Colnago Master: Should I? A few questions

[DarrinNYC]

I'm thinking about adding a NEW, Colnago Master to my stable.. DAMN N+1 cropping up AGAIN!

A few questions for those who have gone down this path:

1) I'm SUPER tall (likely a 61 is my fit based on Colnago's geometry and my current road bikes), so getting the opportunity to demo one is a challenge.

2) Everything I read talks about the riding position as being long and low. I'm way past that! I can see the "low" part based on the short head tube (a few spacers on the stem and a few degrees rise on a stem will fix that), but I don't see the long part... at least not based on Colnago's geometry. The top tubes seem relatively "normal"... at least in comparison to the road bikes I ride now.

3) I'm not going to race this. I have faster bikes if I need to climb or ride a fast group ride. This will be a Sunday cruiser. That said, my experience from 80's-era, tall, steel frames has been crazy flex in the BB area. How do modern Colnago Master frames ride relative to the past in that regard? Does Colnago adjust their frames to ride consistently based on the size?

4) My color of choice is the blue (AD10) color. I feel like this bike SCREAMS white saddle, white bar tape, and SILVER components. I'd love Campy Chorus, but it's all black and carbon. Is there a silver groupset out there that's any good these days? My guess is that I'll be buying a few year old Athena groupset... silver and still a performance groupo.

Thoughts and opinions from you experts? :)

Thanks,
Darrin

[glepore]

Perfect easy day bike. Yeah they’re not carbostiff but thats part of the attraction. Long and low is a relative thing- they’re that way in mid sizes compared to modern bikes but not for any era before people started to ride small frames and compensate w -17 stems and 350 mm posts.

Build it with what you want- mine is on 9 spd record w deltas but 11 athena or 7800 is perfect too


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[KarlC]

Would this one fit ?


https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=222620&highlight=master

.

[wallymann]

alot of this nonsense stems from folks not understanding how the funky "colnago sizing" works. disregard all of it.

i'm an absolutely devoted member of the tifosi and i say with a straight face that colnago geometry is not magical. look at the colnago geo charts and get one with the specs that line up with what you want.

and by specs i mean STA and TT being the drivers for supporting your desired position. of course, you may have secondary fit needs that may require adjustments or concessions, but that's true for *any* bike -- colnago or otherwise.

fwiw...a colnago 61 isnt really that big...i ride a colnago 61 across-the-board and i'm 6'1", tallish but not inordinately so.

and to answer your main question: YES, YOU SHOULD!

2) Everything I read talks about the riding position as being long and low. I'm way past that! I can see the "low" part based on the short head tube (a few spacers on the stem and a few degrees rise on a stem will fix that), but I don't see the long part... at least not based on Colnago's geometry. The top tubes seem relatively "normal"... at least in comparison to the road bikes I ride now.

[Clean39T]

Would this one fit ?


https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=222620&highlight=master

.

To the OP..

I'm not saying this because the Master I have should fit you nicely...but the whole "long n' low" thing is a crock of hooey.

The Master I have for sale is what they call a 65cm, but it fits more like a modern XL Fondo bike for someone who isn't 6'7". My saddle is at 82.5cm in the photos and my reach to the bars, even with a -20, 120mm stem, is the same as what I run on all my bikes these days - right around 62cm from tip of the saddle nose to the center of the bars, maybe a hair less. The headtube on it when combined with a normal stem and some spacers under it would put you nicely upright, similar to an Emonda with the H2 fit, or a Cervelo R3 in 61cm, or most any of the modern bikes. The big difference is just the level top tube. And there really is very little difference in the upper end of the Colnago size spectrum. I'm guessing you'd be fine on a 63-65cm. Just depends how much post you want showing.

I will say the ride on it is very nice. It isn't stiff like a Marcelo, but it isn't supposed to be either. It's a great bike to put 28c tires on and cruise around enjoying yourself on it. Plus, it's damn sezzy for the coffee stops. If you've got the means, why not?

Again, not trying to sell you on mine - it'll sell itself in good time if you don't step up on it :)

But if you do, I'd be happy to build it with a mix of Record 10 alloy - just look at what's on my Ellis - I can move that over to the Master and you'd be most of the way to having the look completed.

[Joel]

I can't address the large size deal as I'm a 55 x 55 guy.

But, owning a relatively new Master, it's a lovely ride. I'd agree that the whole long-low bit is overstated. It's really a function (like everything else) of you much stem you keep or don't keep.

It definitely is an all day bike. Not crazy stiff and won't beat you up on an all day ride. Nor, does it flex about (at least given my lack of power).

I've never had one before and I can tell you that there's no way on earth I'd sell this one! The only thing to watch out for is that if you live in a humid place and keep it in the garage, that chrome fork will want to rust and pit, so keep it clean.

Go out and buy the thing! You'll be happy you did!!!!

Joel

[paredown]

Anyways, TL;DR--I have not owned a Master, but did enjoy a Tecnos, and I thought it was a classic Italian-feeling lively steel bike, and they are enough alike that I would think the Master would be the same!

Another small point to support Clean39--IMO the misunderstanding of Colnago geometry starts because their nominal frame sizes are measured center to top (in reality to the bottom of the seat clamp)--like a number of other frame makers it should be said. People who believe that somehow frame size numbers from the manufacturers are standard, then think there is something weird about Colnago fit when the guy in the store says 'I think a 59 will work for you'--and the customer has only ever ridden a '57' and thinks something weird is going on. Or worse yet (and I think this is where the 'long stem' theory got started)--the customer comes in and says he wants to get fit on a '57' (in Colnago-speak this will be a smaller frame), and by necessity then needs to run a longer stem to get his position right.

It reminds me of when I would get push-back from customers when I was fitting ski boots, and customers would see the nominal size and say 'These can't fit--I wear a size 9'! The Marx brothers' old joke about 'who you gonna believe--me or your own eyes'. Fit is fit--and in the main, Colnagos fit about like most other manufacturers' slightly undersquare level top tube bikes.

Second wrinkle--for the traditional steel frames, by the late '80s (I think?), Colnago started making their largest frames 'Freuler'-style with a dropped top tube. It used to be up to their nominal 60 cm size (~58 cm TT) was standard geometry, and anything larger than that, you can see the extended head tube and seat tube above the top tube line on the bike that Clean has for sale.

This was an early solution to giving tall riders a lighter (smaller) frame, while providing the means to anchor higher seat and stem positions--an especially good solution at a time when typically it was hard to find the robust long seat posts we take for granted now, and most quill stems were pretty short. So if you measure a 'theoretical top tube length' at the point where those Freuler frames' seat post and head tube end--they are large frames.

(We've now solved the same problem by going longer on the head tube, and dropping the top bar to where makers want it because they are not constrained by lugs, and adding long and strong seatposts.)

[RobJ]

I'm thinking about adding a NEW, Colnago Master to my stable.. DAMN N+1 cropping up AGAIN!

A few questions for those who have gone down this path:

1) I'm SUPER tall (likely a 61 is my fit based on Colnago's geometry and my current road bikes), so getting the opportunity to demo one is a challenge.

2) Everything I read talks about the riding position as being long and low. I'm way past that! I can see the "low" part based on the short head tube (a few spacers on the stem and a few degrees rise on a stem will fix that), but I don't see the long part... at least not based on Colnago's geometry. The top tubes seem relatively "normal"... at least in comparison to the road bikes I ride now.

3) I'm not going to race this. I have faster bikes if I need to climb or ride a fast group ride. This will be a Sunday cruiser. That said, my experience from 80's-era, tall, steel frames has been crazy flex in the BB area. How do modern Colnago Master frames ride relative to the past in that regard? Does Colnago adjust their frames to ride consistently based on the size?

4) My color of choice is the blue (AD10) color. I feel like this bike SCREAMS white saddle, white bar tape, and SILVER components. I'd love Campy Chorus, but it's all black and carbon. Is there a silver groupset out there that's any good these days? My guess is that I'll be buying a few year old Athena groupset... silver and still a performance groupo.

Thoughts and opinions from you experts? :)

Thanks,
Darrin

Bottom line answer = YES. I am too in the process of adding a Master Olympic to the quiver of Colnagos as well after agonizing on what to get etc. I almost pulled the trigger on a new X-Light, but went with an older Olympic.

I like the black components on almost all my builds, but agree with you that the AD10 is begging for the white/white combo and alloy components. I am planning the same for mine. As to which ones, you could run Campy Chorus 10 which has always been regarded as one of the best performing groups. Or more modern Athena 11 which has all silver options while still being a well performing group. I believe even Potenza is an option, but I have no experience with its level of performance.

[texbike]

I honestly can't speak to the larger sized Colnago geo, but every Colnago that I've owned has ridden just about perfectly. As others have stated, there really isn't anything funky, magical, or "secret sauce-ish" with the Colnago geo. It's nothing more than a pervasive myth. As Wallyman suggests, just look at a geo chart and match up a size that most closely matches what you are looking for.

As for ride quality and responsiveness, the only steel Colnago that I currently own is a late 80s/early 90s Conic SLX. It absolutely rides as well as anything that I've ever thrown a leg over in more than 25 years of riding. Oh, and it has shiny 7400 Dura Ace on it. Not Italian, but it looks pretty and works perfectly...

Texbike

[WheelNut]

Point 4: Campagnolo Potenza is the only brand new groupset you can buy with a proper polished finish. Shimano 105 is available with a silver painted/brushed anodized finish, but it doesn't have the luster of the Campag group. I haven't installed my Potenza group yet, but I had Athena on my bike last year and it was great. Campag claims Potenza is better than Athena, so I'm hoping that I will be able to say that is the case once I get it on a bike.

Point 3: That frame will probably be flexy as all hell, but why would you worry about that anyway? The headtube will have plenty of flex too. Don't sweat it. It should have excellent comfort and compliance at the front end at least! The Colnago website doesn't mention anything about the tubeset being changed for different sizes, so maybe they do, but maybe they don't. It looks like they do all come with 1" steerer tubes.

[SoCal Al]

FWIW, just buy the d#*m thing, you'll never regret the way steel rides.

I switched from a Tarmac Pro to an NOS Fondriest X-Status, Dedacciai steel, Record 11 groupset and Campy Daytona hubs laced to Mavic OpenPro ceramic rims. It came with the original steel fork for a quill stem but I swapped it out for a Reynold Ouzzo cf fork that my helmet painter chromed- now no one can really tell the difference unless they look at the threadless stem and ask.

The ride is sublime. I don't shed watts but will tell you that guys who have ridden it all rave about it's handling, stability, stiffness (to a point of course) and comfort. I'm in an S-1 household so I ride this bike very weekend in sunny SoCal and every ride, I mean every darn ride, someone always mentions how great it looks. You'll get that same experience too!

[pobrien]

Hi,

I have a Master Light (size 60) which rides very well. It is close to my C50 in how it handles and not so different from my C59.

The Master Light is Molteni with an Aluminum Athena 11 speed drivetrain. I do agree that the aluminum group looks very smart on the Master Light.

Patrick

[Clean39T]

Y'all are making me want to keep my Master...I need more hooks in the garage!

[tbike4]

Y'all are making me want to keep my Master...I need more hooks in the garage!

Doesn't your house/apartment/condo have walls and a ceiling?

If the cards fall right I will have a Master Light incoming soon. With wild paint. A report will post once it actually lands and I am pretty darn sure it will need silver shiny bits.