Aqueduct. I also remember what the FD was like last year.

Once the FD is over I'll be back on 700's, so "thinking" of something besides either of the two above (Byways or Ramparts) for that ride.

I have experience with GravelKIng SK's in 700, so maybe a set of those, or spring for a set of these new Compass ones being discussed here.

I think my issue is am I going to get that magical Compass ride from a knobby tire? I do see that the reports are they roll well on pavement, which comprises about two-thirds of my regular riding.

SPP™

[sparky33]

same.
Enjoyed the Steilacoom, and so I picked up some Pumpkin Ridge 650x42s that I haven't use yet because Babyshoes and SBHs work nicely. I do like the idea of a 48 knobby because 2.1 mtb tires can be tricky wrt clearances on some bikes.

Jan, could you consider making a knobby Snoqualmie 700x44ish?

If these are anything like the Steilicoom Pass tires they should roll pretty well over pavement and dirt/gravel.

I haven't really given these a look yet, but they sound great. I have a set of SBH that I haven't tried along with the SK GK in 48mm and some Soma Grand Rando Sl 42mm that I'm debating for the Farmers Daughter.

[dogrange]

Interesting comment about the Byways...that's what I have on there now.

Farmer's Daughter on my mind...feeling like the Byways don't really have any more of an "effective" tread than the Terrevail Ramparts I have (but haven't tried yet), but there's no knob to those at all. I know the Byways don't do much but slide in the few muddy spots I encounter on the Aqueduct. I also remember what the FD was like last year.

Once the FD is over I'll be back on 700's, so "thinking" of something besides either of the two above (Byways or Ramparts) for that ride.

I have experience with GravelKIng SK's in 700, so maybe a set of those, or spring for a set of these new Compass ones being discussed here.

I think my issue is am I going to get that magical Compass ride from a knobby tire? I do see that the reports are they roll well on pavement, which comprises about two-thirds of my regular riding.

SPP[emoji769]



SPP, for as much as you ride you owe it to yourself to try some of the Compass extra light fatties. For what I see on your IG feed, I would suggest the SBH extra light or BSP.


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[weisan]

Jan, could you consider making a knobby Snoqualmie 700x44ish?

Isn't that BG RnR?
http://www.bgcycles.com/new-page

Also made by Panaracer.

[R3awak3n]

Isn't that BG RnR?
http://www.bgcycles.com/new-page

Also made by Panaracer.

But probably not as supple

[Hilltopperny]

Isn't that BG RnR?

http://www.bgcycles.com/new-page



Also made by Panaracer.I've used the RnR and the Steilicoom Pass and the tread pattern is a lot different as well as the suppleness of the tire. I loved both, but the RnR reminded me of a 90's xc tire while the Steilicoom rides more like a road tire on pavement and it's spread out knobs seemed to really rip on dirt. The compass also shed dirt and mud a bit easier.

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[sparky33]

I've used the RnR and the Steilicoom Pass and the tread pattern is a lot different as well as the suppleness of the tire. I loved both, but the RnR reminded me of a 90's xc tire while the Steilicoom rides more like a road tire on pavement and it's spread out knobs seemed to really rip on dirt. The compass also shed dirt and mud a bit easier.


The WTB Resolute is the only 700c tire that comes close to the Steilacoom. Rolls, grips, sheds. A bit wider at ~43. It's my go-to 700c knobby now.

[Hilltopperny]

The WTB Resolute is the only 700c tire that comes close to the Steilacoom. Rolls, grips, sheds. A bit wider at ~43. It's my go-to 700c knobby now.Good to know. I'm pretty stocked up on my tire stash at the moment.

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[weisan]

But probably not as supple

I've used the RnR and the Steilicoom Pass and the tread pattern is a lot different as well as the suppleness of the tire. I loved both, but the RnR reminded me of a 90's xc tire while the Steilicoom rides more like a road tire on pavement and it's spread out knobs seemed to really rip on dirt. The compass also shed dirt and mud a bit easier.

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I hear you and I suspect that to be true. Everything is a trade off.

[Burning Pines]

The steilacooms are REALLY good. Great off road grip and roll much better than they have a right to on pavement. My only complaint is that they don’t come in 42 like the pumpkin ridge. Wish I had a 650b bike I could use the juniper ridge on, they look awesome.

I also have a pair of cazaderos but in 700 x 50 and I they roll decent and have solid off road cornering grip. They also wear better than the compass offerings because of the raised center tread.

[witcombusa]

Jan thinks a $71 tire "is an affordable option".
I think they are overpriced and over hyped.
And yes, I have bought and ridden some of the now Rene Herse tires.

[BikeNY]

Interesting tire indeed. I know I'm in the minority, but I actually with they were even wider! I'm a fan of the Compass tires after using a few sets of their slicks. Light, comfy, great grip, no flats, worth the cost in my opinion. I've become addicted to volume though, so I'm now running Schwalbe Big One 27.5x2.35 on my 'Road' bike, and very happy with them as well. I generally don't ride in really muddy conditions, so the micro knobs work OK. They worked fine at last years D2R2. The Schwalbe Big One and G One come in a number of widths, diameters, and tread patterns that are worth a look. Nice light casing and work great tubeless as well. Also not cheap, but easier to find deal on than the Compass tires. I'll probably run them for the Farmer's Daughter, unless it looks like it's going to be really sloppy.

[spoonrobot]

For all the fluffy marketing about how fast Compass/Rene Herse knobbies are on pavement it's curious there's no testing done by the company's marketing arm (Bicycle Quarterly) as there was when the slick tread tires were released.

I found the Steilacoom's to be one of the slower tires I've used when riding my preferred "gravel pressure" of 20-25% sag on pavement, based on my personal rolldown testing. The knobs just don't seem to handle lower pressures very well from a speed perspective. They were even slower than the 55mm Schwalbe Racing Ralphs I was using previously.

My thought is most knobbies are not very supple as too much is undampened suspension and does weird things at speed, so when riders get a supple knobbie they think it rolls a lot faster than it actually does. Sorta the same as higher pressure increasing the sensation of speed without being any faster.

Pumpkin Ridge looks like it would be a decent smaller mud tire but not great for general use.

[R3awak3n]

Jan thinks a $71 tire "is an affordable option".
I think they are overpriced and over hyped.
And yes, I have bought and ridden some of the now Rene Herse tires.

100% disagree that they are over hyped. They are excellent tires, nothing like it. Are they affordable? no, overprice? depends. If there was something similar for cheaper then yes but I don't think there is, rene/compass tires ride much better than the competition imo. I love gravel kings, they are half the price but they are not as nice, not even close.

I just took these out for a quick stroll. Won't give a review till tomorrow ride as I just went around the block, I wanted to see how they roll on pavement. They are pretty awesome on pavement, very comfortable, felt as fast as the gravel kings (slicks) I took off, maybe actually felt better... Pretty surprised and happy, it had been a while since I was on a compass tire and had forgotten how amazing they ride. Will do a bigger ride tomorrow, some gravel maybe and its suppose to rain so it will be a nice test ride.

They are set up tubeless on my ATR 650. They went in fairly easy, just like every other TL tire I have. I always have to do the tube trick but they always work. They ended being a bit undersized at 46.5mm, I expect them to grow to 48mm though.

https://scontent-lga3-1.cdninstagram.com/vp/c6e20b6b07a01fb9b6917a9235c60059/5D2A8B03/t51.2885-15/e35/54511771_129601008109638_2888287120163723445_n.jpg ?_nc_ht=scontent-lga3-1.cdninstagram.com

[Jaybee]

Those look pretty sweet to me. Not a lot of options in the knobby 650b 47-50mm space - Senderos are a baby MTB tire with the accompanying rolling resistance. Gravelking SK, WTB Venture, Terrene Elwood, and Teravail Sparwood are more semi-slicks. The new Teravail Rutland might be the closest, though I doubt you are getting the famous Compass/Herse ride out of that tire.

FWIW, all the tires mentioned above save GKs are in the 65-75 $/tire range.

Only question to me is durability of the casing if you are going to be riding rocky singletrack.

[R3awak3n]

yes, these kind of tires are expensive. Only difference btw compass/reneherse and other companies is that some of the other tires do go on sale once in a while, compass I have never seen on sale.

Planned a ride tomorrow, raining and through this awesome gravel climb I had to walk last time on 32s because the mud was just making me sink, should be a nice test for these tires.

[SlowPokePete]

SPP, for as much as you ride you owe it to yourself to try some of the Compass extra light fatties. For what I see on your IG feed, I would suggest the SBH extra light or BSP.


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I've had the Snoqualmie Pass on my Ahearne, but I'm not sure that's the right bike for feeling the benefits of these tires. I also had some issues with durability.

That said, I definitely would like to try a set of BJP's on the 650b wheels. But no matter what, the 650b wheelset is heavier than the I9's with carbon rims (700), plus the minimal existent drag from the dynamo.

SPP™

[John H.]

What is better about this tire than say a Schwable Thunder Burt 2.1? I have not used the Herse- But I find the Schwable's to be good on road or dirt.

[Hilltopperny]

What is better about this tire than say a Schwable Thunder Burt 2.1? I have not used the Herse- But I find the Schwable's to be good on road or dirt.I've ridden Thunder Burts on a rigid mountain bike and they are great, but the Steilicoom Pass which is essentially a 700c 38mm with the same tread road better on the road surface than the Schwalbes. They don't ride like the supple file tread, but they are closest I've experienced with a knobby tread.

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[John H.]

Good feedback that helps.
I guess Maxxis is coming out with a 27.5x48mm Rambler.
The 700c Rambler rolls better than anything else with knobs that I have tried- So I may try the 650b version when it comes out.

Though my motto is 700c for speed and 650b for play-


I've ridden Thunder Burts on a rigid mountain bike and they are great, but the Steilicoom Pass which is essentially a 700c 38mm with the same tread road better on the road surface than the Schwalbes. They don't ride like the supple file tread, but they are closest I've experienced with a knobby tread.

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[owly]

Better than ThunderBurt on the pavement eh?

Might have to put one in the rear once it wears out.

[Hilltopperny]

Good feedback that helps.

I guess Maxxis is coming out with a 27.5x48mm Rambler.

The 700c Rambler rolls better than anything else with knobs that I have tried- So I may try the 650b version when it comes out.



Though my motto is 700c for speed and 650b for play-What is better about this tire than say a Schwable Thunder Burt 2.1? I have not used the Herse- But I find the Schwable's to be good on road or dirt.I've ridden Thunder Burts on a rigid mountain bike and they are great, but the Steilicoom Pass which is essentially a 700c 38mm with the same tread road better on the rosurface than the Schwalbes. They don't ride like the supple file tread, but they are closest I've experienced with a knobby tread.

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I agree 100%.

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[simplemind]

I love the idea of 48's but just can't get that width in the back, so I run the WTB Resolute's F&R (42mm). Have you tried these? They roll quite well and are also durable.


Good feedback that helps.
I guess Maxxis is coming out with a 27.5x48mm Rambler.
The 700c Rambler rolls better than anything else with knobs that I have tried- So I may try the 650b version when it comes out.

Though my motto is 700c for speed and 650b for play-

I've ridden Thunder Burts on a rigid mountain bike and they are great, but the Steilicoom Pass which is essentially a 700c 38mm with the same tread road better on the rosurface than the Schwalbes. They don't ride like the supple file tread, but they are closest I've experienced with a knobby tread.

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I agree 100%.

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[simplemind]

I've become addicted to volume though, so I'm now running Schwalbe Big One 27.5x2.35 on my 'Road' bike, and very happy with them as well. I generally don't ride in really muddy conditions, so the micro knobs work OK. They worked fine at last years D2R2. The Schwalbe Big One and G One come in a number of widths, diameters, and tread patterns that are worth a look. Nice light casing and work great tubeless as well. Also not cheap, but easier to find deal on than the Compass tires. I'll probably run them for the Farmer's Daughter, unless it looks like it's going to be really sloppy.

You have an interesting "road bike" that can fit these! I am testing the Schwalbe G-ONE SPEED in 27.5x2.35 and getting a bit of "self steer". Have you experience that before?

[hobbanero]

if you look at the rolling resistance tests (eg. bicyclerollingresistance.com), it seems like the casing is really important...and can be a bigger factor than the tread. Schwalbe mtb tires with medium knobs will roll better than most other brands small knobbed race tires, because their casings are very supple. The Compass/Rene Herse tires have very supple (but therefore delicate) casings.

[R3awak3n]

I will believe that as the thread on these is way more hardcore than WTB byways and man did I HATE the byways.... They were just so aweful on pavement. Don't get me wrong, I definitely knew I was ridding threads and there was a bit more noise than slicks but felt great.

[SlowPokePete]

I had the byways on for about 500 miles.

Not overly impressed...in bits of mud the small side knobs did little.

the guy I bought the 65ob wheels from included a set of Teravail Rampage light/supple so I put them on and rode about 25 miles today...felt a little nicer all around, but I'm sure just as sketchy with a little mud and definitely not sure about durability .


SPP™

[dogrange]

if you look at the rolling resistance tests (eg. bicyclerollingresistance.com), it seems like the casing is really important...and can be a bigger factor than the tread. Schwalbe mtb tires with medium knobs will roll better than most other brands small knobbed race tires, because their casings are very supple. The Compass/Rene Herse tires have very supple (but therefore delicate) casings.



They ain’t all that delicate.


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[R3awak3n]

They ain’t all that delicate.


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I once thought they were more delicate that say a gravel king but after cutting up a bunch of GKs I think the compasses are about the same as comparable tires.

[stien]

You have an interesting "road bike" that can fit these! I am testing the Schwalbe G-ONE SPEED in 27.5x2.35 and getting a bit of "self steer". Have you experience that before?

That’s a common occurrence on fat (snow) bikes with low pressures on pavement. You might need to air up a bit to get rid of that.

[spoonrobot]

I once thought they were more delicate that say a gravel king but after cutting up a bunch of GKs I think the compasses are about the same as comparable tires.

The gravelkings have a far superior sidewall as far as durability is concerned. The exterior rubber composition is significantly more cut resistant than anything else I've seen on the market. It works well for resisting cuts from rocks, glass and other road hazards without adding much if any rolling resistance. They also don't start leaking sealant after 1000-1500 miles like Compass tires.

I've yet to run a Compass tire through it's lifecycle without broken cords, sidewall weeping and excessive sealant absorption. I find the tradeoffs worth it because the tires roll so well and so far have yet to experience a flat in 6000 miles.

[R3awak3n]

The gravelkings have a far superior sidewall as far as durability is concerned. The exterior rubber composition is significantly more cut resistant than anything else I've seen on the market. It works well for resisting cuts from rocks, glass and other road hazards without adding much if any rolling resistance. They also don't start leaking sealant after 1000-1500 miles like Compass tires.

I've yet to run a Compass tire through it's lifecycle without broken cords, sidewall weeping and excessive sealant absorption. I find the tradeoffs worth it because the tires roll so well and so far have yet to experience a flat in 6000 miles.

Seems like new compasses are better with sidewall seeping. As far as GKs being more durable than compass, I am not so sure about that. I thought that too but did have a lot of cuts on my GKs in just a few miles.. they were the 32s though so can't compare with compass which I have only used the bigger sizes.

[R3awak3n]

https://scontent-lga3-1.cdninstagram.com/vp/6168d2593a8c92d4be80b7edd89259f0/5D3E1EB9/t51.2885-15/e35/54512738_156533872036090_5338889916849430238_n.jpg ?_nc_ht=scontent-lga3-1.cdninstagram.com


A few rides on these tires. I am very happy with them. I feel no reason to run slicks on these wheels any longer, these feel as fast as similar sized slicks. Maybe they aren't, I did not conduct any scientific test but to me they feel as fast so I am going to roll on these instead of a switchback hill or GK 48mm.

I have not have as many miles on gravel (had to cut ride short cuz wife is sick) but the little gravel I used these on, they also felt great. I mean I was expecting that, having more grip than a slick... that is the point. Standing up on steep grades and no as much slippage, they feel planted on descents. No surprises here, hey its a knobbie.

On pavement I am happy with them BUT, hey, its a knobbie... Its loud and I can definitely feel like I am ridding on a knobbies. Does not feel like its robbing me of any speed and its as comfortable as any big vol 650b tire I have been on but I can feel it over pavement.

[sparky33]

Look over there-->https://janheine.wordpress.com/2019/05/22/new-tires-hurricane-ridge-and-endurance-casings/

new RH Endurance casing.
and a 700x42 knobby.

it's a good day.

[xeladragon]

About to pull the trigger on a pair of Juniper Ridges. But before I do, need to decide on which casing.

Is Extralight a stupid idea? Lol.

I'm currently riding some Terrene Elwoods with their Light casing... no issues yet.

I've only ever ridden the standard casing (BJPs) for RH/Compass tires.

Or because there's no weight penalty between standard and Endurance, just pay a few extra bucks for the latter for the extra puncture protection?

Hmm...

[donevwil]

About to pull the trigger on a pair of Juniper Ridges. But before I do, need to decide on which casing.

Is Extralight a stupid idea? Lol.

I'm currently riding some Terrene Elwoods with their Light casing... no issues yet.

I've only ever ridden the standard casing (BJPs) for RH/Compass tires.

Or because there's no weight penalty between standard and Endurance, just pay a few extra bucks for the latter for the extra puncture protection?

Hmm...

From R3's Open thread in Production bike:

They are indeed. They are fantastic, no complaints at all. They are great on gravel, and roll really nice on the road which is a surprise to me. Just standard casing for me. I got them right when they got released but would consider endurance casing for next time (there are some spots I can see where i hit some rocks)

[HTupolev]

But before I do, need to decide on which casing.

Is Extralight a stupid idea? Lol.
I've only ever ridden the standard casing (BJPs) for RH/Compass tires.
Extralight is a lot of money for a fairly small benefit, but I wouldn't necessarily worry about it if you've been using the standard casing without issue. The sidewalls on neither are tough at all.

Or because there's no weight penalty between standard and Endurance, just pay a few extra bucks for the latter for the extra puncture protection?
There's no weight penalty, but the Endurance casing is less supple. If you want the protection (and presumably better tubeless longevity), go for it.

[R3awak3n]

Personally I would never get ELs, but I am not chasing weight (the bike is already 17 lbs I think I am good with that). As doneville mentioned, on my tires, that have probably less than 1000 miles there are some little areas in the sidewalls that I can see will eventually become a problem. Tire still tubeless and still holding up as the day I put sealant in it but i would probably go endurance just because to me I value that over suppleness and speed.

I just rode this tire this weekend, all on ROAD... need to test this bike out for next week gravel ride since I just put it together and want to make sure its all good, this tire is totally great on pavement, amazes me every time (yes, its slower than a road bike tire but very adequate for some road ridding, no slower than the same size sleek compass)

[sparky33]

Is Extralight a stupid idea? Lol.

I'm currently riding some Terrene Elwoods with their Light casing... no issues yet.

I've only ever ridden the standard casing (BJPs) for RH/Compass tires.

Extralight is not stupid... unless you are planning to thrash the tires on sharp rocks or if getting an occasional flat is a big problem or if they just make you uneasy. How much is 60g and extra supple worth to you?

Standard 530g
Extralight 470g
Endurance 530g

I took a trip recently where I needed to avoid any sort of tire failure, and the Endurance casing (Hurricane Ridge) was flawless among some gnarly rocks and such. Back at home, I am enjoying the tires like any other RH/Compass tires. They ride nice - still supple. They retain sealant a bit better too.

The extralight Compass/RH tires have also served me well. I've probably wrecked 1 or 2 extralight tires out of dozens, and this is a passing grade for my needs. fwiw, I feel like the Extralight tires age a bit better if you ride them regularly, and I think this is because the casing likes regular sloshing of the sealant and dislikes pooled still sealant (in a resting tire), so maybe it is worth considering the expected usage frequency too.

[R3awak3n]

Extralight is not stupid... unless you are planning to thrash the tires on sharp rocks or if getting a flat is a big problem or if they just make you uneasy. How much is 60g and extra supple worth to you?

Standard 530g
Extralight 470g
Endurance 530g

I took a trip recently where I needed to avoid any sort of tire failure, and the Endurance casing (Hurricane Ridge) was flawless among some gnarly rocks and such. Back at home, I am enjoying the tires like any other RH/Compass tires. They ride nice - still supple. They retain sealant a bit better too.

The extralight Compass/RH tires have also served me well. I've probably wrecked 1 or 2 extralight tires out of dozens, and this is a passing grade for my needs.

I agree with you but gravel tires with knobs, you are going to trash them on some rocks I hope :banana: