OT: Another stupid car question

[djg]

So . . . I'm becoming more aware of the limitations of my beloved M3 ragtop (2006 -- but new-to-me in 2010) as a daily driver and backup family car for me. I'll ramble a bit about abstract features and tradeoffs: you are forewarned.

For some time, I've had a 2004 Volvo S6 as a winter/ski trip/camping trip backup, but that has been showing it's age, and doesn't have a ton of room either, although a bit more, and 4 doors makes for easier access.

What I'd like to do is combine the roles of the two vehicles, which certainly means giving up on some of the M3's best attributes, as well as the 2 doors and somewhat cramped back seat.

What's supposed to be different from what I have, besides newer: For one thing, I'm looking for a bigger back seat. The kids are tall-ish and they don't really fit in the back seat of the old bimmer comfortably, except for very short jaunts. Not super tall, but the shortest, my younger daughter, has extremely long legs for her "only" about 5' 8" -- her twin brother is over 6' 1" and still growing, and the older daughter is 5' 10". Some of you will say that you routinely ferry people who are 6' 3" in the back seat of a 911 or the trunk of a Boxster -- to all of you, I say mazel tov, but your notion of adequate space is different from mine, so keep that in mind if you're trying to be helpful.

My wife has an MDX for family trips, but I do drive people besides myself, and not just on rare occasions. I'd like to be able to drive my son and, say, two other rowers to a regatta, or two other scouts a couple of hours to go camping. But I don't want a large SUV because . . . well, mostly I drive myself and a large SUV seems unnecessary, as well as harder to park downtown and maybe ponderous or disconnected from the road. The MDX seems like a decent vehicle but it also feels a little larger than I want, if that's a helpful reference point.

Let's say . . . shooting for practical but not dull, even as I'm willing to dial down the sports thing a fair bit.

If I could get a small hitch on the back that would be a plus -- I'm thinking bike rack and not serious towing. I'd like a bit more clearance than the minimum (see skiing and camping, above, as well as the rather occasional snow dump locally), but I'm not anticipating heavy duty off-road use or monster snow conditions, so a bit more clearance than I have now should do it. As much as I like the M3 (and liked an older bimmer as well), I think I'm off the big engine in front and RWD combo for the next vehicle -- 4WD/AWD/FWD all seem a little more versatile.

So . . . crossover or small-to-mid-size SUV, or maybe a wagon?

Obviously I'm juggling various tradeoffs. I have no line-in-the-sand as per budget, but kid 1 is still in college and there are 2 more to go, starting in a couple of years, so I'm likely to be looking at relatively recent used vehicles -- maybe back to 2014, as a way to limit the spend. Up to around 30-ish? (which, I know, also buys any number of new vehicles).

I've been doing a bit of reading and I've been to a Carmax to drive a few different vehicles, but I'm open to suggestions.

[old fat man]

Acura tsx wagon? Or a 2012ish a4 or 3 series wagon?

[C40_guy]

Audi allroad (A4 based). Nice platform, fun to drive, quattro...

CPO from dealer should fit within your budget.

[hoonjr]

Mazda cx5

[ceolwulf]

Crossovers just feel like giving up on life. Porsche Macan an honourable exception. Kind of the new minivan, they are. If you want AWD why not get something entertaining - like a Land Cruiser? Bonus: it’s a vehicle that will last a lifetime.

[cmg]

knowing this forum vw jetta/golf wagon, to be followed by the turbo model. do a search on previous threads.

[Blue Jays]

Buy something that accommodates the 85% of typical stuff and simply RENT when you need to accomplish that remaining 15% of unusual tasks...

[dbnm]

Love my 2013 Volvo XC70 T6 AWD wagon.

325hp and 350 torque.

28mpg on the highway and goes like a bat outta hell!

[eddief]

GTI - room for 4, speed, handling, comfort, utility.

[dbnm]

This is mine. Plenty of clearance for reasonable dirt roads.
Speed for the highway.
Safety for the occupants.

[djg]

Buy something that accommodates the 85% of typical stuff and simply RENT when you need to accomplish that remaining 15% of unusual tasks...

This makes sense -- and I have rented special-purpose vehicles as well as, e.g., minivans for the whole family when we fly somewhere (like last week). I don't want to buy a large/fullsized (behemoth?) SUV just because I'd really appreciate the capacity and off-road abilities a handful of days a year. But the tradeoffs I mentioned mostly represent things I don't want to fix by renting -- that is, I want the bigger back seat and ski/camp/carpool capacity often enough that I want them in the vehicle that I buy.

[djg]

Love my 2013 Volvo XC70 T6 AWD wagon.

325hp and 350 torque.

28mpg on the highway and goes like a bat outta hell!

I have looked at a similar Volvo from 2015 -- one (or two) of the vehicles I might consider.

[djg]

Acura tsx wagon? Or a 2012ish a4 or 3 series wagon?

The wagon, maybe. An A4 is a nice car, but I think I want a slightly bigger back seat.

[fmradio516]

I was thinking of volvos as well but recently heard that they are pretty bad reliability-wise.

[dbnm]

I've had my Volvo for 5 years and have put on 72k miles. No issues.

[C40_guy]

The wagon, maybe. An A4 is a nice car, but I think I want a slightly bigger back seat.

B8 and B9 A4 series do have pretty good sized back seats...the older A4s were smaller...

[Hellgate]

No a luxury car, but a Passat has lots of knee room in the back, and a large trunk. My 6' 1" son fits with plenty of room to spare. Add a Burger Tuner and a downpipe and you're at 250ish HP with massive torque, and great mileage. They're inexpensive too $25,750 buy a lot of car. I'm cheap...

[fmradio516]

I've had my Volvo for 5 years and have put on 72k miles. No issues.

Thats cool. I was just stating what I heard. Im sure theyre great cars.

Just googled a bit and found this: https://www.chicagotribune.com/classified/automotive/sc-auto-tips-1101-consumer-reports-reliability-20181025-story.html

ctrl-f and type Volvo.

Its a shame because theyre really nice looking cars.

[pjm]

I’d also recommend a Passat. Seems like a lot of car for the money. Only I’d go for the GT version with the sweet VR6 for right around 30 grand.
6 year/72K warranty keeps it worry free for a good while.

[yinzerniner]

Kia Stinger with a trailer hitch? It's a hatchback with handling that's better than the latest BMW models, although it's pretty thirsty.

Also the warranty on Kia's is pretty tough to beat, and quality in the last ten or so years has been up there with the best.

[djg]

Does anybody have an X1?

[Irishgirl]

Soooo two or three cents....

I’m a “Bimmer Girl” and have brand loyalty since 1999....My car needed some work done by the dealer and they put me in a X3 M40i and I fell in looovveee....I’ve been driving it for the last two weeks. Handles great ....love the sportiness of the M class engine....feels roomy however my base point is daughters all under 5’3” ....can put a hitch and you can grab a roof rack...also the massive sun roof is fun although it doesn’t replace the feel of my convertible (4 series).

On the flip side driving a convertible ranks right up there next to riding (outside) for enjoyment. Which is why I subscribe to renting larger vehicles if I need more room to transport people or things.

I guess your lanes to chose are practical & economical sprinkled in with fun & enjoyment.


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[Gummee]

Soooo two or three cents....

I’m a “Bimmer Girl” and have brand loyalty since 1999....My car needed some work done by the dealer and they put me in a X3 M40i and I fell in looovveee....I’ve been driving it for the last two weeks. Handles great ....love the sportiness of the M class engine....feels roomy however my base point is daughters all under 5’3” ....can put a hitch and you can grab a roof rack...also the massive sun roof is fun although it doesn’t replace the feel of my convertible (4 series).

On the flip side driving a convertible ranks right up there next to riding (outside) for enjoyment. Which is why I subscribe to renting larger vehicles if I need more room to transport people or things.

I guess your lanes to chose are practical & economical sprinkled in with fun & enjoyment.


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I'm on my 2nd BMW. This one's an 04 X3. The performance suspension, the heated seats, the... ...well...BMW-ness of it all reminds me a lot of my 328i. Not quite the same engine tho. Aah well. This thing swallowed 2 racer's worth of gear and drove from NoVA to CT with nary a hiccup when CX nats was held up there.

So... If you're dead set on a manual like mine, last year (IIRC) they made em was 04. You don't mind the slushbox, find an X3 M-Sport package and have tons of fun AND cargo room.

All the BMW feel and excitement. Now with more room!

My $.02

M

edited to add: I put the hitch on this thing. Easy Peasy and relatively inexpensive ($125 IIRC) for the hitch. I carry the bikes inside when I know it'll be nasty, on a Thule hitch rack when it's nice out.

[yinzerniner]

I'm on my 2nd BMW. This one's an 04 X3. The performance suspension, the heated seats, the... ...well...BMW-ness of it all reminds me a lot of my 328i. Not quite the same engine tho. Aah well. This thing swallowed 2 racer's worth of gear and drove from NoVA to CT with nary a hiccup when CX nats was held up there.

So... If you're dead set on a manual like mine, last year (IIRC) they made em was 04. You don't mind the slushbox, find an X3 M-Sport package and have tons of fun AND cargo room.

All the BMW feel and excitement. Now with more room!

My $.02

M

edited to add: I put the hitch on this thing. Easy Peasy and relatively inexpensive ($125 IIRC) for the hitch. I carry the bikes inside when I know it'll be nasty, on a Thule hitch rack when it's nice out.

Problem is that post-EPS BMWs are nothing like the ones that created the sporty reputation. The engines are still great, but the steering and handling are very hit and miss or sometimes even just straight up BAD. The M2 was a revelation because it seemed like they finally got the EPS tuned correctly, and were able to sharpen up the chassis enough to add back some predictability to the weight transfer, but it'll take some time for the other models to slowly start getting t back some of the character than made them great.

This is coming from an owner of an e46 M3 and an e92 335i. I LOVED both cars and hate that the latest from BMW has been mostly duds.

There have been articles stating that the next-gen 3 is addressing the steering, handling and chassis deadening issue that plagues the current models, but who knows how they'll actually drive until they're actually released.

As for the x1 as a family hauler and utility vehicle it's pretty darn nice, but nothing more. For $10k less you'll get the same utility from a Subaru or VW, and better handling from a CX-5. The interior might not be as nice as the x1, but if you're really into interiors Volvo is the new king of the mountain, even above Mercedes.

[JLQ]

I test drove an X1 and X3 and ended up with an M sport 328i wagon w/ AWD. I love it, it gets great mileage, is a blast to drive and is easy to mount bikes to the roof of since it's so low. I've had an E46 and Audi A6 wagon and my wife has had a couple XC90's, I like mine better than any of them.

[Irishgirl]

Does anyone have a solution for adding a hitch to a 4series Xdrive without punching thru the rear bumper I need a better solution than throwing my bike in the back seat/top down.....it works great until it rains then I have to mess with taking off the back wheel to get the top up and windows closed.


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[yinzerniner]

Does anyone have a solution for adding a hitch to a 4series Xdrive without punching thru the rear bumper I need a better solution than throwing my bike in the back seat/top down.....it works great until it rains then I have to mess with taking off the back wheel to get the top up and windows closed.


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Stealth Hitch seems to be the current top of the utility/cost/ease of installation crop that can be installed without damaging the bumper.
https://stealthhitches.com/products/4-series-coupe

Appears to take a lot of time to install, but once there it works pretty well.
https://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1460255

[Irishgirl]

Stealth Hitch seems to be the current top of the utility/cost/ease of installation crop that can be installed without damaging the bumper.

https://stealthhitches.com/products/4-series-coupe



Appears to take a lot of time to install, but once there it works pretty well.

https://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1460255



Thanks!!!!


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[mudhead]

I’d suggest a F30 335ix. The N55 motor is would give you the performance of your previous M3 and you’d have your choice of 6M or 8A Transmissions. Be sure to get the Sport seats. For hauling gear it comes with factory mount points for a roof rack and a no-cut bolt on receiver hitch runs less than $150.



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[b33]

I really don't think you will find any issue with some of the volvo wagons - I had an 02 cross country and it gave me and the Mrs. 180k of completely trouble-free miles and we got rid of it only because the kids grew up in the back seats (which were beige). Now as a divorced single guy I would not hesitate to drive one of those as a daily driver which would include include roof racks, hitches, throwing my bike in the back and picking up my Bumble date :bike:

FYI - I drive a benz e class sedan and it's plenty roomy and powerful and fits my bike, not sure a hitch would work and roof racks work but always seem out of place.

[dsimon]

Im a volvo for life guy but if I do sway. It would be a Lexus GX470

[YesNdeed]

A Volvo wagon would be a can't-go-wrong, but I'm going to +1 for the Audi Allroad. I'm a wagon guy and I'm on my second Audi wagon. Absolutely love my 2007 S4 Avant, but it's less practical with a big V8 stuffed into it, and they have not been sold US side since 2009, if I'm not mistaken. The Allroad is much more fuel efficient and checks off enough boxes on my list.

[Joe Remi]

I'll throw mine into the mix as a sleeper you'll never think of, the current generation Chevy Impala. Huge back seat, huge trunk with pass through (front wheel off and your road bike jams right in there), the V6 has 300HP and goes like stink, and it handles exactly like the cop car it looks like (very well). I got a raging deal on a 2017 two years ago, and you'll do better now cuz it isn't selling and Chevy is dropping it. Dead reliable and looks great, too.

[bigman]

Anything but dull and you can mount a hitch.
An everyday AWD practice sports car.

[morrisericd]

Audi SQ5. Goes like stink and fits all your gear. You can find the supercharged 2014’s for $25,000. I’ve owned a few nice cars and this one takes the cake. I’ve never been happier with a vehicle. I have a stealth hitch and tow my 18’ Boston Whaler all over the place with it.

[19wisconsin64]

In the DC metro area you need a car with great handling to deal with the wack drivers...... so maybe stick with BMW. Since the 70's I've been in and out of the area for family and work and have noticed the drivers are forever worse and forever driving faster and faster....... so your current safe cars are good. I'll suggest a BMW 435 X Drive four door sedan. Fast, roomy, looks great, rear hatch. Might be too small, but just a suggestion.

But these days the SUV's are just so good. You might take a look at the 2018 or newer X3. Even the base model is fast. If you are looking for more room and need more stuff-X5. Those are pricey options, but if you are used to the M3 you'll feel at home. For half price, you'll be surprised how good the 2019 Honda and Toyota SUV's are.

Volvo has great safe vehicles. New models are coming out of that company this year that should fit your needs too.

Usually I'll get pre-owned cars that are 2-3 years old at half the price and keep them for few years. Last year I ordered a M40i X3. It's too fast, and now with two kids.....on the smallish side for us but fine for now.

Good luck in your search....lots of great options!

[YesNdeed]

Audi SQ5. Goes like stink and fits all your gear. You can find the supercharged 2014’s for $25,000. I’ve owned a few nice cars and this one takes the cake. I’ve never been happier with a vehicle. I have a stealth hitch and tow my 18’ Boston Whaler all over the place with it.

My second choice to a Macan Turbo. 👍🏼

[djg]

In the DC metro area you need a car with great handling to deal with the wack drivers...... so maybe stick with BMW. Since the 70's I've been in and out of the area for family and work and have noticed the drivers are forever worse and forever driving faster and faster....... so your current safe cars are good. I'll suggest a BMW 435 X Drive four door sedan. Fast, roomy, looks great, rear hatch. Might be too small, but just a suggestion.

But these days the SUV's are just so good. You might take a look at the 2018 or newer X3. Even the base model is fast. If you are looking for more room and need more stuff-X5. Those are pricey options, but if you are used to the M3 you'll feel at home. For half price, you'll be surprised how good the 2019 Honda and Toyota SUV's are.

Volvo has great safe vehicles. New models are coming out of that company this year that should fit your needs too.

Usually I'll get pre-owned cars that are 2-3 years old at half the price and keep them for few years. Last year I ordered a M40i X3. It's too fast, and now with two kids.....on the smallish side for us but fine for now.

Good luck in your search....lots of great options!

Just back from South Florida and the DC-area drivers are looking relatively calm and cooperative, not to mention downright predictable, but I take your point (although, really, it's defensive driving much more than a car's handling skills that copes with . . . well, other drivers).

[oldpotatoe]

VW GSW with 4Motion...:)

[bart998]

Here is a different option... I recently divested myself of an F250 (towing veh. for trailer I no longer own) and a Mustang (daily driver) for a four-door Tacoma 4x4. Love it... much more practical for the family than the Mustang and more fun to drive than the F250. Plus I can still tow my motorcycle around and help my grown kids move. Loving every minute in it.

[grateful]

Macan!

[SteveFrench]

How about a Volvo 245 with overload springs, a class III hitch and a supercharged LS motor with a proper transmission stuck in it? See ya later Mr. Engineer in your M3...

[Joe Remi]

I don't think he's getting a Macan for under 30k unless he wants to be meeting with Porsche mechanics on a regular basis.

[djg]

I don't think he's getting a Macan for under 30k unless he wants to be meeting with Porsche mechanics on a regular basis.

I don't think so either -- there's a nearby one in the low 30s but the report shows at least one major (reported) accident, even before we start asking about what it might need in the near future.

[Joe Remi]

I don't think so either -- there's a nearby one in the low 30s but the report shows at least one major (reported) accident, even before we start asking about what it might need in the near future.

I bought a "cheap" Boxster S once. Most expensive cheap car I ever owned.

[YesNdeed]

It took some digging, but I found an obvious solution!

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/01/04/porsche-924-dp-cargo-shooting-brake-for-sale/

[djg]

It took some digging, but I found an obvious solution!

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/01/04/porsche-924-dp-cargo-shooting-brake-for-sale/

A frankenamera?

[Joe Remi]

One more shout for my Impala which isn't so much about the specific car as two features I'll never live without again: Backup camera and Android Auto/Apple CarPlay.

The ability to see from the rear bumper is so helpful that I hardly ever use mirrors anymore for backing up; it's a massive safety improvement which has the effect of making the car feel smaller because it's so much easier to move it out of parking spaces or into curb spots. I imagine it would be useful with bikes on a hitch rack, too.

Android Auto (I have a Google Pixel 2) pairs with the dash screen so I can use Google Maps for navigation with voice commands. Nifty because you get software updates through your phone (or a new phone) instead of being stuck with a rapidly aging nav system installed in the car.

[gemship]

B8 and B9 A4 series do have pretty good sized back seats...the older A4s were smaller...

Meh, I dunno if can I agree on that. Went out to dinner with three of my buddies and I sat in the back of a 2013 A4 wagon. Pretty car but my knees were making love to the back of the driver's seat badly. Granted my friend probably had the seat fully setback, I dunno I didn't ask and the drive to the restaurant was less than 10 minutes. Also there was a lot of road noise in the back for such a refined car but makes sense with the wheel wells being right behind me and it being a somewhat compact, sporty wagon. Having said that the differences between this car and my 09 Outback in terms of refinement are null and void since it's not much quieter nor roomy. Having said that if the OP has tall and growing children I cannot recommend either an A4 or Outback. So how's about a Chevy Suburban, LOL....just say'in....

PS. My friend the driver/owner of the A4 and I are both 5,10 or there abouts tall fwiw.

[gemship]

In fact when it comes to sporty wagons powered by 2/3 liter engines why is it that they really do suck when it comes to rear passenger legroom? Are the engineers just trying to pack features, utility without compromising wheelbase related handling?

[Joe Remi]

In fact when it comes to sporty wagons powered by 2/3 liter engines why is it that they really do suck when it comes to rear passenger legroom? Are the engineers just trying to pack features, utility without compromising wheelbase related handling?

My first guess would be they were designed as sporty sedans first, so the wagon just gets a taller trunk with windows.

[gemship]

My first guess would be they were designed as sporty sedans first, so the wagon just gets a taller trunk with windows.

Interesting as I would think the auto makers could figure out a better way. For me ironically I am single with no family and as I work out of my Outback, most of the time it lives with the back seats folded down. It wasn't until I took a short ride across town in my buddies A4 that I realized this backseat deal is kinda an afterthought. I dunno maybe the backseats in a Passat or any Euro sporty sedan aren't much better for grown ups? Anyway I guess I'm lucky as I really never drive with passengers.

[djg]

BMW X3 35i (2014).

Thanks for the many and varied replies folks. The weeks of web surfing, plus, and then several days of running around and driving things (including canvasing the lots of 2 CarMaxes (Maxi?)) resulted in something I think I'll like.

I won't say "love," because . . . well, this was a compromise/trade-off project.
I think it's a fine way to tick off a bunch of our boxes and enough of a driver, but maybe not a pure anything, apart from what it is. But that's being whiny. I bought it voluntarily last night, and I think it's what I wanted. Clean, pretty well loaded, and low-miles for a 2014 (36k).

[MaraudingWalrus]

Kia Stinger with a trailer hitch? It's a hatchback with handling that's better than the latest BMW models, although it's pretty thirsty.

Also the warranty on Kia's is pretty tough to beat, and quality in the last ten or so years has been up there with the best.

Way late to the party here. But just picked up a Stinger GT2 AWD today. coming from a 2012 GTI that died somewhat suddenly today - I had been expecting a slower death for six months or so, and figured I had another two to three months.

Not going to put a hitch on it, probably just getting a seasucker rack. Rear space is cavernous in the Stinger. Longer than the Golf. but not as tall. Easy bike stuffing in there with seats down.

[Irishgirl]

Anyone have experience with the Seasucker? I’ve been debating the seasucker vs installing a stealth hitch + bike hitch rack.

Love the portability of the Seasucker and looks cool...but will it hold my bike on the trunk of my convertible zooming at probably speeds faster than posted to get to my destination to ride without scratching my paint.


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