Building and riding mountain bikes from the good old days

[fiamme red]

https://cyclingtips.com/2018/10/the-refurb-man-building-and-riding-mountain-bikes-from-the-good-old-days/

“It’s such a disconnect from all the stress of life to go back and restore these old bikes, put parts on them that you lusted after back in the day,” Wilk says. “I love my life, but at the same time to be able to go back – things were so much simpler.”

[d_douglas]

Yes, that era was certainly what got me fascinated with the technology side of things. As an aesthete at heart, I have always loved how things look as well as how they perform.

Some of those bikes look great and remind me of the halcyon days of MTB engineering, but the bikes of today are infinitely better than back then (though I know that isn't the point of the article)

I usually reach for my FS bike these days, but from time to time I pull out my hardtail and the feeling of simplicity is pretty satisfying (in spite of the 140mm fork, dropper post and hydro brakes!)

Nice article though. It must be an expensive hobby to restore those bikes properly. There is a guy local to be who does the same thing, but his budget is much less - his rebuilt classics are usually pretty banged up as he grabs them from off of Craigslist.

[rinconryder]

These make for decent townie bikes but honestly the old bikes and brakes compared to the new stuff make them like death traps. If you come off a new bike and ride an old bike you realize just how far things have come - at least I did when I rode my friends stumpjumper.

[spacemen3]

Great article. I love riding the old mountain bikes, and I think it's because of their limitations. You really have to be conscious of your line and how close you are to a painful yard-sale. :)

[charliedid]

Pretty cool.

The thing that I remember the most about my mountain biking days was just how much younger I was!:)

1987 - Stumpjumper (team or pro I think)

1990 - Yeti FRO

1992 - Ritchey P-21 Team and a couple others including a P-20 Team that I sold before it rusted to bits like the previous ones.

1995 - Independent Fab. Deluxe (First suspension bike)

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2016 - Focus Black Forest 29 (sold frame here) parts on a SOMA Wolverine

The Yeti held it's line going downhill as well as any bike I have ever thrown a leg over. The Ritchey's were all 19 lbs but the IF was IMO the best all-round bike and closest to what a hardtail is today in many ways and wish I still had it. They were all beautiful. The FOCUS a bit less so but rode very nice IMO.

Thanks for the link.

[d_douglas]

Great article. I love riding the old mountain bikes, and I think it's because of their limitations. You really have to be conscious of your line and how close you are to a painful yard-sale. :)

I feel like a good CX bike can accomplish that and be more versatile - disc brakes or not.

[p nut]

Cool bikes. Klein is pretty sweet, as is the Fro.

But "good" old days? I'd say, the "old days." Every few years, I get hankering for an old MTB. Build one up cheap and go for a ride. I am quickly reminded why I moved on.

[choke]

These make for decent townie bikes but honestly the old bikes and brakes compared to the new stuff make them like death traps. It's a wonder that anyone who rode MTBs in the '80s/90s is still alive. :eek:

[weaponsgrade]

Nice article. That's about the time I got into mtn biking. I still love and ride bikes from that era, but most of the time I reach for either my HT 29er or
FS 29er. Cycling Tips has been putting out some good content lately. Jeff Kendalweed (Ibis sponsored rider) recently made a video of him putting together and riding an old Ibis Ti Mojo. There was a line where he pointed out the odd linkages bolted to the frame and explained that they were called "cantilever brakes" and that this would be his first time riding with them. That hurt.

[DarkStar]

Gee, have to get my FRO back on the trails ASAP.

[Ken Robb]

It's a wonder that anyone who rode MTBs in the '80s/90s is still alive. :eek:

We are still alive because we did not over-ride our skills or equipment.

[rinconryder]

We are still alive because we did not over-ride our skills or equipment.

But the equipment held us back no doubt if the skill was there...MTBs are way different from road bikes in my opinion in that MTBs have improved leaps and bounds over road bikes whereas the later has seen incremental improvements mainly in the arena of materials, and now brakes (although that really depends on the terrain you ride). That being said the main improvements have been in suspension which doesn't pertain to road bikes and the brakes, which are more critical than with road bikes so it's an apple to oranges kind of thing.

[pdmtong]

We are still alive because we did not over-ride our skills or equipment.

Truth. when you are riding a rigid six-speed with a U-brake in trail hiking shoes and cat-eye toeclips there's a different level of skill involved from today's close your eyes point and shoot

That said, glad still alive and no longer riding those 32# beasts

[Ken Robb]

But the equipment held us back no doubt if the skill was there...MTBs are way different from road bikes in my opinion in that MTBs have improved leaps and bounds over road bikes whereas the later has seen incremental improvements mainly in the arena of materials, and now brakes (although that really depends on the terrain you ride). That being said the main improvements have been in suspension which doesn't pertain to road bikes and the brakes, which are more critical than with road bikes so it's an apple to oranges kind of thing.
Oh YES! I augmented my 1989 MB-3 with a Marin Rift Zone FS bike in 2001 and it was night and day better in every way off-road. I was pointing out to "kids" who came on the scene after the advent of FS bikes that we didn't ride rigid bikes as aggressively as we did FS bikes on gnarly terrain once we had them.

[avalonracing]

We are still alive because we did not over-ride our skills or equipment.

Yup, I meet so many guys now who think they have "mad skillz yo" because they can just plow through/down/over sh*t with their 29ers with huge tires, 5" of front and rear travel, and $400 dropper posts. I know some of these dudes wouldn't have done well climbing and descending on our old rigs.

[choke]

I was pointing out to "kids" who came on the scene after the advent of FS bikes that we didn't ride rigid bikes as aggressively as we did FS bikes on gnarly terrain once we had them.Heh....it's been a long time since anyone called me a kid......and FWIW I purchased my first MTB in 1985. I suppose I should have used this :rolleyes: instead of the one I did use since my sarcasm meter was high. I understand that newer MTBs are better but older ones were hardly "death traps".

[peanutgallery]

From what I remember, we had fun. I shudder at the thought of riding that stuff again, but it had style

It's a wonder that anyone who rode MTBs in the '80s/90s is still alive. :eek:

[jghall]

To this day I still regret selling my Fisher fillet brazed Mt. Tam. Gorgeous bike and a blast to ride.

[bigbill]

I started MTBing in 1987 with a Specialized Stumpjumper followed by a Raleigh Chill with XT parts (it was a deal). I was in the PNW so we had all kinds of factory guys from Raleigh and Norco. We progressed through all kinds of stuff like 140mm Tioga T-bone stems with bars just wide enough for the grips, brakes, and shifters, because that's what Tomac was doing. We were also doing cyclocross and if the trails were dry enough, we'd be on our cross bikes instead. Then I shifted over to road almost exclusively because of time constraints.

Now I have a Coconino Disc Dirt Road Racer and it's better than any MTB I had 87-91. I ride it on single track a few days a week. Rigid fork and all. I'm in NW Arizona these days, more opportunities off road than on. Once my house sells in TX, I'll get Garro to build me a nice 27.5 hardtail that will clear 3" tires with big knobs.

[Spaghetti Legs]

Truth. when you are riding a rigid six-speed with a U-brake in trail hiking shoes and cat-eye toeclips there's a different level of skill involved from today's close your eyes point and shoot

That said, glad still alive and no longer riding those 32# beasts

Oh yeah! I did get a cool pair of Nike mtb shoes from the outlet in Gilroy. I rode mostly Presidio and Marin County, Mt Tam. I shudder to think now of some of the descents I made on my suspension-less GT Tequesta. I didn’t think it could get any better than v-brakes (you could actually stop!) and Rock Shox Judy forks.

On the other hand I don’t think a modern road bike has too much of an edge over a good 80’s race bike, except for better gearing availability.

[Ronsonic]

It's been a couple of years and a serious mountain bike upgrade since the last time I took the fenders off my '88 Fisher HKEK and rolled some knobbies off road.

That seems to happen at least once every five years, gonna have to do that again. It's always fun. I don't always hit the wilder trails. We'll see how insane I feel this time.

[witcombusa]

I don't have to 'build and refurbish', they're all still going from my beginnings in New England MTB riding in the early 80's...
'82 SJ, '89 SJ Team and '94 Gary Fischer
And yes there is a world of difference between those 12 years!

[NHAero]

I first rode "singletrack" in the early 70s in college and still have that bike, a late 60s Raleigh 20 folder. Sheldon Brown turned me on to riding these bikes on woods trails west of Boston, pointing out that the R20 had 20 inch wheels with steel rims and 36 spokes - hard to ruin one!

I bought a Trek MTB in the early 80s - don't recall the model number. It was almost $600, seemed like a fortune for a bike then. A real tank! I'm sure that bike is still going somewhere - I gave it to a college student in the late 90s.

I have my next two MTBs, a '96 Klein Pulse II, which wears studded tires and gets winter rides, and a '99 Litespeed Unicoi softtail which got converted to 1x10 and drop bars and Conti Speed King tires. It gets frequent rides that combine road and trails, an ideal bike for getting around on Martha's Vineyard.

The '13 Pivot 429 carbon FS 29er is a great ride for the older MTBer and it's what I pick for most of the all-trail riding, especially for 2-3 hours rides, because it's so much easier on the back!

A lot more difference across the years than comparing my '72 Bob Jackson with my '12 Anderson!

[pdmtong]

It's been a couple of years and a serious mountain bike upgrade since the last time I took the fenders off my '88 Fisher HKEK and rolled some knobbies off road.



That seems to happen at least once every five years, gonna have to do that again. It's always fun. I don't always hit the wilder trails. We'll see how insane I feel this time.



I had the blue 88 HKEK since i couldn't afford the montare

[rwsaunders]

I’m currently working on bringing an ‘83 Stumpjumper Sport XT back to life...bullmoose bars, bi-plane fork and Shimano “deer head” drivetrain. Will post when finished.

[kokies]

I bought this one as is about 15 years ago.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181020/c7d037d2602da536132d11c14ab4cd62.jpg

I restored this about 5 years ago. It is a former Ringle show bike.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181020/65d7170a1a90a371a0db8460b6f3f1ae.jpg

I am in the middle of restoring this one. The picture is how I bought it. This is another Ringle show bike. I bought both bikes from a former Ringle employee locally here in NJ. The frame has several cracks and will be going back to FTW this week, then off for new powder. Rebuild on the shocks and then reassembly.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181020/cd42148be26c32d5e9f5d8bae0ae7a3a.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[avalonracing]

Kokies, you are doing the Lord's work. :hello:

[Exonerv]

I still think this old girl had a certain something.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181020/78be3eaee51c6194da8a715685726612.jpg

[cmbicycles]

I'm still riding one of these, my only mountain bike. Not my actual bike, I "downgraded" wheels to regular spokes, have an older lefty, XT disc brakes, and 8s gripshift. I'm amazed I'm still alive. My 1st mtn bike was a rigid Head (tennis racquet maker) with elevated chainstays 1-1/4 head tube and no suspension. I bounced off the ground a lot easier back then.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181020/56a5dd9ca1cde23b421095d4db8903d0.jpg

[Ken Robb]

I don't have to 'build and refurbish', they're all still going from my beginnings in New England MTB riding in the early 80's...
'82 SJ, '89 SJ Team and '94 Gary Fischer
And yes there is a world of difference between those 12 years!

Back in 1989 I had an MB-3 and rode almost every Saturday morning with a pal who had a Stump just like yours except his didn't have drop bars. Very interesting contrast in geometry and handling Stumpy was slower to turn; more stable and easier to keep straight in deep sand and gravel. MB-3 quicker handling so more nimble on pavement and hardpack but the front wheel tended to be a little quick to follow ruts. The irony is that I preferred the Stumpy and my pal preferred my Bridgestone off-road. We swapped rides but never made a permanent swap because I also rode the MB-3 on pavement and it was a lot better there for me.

[weaponsgrade]

Kokies, you are doing the Lord's work. :hello:

Amen

[Red Tornado]

All these bikes with bar ends. Comfortable for your hands, and doubled as great tree hooks.

[cachagua]

I too rode and loved 80s mountain bikes, and I had a lot of trouble understanding when people talked about how mountain bikes had changed. (They said "advanced", but I'm paraphrasing.) But someone here explained that mountain bike riding was very different too, and looking at a couple of mountain-bike parks around where I live, and watching youtube videos, I began to see what was going on. The terrain you ride through, and the techniques that terrain requires, dictate a different design of bike.

Air is the same everywhere on earth, and an F-15 is a helluva lot better plane -- no argument about it -- than a WWII Spitfire. But a loop-the-loop made of wood slats or a 40' dropoff are simply different places to ride than a creekbed full of cobbles and sand, and the bikes appropriate for the two environments may not be comparable in a way that you can say one's "better".

Myself, I don't want to ride 40' dropoffs or loop-the-loops, I want to ride that creekbed. So to me, a Wicked Fat Chance is about as good a mountain bike as money can buy. You can say that an 80s-style mountain bike is as inappropriate for this or that mountain-biking venue as a time-trial bike would be, but I'd say that nothing's more appropriate than a bike meant for the place you plan to ride it.

If there's any good thing that's come out of the bike industry's frantic maneuverings over the last few decades, it's that there's a lot of choice. For example in the early '80s there were two sizes of tires, practically speaking: road bike tires and mountain bike tires. Now there's a tire every few millimeters from 23s to probably three times that width. Every other piece of equipment for your bike has exploded in variety too. You can put together a bike that's insanely well-adapted to nearly any ride you want to do.

Which I guess is what people mean when they say "horses for courses."

[fiamme red]

These make for decent townie bikes but honestly the old bikes and brakes compared to the new stuff make them like death traps. If you come off a new bike and ride an old bike you realize just how far things have come - at least I did when I rode my friends stumpjumper.I had a great trail ride today on my 1987 Ritchey Deathtrap... er, I mean Ascent Comp. Somehow I survived. :)

[C40_guy]

Truth. when you are riding a rigid six-speed with a U-brake in trail hiking shoes and cat-eye toeclips there's a different level of skill involved from today's close your eyes point and shoot

That said, glad still alive and no longer riding those 32# beasts

Well, I'm still riding one of those beasts. Only time I really feel left behind is on technical hills, either going up or down. Otherwise it's fine. :)

[rinconryder]

I had a great trail ride today on my 1987 Ritchey Deathtrap... er, I mean Ascent Comp. Somehow I survived. :)

you should try something from this millennium and take it to the next level!!! My point here is merely that the bikes from the last 10 years or so are light years ahead of older bikes as far as what they will allow you to do. You can ride flatter trails and have a great ride on 26, 27.5, 29, rigid, hard tail, full suspension, or whatever you like. BUT, once the hills start pointing up, then most noticeably down, the newer equipment is a huge advantage over the older stuff. In no particular order here is what I have observed after riding MTBs for years...

1) Disc Brakes are way way way better than rim brakes when it comes to MTB. They allow you to carry more speed and brake faster and more predictably into corners or when things feel like they are getting sketchy.

2) Wheel size. I rode a 26 inch single speed that sent me over the handlebars several times that I easily cleaned on a 29er solely because of the approach factor of 29 inch wheels. I love 29ers, could take or leave 27.5 and will never ride a 26 on anything of consequence again.

3) Suspension. Is probably the last on my list of significant of upgrades as I feel it has saved me from my own poor line choices than anything else. But the pedaling platform provided on the newer FS models is way better than the stuff that was available in the early 2000s. I had a 2003 Specialized Enduro that would have pedal bob like no other but when you get on something like a DW design bike it's amazing.

Yes, you can go out and have a fun ride on anything. But for many MTBrs, myself included, part of the fun is pushing the limit and seeing how fast you can go and the newer stuff definitely helps in that.

[RFC]

you should try something from this millennium and take it to the next level!!! My point here is merely that the bikes from the last 10 years or so are light years ahead of older bikes as far as what they will allow you to do. You can ride flatter trails and have a great ride on 26, 27.5, 29, rigid, hard tail, full suspension, or whatever you like. BUT, once the hills start pointing up, then most noticeably down, the newer equipment is a huge advantage over the older stuff. In no particular order here is what I have observed after riding MTBs for years...

1) Disc Brakes are way way way better than rim brakes when it comes to MTB. They allow you to carry more speed and brake faster and more predictably into corners or when things feel like they are getting sketchy.

2) Wheel size. I rode a 26 inch single speed that sent me over the handlebars several times that I easily cleaned on a 29er solely because of the approach factor of 29 inch wheels. I love 29ers, could take or leave 27.5 and will never ride a 26 on anything of consequence again.

3) Suspension. Is probably the last on my list of significant of upgrades as I feel it has saved me from my own poor line choices than anything else. But the pedaling platform provided on the newer FS models is way better than the stuff that was available in the early 2000s. I had a 2003 Specialized Enduro that would have pedal bob like no other but when you get on something like a DW design bike it's amazing.

Yes, you can go out and have a fun ride on anything. But for many MTBrs, myself included, part of the fun is pushing the limit and seeing how fast you can go and the newer stuff definitely helps in that.

Yes, I agree that modern MTB's are superior for climbing, descending and extreme conditions, although I spent a lot of time riding a rigid steel MTB in extreme conditions, including getting stuck in a very steep river valley and having to climb out with the bike on my shoulder. We didn't know anything else.

The old XC MTB's were sort of built on a road bike model with high seat and low bars. For moderate conditions, they did very well. And that's my level of MTB riding.

You've seen this before. Here are a few photos. 1. My mid 90's Ti gravel grinder MTB perfect for canal trails and jumping off of curbs. 2. Russian Titanium Red as both a gravel grinder and SS bomber. 3. 1989 Fisher Procaliber (I had two. One to a Thailand collector and the other to a West Coast collector).

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1734/42545314581_13b4a5437a_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/27PzRLz)IMG_0359 (https://flic.kr/p/27PzRLz) by Robert Copple (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150689726@N06/), on Flickr

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1746/42545312051_906b4e4ef2_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/27PzR1X)IMG_0361 (https://flic.kr/p/27PzR1X) by Robert Copple (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150689726@N06/), on Flickr

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1843/43550013235_25445a1ca9_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/29mncFa)IMG_0355r (https://flic.kr/p/29mncFa) by Robert Copple (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150689726@N06/), on Flickr

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1879/29785163977_7324df586b_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Mo1KxX)SRP Canel (34)r (https://flic.kr/p/Mo1KxX) by Robert Copple (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150689726@N06/), on Flickr

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1947/45433697722_f0b5fe5c3c_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2cdPzrU)Fisher GG (11)r (https://flic.kr/p/2cdPzrU) by Robert Copple (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150689726@N06/), on Flickr

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1911/30544998757_6b3c8c7816_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Nxa6XB)IMG_0007r (https://flic.kr/p/Nxa6XB) by Robert Copple (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150689726@N06/), on Flickr

[bouldergary]

New spin on my old Lotus

[Ronsonic]

I like that beastly beautiful Lotus.

[HTupolev]

My '84 Stumpy...

https://i.imgur.com/GxI1bjn.jpg

On the other hand I don’t think a modern road bike has too much of an edge over a good 80’s race bike, except for better gearing availability.
Even the gearing issue was as much tradition as technology. There was nothing particularly race-unsuitable about the "touring" parts at the time, which allowed for much better low-end bailout at practically no functional compromise.

[pdonk]

In anticipation and to fund my incoming road bike, I sold my "modern" dualie (2012 Lapierre pendbox based dualie) and am left only with my 1996 Dekerf Team SL and my 1989 brodie climbmax.

Here are my threads about them
https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=181686
https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=10250

I still ride my dekerf off road from time to time, and for the trails where I live it is fine and fun, if I was to go to moab again or get back into ultra long trail rides I'd likely get a new bike.

For the brodie, just got a new stem from Paul Brodie that raises the front end significantly. I doubt I'll be riding it off road any time soon, but thinking about making it into a gravel bike.

[rwsaunders]

https://i.imgur.com/OIUPLeBh.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Qn8kvYdh.jpg

My '83 Stumpy lives to ride again and I'm currently on the hunt for some fatty, bad arse, skinwalls. There could be a drop bar conversion in the future as I like what Tupolev his done with his '84.