View Full Version : Drunk, wrong way driver kills cyclist
Wasted in the morning, driving the wrong way in a 15 mph zone in a public park and hits 2 pedestrians and a cyclist. Then leaves and is only caught because she wrecked her car on a boulder at the bottom of the hill.
At least she's been charged with MURDER.
Condolences to the family and friends.
TUCSON, AZ (Tucson News Now) - A cyclist was killed and a woman is facing a murder charge after a hit-and-run crash on 'A' Mountain early Thursday, Oct. 11.
According to Sgt. Pete Dugan of the Tucson Police Department, 20-year-old Yanibra Moreno has been booked into the Pima County Jail. No bond has been set.
A 73-year-old man was biking up the mountain when he was hit by a vehicle that was coming down in the wrong lane. His identity has no yet been released.
Moreno allegedly also hit two pedestrians and several boulders before coming to a stop near the parking area.
The cyclist died at a hospital while the pedestrians suffered minor injuries. Moreno was treated at a hospital for her injuries.
TPD said Moreno showed signs of impairment. She is facing charges of second-degree murder, felony hit and run and two counts of aggravated assault.
As of 6:39 p.m. Sentinel Peak Road is back open and detectives have cleared the scene, according to the TPD.
#BREAKING: 73-year-old male cyclist hit by a car on ‘A’ Mountain has passed away.
20-year-old female driver facing several felony charges, including second degree murder & agg assault.
TPD says alcohol played a role, two other pedestrians were also hit. @TucsonNewsNow pic.twitter.com/TimYohUGB5
— Melissa Egan - Tucson News Now (@_MelissaEgan) October 11, 2018
https://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/2018/10/11/police-cyclist-struck-alleged-hit-run-a-mountain-closed/
Idris Icabod
10-12-2018, 02:01 PM
This is beyond sad. Im currently in Mexico in a family vacation but was included in the text stream about this. I sat with Rick at Starbucks just a few weeks ago. RIP.
Matthew
10-12-2018, 02:09 PM
Terrible. And I won't look for or click on the article because the comment section will likely make my blood boil.
This is beyond sad. Im currently in Mexico in a family vacation but was included in the text stream about this. I sat with Rick at Starbucks just a few weeks ago. RIP.
I had not heard a name yet, Rick who?
Terrible. And I won't look for or click on the article because the comment section will likely make my blood boil.
There's no comment section on the link I posted. But ya, terrible. This is a location where nobody should be going fast enough for anything bad to happen.
AngryScientist
10-12-2018, 02:17 PM
Senseless and terrible. Family must be devastated. My sincere condolences to them and the cycling community there.
soulspinner
10-13-2018, 06:36 AM
20 and wasted in the AM. wow...so sad..
Cicli
10-13-2018, 06:44 AM
20 and wasted in the AM. wow...so sad..
Sad for her? F! her.
I feel bad for the cyclists family. Tragic and sad.
froze
10-13-2018, 08:08 AM
That is terrible, my condolences as well to the family.
But you guys have to know that the lady that killed that guy will get a lawyer and the second degree murder charge will be dropped to either gross vehicular manslaughter while drinking or to vehicular manslaughter. With second degree murder you have to prove that she 1) an intentional killing that is not premeditated or planned, nor committed in a reasonable "heat of passion"; or 2) a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life. It's all about intent and I doubt the prosecutor is going to be able to prove intent. All of those things will be tricky to prove in court and most cases involving driving while intoxicated are dropped to lessor charges. If by chance the prosecutor succeeds she's facing a minimum of 10 years.
Gross vehicular manslaughter means she did something really out of line with the law and the prosecutors will have to prove 3 things: one, was she driving under the influence of alcohol or drugs? Check! Two, in acting with gross negligence, did she cause an accident where another person was killed? Check! Third, did she act with gross negligence? This is the tricky one because the prosecutors have to prove that she was driving in an extremely reckless manner, like doing 100 mph at night in a residential area, or blowing through several red lights without any regard to others, weaving in out of traffic at high speeds, or tailgating car after car, it cannot be ordinary negligence that we see all the time, and that one is going to be the toughest battle the prosecutor is going to face, because the defense could say that people drive down one way streets all the time not realizing they did so till they commit, I see people doing that all the time where I live and their not drunk, so that could be a sticky icky that could drop the charge to just vehicular manslaughter, note I said could not would. Also was she over the .08 alcohol limit? more than likely she was so that's a check. All this would carry is a 4 to 10 year sentence, and if it's her first time she'll probably get it reduced to 4 years and with time off for good behavior she might see 2 years.
Depending on the state's law more than likely if this is the persons first offense then the sentence will be reduced to just vehicular manslaughter which carries a one year sentence for first time offenders.
Even with all of that illegal stuff going against her things could go wrong for the prosecutor if her attorney is really good, things like attempts to exclude incriminating evidence, such as test results showing that the defendant was driving with a blood-alcohol level above 0.08. A defense attorney may argue that such evidence should be excluded because it was obtained in violation of the defendant’s constitutional rights, or because law enforcement did not comply with procedures established for collecting the evidence. Or her intoxication was not the legal cause of the accident resulting in death. Instead, a defendant may argue that an independent intervening event outside of the defendant’s control not reasonably foreseeable is the cause of the death instead of the defendant’s intoxication. If any of that occurs or anything else the defense can dream up she could be looking at just a charge of driving under the influence which she could see as little as 30 days and that could be jail or even house arrest, suspension of her drivers license (which is bogus since people will simply drive anyways), and a fine.
Of course she will be subject to a civil lawsuit which depending on her net worth could be quite damaging for her financially, plus a percentage of her wages could be garnished for the rest of her working life. Civil lawsuits are not so easily to reduce as OJ Simpson found out.
Of course I think that the original charges on such cases like this ought to be the one that sticks, the cops tested her, she was for certain taken to a hospital for a blood test and the results agreed with the breath analyzer (I assume anyways), so she should be facing the full punishment with no weird excuses to get out of it, but that's why we are innocent until proven guilty, if we didn't have lessor charges to convict her of if she fails to get charged for the first charge then she could be let go completely and that wouldn't be good either, so those other lessor charges are there to try to catch her on something so she can do the time.
I'm not a lawyer, I got all this information off the internet, so I may be wrong in some of it, and of course each state is different on how they handle cases like this. So maybe a lawyer here, or a law student here can correct most of what I've said.
soulspinner
10-14-2018, 07:58 AM
Sad for her? F! her.
I feel bad for the cyclists family. Tragic and sad.
Since you posed a question I will answer it. She obviously has a bad problem to be bombed at 640 am. That is sad in and of itself, and of course its sad for the family and friends of the deceased most importantly.....not sure F! her helps anything.
sjbraun
10-14-2018, 08:54 AM
More info on this tragedy here,
https://tucson.com/news/local/tucson-police-identify--year-old-cyclist-fatally-struck-on/article_f97e16ee-cd75-11e8-98d6-cb560d015bd0.html
I didn't know Rick, but saw him occasionally at places where cyclists congregate post ride. I have friends who rode with him, at 73 he could fly up hills, easily dropping riders half his age. Everyone I've met who knew him says he was just a fantastic person.
Last night more than 100 people showed up to walk or ride the road where he was killed. A local news story describes the tribute,
https://kvoa.com/news/2018/10/13/dozens-ascend-a-mountain-in-tribute-to-late-cyclist/
parris
10-14-2018, 02:06 PM
I wonder what else was in her system in addition to the alcohol. At 20 shes too young to legally drink in the state anyway. Her indifference to human life is disgusting and hopefully the prosecutor has a good case.
Since you posed a question I will answer it. She obviously has a bad problem to be bombed at 640 am. That is sad in and of itself, and of course its sad for the family and friends of the deceased most importantly.....not sure F! her helps anything.
I don't care about her reasons, I only care about the results of the actions she chose to take. Objectively those actions were criminal and she deserves to be severely punished for those actions. No tolerance, none, F her.
Louis
10-14-2018, 03:50 PM
I don't care about her reasons, I only care about the results of the actions she chose to take. Objectively those actions were criminal and she deserves to be severely punished for those actions. No tolerance, none, F her.
In some situations the threat of enforcement of the law after a crime has been committed isn't enough to deter criminals.
Sometimes you need to understand why the crime is being committed to have any hope taking actions to deter potential criminals and reducing the crime rate.
In some situations the threat of enforcement of the law after a crime has been committed isn't enough to deter criminals.
Sometimes you need to understand why the crime is being committed to have any hope taking actions to deter potential criminals and reducing the crime rate.
That's irrelevant to the point. She is a criminal who took a life, she deserves to be punished severely.
Cicli
10-14-2018, 04:08 PM
That's irrelevant to the point. She is a criminal who took a life, she deserves to be punished severely.
Agreed. 100%.
Louis
10-14-2018, 08:46 PM
That's irrelevant to the point. She is a criminal who took a life, she deserves to be punished severely.
It's 100% relevant to your statement that you "don't care about the reasons."
I agree that justice needs to be done and that she should be punished, but that's hardly the only issue one needs to address. We've tried the "jack up drug-related offense" sentences way high, and look at where that got us with the "drug problem" - jails full of offenders, and still a massive drug problem across the country.
You can't just put blinders on and lock 'em up and throw away the key - you have to understand the problem and understand the types of solutions that might help.
It's 100% relevant to your statement that you "don't care about the reasons."
I agree that justice needs to be done and that she should be punished, but that's hardly the only issue one needs to address. We've tried the "jack up drug-related offense" sentences way high, and look at where that got us with the "drug problem" - jails full of offenders, and still a massive drug problem across the country.
You can't just put blinders on and lock 'em up and throw away the key - you have to understand the problem and understand the types of solutions that might help.
You're more than welcome to start a thread discusing the politics of DUI cause and punishment. This isn't the thread for it and a hearty "F her" is entirely appropriate when discussing the homicide of a good man.
froze
10-14-2018, 09:26 PM
It's 100% relevant to your statement that you "don't care about the reasons."
I agree that justice needs to be done and that she should be punished, but that's hardly the only issue one needs to address. We've tried the "jack up drug-related offense" sentences way high, and look at where that got us with the "drug problem" - jails full of offenders, and still a massive drug problem across the country.
You can't just put blinders on and lock 'em up and throw away the key - you have to understand the problem and understand the types of solutions that might help.
While I agree with you to a point, the problem is with throwing someone in prison is that they don't offer any help for a person with a drug or alcohol problem, they just sit in jail watching TV and fighting off scumbags. Instead they should be put into a very regimental drug/alcohol abuse program that lasts say a year if the sentence is a short term one. But in this case she blatantly killed a person, she wasn't trying to sell a small amount of drugs to someone, or using a small amount of drugs and got caught before someone innocent died and now sent to rot in jail for several years...that is in my opinion a waste of time because as you said it's done nothing to curb the drug problem; but she stepped over the line when she killed someone, and that's were the difference lies, and that's why she should spend an extended time in jail for her actions.
oldpotatoe
10-15-2018, 07:02 AM
You're more than welcome to start a thread discusing the politics of DUI cause and punishment. This isn't the thread for it and a hearty "F her" is entirely appropriate when discussing the homicide of a good man.
Perhaps but with the current state of incarceration, chances are she’ll get out of prison worse than she went in. Not because I feel sorry for her but because the chances or her repeating is very high. Clearly the present ‘system’ for these types of offenses isn’t working. There is no ‘rehabilitation’, just revenge based punishment.
Perhaps but with the current state of incarceration, chances are she’ll get out of prison worse than she went in. Not because I feel sorry for her but because the chances or her repeating is very high. Clearly the present ‘system’ for these types of offenses isn’t working. There is no ‘rehabilitation’, just revenge based punishment.
There are drug rehab programs in prison. In some cases Inmates can reduce their sentence if they complete the program/programs
redir
10-15-2018, 09:31 AM
In some situations the threat of enforcement of the law after a crime has been committed isn't enough to deter criminals.
Sometimes you need to understand why the crime is being committed to have any hope taking actions to deter potential criminals and reducing the crime rate.
Yup square peg, round hole, see it all the time. Of course she deserves what is coming to her, hopefully. But without addressing the real issue putting people in prisons will not solve the problem. It certainly makes us feel better though.
Aaron O
10-15-2018, 09:43 AM
In some situations the threat of enforcement of the law after a crime has been committed isn't enough to deter criminals.
Sometimes you need to understand why the crime is being committed to have any hope taking actions to deter potential criminals and reducing the crime rate.
The logical side agrees...
The other part hopes she gets shiv'd to spare "us" court costs and the families prolonged suffering.
William
10-15-2018, 09:54 AM
... But without addressing the real issue putting people in prisons will not solve the problem. It certainly makes us feel better though.
Sometimes people demonstrate (often with tragic consequences ) that they can't function lawfully in the general public. Reasons for their behavior can be multifaceted but that doesn't excuse the outcome. Separation from the general public is warranted in cases of violent and/or behavior where death occurs. It's not about making people "feel" better, it's about demonstrating there are consequences for unlawful behavior in society.
William
Sometimes people demonstrate (often with tragic consequences ) that they can't function lawfully in the general public. Reasons for their behavior can be multifaceted but that doesn't excuse the outcome. Separation from the general public is warranted in cases of violent and/or behavior where death occurs. It's not about making people "feel" better, it's about demonstrating there are consequences for unlawful behavior in society.
William
Agree
Black Dog
10-15-2018, 10:12 AM
Perhaps but with the current state of incarceration, chances are she’ll get out of prison worse than she went in. Not because I feel sorry for her but because the chances or her repeating is very high. Clearly the present ‘system’ for these types of offenses isn’t working. There is no ‘rehabilitation’, just revenge based punishment.
Truth. Everyone wants punishment for an injustice and that is legitimate, however when we ignore rehabilitation and prevention we are condemning someone else to the same injustice in the future. We can have both punishment, rehabilitation, and prevention all at the same time. The smart money is on the rehab and prevention side if you want to save lives and money.
William
10-15-2018, 10:19 AM
... when we ignore rehabilitation and prevention we are condemning someone else to the same injustice in the future. We can have both punishment, rehabilitation, and prevention all at the same time. The smart money is on the rehab and prevention side if you want to save lives and money.
I don't disagree that rehabilitation can be successful, it can change some people's behavior. Often the problem occurs when they get out and end up in the same environment they were in before hand. Same pressures and influences (and possibly dysfunctional) from family and friends. I think success is much more probable if they can also get away from those influences/pressures.
But we are drifting here.
William
froze
10-15-2018, 11:44 AM
There are drug rehab programs in prison. In some cases Inmates can reduce their sentence if they complete the program/programs
Right, while they complete those classes they also suddenly find Jesus and now their entirely different then before...till they get out and go back to drinking and driving while under license suspension. I knew a guy that had to take classes for year and was given some sort of chemical that if you drank you immediately threw up, he was on that for almost a year while he was in rehab, after the year was up guess what? yup, he went back to drinking.
So these programs are not working either, in fact the success rate is a astonishing low 3 to 10%. Lindsay Lohan went 4 times to rehab centers with no success. I know you can find success percentages on the internet at 30% but those have been proven dubious but they keep pushing that percentage because the money coming from the federal government so some success has to be shown or they'll shut them all down.
https://www.soberforever.net/currenttreatdoesnt.cfm
parris
10-15-2018, 01:15 PM
I've seen a bit of this over the years and what I see is it comes down to the person that's going through rehab. It doesn't matter how good the program is either. The person going through rehab has to WANT and ACCEPT it in order for it to have any real chance of success.
One of the other posters hit on an important component which is the person that's gone through rehab pretty much needs to get right away from his/her former life and contacts. If they don't do that it's generally a matter of time before the temptation combined with circumstance draws them back into the life.
For the driver in the case it's going to be interesting to see how the case unfolds.
William
10-15-2018, 03:37 PM
I... an important component which is the person that's gone through rehab pretty much needs to get right away from his/her former life and contacts. If they don't do that it's generally a matter of time before the temptation combined with circumstance draws them back into the life.
For the driver in the case it's going to be interesting to see how the case unfolds.
From what I've seen first hand this is a huge point. Not only from the temptation of being around the former influences, but also because their presence as one trying to change causes the others to become uncomfortable. If the reformer has admitted they had a problem and need to change, that means the "others" might also have a problem. Many times they will actively try to pull the reformer back in, not from malice per say, but from the fact that they are made uncomfortable by the reformers presence.
William
redir
10-15-2018, 07:18 PM
Sometimes people demonstrate (often with tragic consequences ) that they can't function lawfully in the general public. Reasons for their behavior can be multifaceted but that doesn't excuse the outcome. Separation from the general public is warranted in cases of violent and/or behavior where death occurs. It's not about making people "feel" better, it's about demonstrating there are consequences for unlawful behavior in society.
William
Sometime people who have demonstrated that they tragically cannot function within a civil society prove otherwise that they can too.
Again, and I want to be perfectly clear about this, this women needs harsh punishment. But it still doesn't address the problem. People always want to blame addicts for this that and the other thing as though it's their personal choice, it's really not. Some people are predisposed to certain addictions and while the majority of the 'punish them all' crowd just wants to put them all in prisons, like it will eliminate it from the gene pool or something, statistics over and over and over again show that it doesn't work.
There is lots of new science and treatment programs that treat addiction as the medical problem that it actually is. So if and when this really hits the mainstream addiction will be seen as nothing more then other genetic disease like IDK narcolepsy or something. The problem with addiction is that it requires and outside source, a 3rd party if you will. And so the general public see's that as 'a choice' that the attic makes. The dynamics of it are fluid though. You see it more and more with this terrible opiate epidemic. A child born to an addicted mother is not given 'a choice.'
My personal believe based on experience and research is that we'd be better off as a society if we treated a lot of things on a medical model rather then a crime and punishment one. The reality is that it's somewhere in between.
sjbraun
10-15-2018, 10:24 PM
Her BAL was 0.4.
Louis
10-15-2018, 10:28 PM
Her BAL was 0.4.
No way! That's practically comatose.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_alcohol_content
oldpotatoe
10-16-2018, 06:35 AM
There are drug rehab programs in prison. In some cases Inmates can reduce their sentence if they complete the program/programs
Yup, but
An estimated two-thirds (68 percent) of 405,000 prisoners released in 30 states in 2005 were arrested for a new crime within three years of release from prison, and three-quarters (77 percent) were arrested within five years, the Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) announced today
The 'system' is lacking plus the drug laws makes for a bunch of non violent, small time drug users filling the jails..PLUS the DC push for private prisons doesn't help BUT..yup, I hope this person doesn't get high/drunk and drive after she's out but chances are, she will...
nalax
10-16-2018, 06:47 AM
Yup, but
The 'system' is lacking plus the drug laws makes for a bunch of non violent, small time drug users filling the jails..PLUS the DC push for private prisons doesn't help BUT..yup, I hope this person doesn't get high/drunk and drive after she's out but chances are, she will...
However the result in this case was very violent, resulting in death to the rider and severe loss and suffering to the family.
oldpotatoe
10-16-2018, 06:50 AM
However the result in this case was very violent, resulting in death to the rider and severe loss and suffering to the family.
Correct and her sentence will probably reflect that BUT her chances of not repeating, because of not only the prison system into which she will be placed but also the situation she will return to after getting out, are small..she's not facing execution of life behind bars, she will get out.
sjbraun
10-16-2018, 07:10 AM
No way! That's practically comatose.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_alcohol_content
Five times the legal limit.
https://tucson.com/news/local/driver-arrested-in-connection-with-fatal-cyclist-crash-on-a/article_7ea63b4e-d0af-11e8-b733-8b45f11c782f.html#tracking-source=home-trending
Five times the legal limit.
https://tucson.com/news/local/driver-arrested-in-connection-with-fatal-cyclist-crash-on-a/article_7ea63b4e-d0af-11e8-b733-8b45f11c782f.html#tracking-source=home-trending
That's an astounding amount of booze.
Scuzzer
10-16-2018, 07:25 PM
That's an astounding amount of booze.
Yes it is. My close riding buddy has an alcoholic wife, she's reasonably operable in the 0.3s but her eyes roll back in her head and they take her to the emergency room at 0.45.
Trying to drive at 0.4 is impossible for hard core long time alcoholics, no wonder it ended up this way.
Before anyone yells at me about excusing any drunk driving, I'm not. In the day and age of Uber there's no reason to ever drink and drive.
Louis
10-16-2018, 07:46 PM
In the day and age of Uber there's no reason to ever drink and drive.
Will Uber even take a passenger who's that wasted? They're surely a threat to throw up and otherwise trash the vehicle, and their actions would be totally unpredictable.
Yes it is. My close riding buddy has an alcoholic wife, she's reasonably operable in the 0.3s but her eyes roll back in her head and they take her to the emergency room at 0.45.
Trying to drive at 0.4 is impossible for hard core long time alcoholics, no wonder it ended up this way.
Before anyone yells at me about excusing any drunk driving, I'm not. In the day and age of Uber there's no reason to ever drink and drive.
It sounds like just a couple more drinks and she wouldn't have been on the road at all.
She must have driven up there that morning since the park is closed to vehicles 8-8. She had to be wasted before she went up there.
Correct and her sentence will probably reflect that BUT her chances of not repeating, because of not only the prison system into which she will be placed but also the situation she will return to after getting out, are small..she's not facing execution of life behind bars, she will get out.
I'm not sure what prison or prison system your taking about? Private?
The prison system here in CA makes a concentrated effort to assist and offer programs to help inmates while in prison and help their return to society.
Worked for two prisons in CA. for many years as a Vocational instructor. Inmates are assigned counselors that play a significant role providing guidance to inmates through out their sentence.
All the academic and vocational programs include life skills in their curriculum from the most entry level. Inmates without a HS or GED are assigned into education programs in classification. Many inmates get their GED and or complete their HS while in these programs. Within the education department both academic and vocational there are programs for Anger Management, Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, Employment Preparation, Substance Use Disorder Treatment, Arts in Corrections and many others including AA programs from outside volunteers that assist an inmate with social and personal development. To find and maintain work is a main factor in recidivism across the nation, these programs help reduce recidivism. I have personally witnessed many lives changed because of these programs and the prison system I worked.
The programs are there, it's up to the person to want change and better his or her live.
oldpotatoe
10-17-2018, 06:50 AM
I'm not sure what prison or prison system your taking about? Private?
The prison system here in CA makes a concentrated effort to assist and offer programs to help inmates while in prison and help their return to society.
Worked for two prisons in CA. for many years as a Vocational instructor. Inmates are assigned counselors that play a significant role providing guidance to inmates through out their sentence.
All the academic and vocational programs include life skills in their curriculum from the most entry level. Inmates without a HS or GED are assigned into education programs in classification. Many inmates get their GED and or complete their HS while in these programs. Within the education department both academic and vocational there are programs for Anger Management, Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, Employment Preparation, Substance Use Disorder Treatment, Arts in Corrections and many others including AA programs from outside volunteers that assist an inmate with social and personal development. To find and maintain work is a main factor in recidivism across the nation, these programs help reduce recidivism. I have personally witnessed many lives changed because of these programs and the prison system I worked.
The programs are there, it's up to the person to want change and better his or her live.
You obviously have much more info and experience than I do..I just look at the recidivism rates for this type of thing and it's depressing. I feel sorry for the family of the gent that was killed but I hope that this 20 year old comes out the other end much, much better than she went in...Both for her sake and any potential victims that may end up in front of her. Arizona prison system...
You obviously have much more info and experience than I do..I just look at the recidivism rates for this type of thing and it's depressing. I feel sorry for the family of the gent that was killed but I hope that this 20 year old comes out the other end much, much better than she went in...Both for her sake and any potential victims that may end up in front of her. Arizona prison system...
Forgot to mention that as a vocational instructor we all had to develop a Trades Advisory Committee, TAC. These are folks working in their specific trades. All instructors are required to meet monthly with their TAC members on current technologies in their trade. These TAC folks would get clearance with the institution to come in and speck to the inmate students several times a year.
Many students in my program received jobs after their release with my TAC members. The vocational welding program had a very high rate of inmate employment with their TAC members.
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