What he knew (Dario content)

[Climb01742]

There was so much to Dario. His frames, his art, his life, his personality, his fame. Some of that may have put some folks off. Like, come on, is anyone worthy of all that hubbub? Maybe we, his fans, sang his praise too loudly for some. I sure loved him.

But in all that he was, I hope something doesn’t get lost. What he knew. What his hands and mind knew about bikes.

He raced when he was young. He had a girlfriend who he’d ride to see, over 200kms round trip in one day, when he was young. That may be the very definition of ‘young’, being able to ride a few hundred kms and still be able to, um, visit with your girlfriend. He was raised on a bike.

Then he apprenticed to a bike builder, beginning by sweeping floors. He learned with his hands.

Then he became a builder of trust. Though we, his fans, built him up, he never puffed himself up. I had to go digging in a corner, on the floor, in the dust to find the box with all his pro build sheets. Another builder might have put those front and center. Hell, others might have framed them on their walls and said, see! Dario shoved them on the floor, in the dust. But think about what those built sheets really meant. Today, a new frame goes through thousands of CAD versions. But what Dario made, he made by hand. Then it was ridden by a racer in the hardest conditions and hardest ways possible and then real world feedback came in. Human feedback, racing feedback. In one year, Dario made 25 frames for Pantani and Pantani said what he thought of each, how a mm felt here, how an angle felt there. Crazy, yes. But who will ever again do that? Who will ever again build with his own hands so many frames for men who pushed them so hard and then told Dario the good and the bad? All that was in his head and in his hands, and now it’s gone.

One last thing he knew. Doing a fit these days has become gizmo crazy. Dario used two things. First his tape measure. Then his eyes as you sat on a bike. Outside his old shop, in the sun, he had me sit on my stock CCKMP I had bought in America and brought to Italy to ride. He had me just sit on it. First he asked me who fit me to this bike? Sheepishly I said, me. I heard him shake his head. I tried to melt into my bike. Then he just walked around me sitting (and hiding) on the bike. And he looked. Then out of the blue he said, does your right shoulder hurt? Every time I ride, I said. No wonder, he said. Then he said, ok, you can get off. I’ve had too many fits to count in my life and no one else ever asked about my aching right shoulder. But Dario’s eyes knew.

It’s good to celebrate all that Dario was, because he was, and meant, so much to so many people. And maybe forgive those of us who loved him if we get a little carried away. Blame us for that, not him. We put him on the mountaintop, he never put himself there. All that he knew and had done was in a cardboard box, in the dust, shoved in a corner, under a bunch of crap.

But what he knew really lived in his hands and his eyes and his mind. I don’t think anyone will ever again go through what his hands made. That world is gone. And sadly, now he is too. With all he knew.

[ERK55]

Thanks for that.

[thwart]

Great story. Thanks for posting it.

Death takes so much knowledge from this world. Hope Dario was a teacher... his generous personality leads me to believe he must have been.

[rwsaunders]

Great story. Thanks for posting it.

Death takes so much knowledge from this world. Hope Dario was a teacher... his generous personality leads me to believe he must have been.

+!.

[notsew]

Very nice.

I've always wondered why people got excited about Pegoretti - and never really looked to find out - and you've summed it all up very nicely. thanks.

[efuentes]

Very well said.

[nobuseri]

These kinds of posts are very welcome here. Nothing to forgive. Post away and thanks for sharing.

[Johnnysmooth]

Nice story, great reflection on a true master of his craft.

[paredown]

Beautifully said.

Fatto a mano. With hands that feel, measure, weigh and fit....

[David Kirk]

Thank you for this.

As a younger builder I knew of Dario and his work with the top pros of the time and this was very inspiring. Over time his image was more formed by his beautiful paint on both bikes and canvas. And as much as I love his paint (I really do just stare in smiling wonder) I feel it short changes his legacy as a framebuilder working to make the metal work for the rider.

Whenever I spoke with Dario we usually focused on life's non-cycling pleasures and this of course was a real joy. On one occasion we spoke about the technical aspects of bike design and stiffness and I loved every second of it....not only because I'm a tech geek but because so many young builders (and customers) really didn't know the depth of Dario's knowledge when it came to handling and fit. There are some very popular builders on the scene that know little about why a bike does what it does but Dario was not one of them. His lust for life could give one the impression that he'd never be bothered with those little details but that would be wrong. He owned them.

dave

[Bob Ross]

<3

[Hardlyrob]

Nice Climb

[weisan]

Thank you climb and Dave pal, can always count on you two gents to help us rise above ourselves and regain that mountain-top experience.

[Climb01742]

Thank you for this.

As a younger builder I knew of Dario and his work with the top pros of the time and this was very inspiring. Over time his image was more formed by his beautiful paint on both bikes and canvas. And as much as I love his paint (I really do just stare in smiling wonder) I feel it short changes his legacy as a framebuilder working to make the metal work for the rider.

Whenever I spoke with Dario we usually focused on life's non-cycling pleasures and this of course was a real joy. On one occasion we spoke about the technical aspects of bike design and stiffness and I loved every second of it....not only because I'm a tech geek but because so many young builders (and customers) really didn't know the depth of Dario's knowledge when it came to handling and fit. There are some very popular builders on the scene that know little about why a bike does what it does but Dario was not one of them. His lust for life could give one the impression that he'd never be bothered with those little details but that would be wrong. He owned them.

dave

Thanks, Dave, for adding your words. I can imagine that talking shop between you two would have been cool. You approach your work as he did, with passion and respect and time-won knowledge.

[Lionel]

Very well said.

[overmyhead]

Thanks for that. Very nice.

[FlashUNC]

I never had a chance to meet Dario. Know more than a few folks who did, and none of them had an ill word about him. Quite the opposite, it seemed like everyone loved him, even if they just crossed paths with him briefly.

I'll freely admit to -- purely on the bike end of things -- being something of a Pegoretti hater through the years. I thought the headtubes were goofy, the proprietary seatpost sizes oddly stubborn, and then the proprietary headtube sizes even more so. How much different could a steel bike be anyways from another steel bike made by a similarly accomplished builder?

In hindsight, its that kind of blase assessment that kept me away from what I've now found to be one of the best riding bikes I've ever had. I regret not putting my money where my mouth was sooner, and I do wish I'd met the man at some point.

[wgp]

Loving these stories!
As I said in another post, I have my first Peg coming in from a purchase here on the forum last week - a Marcelo that belonged to mistremo. In preparation I’ve been “reading up” on all the Peg threads here and at VSalon.

[chazmtb]

Thank you for sharing.

Although I knew that Dario was a great craftsman, and how that passion went into my bike, it is kind of bitter sweet to find the other stories about Dario after his passing.

Rest In Peace Maestro.

[Never]

One of Pegoretti’s wonderful qualities as a person was that he was never so egotistical or self-serving about his accomplishments and interactions. He didn’t seem to have any need to show off about himself, and did not seem at all interested in acting superior or special in any way.

He was devoted to his family, friends, his work, and living his own life; the “image” part he left to others, to make of as they would for whatever reasons, supportive and suspect.

Given his stature, his humility in that sense was one of the many great lessons that came from within him, as always naturally and without arrogance or conceit.

[pinkshogun]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9SVKeUS9Dc

[choke]

was he in on the joke?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9SVKeUS9DcI remember when that came out....Jeff got a lot of flak for it. He said that he told Dario to just 'go with the flow' so Dario was in on it to some degree.

[choke]

Climb....that was great read. Thanks. :beer:

[EliteVelo]

There was so much to Dario. His frames, his art, his life, his personality, his fame. Some of that may have put some folks off. Like, come on, is anyone worthy of all that hubbub? Maybe we, his fans, sang his praise too loudly for some. I sure loved him.

But in all that he was, I hope something doesn’t get lost. What he knew. What his hands and mind knew about bikes.

He raced when he was young. He had a girlfriend who he’d ride to see, over 200kms round trip in one day, when he was young. That may be the very definition of ‘young’, being able to ride a few hundred kms and still be able to, um, visit with your girlfriend. He was raised on a bike.

Then he apprenticed to a bike builder, beginning by sweeping floors. He learned with his hands.

Then he became a builder of trust. Though we, his fans, built him up, he never puffed himself up. I had to go digging in a corner, on the floor, in the dust to find the box with all his pro build sheets. Another builder might have put those front and center. Hell, others might have framed them on their walls and said, see! Dario shoved them on the floor, in the dust. But think about what those built sheets really meant. Today, a new frame goes through thousands of CAD versions. But what Dario made, he made by hand. Then it was ridden by a racer in the hardest conditions and hardest ways possible and then real world feedback came in. Human feedback, racing feedback. In one year, Dario made 25 frames for Pantani and Pantani said what he thought of each, how a mm felt here, how an angle felt there. Crazy, yes. But who will ever again do that? Who will ever again build with his own hands so many frames for men who pushed them so hard and then told Dario the good and the bad? All that was in his head and in his hands, and now it’s gone.

One last thing he knew. Doing a fit these days has become gizmo crazy. Dario used two things. First his tape measure. Then his eyes as you sat on a bike. Outside his old shop, in the sun, he had me sit on my stock CCKMP I had bought in America and brought to Italy to ride. He had me just sit on it. First he asked me who fit me to this bike? Sheepishly I said, me. I heard him shake his head. I tried to melt into my bike. Then he just walked around me sitting (and hiding) on the bike. And he looked. Then out of the blue he said, does your right shoulder hurt? Every time I ride, I said. No wonder, he said. Then he said, ok, you can get off. I’ve had too many fits to count in my life and no one else ever asked about my aching right shoulder. But Dario’s eyes knew.

It’s good to celebrate all that Dario was, because he was, and meant, so much to so many people. And maybe forgive those of us who loved him if we get a little carried away. Blame us for that, not him. We put him on the mountaintop, he never put himself there. All that he knew and had done was in a cardboard box, in the dust, shoved in a corner, under a bunch of crap.

But what he knew really lived in his hands and his eyes and his mind. I don’t think anyone will ever again go through what his hands made. That world is gone. And sadly, now he is too. With all he knew.

This gives me great pleasure to read. Thank you for sharing! Without taking away from the unfortunate, Marco Bertoletti did the same for me as a young, innocent, arrogant American in their presence. Aside from fit, we rode together and he analyzed my fit based on how I rode.

While I never had the pleasure of meeting Dario in person, aside from a distance listening to the beauty of conversation, Marco was inspired by his passion. When asked who he would have him build his personal bike other than himself, without hesitation he said Pegoretti. His artistry and true passion for what we do inspired many. Continued prayers for his family.

[EliteVelo]

There was so much to Dario. His frames, his art, his life, his personality, his fame. Some of that may have put some folks off. Like, come on, is anyone worthy of all that hubbub? Maybe we, his fans, sang his praise too loudly for some. I sure loved him.

But in all that he was, I hope something doesn’t get lost. What he knew. What his hands and mind knew about bikes.

He raced when he was young. He had a girlfriend who he’d ride to see, over 200kms round trip in one day, when he was young. That may be the very definition of ‘young’, being able to ride a few hundred kms and still be able to, um, visit with your girlfriend. He was raised on a bike.

Then he apprenticed to a bike builder, beginning by sweeping floors. He learned with his hands.

Then he became a builder of trust. Though we, his fans, built him up, he never puffed himself up. I had to go digging in a corner, on the floor, in the dust to find the box with all his pro build sheets. Another builder might have put those front and center. Hell, others might have framed them on their walls and said, see! Dario shoved them on the floor, in the dust. But think about what those built sheets really meant. Today, a new frame goes through thousands of CAD versions. But what Dario made, he made by hand. Then it was ridden by a racer in the hardest conditions and hardest ways possible and then real world feedback came in. Human feedback, racing feedback. In one year, Dario made 25 frames for Pantani and Pantani said what he thought of each, how a mm felt here, how an angle felt there. Crazy, yes. But who will ever again do that? Who will ever again build with his own hands so many frames for men who pushed them so hard and then told Dario the good and the bad? All that was in his head and in his hands, and now it’s gone.

One last thing he knew. Doing a fit these days has become gizmo crazy. Dario used two things. First his tape measure. Then his eyes as you sat on a bike. Outside his old shop, in the sun, he had me sit on my stock CCKMP I had bought in America and brought to Italy to ride. He had me just sit on it. First he asked me who fit me to this bike? Sheepishly I said, me. I heard him shake his head. I tried to melt into my bike. Then he just walked around me sitting (and hiding) on the bike. And he looked. Then out of the blue he said, does your right shoulder hurt? Every time I ride, I said. No wonder, he said. Then he said, ok, you can get off. I’ve had too many fits to count in my life and no one else ever asked about my aching right shoulder. But Dario’s eyes knew.

It’s good to celebrate all that Dario was, because he was, and meant, so much to so many people. And maybe forgive those of us who loved him if we get a little carried away. Blame us for that, not him. We put him on the mountaintop, he never put himself there. All that he knew and had done was in a cardboard box, in the dust, shoved in a corner, under a bunch of crap.

But what he knew really lived in his hands and his eyes and his mind. I don’t think anyone will ever again go through what his hands made. That world is gone. And sadly, now he is too. With all he knew.

This gives me great pleasure to read. Thank you for sharing! Without taking away from the unfortunate, Marco Bertoletti did the same for me as a young, innocent, arrogant American in their presence. Aside from fit, we rode together and he analyzed my fit based on how I rode.

I never had the pleasure of meeting Dario in person, aside from a distance listening to the beauty of conversation. Marco was inspired by his passion. When asked who he would have him build his personal bike other than himself, without hesitation he said Pegoretti. His artistry and true passion for what we do inspired many. Continued prayers for his family.

[Never]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9SVKeUS9Dc

I remember when that came out....Jeff got a lot of flak for it. He said that he told Dario to just 'go with the flow' so Dario was in on it to some degree.

I never saw that video before but it is silly and insipid, and doesn't teach anything interesting at all. Pegoretti looks more annoyed than anything there even if he knew the setup and what he was supposed to do to play the game.

Too bad now for having seen it in a thread about appreciating someone who gave so much actual intelligence to cycling. It's sad.

If it is entertaining for others, OK fine; it just feels pointless and not very respectful in this context, today.

Maybe VSalon simply shutting their entire site for a couple of days was a very good idea, the most elegant way to really honor him.

[Keith A]

Climb and Dave -- Thanks so much for sharing your personal experiences with Dario. They are a very nice tribute to him and how he touched your lives as well as many others.

[Burnette]

I posted this in the RIP Dario thread and wanted to relay it here too. It says a lot about the man that even in his passing something beautiful came out.

I just wanted to post that this and the other thread about Dario in this forum is about as good as a tribute as he could ask for.

It's cyclist touched by him and his work sharing about time spent with him, articles and videos and cyclists here who have and appreciate examples of his work.

It reflects well on Dario and it does so just as well on the people who contributed to the two thread here, I have enjoyed reading you all and I have a greater appreciation and understanding of Dario because of it.

[weisan]

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a20006361/custom-bicycles/

https://pelotonmagazine.com/features/the-legend-of-dario-pegoretti/

[buddybikes]

Fortunately there are younger highly skilled builders out there to keep this little art/industry going. Remember, buying second hand the tubes weren't selected for you and your riding...

the cycling world remembers, life goes on...

[oldpotatoe]

“I experiment because everything interests me,” he replied. “There is just too much to learn, but I think about perfection in everything I do; it is always in my mind. I think about Michelangelo (painting the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel). If you spend a lifetime at the bench and you give everything, maybe before you die you can be a fingertip away from perfection — a fingertip away from touching God. We can try, no?”
https://cyclingtips.com/2018/08/tribute-to-dario-pegoretti/

[crankles]

Great story. Thanks for posting it.

Death takes so much knowledge from this world. Hope Dario was a teacher... his generous personality leads me to believe he must have been.

I think Dario left far more behind that he took with him...exponentially so.

Thanks Dario.

[colker]

Fortunately there are younger highly skilled builders out there to keep this little art/industry going. Remember, buying second hand the tubes weren't selected for you and your riding...

the cycling world remembers, life goes on...

MOst of the Pegorettis out there have standard model geometries and tubing.

[weaponsgrade]

https://cyclingtips.com/2018/08/tribute-to-dario-pegoretti/

That's a beautiful quote.

[Never]

That's a beautiful quote.

Yes it really is so.

And very applicable to so many aspects of life and work and even love including bicycle forums, really.

[weisan]

“You have told me that perfection is not possible,” I said to him. “Is this what gives you the freedom to reinvent and experiment?”

“I experiment because everything interests me,” he replied. “There is just too much to learn, but I think about perfection in everything I do; it is always in my mind. I think about Michelangelo (painting the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel). If you spend a lifetime at the bench and you give everything, maybe before you die you can be a fingertip away from perfection — a fingertip away from touching God. We can try, no?” .

[thwart]

https://vimeo.com/100338794

Most of you have probably seen this already... but a good way to start the day.

Suspect Mr. Pegoretti had something to do with picking the soundtrack. Turn it up.

[pjbaz]

Fortunately there are younger highly skilled builders out there to keep this little art/industry going. Remember, buying second hand the tubes weren't selected for you and your riding...

the cycling world remembers, life goes on...

Also remember, not everyone needs a custom frame, yet a master designed, selected tubes and built magnificent machines that change hands and make others' happy.

Way to piss in the punchbowl ...

[pjbaz]

I never saw that video before but it is silly and insipid, and doesn't teach anything interesting at all. Pegoretti looks more annoyed than anything there even if he knew the setup and what he was supposed to do to play the game.

Too bad now for having seen it in a thread about appreciating someone who gave so much actual intelligence to cycling. It's sad.

If it is entertaining for others, OK fine; it just feels pointless and not very respectful in this context, today.

Maybe VSalon simply shutting their entire site for a couple of days was a very good idea, the most elegant way to really honor him.

I want to slap that jackass interviewer. If he was joking, he did a piss-poor job of it. If he was serious, well, he still sucks, and I still want to slap him.

[wgp]

https://vimeo.com/100338794

Most of you have probably seen this already... but a good way to start the day.

Suspect Mr. Pegoretti had something to do with picking the soundtrack. Turn it up.


That is one of the best Dario videos I’ve seen over these last few days of tribute postings - many thanks!