campagnolo UT chainstay clearance

[R3awak3n]

About had it with this frame, if its not 1 thing its the other.

Just went through trouble of removing praxis bb386 evo cups (what a PITA), and now installed the campy bb386 evo cups. Go to install the damn UT cups and the NDS arms rubs on the frame. Any way I can space the arm out to have some clearance or am I SOL?

ok, so it does not rub but there is only 1mm clearance which is not to my liking. It was rubbing because somehow the wavy washer fell on the floor. I would still like to have a bit more room. Can I put 2 wavy washers in there? Or some sort of spacer?

[m4rk540]

Sol

[R3awak3n]

Sol

that is extremely disappointing.

[m4rk540]

This the UP?

[Mark McM]

Is the right cup fully pressed into the frame? And is the right BB face full flat and parallel? The lateral position of the cranks is fixed by the right cup, so if the cup is not fully pressed in, the cranks will be offset to the right.

If the BB face is flat and parallel and the right cup is fully pressed in, then the only option I can see (and it isn't a good one), is to shave down the BB right face a millimeter or two, and then add extra wavy washers to the left cup to fill in the space. This would be an option of last resort, if you really had to fit Ultra Torque cranks into this frame.

By the way, what brand and model frame is this?

[R3awak3n]

This the UP?
yes

Is the right cup fully pressed into the frame? And is the right BB face full flat and parallel? The lateral position of the cranks is fixed by the right cup, so if the cup is not fully pressed in, the cranks will be offset to the right.

If the BB face is flat and parallel and the right cup is fully pressed in, then the only option I can see (and it isn't a good one), is to shave down the BB right face a millimeter or two, and then add extra wavy washers to the left cup to fill in the space. This would be an option of last resort, if you really had to fit Ultra Torque cranks into this frame.

By the way, what brand and model frame is this?

Its an Open U.P.

The BB is flat, everything is pressed in and looks good except the middle of the arm is 1mm from hitting the frame.


edit - ok so something is weird, the crank even when fully tight moves a tiny little bit.

[FlashUNC]

Didn't Campy make the H11 crank to deal with this issue?

[R3awak3n]

I thoughr h11 was to deal with chainstay issues but I will inveatigate

[m4rk540]

^Correct. They are not mountain bike cranks. :crap:

TBH, my recent experience has scared and scarred me away from mid-cage RDs on "modern" frames, ie, non-standard chainstay lengths.

[R3awak3n]

I have been running mid cage on a few modern frames with no problems. This frame though not so much. I thought it was the crank and might be but now this problem is going to delay the answer since I have now have to find a new crank and BB

[NoMoreParagon]

Paulo you sure you tightening the bolt from the right side? The crank might feel wobbling if bolt is tightened from wrong side.
As a last resort I would try the Wishbone BB adapter. Only proven pressing system that works.
Good luck amigo


I have been running mid cage on a few modern frames with no problems. This frame though not so much. I thought it was the crank and might be but now this problem is going to delay the answer since I have now have to find a new crank and BB






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[oldpotatoe]

About had it with this frame, if its not 1 thing its the other.

Just went through trouble of removing praxis bb386 evo cups (what a PITA), and now installed the campy bb386 evo cups. Go to install the damn UT cups and the NDS arms rubs on the frame. Any way I can space the arm out to have some clearance or am I SOL?

ok, so it does not rub but there is only 1mm clearance which is not to my liking. It was rubbing because somehow the wavy washer fell on the floor. I would still like to have a bit more room. Can I put 2 wavy washers in there? Or some sort of spacer?

One of the issues with most all external BB type cranks..how they may not match with all frames..what frame material? Metal..put a socket at that spot and wack the socket to make an indentation there..it's really no big deal but it's a frame issue, not a crank issue.

[corky]

I run two wave washers to deal with a creak problem.......works fine for me.....

[ultraman6970]

Like cannondale did years ago? :)


One of the issues with most all external BB type cranks..how they may not match with all frames..what frame material? Metal..put a socket at that spot and wack the socket to make an indentation there..it's really no big deal but it's a frame issue, not a crank issue.

[ultraman6970]

This...

I run two wave washers to deal with a creak problem.......works fine for me.....

[oldpotatoe]

I run two wave washers to deal with a creak problem.......works fine for me.....

Carbon frame I see...this 'may' work, depends on the width the BB shell..certainly try it and see if crank spin is OK or is 'bindy'...

[R3awak3n]

Paulo you sure you tightening the bolt from the right side? The crank might feel wobbling if bolt is tightened from wrong side.
As a last resort I would try the Wishbone BB adapter. Only proven pressing system that works.
Good luck amigo









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Bolt on right side. I just think its too wide for campy

One of the issues with most all external BB type cranks..how they may not match with all frames..what frame material? Metal..put a socket at that spot and wack the socket to make an indentation there..it's really no big deal but it's a frame issue, not a crank issue.

carbon. :/

I run two wave washers to deal with a creak problem.......works fine for me.....

I even put 3... still not enough clearance and still some play.

[R3awak3n]

Carbon frame I see...this 'may' work, depends on the width the BB shell..certainly try it and see if crank spin is OK or is 'bindy'...

crank spins fine but if I move side to side I can feel a bit of play. And still just not enough space. I would like at least 3mm. Sure the frame is stiff and so are the cranks but its too close for comfort.


It is weird because I have seen a couple of OPENs with campy cranks. I have looked over everything and everything is installed properly. I mean, its a BB that is pressed in all the way, the wavy washer is in. If I put the NDS crank in and put it in it is clear that the stay is too close.

I think its just a compability issue since Open has to have the stays this way in order to clear the big tire.


Next try.... Rotor crank....


Boy.... I just got a quill stem, BSA frame and its oh so nice...

[oldpotatoe]

Bolt on right side. I just think its too wide for campy



carbon. :/



I even put 3... still not enough clearance and still some play.

Methinks the BB shell is undersized also..sorry..SOL, methinks..Does wheels manufacturing have an adapter/BB that is wider than the setup you have now?

[R3awak3n]

Methinks the BB shell is undersized also..sorry..SOL, methinks..Does wheels manufacturing have an adapter/BB that is wider than the setup you have now?

I am not sure...

At least the campy cups came out easily (unlike the praxis cups, which I don't think praxis has ever removed from a frame since their instructions were wrong lol).

I think I will call this one done and move to the Rotor. Reason I have seen plenty of OPEN frames with them and they have a screw in Press BB which I like better than just press.

The saga continues on this one, winter is coming and I will probably have less than 200 miles on the bike lol

[Hindmost]

Didn't Campy make the H11 crank to deal with this issue?

What's the deal with H11? Does it have a wider Q? Are the chainrings shifted outboard? Or...

[oldpotatoe]

What's the deal with H11? Does it have a wider Q? Are the chainrings shifted outboard? Or...

Clearly the difference is tiny. Campagnolo didn’t say how far their new chainrings were moved outboard to maintain ideal alignment, so we did the simple math. 5mm wider hubs. That moves the cassette 2.5mm outboard. So the chainrings just need to move the same 2.5mm outboard to again line up with the cassette. Ok, that is small, and explains why Campy said they were able to make the change without impacting the 145.5mm Q-factor of their cranks.

From a BikeRumor test/review. Aligning the CRs to a cogset that is further outboard on either 135mm QR or 12/142 TA rear hub...

[R3awak3n]

What's the deal with H11? Does it have a wider Q? Are the chainrings shifted outboard? Or...

From a BikeRumor test/review. Aligning the CRs to a cogset that is further outboard on either 135mm QR or 12/142 TA rear hub...

exactly, Q factor remains the same and H11 cranks work fine with 130mm frames