Request for Help - Does anyone know this Serotta Concours?

[Tonger]

Hello All,

I know it's probably bad form to have your first post as a noob on the boad be request for help but I thought that this would be where I might be able to get some meaningful help with my situation.

I am the high eBay "winner" for this auction and would be delighted to complete the transaction, but for multiple reasons have come to believe that this may not represent a legitimate auction. The last thing that I want to do is insult the seller but my request for an escrow transaction have gone unreplied. Actually, all of my communications have gone unreplied. The only thing that I have received from the seller is a request for payment.

Therefore my question for the forum is: Does anyone know this bike? I know that a lot of you keep up with auctions etc and thought that someone may have seen this auction advertised before. Also, is there any way to check the serial # of the bike to see if the seller is the original owner?

I know I'm probably a day late and a dollar short but I'd really appreciate any help that I could get. I have also written customer support at eBay and am awaiting their reply.

Here's the link:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120056577263

Hopefully my images will attach. This is probably what I get for having champagne tastes on a beer budget...

Respectfully,

Frank
Atlanta, GA

The eBay listing text follows:

tem Specifics - Road Bikes & Frames
Brand: Serotta Complete Bike/Frame: Complete Bike
Model Year: 2001 Frame Material: Titanium
Frame Size: 58 cm Condition: Used

58cm Concours Ti (this model is the same as the Legend except the top-tube is not swaged):

Frame: circa 2001 (serial CT 58 602)
"Stock" Geometry: 57.5 TT 73SA/73.5HA pump peg
Fork: F1 carbon (painted to match)
RDeraillier: Record 10 (mid-cage)
FDerailleur: Record
Cassette: Record 10 13-29
Seat tube is 58cm (c-c). Standover is ~83-84cm
Shifters: Record 10 carbon
Crank: FSA Team Carbon 53/39 172.5
Wheels: Mavic Ksyrium SSCSL (2005) with Michelin Pro Race (23c) (can substitute Bontrager Race Lites for $250 less)
Seatpost: Thomson
Saddle: Fizik Arione
Ritchey Comp stem 110 +/-6deg
Headset: Record threadless (1 inch)
Handlebar: TTT 42cm (c-c)
Pedals: NONE

Bike is in very good condition (chainstay decals and tubing sticker are worn). Most components are less than 3 years old. Bike will be professionally boxed. I would estimate about 5,000 miles on the frame with about 1500-2000 on the components. Weight is ~18lbs

Verified Cashiers Check or Money Order is acceptable payment method. Shipping is within 5 days of reciept of payment in any case. Be aware: This item ships in two large packages, buyer pays actual shipping cost. USA shipping $$ is $35.66

[Ahneida Ride]

1200 seems like a spectacular price ...

[Serpico]

that's a really nice concours, I'll trade you for mine :rolleyes:

[Ginger]

I dunno...it just ended yesterday....That might seem time enough to reply, but the seller's id is jr "from work" whether that means anything or not. Seller's been a member since 99...has 24 feedbacks, looks like mostly from buying things. They might not be totally clear on what you're requesting. Can you do the escrow through paypal?

[Serpico]

fwiw, I don't think it's a scam

1) a scammer wouldn't hack an account with only 24 transactions

2) a scammer wouldn't sell a serotta concours, they'd have a pic of a trek madone and some lame text about lance armstrong

3) you said you received an email "requesting money", I believe that's an auto-generated email from ebay. the seller is probably out for the weekend and doesn't even know yet. also consider it is thanksgiving weekend, he might've went out of town.

4) scammer text doesn't look like that. it's usually copied from a website, or if they write it it doesn't sound like they know anything "bike full gruppo campagnolo, wheels fast, this handlebar is high alloy, stem is machined cnc for proper planing, pneumatic trail is 5.8-3/4.456" etc

nothing looks like a scam to me, I would just wait until the guy checks his email

[Ken Robb]

I'd say it should be a $2000-2200 bike so you have a screaming good deal here so---maybe the seller is really disappointed in the price it achieved?
Just a guess--isn't the serial number very low for a 2001 frame? I think a Concours is a fine frame no matter the year so I think you should pursue this unless you really find it to be a scam. As the other guy said a lot of folks may be off-line over the holiday weekend so see what response you get by Tuesday. All I can say is you're lucky this wasn't "just Dave T's size". :)

[Steelhead]

I think that it's a legit transaction - and if it is you got a good deal. The invoice was most likely automatically generated - and the guy may just not gotten around to getting back on line and checking his ebay.....it is a holiday weekend.

The bike can't belong to a member here because none of the photos are in front of a white garage door. ;)

[d_douglas]

Just pulling a Dave T. on ya.

It sounds legit and a good deal. When I saw the subject title, I was expecting ot to be photos of my concours ripped off and being sold (it has happened many times).

I love the horizontal TT - I wish mine would 'right' itself and rotate 4deg clockwise - then I would love it. If you wanna trade for a 2003, let me know!!

DD

[Ginger]

As it is a private auction, we can't see how many feedbacks you have on ebay, but consider that if you only have a few and you requested an escrow payment, the seller might be wondering if he's being scammed...



Oh Yeah...

Tonger...

Welcome to the forum! Congratulations on your new to you Serotta!

[big shanty]

private auctions are way too sketchy for me.

[Serotta PETE]

Great looking bike at a very fair price.

I have never heard of an escrow account on a sale on e-bay. If you can get it great but on all the bikes I have sold, I never have done an escrow.

e-bay, as others used items, always need e to be looked carefully.

If you want to make sure you are ok, than have a local SEROTTA dealer check it out as soon as or before you get it.




, but that bike will sell in the spring if you do not like it.

Hello All,

I know it's probably bad form to have your first post as a noob on the boad be request for help but I thought that this would be where I might be able to get some meaningful help with my situation.

I am the high eBay "winner" for this auction and would be delighted to complete the transaction, but for multiple reasons have come to believe that this may not represent a legitimate auction. The last thing that I want to do is insult the seller but my request for an escrow transaction have gone unreplied. Actually, all of my communications have gone unreplied. The only thing that I have received from the seller is a request for payment.

Therefore my question for the forum is: Does anyone know this bike? I know that a lot of you keep up with auctions etc and thought that someone may have seen this auction advertised before. Also, is there any way to check the serial # of the bike to see if the seller is the original owner?

I know I'm probably a day late and a dollar short but I'd really appreciate any help that I could get. I have also written customer support at eBay and am awaiting their reply.

Here's the link:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120056577263

Hopefully my images will attach. This is probably what I get for having champagne tastes on a beer budget...

Respectfully,

Frank
Atlanta, GA

The eBay listing text follows:

tem Specifics - Road Bikes & Frames
Brand: Serotta Complete Bike/Frame: Complete Bike
Model Year: 2001 Frame Material: Titanium
Frame Size: 58 cm Condition: Used

58cm Concours Ti (this model is the same as the Legend except the top-tube is not swaged):

Frame: circa 2001 (serial CT 58 602)
"Stock" Geometry: 57.5 TT 73SA/73.5HA pump peg
Fork: F1 carbon (painted to match)
RDeraillier: Record 10 (mid-cage)
FDerailleur: Record
Cassette: Record 10 13-29
Seat tube is 58cm (c-c). Standover is ~83-84cm
Shifters: Record 10 carbon
Crank: FSA Team Carbon 53/39 172.5
Wheels: Mavic Ksyrium SSCSL (2005) with Michelin Pro Race (23c) (can substitute Bontrager Race Lites for $250 less)
Seatpost: Thomson
Saddle: Fizik Arione
Ritchey Comp stem 110 +/-6deg
Headset: Record threadless (1 inch)
Handlebar: TTT 42cm (c-c)
Pedals: NONE

Bike is in very good condition (chainstay decals and tubing sticker are worn). Most components are less than 3 years old. Bike will be professionally boxed. I would estimate about 5,000 miles on the frame with about 1500-2000 on the components. Weight is ~18lbs

Verified Cashiers Check or Money Order is acceptable payment method. Shipping is within 5 days of reciept of payment in any case. Be aware: This item ships in two large packages, buyer pays actual shipping cost. USA shipping $$ is $35.66

[christian]

Looks legit to me - it certainly doesn't have any telltale signs...

If you're worried, how about having a local friend pick it up and box/ship it to you?

- Christian

[93legendti]

It is a holiday weekend--could be he has better things to do than sit in front of his computer--he could be on a plane or ina car travelling, right? I would be doing something more fun if I hadn't finally caught the family cold. :)

In my experience, eBay works best if you ask the escrow/serial number/verification questions before you bid and certainly before you win. You could always go to eBay's "help" link and find the link for "contact information" and get the seller's name and phone number and call him.

[barry1021]

I disagree with most of the comments above. To me, the FIVE YEAR GAP since the last transaction (and NONE under this name) are huge warning signs. Since you got a good deal I would insist on escrow at your expense (and it won't be cheap). There is no reason for him not to do escrow if he is legitimate and it wont cost him anything. Despite what a previous note said, escrow is common for large ticket items and there are plenty of legitimate services. Of course, you should have discussed all of this with him before you bid and won, and he has the right to refuse you and insist u complete the auction. I may be more cautious than most but I have done over 500 auctions without a hitch

B21

[dave thompson]

Tonger:

There are a couple of small red flags in the auction that would concern me. First, that the seller has had no activity since 2001 might make me a little suspicious that the seller I.D. may have been hijacked. Second, that the bidders I.D.s are held private, which is often a trick of eBay scammers. Third, he states that the bike will be shipped in two large boxes yet freight will come to only $35.66.

That very same Concours was offered for sale here in the classifieds in March of this year ( http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=15809&highlight=concours ) I'm not familiar with the seller. I would e-mail this seller to see if he's the eBayer or who he sold the bike to. You e-mail him by clicking on his user name and use the e-mail feature.

If it were me, I would explain to the seller why I'm feeling reluctant to proceed unless there are some assurances that things are correct. I would ask him to provide his bona fides (verifiable address, phone number etc.) and talk to him until I could make a rational decision on which direction to take. If I were a seller and was approached by a buyer in this method, I don't think I would be offended knowing what I do about eBay scams.

Proceed cautiously, protect yourself, be polite with the seller and be prepared to buy the bike if the answers are correct.

[93legendti]

Tonger:

There are a couple of small red flags in the auction that would concern me. First, that the seller has had no activity since 2001 might make me a little suspicious that the seller I.D. may have been hijacked. Second, that the bidders I.D.s are held private, which is often a trick of eBay scammers. Third, he states that the bike will be shipped in two large boxes yet freight will come to only $35.66.

That very same Concours was offered for sale here in the classifieds in March of this year ( http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=15809&highlight=concours ) I'm not familiar with the seller. I would e-mail this seller to see if he's the eBayer or who he sold the bike to. You e-mail him by clicking on his user name and use the e-mail feature.

If it were me, I would explain to the seller why I'm feeling reluctant to proceed unless there are some assurances that things are correct. I would ask him to provide his bona fides (verifiable address, phone number etc.) and talk to him until I could make a rational decision on which direction to take. If I were a seller and was approached by a buyer in this method, I don't think I would be offended knowing what I do about eBay scams.

Proceed cautiously, protect yourself, be polite with the seller and be prepared to buy the bike if the answers are correct.

He should be more than prepared, his winning bid was a promise to pay.

[Tonger]

All,

Thank you very much for your insight and advice. I have looked at the ad that Dave T alerted me to and it is the exact same ad and bike. That was a huge find and I am indebted you Dave and the forum. At your suggestion I have e-mailed the individual that sold the bike earlier this year for insight before sending payment to the eBay seller.

Unfortunately, this is looking more and more like it will not pan out. I'd love for it to be legit because I'd love to have the bike and will definitely honor the terms of the auction. The seller had contacted me from his private e-mail at the immediate close of the auction but did not reply to either my information inquiry during the auction or my request for communication after the close of the auction. I have offered to pay for the escrow charges but am still waiting to hear back from the seller who is offering 30 days money back as part of the auction.

Thanks for helping out a stranger. Ya'll are great and I hope to get to know you soon! I'll definitely let you know what eBay says and how it turns out.

Dave - if you're ever in Atlanta, the Guinness is on me...

Appreciatively,

Frank
Atlanta, GA

[93legendti]

Don't give up yet. I sold a Bike Friday a few weeks ago. The buyer did not answer most of my emails, but sure enough his USPS money order came 4 days after the auction ended. I shipped the bike the same day and 3 days later when he got the bike he left me positive feedback. He then emailed me and said he guessed he should read his email more often...go figure. Good Luck!

[dave thompson]

All,

Thank you very much for your insight and advice. I have looked at the ad that Dave T alerted me to and it is the exact same ad and bike. That was a huge find and I am indebted you Dave and the forum. At your suggestion I have e-mailed the individual that sold the bike earlier this year for insight before sending payment to the eBay seller.

Unfortunately, this is looking more and more like it will not pan out. I'd love for it to be legit because I'd love to have the bike and will definitely honor the terms of the auction. The seller had contacted me from his private e-mail at the immediate close of the auction but did not reply to either my information inquiry during the auction or my request for communication after the close of the auction. I have offered to pay for the escrow charges but am still waiting to hear back from the seller who is offering 30 days money back as part of the auction.

Thanks for helping out a stranger. Ya'll are great and I hope to get to know you soon! I'll definitely let you know what eBay says and how it turns out.

Dave - if you're ever in Atlanta, the Guinness is on me...

Appreciatively,

Frank
Atlanta, GA
Frank:

Contact the seller through the 'Contact Seller' feature on eBay. This is another way to ensure that the seller is legit. If it's a hi-jacked I.D., he won't be able to receive or reply to your contacts using that method. You might, through his private e-mail, ask him to either contact you or reply to you via the 'Contact Seller'. Good luck! I hope it's a legitimate deal. You'll wind up with a hell of a bike at a hell of a price!

Now I need your name address and phone number so I can collect the Guinness! :D

Dave

[Tonger]

All,

After a good bit of detective work with tremendous help from you all on the forum, I have tracked down the both the original owner of the bike and gentleman that he sold it to. The eBay purchaser of the bike in April was kind enough to call me back and stated that he has the bike in his possession and that he had not listed it on eBay. This means that the eBay "seller" in Virginia Beach is not legitimate and that it was a sham auction. He simply hijacked someone's eBay ID and copied the original eBay bike listing. Maybe that's why he has never gotten back to me...

I am still waiting for the eBay people to respond. Hopefully they will catch this guy and prevent him from taking advantage of anyone. He had a concurrent auction for a nice carbon fiber bike and I hope that the "winner" of that auction did not get hosed. In the mean time, I thank you all for your guidance and assistance which has prevented me from making a very expensive mistake. This means that my search for my very own Serotta continues and that I'll try to be more cautious the next time around.

In the mean time, if you know of a good 58-59 cm bike I'd appreciate it if you could drop me a line. I have to say that I am most impressed by the kindness shown by the forum members to a complete stranger requesting help.

Thanks again!

Frank

[93legendti]

Wow, glad I was wrong! Here's a nice bike or 2:http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=22962&highlight=merckx

[dave thompson]

Frank:

Glad it worked out that it didn't cost you wasted money. Sorry that it didn't get you the Serotta you wanted.

Post a WTB (want to buy) ad on our classifieds here. You might be surprised at the response you get.

[BumbleBeeDave]

I'm also glad you managed to get things sorted out and that the Forum could be of help to you!

But I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for eBay to get back to me, if I were you.

BBD

[ThasFACE]

Wow. I came perilously close to bidding on this bike. Glad that I didn't since I'm not so sure that I would have caught onto the scam. Scary.

[Serpico]

wow, I'm humbled to have been so wrong

apparently eBay scams are getting a LOT more sophisticated

my apologies for the bad advice :o

[DfCas]

I'm glad Tonger beat the scam,and I have a question.

Since private auctions are a favorite tool of scammers,why does Ebay allow private auctions,and what is the purpose?

I refuse to bid on a private auction,but others may not be aware of the danger.

Maybe this should be a seperate thread.

dan

[Tonger]

Serpico - No problem. I appreciate your good intentions. :beer:

I guess since I stumbled into this I don't really understand the rationale behind a scammer specifying a private auction. How does keeping the bidder id's private really help the scammer get away with anything?

I'm not going to bid on private auctions anymore but it'd be nice to know why it's not a good idea...

Tonger

[Big Dan]

Serpico - No problem. I appreciate your good intentions. :beer:

I guess since I stumbled into this I don't really understand the rationale behind a scammer specifying a private auction. How does keeping the bidder id's private really help the scammer get away with anything?

I'm not going to bid on private auctions anymore but it'd be nice to know why it's not a good idea...

Tonger

The private auction prevents someone from alerting the bidder of a fraudulent auction.
That's pretty much a bad sign on .... :)

[dave thompson]

The reason that eBay scammers often 'hide' the ID of the bidders is to prevent the bidders from being contacted by outsiders who could warn them of a fraudulent auction. When the bidders eBay ID not hidden, by clicking on their ID you can bring up a "Contact Memeber" link.

[93legendti]

wow, I'm humbled to have been so wrong

apparently eBay scams are getting a LOT more sophisticated

my apologies for the bad advice :o

My apologies as well.

[Serotta PETE]

I would like to thank everyone for educatiing me on this type of thing. Wow, i am in IT and am still amazed at the steps folks go to - to steal from others...

Pete

[dave thompson]

I would like to thank everyone for educatiing me on this type of thing. Wow, i am in IT and am still amazed at the steps folks go to - to steal from others...

Pete
I often think that they do it...just because... they can.

This particular fraudulent auction was actually one of the better ones I've seen. What made me very suspicious was the bidder ID being hidden, the "sellers" inactivity for the past 5 years, no "item location" and the gross mis-statement of the freight. No one of those things was a huge red flag, but put them together in the same auction and the flags went up

Because the OP asked for help, I started digging around and did a search for Concours in our classifieds and found the ad for this bike, posted and sold 7 months ago, and seeing the verbiage of the ad had been cut and pasted on the eBay auction. That finalized my suspicions about the legitimacy of the auction.

Concurrently I had been PM'ing with the OP telling him what I found and he telling me about what he had discovered. I shudder to think what the result would have been if the OP had not asked for our help.

[barry1021]

Dave finding the earlier auction was pure gold.As discussed the five years of inactivity was a huge negative-glad you caught it. Dont waste your time with EBAY-they will frustrate you, best to "pass it forward" and spread your new knowledge to others. EBAY will just spend more time covering it up and NOT letting people know, that's what they do. When I had my identity stolen, they made me feel like i had done something wrong......
Barry1021

[Tonger]

All,

Here is the text verbatim from my attempt at reporting the scam to eBay. I have just concealed the present owner's eBay ID to preserve his privacy. Jesse R. is the eBay representative. I really would like to think that it shouldn't be this hard to help them rid their site of fraud but it wasn't very satisfying as you can see below...

10:16:16 PM Jesse R. Hello! Thank you for using eBay Live Help. My name's Jesse. I really appreciate your patience while waiting. How may I help you?

10:16:53 PM ME I am the winner of a fraudulent auction 120056577263 and need to know how to proceed. I know that this is a scam because I have made contact with the owner of the item scot**** and he has not listed the item for sale.

10:17:38 PM Jesse R. Hi! Let me look into this for you. 10:18:54 PM Jesse R. Fortunately, what I can do is connect you to the appropriate department that deals with fraud items. I might be able to give you the link to contact them. Would that be okay?

10:19:53 PM ME I have written to them and have not received any reply. The fraudulent "seller" doesn't know that I know it's a scam and is awaiting payment. I want this guy to get caught!

10:20:20 PM ME The previous auction that was copied is 7231731***.

10:20:45 PM Jesse R. It sounds like the Fraud chat will be able to help you in this case. I would like to help you have a contact with a representative right now. Please go to: https://livechat2.ebay.com/Chat/servlet/AppMain?__lFILE=index.jsp&grp=INR&PlacementID=000_INRContactUS3

10:21:10 PM ME ok thanks. (I attempt to click the link to get connected to fraud chat)
10:22:02 PM ME they are not there now!

10:22:20 PM ME is there any human being that i can talk to?

10:22:45 PM Jesse R. You may try again later. The volume maybe too high as of the moment.


10:22:50 PM ME hello?

10:22:59 PM Jesse R. I understand that you would like to speak with an eBay representative over the phone, however, as of the moment, the mediums of support we use are email and chat. We apologize for any inconvenience, but you can rest assured that I am here to help you in any way that I can.

10:23:42 PM ME I have emailed security twice and received no reply. It really doesn't seem like you guys really care if people are scamming innocent buyers.

10:25:10 PM ME Can you get someone from the fraud area to contact me by email? I was supposed to get a reply within 24-48 hours and haven't received any contact from eBay.

10:25:35 PM Jesse R. I'll see what I can do.

10:25:58 PM ME What does that mean specifically?
10:27:32 PM ME Hello?

10:27:46 PM Jesse R. You did the right thing by writing our Trust and Safety team. I can see that you wrote in 32 hours ago and that your email is with the proper department. They will certainly respond to your message. They do handle these emails on a first come-first served basis.

10:28:23 PM ME What do I do in the meantime when the "seller" is awaiting payment?

10:29:01 PM Jesse R. You may leave him a feedback or look for similar items on eBay. :crap:

10:30:23 PM ME Will eBay try to catch him or will he simply steal another ID and try to scam someone else? He was running another simultaneous auction and I'm certain that the winner of that auction will lose his/her money unless something is immediately done about this guy!

10:31:26 PM Jesse R. Thank you for reporting this to the Trust and Safety team. He will probably be removed from eBay soon.


10:32:10 PM ME My waiting in line for this chat was really a waste of both of our time wasn't it?

10:34:16 PM Jesse R. Please wait for them to deal with this seller. Please give them at least 2 more days. The Trust and Safety is doing everything to accommodate every member's complaints. I deeply apologize for the delay.

10:34:41 PM ME Bye

10:35:21 PM Jesse R. If there's anything else I can do for you, just let me know, okay?

10:36:07 PM ME It's nothing personal but you really haven't done anything! Have a good night anyway.

[Ginger]

Tonger,
I guess this is one of those times when something too good to be true really is. Sorry about that...and actually...thanks for the discussion here on the forum. I don't spend much time on ebay, but now I know a few more things to look out for!
Good luck on your search for a bike.
Mary Ann

[Louis]

Tonger,

If you are patient (say a few months) then I can guarantee that you will find something in the forum Classifieds that matches your requirements , quite possibly from someone whom you have come to know and trust.

Good luck.

Louis

[sc53]

Tonger, I appreciate your posting this story here. I have bought and sold many items on eBay with absolutely no problems but it really seems as if the scammers are on the rise there now. I would not have flagged your auction as trouble, but thanks to the info I gained from your post and all the replies, I will be more careful in future. I always prefer selling to and buying from forum members on sites like this one, Audiogon, head-fi, and other similiar sites for aficionados (crazies).
ps Your dialogue with "Jesse R" is hilarious! I reread it a few times and kept laughing out loud! Esp your ending: "no offense, but you really haven't done anything." There's no way Jesse R was a live person; he is a bot!

[93legendti]

Tonger, I appreciate your posting this story here. I have bought and sold many items on eBay with absolutely no problems but it really seems as if the scammers are on the rise there now. I would not have flagged your auction as trouble, but thanks to the info I gained from your post and all the replies, I will be more careful in future. I always prefer selling to and buying from forum members on sites like this one, Audiogon, head-fi, and other similiar sites for aficionados (crazies).
ps Your dialogue with "Jesse R" is hilarious! I reread it a few times and kept laughing out loud! Esp your ending: "no offense, but you really haven't done anything." There's no way Jesse R was a live person; he is a bot!

+1. Lately, I have seen a few eBay auctions for Serottas where the seller refuses to provide the serial number--which alone is a red flag. Coupled with an inability by the seller to provide specs for the bike makes me wonder who would bid on such an auction.

[barry1021]

Tonger, I appreciate your posting this story here. I have bought and sold many items on eBay with absolutely no problems but it really seems as if the scammers are on the rise there now. I would not have flagged your auction as trouble, but thanks to the info I gained from your post and all the replies, I will be more careful in future. I always prefer selling to and buying from forum members on sites like this one, Audiogon, head-fi, and other similiar sites for aficionados (crazies).
ps Your dialogue with "Jesse R" is hilarious! I reread it a few times and kept laughing out loud! Esp your ending: "no offense, but you really haven't done anything." There's no way Jesse R was a live person; he is a bot!

The scammers have always been there but they are getting better. If the stolen account had not set off a red flag and most importantly Dave had not seen the original transaction, Tonger probably would have been scammed. Unfortunately EBAY's response is typical and expected-they do not want to promote the truth that scamming is rampant in big ticket items. If you actually get fleeced, they are more aggressive, but if you detect the scam before payment you might as well ask for free auctions.

b21

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . where I would be VERY leery of buying any big ticket item on eBay--say, a whole bike--where I could not be doing business with someone such as an LBS that I could trace to a brick & mortar location via Google or other outside aids. Sadly, I think it's gotten to the point where the bigger the price, the more chance it's going to be a scam.

I know it's probably been done here before, but maybe it's time for an update thread on how to spot a scam . . .

In fact, I think, I'll go start it . . .

BBD

[Tonger]

All,

Well a week and a half later I have the official ebay findings.


I guess I should hurry up and send the money order after all... ;)


Tonger


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ebay response<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Subject: TK91014 Your recent email to eBay's Trust and Safety Department. (KMM236740867V14656L0KM)
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 10:35:49 -0800

Dear eBay Member,

Thank you for writing to eBay in regards to the legitimacy of item
number: 120056577263.

After reviewing the seller accounts for this item #120056577263, I have
been unable to find any unauthorize access or tempering of this account.
Since there has been no unauthorize activities on this account, the
listings is legitimate.

If unauthorize access does take place, we will take action on those
items appropriately.

Thanks for writing.

Sincerely,

Ziedel
eBay Customer Support
______________________________

[dave thompson]

All,

Well a week and a half later I have the official ebay findings.


I guess I should hurry up and send the money order after all... ;)


Tonger


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ebay response<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Subject: TK91014 Your recent email to eBay's Trust and Safety Department. (KMM236740867V14656L0KM)
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 10:35:49 -0800

Dear eBay Member,

Thank you for writing to eBay in regards to the legitimacy of item
number: 120056577263.

After reviewing the seller accounts for this item #120056577263, I have
been unable to find any unauthorize access or tempering of this account.
Since there has been no unauthorize activities on this account, the
listings is legitimate.

If unauthorize access does take place, we will take action on those
items appropriately.

Thanks for writing.

Sincerely,

Ziedel
eBay Customer Support
______________________________
Send me the check, I'll forward it to the seller. :D

Glad EBay is so on top of things.

[Ken Robb]

So did you ever have any direct contact with the seller so he could answer your questions?

[chakatrain]

All,

Well a week and a half later I have the official ebay findings.


I guess I should hurry up and send the money order after all... ;)


Tonger


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ebay response<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Subject: TK91014 Your recent email to eBay's Trust and Safety Department. (KMM236740867V14656L0KM)
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 10:35:49 -0800

Dear eBay Member,

Thank you for writing to eBay in regards to the legitimacy of item
number: 120056577263.

After reviewing the seller accounts for this item #120056577263, I have
been unable to find any unauthorize access or tempering of this account.
Since there has been no unauthorize activities on this account, the
listings is legitimate.

If unauthorize access does take place, we will take action on those
items appropriately.

Thanks for writing.

Sincerely,

Ziedel
eBay Customer Support
______________________________

Tonger,

I have been following this saga and really can't believe the poor service from ebay. I, too, would have not flagged the sell as a scam and consider myself educated. I'm glad that you didn't get caught up in it and thank you for the education.



After reviewing the seller accounts for this item #120056577263, I have
been unable to find any unauthorize access or tempering of this account.
Since there has been no unauthorize activities on this account, the
listings is legitimate.

If unauthorize access does take place, we will take action on those
items appropriately.
_________

The above has three incorrect uses of "unauthorize." No wonder they can't get the service right. They even mix up a verb with an adjective.

[Fivethumbs]

Awe come on, cut 'em some slack. I'm sure ebay outsourced this service to India or Pakistan where Zeidel is just a poor working stiff with English as a second language.

[ericspin]

Tonger,

If this does not work out I am posting my Concours CS 58 cm (stock geometry) frame and fork soon.

PM me if you have some interest. I robbed all the parts off of it when I got the Kirk and just have not had the heart to sell it yet.

Onyx black with red decals -- she's a beauty.

Eric

[Tom]

Awe come on, cut 'em some slack. I'm sure ebay outsourced this service to India or Pakistan where Zeidel is just a poor working stiff with English as a second language.

It's been my experience that the people who speak English as a second language speak it a whole lot better than Americans do. Zeidel's local.

[Fivethumbs]

Well then he gets no slack cut.