Phil Wood Headset feedback

[joosttx]

Has anyone used a Phil Wood headset? If so what is your opinion of them? So far, I have heard only positive things but I am looking for real-world experience. Thanks.

[rwsaunders]

If it’s like their other products I bet that it’s awesome. Aren’t they a relatively new item for PW?

http://www.philwood.com/products/headsethome.php

[false_Aest]

With a Phil Wood headset I'm able to change direction by rotating my handlebars to the right and left. For that very reason I give it 4/5 stars.

The reason for not getting 5/5 stars is because I don't like the name Phil.

Chris King gets 2.5/5 stars because I like the name Chris less than I do Phil. It should be a 2/5 but I like the last name King.

Cane Creek gets 5/5 stars because Peter Gilbert is an effin awesome mensch and can do no wrong.

If Chris King headsets and Phil Wood Headsets and White Industry headsets were named Cane Creek headsets they would also get 5/5 stars because they let me change direction by rotating my handlebars and they would be associated with Peter Gilbert.

[nmrt]

I have no idea how the headsets are. I have used their BB and it was solid. And I am pretty certain that the headset should be too. But I was just aghast at the weight (it matters to me). CK is about 108 g and so is Cane Creek 110 for a 1 1/8 headset. Tune and other boutique headsets are about 55- 80 g. I have used headsets made by Cane Creek, CK, and as well as Tune and Extralite. They have all worked great.

But I just wonder how is the PW headset 267 g?!

[FlashUNC]

Go Ceramicspeed

[joosttx]

With a Phil Wood headset I'm able to change direction by rotating my handlebars to the right and left. For that very reason I give it 4/5 stars.

The reason for not getting 5/5 stars is because I don't like the name Phil.

Chris King gets 2.5/5 stars because I like the name Chris less than I do Phil. It should be a 2/5 but I like the last name King.

Cane Creek gets 5/5 stars because Peter Gilbert is an effin awesome mensch and can do no wrong.

If Chris King headsets and Phil Wood Headsets and White Industry headsets were named Cane Creek headsets they would also get 5/5 stars because they let me change direction by rotating my handlebars and they would be associated with Peter Gilbert.

cane creek headsets suck.

[m4rk540]

Performance to cost, this is the best headset on the market.

https://velo-orange.com/collections/headsets/products/grand-cru-1-1-8-threadless-headset

[AngryScientist]

I have no idea how the headsets are. I have used their BB and it was solid. And I am pretty certain that the headset should be too. But I was just aghast at the weight (it matters to me). CK is about 108 g and so is Cane Creek 110 for a 1 1/8 headset. Tune and other boutique headsets are about 55- 80 g. I have used headsets made by Cane Creek, CK, and as well as Tune and Extralite. They have all worked great.

But I just wonder how is the PW headset 267 g?!

ha, i feel the same way about the hubs. i have a really sweet, and beautiful to look at set of phil road hubs in the basement, but i often wonder where the hid the depleted uranium pellets in those things. heavy!


as for right above, joostx probably subjects his equipment to a more demanding environment than i do typically, but i've found cane creek 110 headsets to be every bit as good of quality as chris king, for whatever that's worth.

[elliott]

cane creek headsets suck.

I hope you are joking.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Performance to cost, this is the best headset on the market.

https://velo-orange.com/collections/headsets/products/grand-cru-1-1-8-threadless-headset

I've used that headset and it was just fine. But, it wasn't better or cheaper than the Cane Creek 40s I've used.

I like Cane Creek 110 for several reasons.

I wouldn't expect a Phil Wood headset to have any performance/operational issues and I can see the appeal of using one for reasons aside from performance or weight.

[joosttx]

I hope you are joking.

i wish i were. have owned two Cane Creek headset in my life both lasted less than 2 months. My buddy had one warrantied on his ibis and the new one seized (not 100%) the next day we were going on a long biking weekend. He sold the bike and got a seven bc the cane creek was the only brand of headset that would fit the ibis. a guy sold a bike because he wanted to use a different headset brand than cane creek.

[joosttx]

I have no idea how the headsets are. I have used their BB and it was solid. And I am pretty certain that the headset should be too. But I was just aghast at the weight (it matters to me). CK is about 108 g and so is Cane Creek 110 for a 1 1/8 headset. Tune and other boutique headsets are about 55- 80 g. I have used headsets made by Cane Creek, CK, and as well as Tune and Extralite. They have all worked great.

But I just wonder how is the PW headset 267 g?!

the 11/8 - 1.5 (the bigger one) claimed weight is 156g slightly less than CK inset 7 which is the equivalent.

[R3awak3n]

i wish i were. have owned two Cane Creek headset in my life both lasted less than 2 months. My buddy had one warrantied on his ibis and the new one seized (not 100%) the next day we were going on a long biking weekend. He sold the bike and got a seven bc the cane creek was the only brand of headset that would fit the ibis. a guy sold a bike because he wanted to use a different headset brand than cane creek.

I am going to bet there are way more good experiences with CC than are bad experiences. I myself have owned more CC headsets than kings. They have always been great. CKs have been great too. hell I have had cheap ritcheys that have been great as well.

[joosttx]

I am going to bet there are way more good experiences with CC than are bad experiences. I myself have owned more CC headsets than kings. They have always been great. CKs have been great too. hell I have had cheap ritcheys that have been great as well.

Chris King has been the only brand that has worked out for me. However, I torched one of their headsets after 3 years of use.

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/799/41592142171_08f2167d12_h.jpg

[m4rk540]

I've used that headset and it was just fine. But, it wasn't better or cheaper than the Cane Creek 40s I've used.

I like Cane Creek 110 for several reasons.

I wouldn't expect a Phil Wood headset to have any performance/operational issues and I can see the appeal of using one for reasons aside from performance or weight.

I have one on my pub bike which has lived in the backyard for about 6 years, slightly protected from the elements by a hedge. Rainfall last winter was higher than average and for the first time I began to notice corrosion and dulled finishes on the bike. But the headset looks as good as the day I installed it. And it's silky smooth. Tough to keep a modern polished headset looking mint, let alone a neglected one. I think I paid $45.

[donevwil]

I am going to bet there are way more good experiences with CC than are bad experiences. I myself have owned more CC headsets than kings. They have always been great. CKs have been great too. hell I have had cheap ritcheys that have been great as well.

I agree on most counts. Old CCs from the S2 generation were hit and miss on quality, current 40s and 110s are excellent. CK should be boycotted for trying to pass off an O-ring as a compression ring just to avoid an active patent only to incorporate one into their design as soon as the patent lapsed.

Most pre-mature headset failures are due to poor frame prep or ham fisted mechanics.

[ColonelJLloyd]

I have one on my pub bike which has lived in the backyard for about 6 years, slightly protected from the elements by a hedge. Rainfall last winter was higher than average and for the first time I began to notice corrosion and dulled finishes on the bike. But the headset looks as good as the day I installed it. And it's silky smooth. Tough to keep a modern polished headset looking mint, let alone a neglected one. I think I paid $45.

Legit testimony.

Most pre-mature headset failures are due to poor frame prep or ham fisted mechanics.

Heard.

[joosttx]

I am going to bet there are way more good experiences with CC than are bad experiences. I myself have owned more CC headsets than kings. They have always been great. CKs have been great too. hell I have had cheap ritcheys that have been great as well.

I know people that like them and they have worked for them. Others and me not so much. I have never heard someone not happy with a chris king headset.

[R3awak3n]

I know people that like them and they have worked for them. Others and me not so much. I have never heard someone not happy with a chris king headset.

fair enough. I am sure there is someone out there but I also never heard anyone not happy with a CK and they sure are quality head sets, no doubt

[donevwil]

I have never heard someone not happy with a chris king headset.

Well here you go.

[joosttx]

Well here you go.

Seriously you are the first. why?

[AngryScientist]

ahh, i understand now. i just looked at the website. there is indeed a stainless steel cup version of the headset as well as an alloy cup version (which is the one that comes in colors other than silver). that accounts for the weight difference mentioned early in the thread.

says that all parts are machined in house, and we know that phil wood bearings are some of the best in the business - so with those two things in mind, i would imagine there is no reason to expect that these are any less than excellent.

[bigbill]

I considered one for the Coconino but there wasn't good availability last summer. I ended up with a CC 110 and it's been just fine. All my other bikes have King including a 21 year old threaded one in the Merckx MX Leader.

[donevwil]

Seriously you are the first. why?

My opinion relates to their old threadless design that used an o-ring in the compression cap to avoid a patent. O-ring would wear grooves in soft steerers if not checked and cleaned/replaced periodically and ultimately the bearing contact surface of the compression cap (or whatever they called it) would develop a groove due to relative motion (compliant o-ring) causing the headset to loosen. Cap had to be replaced to get the headset tight. CK changed the design as soon as the patent lapsed, so they clearly knew they had been selling a sub-standard design for years simply to save a buck on an already overpriced unit.

Threaded and current threadless headsets are great, wonderful bearings that are press fit, excellent. I simply refuse to use anything from a company that knowingly sells an inferior product simply to save money just because they know the can (have a cult following).

[joosttx]

ahh, i understand now. i just looked at the website. there is indeed a stainless steel cup version of the headset as well as an alloy cup version (which is the one that comes in colors other than silver). that accounts for the weight difference mentioned early in the thread.

says that all parts are machined in house, and we know that phil wood bearings are some of the best in the business - so with those two things in mind, i would imagine there is no reason to expect that these are any less than excellent.

I would just like to hear some real world experience. My hesitation goes back to when Chris King started making BB. They (the BBs) had some issue with longevity. You can give all the accolades about CK that you are saying about Phil. However, switching from one part to another maybe harder than we think regardless of standards of quality.

[joosttx]

My opinion relates to their old threadless design that used an o-ring in the compression cap to avoid a patent. O-ring would wear grooves in soft steerers if not checked and cleaned/replaced periodically and ultimately the bearing contact surface of the compression cap (or whatever they called it) would develop a groove due to relative motion (compliant o-ring) causing the headset to loosen. Cap had to be replaced to get the headset tight. CK changed the design as soon as the patent lapsed, so they clearly knew they had been selling a sub-standard design for years simply to save a buck on an already overpriced unit.

Threaded and current threadless headsets are great, wonderful bearings that are press fit, excellent. I simply refuse to use any product from a company that knowingly sells an inferior product simply to save money just because they know the can (have a cult following).

makes sense.

[donevwil]

I would just like to hear some real world experience. My hesitation goes back to when Chris King started making BB. They had some issue with longevity. You can say all the accolades about CK that you are saying about Phil. However, switching from one part to another maybe harder than we think regardless of standards of quality.

I would be curious about this too. The one knock on PW BBs is their bearings not incorporating the most durable and effective seals out there. That would be important to me in a top of the line headset.

[joosttx]

I would be curious about this too. The one knock on PW BBs is their bearings not incorporating the most durable and effective seals out there. That would be important to me in a top of the line headset.

Well, I ordered one from the LBS today. And will have it installed in a week and half. I will let you know how it works. But for me, headset performance is all about longterm durability and robust-itude.

I guess you dont want to buy a lightly used black CK inset7 on the cheap? Ill even drive up to Petaluma and hand deliver it to you. :)

[joosttx]

looks pretty cool.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1840/28874846717_8a542140c0.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1775/43811174251_0b2a3df6fa.jpg

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/929/42907584085_cbcb95f0d8.jpg

[AngryScientist]

sounds like you pulled the trigger, but for what it's worth, i had an opportunity to talk to a well respected framebuilder todayand handle some of the new white industries headsets, and they look good, from an aesthetic and engineering standpoint.

[jtbadge]

sounds like you pulled the trigger, but for what it's worth, i had an opportunity to talk to a well respected framebuilder todayand handle some of the new white industries headsets, and they look good, from an aesthetic and engineering standpoint.

Hopefully they figured out their sizing tolerances. My bike had the headtube reamed with the Chris King tool and the WI headset is too small for a tight press fit.

[AngryScientist]

Hopefully they figured out their sizing tolerances. My bike had the headtube reamed with the Chris King tool and the WI headset is too small for a tight press fit.

from what i understand, yes, the very early V1 tolerance issues have been resolved.

[joosttx]

Hopefully they figured out their sizing tolerances. My bike had the headtube reamed with the Chris King tool and the WI headset is too small for a tight press fit.

This is what I am worried about. I am a believer (from plenty of experiences) dont go messing with something that works.

Hopefully, this adventure will not be a boondoggle just to get a solid black headset with a red "P" on top.

[joosttx]

from what i understand, yes, the very early V1 tolerance issues have been resolved.

I hear the same thing around town.

[donevwil]

IMO the PW headsets have the best aesthetic by far, subtle with no garish advertising. They just don't make the combo I need, yet.

Eager to hear your impressions.

[weiwentg]

But I just wonder how is the PW headset 267 g?!

If you look at the specs page (http://www.philwood.com/products/headsethome.php), the version with steel cups is the one that weighs 267g. Everyone else's cups are aluminum, so that would explain things IMO. They also sell a version with aluminum cups that's a claimed 144g. I think that's still heavier than others, but perhaps that's in the bearings - maybe better sealed, maybe more grease, all speculation on my part.

[joosttx]

If you look at the specs page (http://www.philwood.com/products/headsethome.php), the version with steel cups is the one that weighs 267g. Everyone else's cups are aluminum, so that would explain things IMO. They also sell a version with aluminum cups that's a claimed 144g. I think that's still heavier than others, but perhaps that's in the bearings - maybe better sealed, maybe more grease, all speculation on my part.

The tapered PW HS for a 44mm HT claimed weight is 156g. That’s slightly lighter than the CK inset7 which is CK equivalent. That’s the one I am interested in.

[Lionel]

My CC110 experience was terrible as well. Never again. Also never had an issue with a CK headset. Where is this PW going the Mosaic ?

[joosttx]

My CC110 experience was terrible as well. Never again. Also never had an issue with a CK headset. Where is this PW going the Mosaic ?

No, I’m putting it on the 44.

[Lionel]

No, I’m putting it on the 44.

What is wrong with the CK that is in there now ?

[joosttx]

Nothing. Wanna buy a black inset7 for cheap? I want an all black headset

[Lionel]

Nothing. Wanna buy a black inset7 for cheap? I want an all black headset

I have no frame for that :)

[joosttx]

I have no frame for that :)

yet....

[joosttx]

Ill give a review in 10 years (I hope)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1813/29124467387_dedd223bc5_z.jpg

[joosttx]

Here are some close up of the headset. It is shaped differently than others. Its a like more squared for the bottom part than CK. Without getting into mm variances it is the same size as the CK inset 7. A nice touch on top is spacer that is contoured. the Quality is very nice as you would expect. It does seem more solid but that is probably the squared look. So far so good after about 100 miles.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1898/42360127440_e4beed1945_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1833/42360127260_02d07b0dbb_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1852/42360127170_e4beed1945_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1889/29231036887_fc90f6f858_b.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1831/29231036857_a9e3b3eea9_b.jpg

[berserk87]

Anyone? Or maybe an update from Joosttx? I'm in the market for a new headset. I think my CK is smoked and I'm looking at the Cane Creek 110 series or the Phil Wood. Just considering. I've used Chris King headsets for a loooong time so I don't know much else.

[joosttx]

Anyone? Or maybe an update from Joosttx? I'm in the market for a new headset. I think my CK is smoked and I'm looking at the Cane Creek 110 series or the Phil Wood. Just considering. I've used Chris King headsets for a loooong time so I don't know much else.

I sold my 44 a few months ago. But I had no issues with the Philwood headset. I was very happy with it.

[sales guy]

Anyone? Or maybe an update from Joosttx? I'm in the market for a new headset. I think my CK is smoked and I'm looking at the Cane Creek 110 series or the Phil Wood. Just considering. I've used Chris King headsets for a loooong time so I don't know much else.

Just put this on a build for a customer. Beautiful headset with matching spacer kit. Even did a matching seat collar for him.