OT: Toronto Shooting

[giverdada]

I was watching Netflix at 10 on Sunday night when I heard a staccatto of pops somewhere out the living room window. I thought they were random fireworks for an obscure holiday being celebrated. Then I heard the sirens. Wailing. Increasing in both number, and volume. Cruisers flying down our street. No more pops. Lights going on, others going off. And always, that siren wailing.

Literally around the corner from my daughter's school, across the street from where I had sent the girls to get mangoes a few hours earlier, and in restaurants that I frequent every few paydays, there were casings all over the ground, and people bleeding. I didn't see any of this, of course, from my living room couch two streets south. But I heard it. And I read about it. And the street is 'open' again now, but many windows are dark, many people are sombre, only the sky saw fit to put up a rainbow and shine a little light on the Danforth.

I am angry and sad and confused and I have no answers or even real questions formed. Too many connections to one of the victims who has already died. No words for someone who shoots children. Children. Children like the ones I'm lucky enough to be tucking into bed tonight. I don't know. I don't know anything.

[Cicli]

Sad for sure.

These threads always go to pewp so..........

[rnhood]

It is very sad, but it could have been much worse. Only two died. Not sure if the Arab was a terrorist or just a complete nut case. His family says he was a nut case.

[gone]

Not sure if the Arab was a terrorist or just a complete nut case. His family says he was a nut case.
I wonder if the parents of the children that died appreciate the distinction.

[Louis]

I wonder if the parents of the children that died appreciate the distinction.

Perhaps not, but understanding the problem is a useful if societies are going to try to prevent this from happening again, and again, and again.

[DRZRM]

Faisal Hussain, "The shooter," "the murderer," the gunman who was a lifelong sufferer of psychosis and depression, all of these are much less problematic and less prejudiced descriptions than calling him "the Arab" based on, his name? His language?

As for dismissing it as 'very sad, but it could have been much worse" I wonder how the 13 people shot and the families of the ten-year-old child and the 18-year-old young woman who were killed see it. Sure, it would have been "worse" if he mowed down and killed 10 people with a cargo van, or if he lived somewhere where he had a legal right to buy a semi-automatic assault rifle and a bump stock, or if he had legal access to dozens of them, of if we'd elected him president, but what is your investment in dismissing the tragedy of "the Arab's" massacre?

Maybe we can all just be sympathetic and not belittle what just happened.

It is very sad, but it could have been much worse. Only two died. Not sure if the Arab was a terrorist or just a complete nut case. His family says he was a nut case.

[R3awak3n]

Faisal Hussain, "The shooter," "the murderer," the gunman who was a lifelong sufferer of psychosis and depression, all of these are much less problematic and less prejudiced descriptions than calling him "the Arab" based on, his name? His language?

As for dismissing it as 'very sad, but it could have been much worse" I wonder how the 13 people shot and the families of the ten-year-old child and the 18-year-old young woman who were killed see it. Sure, it would have been "worse" if he mowed down and killed 10 people with a cargo van, or if he lived somewhere where he had a legal right to buy a semi-automatic assault rifle and a bump stock, or if he had legal access to dozens of them, of if we'd elected him president, but what is your investment in dismissing the tragedy of "the Arab's" massacre?

Maybe we can all just be sympathetic and not belittle what just happened.


thank you for this

[Clean39T]

thank you for this

+ 2

[GonaSovereign]

One of those killed is part of my extended circle. Some sad people in my world today.
F you to the piece of garbage who did it. Garbage. Utter s-t.

Also, F you to the guy above who referred to him as "the Arab." You make things worse; you are part of the problem.

[dancinkozmo]

...

[veggieburger]

Lots of details coming out now. Very curious how he managed to obtain a handgun in an environment that is extremely strict with pistols. If legally, huge failing on the part of the RCMP.


"From the outside, Faisal Hussain appeared to be living a normal life for a 29 year old. People who knew him say he was unflinchingly polite, had a smile that could light up a room, and helped take care of his aging parents.

Only the people closest to Hussain knew that he had spent most of his life battling depression, psychosis and other mental health issues – and not even the people who knew about that had any reason to think he was planning a mass shooting."

[redir]

I was watching Netflix at 10 on Sunday night when I heard a staccatto of pops somewhere out the living room window. I thought they were random fireworks for an obscure holiday being celebrated. Then I heard the sirens. Wailing. Increasing in both number, and volume. Cruisers flying down our street. No more pops. Lights going on, others going off. And always, that siren wailing.

Literally around the corner from my daughter's school, across the street from where I had sent the girls to get mangoes a few hours earlier, and in restaurants that I frequent every few paydays, there were casings all over the ground, and people bleeding. I didn't see any of this, of course, from my living room couch two streets south. But I heard it. And I read about it. And the street is 'open' again now, but many windows are dark, many people are sombre, only the sky saw fit to put up a rainbow and shine a little light on the Danforth.

I am angry and sad and confused and I have no answers or even real questions formed. Too many connections to one of the victims who has already died. No words for someone who shoots children. Children. Children like the ones I'm lucky enough to be tucking into bed tonight. I don't know. I don't know anything.

Believe me I know what you mean. I was on the Virginia Tech campus when it happened here, lost one acquaintance and another co worker was injured. There is no way to rationalize the madness. When the mentally ill have such easy access it's going to continue to happen.

[ntb1001]

I was watching Netflix at 10 on Sunday night when I heard a staccatto of pops somewhere out the living room window. I thought they were random fireworks for an obscure holiday being celebrated. Then I heard the sirens. Wailing. Increasing in both number, and volume. Cruisers flying down our street. No more pops. Lights going on, others going off. And always, that siren wailing.



Literally around the corner from my daughter's school, across the street from where I had sent the girls to get mangoes a few hours earlier, and in restaurants that I frequent every few paydays, there were casings all over the ground, and people bleeding. I didn't see any of this, of course, from my living room couch two streets south. But I heard it. And I read about it. And the street is 'open' again now, but many windows are dark, many people are sombre, only the sky saw fit to put up a rainbow and shine a little light on the Danforth.



I am angry and sad and confused and I have no answers or even real questions formed. Too many connections to one of the victims who has already died. No words for someone who shoots children. Children. Children like the ones I'm lucky enough to be tucking into bed tonight. I don't know. I don't know anything.



I’m glad you and your family are safe giverdada.
I work 2 blocks away from your neighbourhood, and drive by those restaurants everyday.

It’s terrible that we’ve had things like this and the van massacre 3 months ago.

As far as the shooter...I’m glad he didn’t survive. If he did, he would’ve been out on the streets again sooner than any of us ever would want.


Stay strong




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Mikej]

Is it easy to acquire fire arms in Canada?

[buddybikes]

Meanwhile in Cambridge MA, a 14 year old girl shoved to the ground on her face/head and died of blunt trama.

[xlbs]

Buying a handgun is a significant challenge here in Canada.

Story: An elderly aquaintance asked me to help her sell a WW2 Luger that her father had brought home from the war. She found a buyer. He had to certify that the firing pin had been decommissioned by a gun smith before he could purchase it. She had to provide a lock box AND a trigger lock plus a travel permit with specified date, destination, and time frame (2 hours maximum) simply to have me drive the gun to the gunsmith...

He had to provide the same upon picking up the gun from the gunsmith...

Even buying a rifle is not a straightforward process; buying an assault weapon is virtually impossible.

But, there are lots of guns on the street, so the less than law abiding crowd seems to have little difficulty sourcing hand guns etc.

We are not the US of A when it comes to guns here.

One of the nagging questions about this shooter is "How and where did he buy a handgun?"

[ntb1001]

It is very difficult to buy a legal handgun here. I would doubt very much someone with mental illness history would clear through the process.
Saying that....illegal handguns are easily acquired. Many, many handguns are smuggled across our boarder, and supply the black market.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bruce K]

Stevesndbarb1 - police are now searching for a “cyclist” who may have been involved in the assault/murder of that girl in Cambridge.

BK

[FlashUNC]

Buying a handgun is a significant challenge here in Canada.

Story: An elderly aquaintance asked me to help her sell a WW2 Luger that her father had brought home from the war. She found a buyer. He had to certify that the firing pin had been decommissioned by a gun smith before he could purchase it. She had to provide a lock box AND a trigger lock plus a travel permit with specified date, destination, and time frame (2 hours maximum) simply to have me drive the gun to the gunsmith...

He had to provide the same upon picking up the gun from the gunsmith...

Even buying a rifle is not a straightforward process; buying an assault weapon is virtually impossible.

But, there are lots of guns on the street, so the less than law abiding crowd seems to have little difficulty sourcing hand guns etc.

We are not the US of A when it comes to guns here.

One of the nagging questions about this shooter is "How and where did he buy a handgun?"

Dollars to donuts it was acquired in the United States.

[Bruce K]

Not legally if he was not a citizen or properly documented.

BK

[oldpotatoe]

Lots of details coming out now. Very curious how he managed to obtain a handgun in an environment that is extremely strict with pistols. If legally, huge failing on the part of the RCMP.


"From the outside, Faisal Hussain appeared to be living a normal life for a 29 year old. People who knew him say he was unflinchingly polite, had a smile that could light up a room, and helped take care of his aging parents.

Only the people closest to Hussain knew that he had spent most of his life battling depression, psychosis and other mental health issues – and not even the people who knew about that had any reason to think he was planning a mass shooting."

Very sad all around but the above..too many times access to the weapon is the issue. The route the gun took to get into his hands needs to be very carefully analyzed, in this and any other case, regardless of location or what his name was. People who have diagnosed, severe mental problems should NOT have access to a weapon..

[oldpotatoe]

Not legally if he was not a citizen or properly documented.

BK

Not really true..any local gun show will sell guns w/o any sort of BG check or even an ID. Only 9 states require all gun sales to be preceded by a BG check.
Gun dealers go to gun shows as a 'private citizen' and cash talks..
Nine states (California, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Nevada, New York, Oregon, Rhode Island, Washington) and DC require universal background checks at the point of sale for all sales and transfers of all classes of firearms, whether they are purchased from a licensed dealer or an unlicensed seller.

NOT Pennsylvania or Michigan..close to Toronto

Sorry in advance, I'm NOT trying to steer this thread in any direction, anti-or pro gun..just saying how it works in some states.

[veggieburger]

It is very difficult to buy a legal handgun here. I would doubt very much someone with mental illness history would clear through the process.
Saying that....illegal handguns are easily acquired. Many, many handguns are smuggled across our boarder, and supply the black market.



I have my PAL and restricted handgun license. Until recently we needed an ATT permit just to drive to the firing range. Also, doesn't matter if you own 1,000 acres, you may NOT shoot that pistol at cans set up on a log. So yeah....how did this man get himself a handgun? Finding the answer to that question is an essential piece of the puzzle.

[redir]

That's the way it is in Virginia. As a private 3rd party sale I can sell what ever legal weapon I have to whom ever I want as long as they are a Virginia resident. But even the citizenship requirement is often overlooked on private sales. You got the cash? I got the gun. Sociopaths by their very nature are often described as genuine, warm and friendly people. They know how to trick everyone, it's in their insidious nature. You never know who's going to answer your 'gun for sale' add. Some of the worst recent mass killings were all done with legally purchased weapons so it's not just a problem of getting illegal guns in the hands of criminals.

[William]

At this point it is speculation on how and where he got the gun and where it originated. Let the investigation run its course.



In the meantime we aren't going to let that speculation run into a gun control debate so keep that in mind running forward.







William

[veggieburger]

This just popped up on my feed:
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/isis-claims-responsibility-for-danforth-attack-provides-no-proof-to-back-up-claim-1.4027018

[bicycletricycle]

this sort of thing is really depressing. I wonder if the ISIS connection has any basis in reality. Those guys will claim responsibility for just about anything.

I do not doubt the family's claims of mental illness but in some ways this always seems redundant. We categorize everyone who shoots random people as mentally ill don't we?

[bicycletricycle]

Wanting to know the reason something happened belittles it? What is wrong about making some guesses about an event based on a name/language? Sure it is inaccurate but its not like we have nothing to learn from this info. I don't think anyone was building a case for prosecution or attributing motives, it was just a guess. No doubt the use of "arab" was clumsy, however, when someone with a name like "Faisal Hussain" shoots random people in the street I think it is fair to be curious about possible terrorist motives just based on recent history. Heck, anyone shooting random people in the street is fairly treated a terrorist suspect these days.

Faisal Hussain, "The shooter," "the murderer," the gunman who was a lifelong sufferer of psychosis and depression, all of these are much less problematic and less prejudiced descriptions than calling him "the Arab" based on, his name? His language?

As for dismissing it as 'very sad, but it could have been much worse" I wonder how the 13 people shot and the families of the ten-year-old child and the 18-year-old young woman who were killed see it. Sure, it would have been "worse" if he mowed down and killed 10 people with a cargo van, or if he lived somewhere where he had a legal right to buy a semi-automatic assault rifle and a bump stock, or if he had legal access to dozens of them, of if we'd elected him president, but what is your investment in dismissing the tragedy of "the Arab's" massacre?

Maybe we can all just be sympathetic and not belittle what just happened.

[DRZRM]

Can foreigners not buy guns legally in the U.S.? Is it illegal if he bought it used at a gun show? Do foreigners not have the right to buy guns? Not trying to start anything, serious question?

Edit, just saw BT's response.

The belittling comment was about him saying "very sad, but it could have been worse." That is always true, but in a conversation in which people effected by and/or close to the event, does it add anything? Is that ever the appropriate response to someone dying?

The focus of your response is the use of "the Arab" as a descriptor. Sure people are curious, but the was not curiousity, it was prejudging without evidence. Terrorism has no specific race or ethnicity in this country or any other. We can argue about the history and use of that term, but let's not do that here in this thread.


Not legally if he was not a citizen or properly documented.

BK

[Bruce K]

Zach

The paperwork asks if you are a citizen or not

Green card required for purchase.

At least here.

I would never private sale (personally) - I don’t want the responsibility of not fully knowing who it’s going to.

BK

[xnetter]

News reporting that the perp obtained the weapon from his low-life gangbanger brother, who it seems ... ding ding ... smuggled it from the US. No surprise there.

KJ

[William]

News reporting that the perp obtained the weapon from his low-life gangbanger brother, who it seems ... ding ding ... smuggled it from the US. No surprise there.

KJ


So, if true illegally obtained/brought into the country.





William

[LizaGrey]

It's horrible! I sympathize..

[oldpotatoe]

News reporting that the perp obtained the weapon from his low-life gangbanger brother, who it seems ... ding ding ... smuggled it from the US. No surprise there.

KJ

If true, brother needs to go meet some bro’s in the big house.

[mmelito]

I read the chatter from various social/media sites speculation as to the shooter's motivation, the acquisition of the firearm, his ethnicity, religion, where he worked, family situation and so on and so on....

Regardless of the circumstances, the outcome remains the same to me; innocents were murdered.

Healthy or ill, terrorist or pacifist , foreigner or citizen, legal or illegal possession etc.. any of these attributes in any combination can't justify or make the outcome acceptable.

I don't know what else to say; have a good ride and be safe out there kids.