Help me decide if I want a dedicated road bike

[belopsky]

I have a Gunnar Crosshairs. I have two different wheelsets.

I was thinking about a dedicated road bike. Will I notice a big difference?

Is a Gunnar Sport or Roadie too similar to my Crosshairs? I'd like to run 28mm tires.

Should I go test ride a CAAD (though it may be too long and low), a Synapse, a Domane/Emonda?

Wraith Hustle?

I love steel bikes, Carbon scares me but I have carbon bars on my Mountain bike..LOL..

Help :( :)

As additional info, I am 29, plenty flexible, but when I was fit for my Crosshair it ended up being a 566/382mm stack/reach. Long legs, short torso.

[oldpotatoe]

I have a Gunnar Crosshairs. I have two different wheelsets.

I was thinking about a dedicated road bike. Will I notice a big difference?

Is a Gunnar Sport or Roadie too similar to my Crosshairs? I'd like to run 28mm tires.

Should I go test ride a CAAD (though it may be too long and low), a Synapse, a Domane/Emonda?

Wraith Hustle?

I love steel bikes, Carbon scares me but I have carbon bars on my Mountain bike..LOL..

Help :( :)

Find a shop that will let you do real test rides..as in more than a spin around the parking lot. ALL bikes feel good around the parking lot.
Look at the geometry of the Roadie Sport and Crosshairs..stack and reach...

[belopsky]

Find a shop that will let you do real test rides..as in more than a spin around the parking lot. ALL bikes feel good around the parking lot.
Look at the geometry of the Roadie Sport and Crosshairs..stack and reach...I don't know that I want *another* Gunnar but my Crosshairs rides great. I was also looking at the Waterford-built Milwaukee road

[colker]

Find a shop that will let you do real test rides..as in more than a spin around the parking lot. ALL bikes feel good around the parking lot.
Look at the geometry of the Roadie Sport and Crosshairs..stack and reach...

what about BB drop?

[MattTuck]

Where do you live? What kind of rides do you do and what is the condition of the roads?

A pure road bike (ie. racing bike) only makes sense, in my opinion, if you have plenty of high quality pavement.

If the pavement is junk, I'd rather have a bike that can take 32s, and call it a day.

You say you have two wheel sets, so I'm not sure what tire sizes you already run.

[belopsky]

Where do you live? What kind of rides do you do and what is the condition of the roads?

A pure road bike (ie. racing bike) only makes sense, in my opinion, if you have plenty of high quality pavement.

If the pavement is junk, I'd rather have a bike that can take 32s, and call it a day.

You say you have two wheel sets, so I'm not sure what tire sizes you already run.
Somehow we got people here on road bikes riding a lot, but the roads are not the best, which is why I was thinking 28mm-32mm.

Currently I have a wheelset with 32mm Compass tires and also one with 35mm. I also have 40-42mm (dont remember) cross/dirt tires.

[oldpotatoe]

what about BB drop?

Sport and Crosshairs, BB drop the same. 75mm...across the size ranges.

[Ken Robb]

Richard Schwinn was very candid and helpful when I asked him about upgrading from my RS11 to another Waterford. He told me I was unlikely to notice a worthwhile difference. How's that for a lack of hype? :banana:

[charliedid]

You do.

[deechee]

For me, the difference between my Black Mountain Monster Cross and my Serottas are night and day - but not in a bad way; just different. But is it a fair comparison? Not really. They are different tools for different jobs. My MC is left outside, gets a lot more dirt/mud on it and the parts are a mishmash of leftover parts.

To generalize, my Serotta feels like an extension of my body. Everything just clicks. I get out of saddle, the bike surges. The bike shoots up the climbs whereas I feel the weight of the MC. The MonsterCross feels more utilitarian - maybe cuz of the weight, fenders and usually load. BUT, it's still plenty of fun. I'm not afraid to ride my road bike on dirt/gravel but the MC just feels more secure on the rough stuff.

Like you, I'm long leg, short torso. So fit will dictate more about the ride than what you can learn from a test ride. I would seriously consider a road bike from Black Mountain if I didn't already have two road bikes. Mike Varley is super helpful in determining the correct fit; I had a few email exchanges since I live in Canada and it was really quick and informative.

[NHAero]

Need, no. Want, maybe.
After decades of riding all-rounders that can take fatter rubber (and fenders and racks and handlebar bags), I got a lucky bargain CL find last April - a 2011 CAAD10 for $600. It's character is very different than my Anderson (or my '72 Bob Jackson) and it's just plain fun to have a bike that weighs under 17 pounds (with carbon only for the fork and crankset) and runs 25mm tires. But, I do live where the pavement is good.

[p nut]

Unless you're racing, I would rather buy a set of really nice carbon wheels for that Gunnar.

[mt2u77]

How many bikes can you justify keeping? If it's 3 or more, I personally think one of them should be a pure road bike. For me it would break down as one bike for singletrack/snow, one all road/utility bike, and one go fast/sunny day road bike (+ a fat bike, TT bike, trainer bike, fixed gear, and a couple extra road bikes, but who's counting). Your breakdown may differ, but I've never gotten the same thrill from a cross bike on the road as I do from a thoroughbred road bike. I'm sure I could do without the road bike, but I'm in a position where I can afford a little vanity, and great news-- skinny tired anything is cheap right now.

[yinzerniner]

...from a dedicated "road" bike.

Having recently moved from a 2014 Supersix Evo Hi Mod to a 2018 Crux it's the small differences that add up to a whole. The bike weights were within a pound in road going guise, but the weight was tertiary to any real world differences. What I mean by that is the measurable and tangible differences are easy to pick out, but how they make the total ride feel will fully inform your decision. Since I don't do as many fast and hilly rides anymore the sharper handling, more connected chassis feel and snappier acceleration aren't as big a loss going from a road to a cross rig, but the total difference is easily noticeable. To use a tired car analogy, it was like going from a dedicated sports car to a GT - everything was more direct in good and bad ways on the road bike.

With your stated fit a CAAD10 will probably be too long, and if you have to use a shorter stem the steering could veer from quick to downright skittish. Also the CAAD frame is very smooth for an ALU but it will be a big change from steel. Maybe a Trek in H2 or H3 fit would serve better, or something like the new Synapse, or an Endurace or BMC Road Machine. Even better yet a new titanium might hit all the notes you're looking for but the cost of entry is still very steep.

[sitzmark]

I have a Gunnar Crosshairs. I have two different wheelsets.

... Should I go test ride a CAAD (though it may be too long and low), a Synapse, a Domane/Emonda?

Help :( :)

Yes. Take your Crosshairs with the wheelset you plan to use on new bike. Pick a route and ride the Crosshairs. Swap demo bike wheelset out with your wheels/tires. Fit the test bike to you as much as shop will allow. Ideal if you can swap saddle with yours. Go for same ride. If you feel differences between Crosshairs and test bike, they will be more related to the frame/frame geo than an unstructured grab-n-go test ride.

[colker]

If you want a pure road bike then it´s a 25mm tire you want to ride.
If you don´t want a 25mm tire then you have less need of a pure road frame.

[93KgBike]

Just a warning; once you have two bikes, having four won't seem so odd.

That said, start with a classic steel frameset.

[zennmotion]

The used market is great for buyers, especially those who know what they want and can make an accurate judgement of what is likely to fit- so if you can do that, I'd be looking in here, Craigslist and Ebay (in that order) If you're unsure of fit, then find someone who can help advise or don't go that route- a good LBS is better for you, maybe costs more upfront but buying/rebuying/modifying used can add up and like many of us you end up with boxes full of old parts that are difficult to sell at "true value" without a lot of hassle. That said, I'm with you regarding steel (love it) and carbon (suspicious but learning to like it) I have a perfect steel frame/fork all-road Spectrum that was made just for me, I'd be just fine with it for just about anything short of technical trails. Then just out of curiosity I bought an "older" (2011?) carbon frame/fork in the classifieds here that looked good in terms of fit, took a leap of faith and built it up with Ultegra 6800 components and wheels (amazing deals a couple years ago from UK websites, still pretty good). I love it, I was never concerned about the weight of my Spectrum (still not, though it's about 22lbs with gravel wheels and accessories) but the carbon bike is a very different riding experience that I love to push hard, race the boyz (and girlz) at Tuesday Night World Championships, and the light weight (just shy of 17lbs with Alu bar/stem, Alu Shimano factory wheels-still carbon suspicious) feels great on hard pavement climbs and long rides where I'm pushing hard and paying attention to time and speed. I'm not sure that the data would say there's much of a performance difference with my steel bike, but it sure FEELS different in a zippy way- it's a different ride. It's not custom, and not as comfortable as my steel bike (a Tom Kellogg/Spectrum fit is like buying a wedding tuxedo) but I ride it when I feel like something fast and racy- maybe a day or two a week in summer, mostly hung up off-season- thin 25c tires and no fenders. I was lucky to find a used Cyfac Cadence, an older mid-range model of a very expensive maker at a fraction (maybe 25%?) of the original cost when it was new in 2011. Carbon technology has advanced a lot since then, but I'm not sure I'd notice much. My advice for the OP would be to buy something quite different than his Crosshairs if he's going for a second bike. Another steel road bike will be incrementally different, but doesn't really stretch his riding experience much. A fast racey road bike will feel very different than the Crosshairs, and the used market is a great option for something very nice for a very reasonable cost.

Edit: Like the OP, I'm a fan of 28c tires too. The Cyfac won't fit them but I'm using Michelin Pro4s in 25c (hey it's a French bike!) that are damn fine tires and measure out to 26-27mm by my calipers, enough daylight under the fork and at the stays for safe clearance. They feel great on pavement, rough pavement and hard packed maintained roads- which in reality is 90% of my riding. With a reputation of being somewhat flat-prone (I haven't experience this) I use the "endurance" version on the rear wheel with a little more rubber and the lighter "Service Course" on the front wheel for better road feel. At 85psi the Michelins are great tires IMO, I don't really miss the 28s at all on primarily paved roads that the Cyfac was designed to ride on. it's a "dedicated road bike" - which is what the OP said he was considering.

[Kontact]

You can buy a used Serotta steel frame for less than $400 and an old Litespeed Ti for less than $600, so if you want to try out a dedicated road bike there is little barrier to entry. You've already got nice wheels to use.

[C40_guy]

Just a warning; once you have two bikes, having four won't seem so odd.


Once i said to myself "why would I ever need more than one cyclocross bike?"

Anyway, now I have four.

And none of them is a pit bike.

Go figure. In my case N+1 has worked out to N+N... :)

[zennmotion]

Once i said to myself "why would I ever need more than one cyclocross bike?"

Anyway, now I have four.

And none of them is a pit bike.

Go figure. In my case N+1 has worked out to N+N... :)

Hi, my name is Zen, and I'm addicted to cyclocross bikes. They can all be raced or used as pit bikes, with the "pit" being my basement. My addiction has led me to the brink of financial ruin, threatened my marriage, and I rarely sleep "what was that noise- did a bike tip over down there?" I'm in the process of moving. Cross country. The load is costed out by the cubic ft. Tough decisions ahead, I really detest reality. Thank you for listening, Dog help me.

"To infinity-- and beyond!"
- Buzz Lightyear

[C40_guy]

Hi, my name is Zen, and I'm addicted to cyclocross bikes. They can all be raced or used as pit bikes, with the "pit" being my basement. My addiction has led me to the brink of financial ruin, threatened my marriage, and I rarely sleep "what was that noise- did a bike tip over down there?" I'm in the process of moving. Cross country. The load is costed out by the cubic ft. Tough decisions ahead, I really detest reality. Thank you for listening, Dog help me.


We moved two years ago. Other than that, pretty spot on. :)

And it's not a "basement", it's a "shop" that happens to be located on the lower floor.

Oh, and by the way...four doesn't include the LiteSpeed Appalachian (or Blue Ridge, I can never remember which) that I bought as a touring/all rounder, and is currently occupying the slot in the trainer. Nor does four include the Cannondale 'cross bike I'm building up for my son (and have been for three years now...)

So, it's four cyclocross bikes. Yep. Four.

Not six.

No problem here.

[belopsky]

Gunnar Roadie vs Gunnar Crosshairs?

Milwaukee Road? https://www.milwaukeebicycleco.com/milwaukee-bicycle-co-road-frameset/mkepackage_milwaukeebicycleco_mkeroad_20834/product

[zennmotion]

Gunnar Roadie vs Gunnar Crosshairs?

Milwaukee Road? https://www.milwaukeebicycleco.com/milwaukee-bicycle-co-road-frameset/mkepackage_milwaukeebicycleco_mkeroad_20834/product

All fine bikes, but I don't think you'd notice much difference between any of them and your Crosshairs except the caliper brakes- I used to ride (and race) a Crosshairs- great versatile bike. When I think "dedicated road bike" I think of something that's lighter and more lively than any of the above. You'd notice more by getting a bling set of light wheels than another steel frame/fork-- UNLESS you're talking custom, which if you have the budget and patience to wait is absolutely a step up from the Crosshairs. If you don't want to spend that much, and are adamant about steel, then as someone suggested above, look for a classic 80s-90s steel race bike. I have one, they're fun too. But not the "wow this is different in a very cool way" like a nice used-but-not-so-old carbon race bike would feel from your current sled. The heart wants what the heart wants.

Edit: and if what the heart really wants is your Crosshairs, but mo' betta, then maybe do a major makeover. I'm a Shimano guy, 105/5800 group set "feels" just like mechanical Dura Ace, lightening fast and easy shifts (front shifting is a huge upgrade from older groups once it's dialed in), maybe upgrade your cantis, lighter cockpit, maybe even a new paint or powder job- it will feel very much like a different new bike. 5800 is the best bang for buck or spend more with Ultegra, I really can't tell the difference there. Someone below will prolly add something rude about ShimaNo and suggest Campy Potenza or Chorus- you can do that too. Or Sram Force, hey I'm not afraid of trolls!

[David Kirk]

I think that if you have the desire and the means you should go for it. It's easy to argue that you don't "need" a road bike when you already have a bike that you can ride on the road - I get that. Not that long ago I saw an article about a guy who did the Ironman on a fatbike. He didn't "need" a road bike either and he finished the event. So "need" to me seems to not be the point.

I think "want" is more the point and personally I love a dedicated road bike...light, stiff, efficient, snappy, precise, quick and fun. Will you be a lot faster on a full-on road bike than your current bike? Maybe....maybe not. Will you smile more and enjoy the feeling of using a tool in the way it was directly intended? I think that would be a huge yes. Properly done they feel very good.

Test ride some bikes and see what resonates and have fun with a machine that is meant to do one thing and do it well.

dave

[marciero]

I also have a Crosshairs, a great all-around bike. For years this was my everything bike even though I had other bikes. But for me does not fit the bill for a dedicated road bike, even with skinny tires. Not sure how it compares with the Roadie, but it has a very different ride and handling from the 700c road bikes I ride, which tend to be more well-mannered and refined. To qualify my remarks-Most of my riding is more "all-road" on 42 or 48 650b. For me, a "road bike" has 27mm tubulars. You can go skinnier but why? Going to 32 you begin to lose the handling and feel, IME.

[zennmotion]

I think "want" is more the point and personally I love a dedicated road bike...light, stiff, efficient, snappy, precise, quick and fun. Will you be a lot faster on a full-on road bike than your current bike? Maybe....maybe not. Will you smile more and enjoy the feeling of using a tool in the way it was directly intended? I think that would be a huge yes. Properly done they feel very good.

dave


Best idea yet ^^^ save some money, sell some crap off you don't need anymore or rob a kid's lemonade stand and send Dave a deposit and have him build you exactly what you want. What he builds is what you're pining after. I can't believe I waited so long for my custom, it's a good investment especially if you tend to love yo bika long time, which it sounds like you do, and getting something less than what you really want the first time can actually cost you more in the longer term after you change your bike out every year or two in your quest for your holy grail. Dave is as Grail as they come, talk to him!

[belopsky]

im going to go check out the emonda, domane and tarmac today. i hear you all on the 'a steel road bike won't feel substantially different than the crosshairs' bit

[mtechnica]

A good racing bike will be way better feeling on the road

[belopsky]

time to call the dealers before i go drive out. their sites are all trash and they dont keep their inventory up to date

[CMiller]

I might be in the minority but I dislike the way pure road race bikes can feel sometimes feel "twitchy" and quick. I had a crosshairs and it felt intuitive and quick, and about as perfect of a road bike as I could think of, especially with the 75mm bb drop. I like a stable and predictable bike with skinny fast tires.

[David Kirk]

I might be in the minority but I dislike the way pure road race bikes can feel sometimes feel "twitchy" and quick. I had a crosshairs and it felt intuitive and quick, and about as perfect of a road bike as I could think of, especially with the 75mm bb drop. I like a stable and predictable bike with skinny fast tires.

I would say that your impression of a "race" bike falls in line with what many others think. Which is too bad really.

A real race bike should be stable first and foremost....not dull or slow witted but stable in the best sense of the word. If you can't sit up to take your vest off or open a powerbar wrapper then something is wrong.

All too many so-called races bikes are built to be unstable because it feels fast on a short ride and this sadly sells bikes. High BB's, short front centers and overly stiff construction make a bike feel fast on a test ride but are annoying and slower than if the bike is properly designed.

Anyway...the soap box is free if anyone cares to step up.


dave

[CMiller]

I would say that your impression of a "race" bike falls in line with what many others think. Which is too bad really.

A real race bike should be stable first and foremost....not dull or slow witted but stable in the best sense of the word. If you can't sit up to take your vest off or open a powerbar wrapper then something is wrong.

All too many so-called races bikes are built to be unstable because it feels fast on a short ride and this sadly sells bikes. High BB's, short front centers and overly stiff construction make a bike feel fast on a test ride but are annoying and slower than if the bike is properly designed.

Anyway...the soap box is free if anyone cares to step up.


dave

I absolutely trust your opinion and experience, Dave!

I am thinking of the Gunnar Roadie and Crosshairs I had at the same time, and much preferred the Crosshairs for all riding. I think I ride a bit slower and with less power than a lot on here, to feel the true benefits of the road frame.

[David Kirk]

I absolutely trust your opinion and experience, Dave!

I am thinking of the Gunnar Roadie and Crosshairs I had at the same time, and much preferred the Crosshairs for all riding. I think I ride a bit slower and with less power than a lot on here, to feel the true benefits of the road frame.


Maybe......? I think that you don't need to be Peter Segan to feel the difference in the way a bike responds to inputs and steers and handles.

dave

[Kontact]

Maybe......? I think that you don't need to be Peter Segan to feel the difference in the way a bike responds to inputs and steers and handles.

dave

I am a huge proponent of the classic road bike, but after looking at the Crosshairs' geo chart, there isn't a lot of difference between it and a road bike - mostly it comes down to 15mm of extra chainstay. The steering angles, trail, BB drop are all rather road-ish.

So it may actually be hard to feel a lot of difference when you have road tires installed in this case.

[MattTuck]

The paceline forum, where someone asks if they should get another bike and we have a cerebral discussion on the philosophical definition of a race bike :)

I wouldn't have it any other way.


On Dave's point, I think good fit and handling should be required for any type of bike. For a dedicated race/road bike, I'd look for lightness and narrower tires.

Dave's philosophy of having multiple bikes with the minimal amount of overlap is one that speaks to me. Road, cx, mountain and fat.

[David Kirk]

I am a huge proponent of the classic road bike, but after looking at the Crosshairs' geo chart, there isn't a lot of difference between it and a road bike - mostly it comes down to 15mm of extra chainstay. The steering angles, trail, BB drop are all rather road-ish.

So it may actually be hard to feel a lot of difference when you have road tires installed in this case.

That could be I suppose. Of course some of the feel of a bike comes from the geometry and fit to a large degree but it's also influenced by the tubing used. I don't know the Crosshair's specs off the top of my head but I'd venture a guess that the tube walls are in the 1.0/.8/1.0 or .9/.6/.9 range while a modern steel race bike will have tube walls that are nearly 1/2 that thick. My main tubes are usually in the .5/.35/.5 range so they are of course much lighter while at the same time they take out a lot of the road buzz. So you get a lighter bike that rides smoother while at the same time retaining the stiffness (stiffness is mostly due to the O.D. of a tube and not the wall) which makes for a very nice, and quite different package.

I guess I'm reacting to what I hear some people say about steel bikes....so many think that a Surly will ride the same as a Weigle or Ellis because they are all made of steel and the numbers are similar. This is understandable but sad at the same time. They do share the base material but from there on out they vary by a lot. So when someone says they tried a Surly once and so they don't think steel is a big deal I get sad and have a beer.....dark beer thank you very much.

Thanks for listening. I've highjacked this thread too much already.

dave

[belopsky]

I was under the impression that True Temper OX was thinner than that. It certainly feels nicer and snappier than my Surly Steamroller..

I am itching to try a Caad12 or a SuperSix Evo. My local dealer has a 'fit guarantee' but unfortunately no bikes in stock for me to try.

They will be on closeout soon he tells me, since the 2019 models are coming..

[Kontact]

That could be I suppose. Of course some of the feel of a bike comes from the geometry and fit to a large degree but it's also influenced by the tubing used. I don't know the Crosshair's specs off the top of my head but I'd venture a guess that the tube walls are in the 1.0/.8/1.0 or .9/.6/.9 range while a modern steel race bike will have tube walls that are nearly 1/2 that thick. My main tubes are usually in the .5/.35/.5 range so they are of course much lighter while at the same time they take out a lot of the road buzz. So you get a lighter bike that rides smoother while at the same time retaining the stiffness (stiffness is mostly due to the O.D. of a tube and not the wall) which makes for a very nice, and quite different package.

I guess I'm reacting to what I hear some people say about steel bikes....so many think that a Surly will ride the same as a Weigle or Ellis because they are all made of steel and the numbers are similar. This is understandable but sad at the same time. They do share the base material but from there on out they vary by a lot. So when someone says they tried a Surly once and so they don't think steel is a big deal I get sad and have a beer.....dark beer thank you very much.

Thanks for listening. I've highjacked this thread too much already.

dave
I'm with you 100%.

[belopsky]

ok but what about this? https://shop.litespeed.com/collections/titanium-road/products/2017-litespeed-t6?variant=42050082319
$2k for 105

[CMiller]

I would take more than a few test rides of more traditional road bikes before spending $2000 on a new road bike. You might have all you want in the crosshairs and a super light wheelset.

[colker]

I am an enthusiast of late 80s italian race bikes: not expensive, fun, fast and you can have your 28mm tire w/ those long horiz. drop outs.

[belopsky]

alternatively i do have wheels..any sub $1000 frames to look at. maybe something used?
I could definitely build up a 105 or ultegra bike for under $2k invested

[belopsky]

and for way more than i was thinking I want this
https://www.canyon.com/en-us/road/endurace/endurace-cf-sl-disc-8-0

this is more affordable and maybe fortunately out of stock in my size
https://www.canyon.com/en-us/road/endurace/endurace-cf-sl-disc-7-0

[jlwdm]

Riding is all about road bikes for me. Three bikes and all road bikes. Best feeling and handling bikes.

Jeff

[charliedid]

I would say that your impression of a "race" bike falls in line with what many others think. Which is too bad really.

A real race bike should be stable first and foremost....not dull or slow witted but stable in the best sense of the word. If you can't sit up to take your vest off or open a powerbar wrapper then something is wrong.

All too many so-called races bikes are built to be unstable because it feels fast on a short ride and this sadly sells bikes. High BB's, short front centers and overly stiff construction make a bike feel fast on a test ride but are annoying and slower than if the bike is properly designed.

Anyway...the soap box is free if anyone cares to step up.


dave

Clap Clap Clap

Totally agree

[yinzerniner]

alternatively i do have wheels..any sub $1000 frames to look at. maybe something used?
I could definitely build up a 105 or ultegra bike for under $2k invested

Honestly way too many options to list as of this point. As other have stated, best bet is to visit as many LBSs as possible and try out whatever you can, hopefully with at least your desired saddle and possibly with your desired wheelset and tire combo.

Right now it looks like you have the Emonda, Domane and Tarmac all lined up, that's a good start. If you're trying the Tarmac make sure you do both current designs(reg vs dropped seat stays) as they vary greatly in terms of performance as well as price.

CAAD12 and Supersix are very much race geo so your position will be long and low but they've been designed with a lot of compliance in mind. That being said I prefer both the CAAD12 and Supersix to their nearest Trek competition, although I know plenty that skew the other way.

Canyon has a no questions asked return policy, so that's always a good thing to try out if you have the patience. Their biggest trump card seems to be value, aesthetics and quality over outright engineering, but I've only tried a single Endurace so maybe the opinion is suspect.

Lastly do an ask around here. Hopefully some people on Paceline live near you and would be willing to have you try out their steeds for a pint or two.

[colker]

and for way more than i was thinking I want this
https://www.canyon.com/en-us/road/endurace/endurace-cf-sl-disc-8-0

this is more affordable and maybe fortunately out of stock in my size
https://www.canyon.com/en-us/road/endurace/endurace-cf-sl-disc-7-0

Why not a Cannondale racing frame for starters? A CAAD12 would kick that crave real nice.

[belopsky]

Anyone near Ann arbor with a 52 caad?

[colker]

and for way more than i was thinking I want this
https://www.canyon.com/en-us/road/endurace/endurace-cf-sl-disc-8-0

this is more affordable and maybe fortunately out of stock in my size
https://www.canyon.com/en-us/road/endurace/endurace-cf-sl-disc-7-0

What´s your size? If i were in your shoes i would look for a late 80s 90s italian race bike on ebay. Those have stage race geometries meaning stable, fun, comfortable.
A Gios. Pinarello.Colnago. Tommasini. Mondonico. De Rosa. Basso. Casati or an Eddy Merkcx.
Get an slx or even better... an EL OS bike and be happy.

You don´t need an ultra light frameset. You want a balanced well designed frameset. You don´t even need a carbon fork.

[Kontact]

alternatively i do have wheels..any sub $1000 frames to look at. maybe something used?
I could definitely build up a 105 or ultegra bike for under $2k invested

You might check earlier in the thread for suggestions.

[colker]

Anyone near Ann arbor with a 52 caad?

i would size a larger road bike than a cross bike. Nothing wrong w / pending towards big.

[zennmotion]

Anyone near Ann arbor with a 52 caad?

Theres a 2016 52cm CAAD 12 on ebay now $750 OBO, The Pros Closet in Boulder- those guys are legit. I agree that CAADs are great workhorse race bikes, more zoom than bling. Hang a 5800 group on it an it would be awesome. It's also red...

[Pastashop]

For a road bike, in addition to Cannonball, Trekalized, there are Giant Defy, Giant SCR, Fuji Roubaix, Fuji Team/Pro... Guru, Felt... quite a few choices out there. The formula is pretty stable now — compact frame, low BB, long seatpost, massive HT and DT... and look for the longest chainstays you can find.

To liven up your cross bike, 25 mm tires (preferably tubulars) on low profile rims — badabing!

To do it right, commit, get a custom, join a local club, ride the bike exclusively for a year, and be happy.

[Clean39T]

I would say that your impression of a "race" bike falls in line with what many others think. Which is too bad really.

A real race bike should be stable first and foremost....not dull or slow witted but stable in the best sense of the word. If you can't sit up to take your vest off or open a powerbar wrapper then something is wrong.

All too many so-called races bikes are built to be unstable because it feels fast on a short ride and this sadly sells bikes. High BB's, short front centers and overly stiff construction make a bike feel fast on a test ride but are annoying and slower than if the bike is properly designed.

Anyway...the soap box is free if anyone cares to step up.


dave

If this were on FB, it'd have all the likes :beer:

#StableIsFast

[Clean39T]

To do it right, commit, get a custom, join a local club, ride the bike exclusively for a year, and be happy.

Nah, just do what you're drawn to...and enjoy how that changes over time.

Happiness is a process, not a destination.

It starts with knowing enough about yourself in the present moment to do what's authentically right for you.

That may not be a custom right now or steel in general...for you, in this moment, it might be a CAAD12...

But if you go read through most of what Dave's written here and over across the hall and on his blog...well, I don't know anyone who has done that and not immediately wanted a Kirk that's built just for them...or at the very least come away knowing more about bikes than they'd pick up in ten years of reading the typical industry rags.

My advice is to fall down that rabbit hole as fast as you can...and see where it takes you...

[marciero]

I would hold off on custom initially. The CAAD or CAAAD clone would seem to be a cant-go-wrong option. After you ride that for a while, and possibly ride other bikes, you might develop some preferences and want something else, or in addition to, and possibly custom. The road bike I use on fast group rides is not the road bike I sometimes select for longer solo rides.

[belopsky]

I *assume* a steel bike will ride more comfortable than an aluminum one. Is this assumption wrong?

Is there a steel frameset for under $1000 that will net me a 18lb bike?

The wheels on the stock Caad12 or the Supersix Evo 105 are hogs. Even my HUNT wheelset beats em.

[Cicli]

I *assume* a steel bike will ride more comfortable than an aluminum one. Is this assumption wrong?

Is there a steel frameset for under $1000 that will net me a 18lb bike?

The wheels on the stock Caad12 or the Supersix Evo 105 are hogs. Even my HUNT wheelset beats em.

Aluminum when done right will ride very nice. I have an alloy Rock Lobster that is very, very comfortable. Super smooth.

[tommyrod74]

I *assume* a steel bike will ride more comfortable than an aluminum one. Is this assumption wrong?

Is there a steel frameset for under $1000 that will net me a 18lb bike?

The wheels on the stock Caad12 or the Supersix Evo 105 are hogs. Even my HUNT wheelset beats em.

Since you've been inquiring about my Gunnar Roadie that's for sale, I realize this might sound a bit self-serving, but there you go.

I've owned pretty much every bike you're considering. The Gunnar is a great mix of stiff enough (oversized steel, but not crazy oversized) and comfortable enough (especially with 28c tires, which fit easily), paired with rather aggressive geometry (steeper seat angles than the equivalent CAAD bikes, for example).

Compared with a CAAD of recent vintage (I've owned multiple CAAD 9 and 10 frames, and ridden a 12), it's a very different ride. Not whippy, definitely racy, but takes a bit of the edge off. Not like carbon, either, as you definitely get lots of road feedback. And at 1600-ish grams for the frame, very light for steel. Modern steel rides very nicely. With the Enve fork it's as good a race bike as I've ridden, but is fine on 100+ mile rides. Plus, it's harder to dent :)

For me, the made-in-USA (by a Schwinn family member) heritage and ride quality make it a great choice. I'm keeping my other one as my race bike.

When I had one Roadie and one CAAD9 (set up identically) I chose the Gunnar to ride 90% of the time. The one in the classifieds is sub-18 lbs with pedals, and that's with full 6800, alloy bars, and no real effort to save weight.

[belopsky]

Thank you for all the opinions and advice! I'll try to find a CAAD to ride among a few others. There are lots of trails around me for my trail bike as well so I don't want to buy another bike and find myself in a situation that I have too many bikes and not enough riding :)

[C40_guy]

I *assume* a steel bike will ride more comfortable than an aluminum one. Is this assumption wrong?



I've done 75+ mile days on my Colnago Dream (aluminum frame, carbon fork). I find it as comfortable as my Colnago Spiral Conic (Columbus tubing, carbon fork).

[dddd]

Unless you're racing, I would rather buy a set of really nice carbon wheels for that Gunnar.

I too was thinking that the choice of wheels and tires was going to be a big part of the equation right there.
And then the related issue of whether or not the rim supports your choice of tire in terms of aero performance.
Maybe just a lighter but still-sturdy carbon wheelset at the non-aero end of the scale, with enough width to support your choice of tire.
There can also be the issue of braking performance with carbon rims, but some of the newer ones are greatly improved in this regard if you read the reviews.
Switching back and forth between alloy and carbon rims will of course require switching the pads, too, and possibly tweaking the derailer adjustment.

Then there is the frame geo issue, another big player, and perhaps lastly the weight of the bike, the gearing choices and any subtle alterations to your fit position.

So yeah, I would say you might feel quite a difference with a different bike!

[belopsky]

I may get a CAAD on discount (theyre on closeout soon) but I want to ride one first.

[MerckxMad]

.

[Kontact]

Go ride.

No, you go ride.

We're having a discussion.

[Abelicoln]

I just switched back to a CAAD10 after a year on relatively inexpensive steel road bike (Mr. Pink). The CAAD just feels so much more sprightly going uphill and quicker around corners. Guess it depends on what you're looking for, but for me, who usually has time for 30-40 mile rides at a fairly high intensity, the CAAD just seems to fit the bill much better.

[Jeff N.]

you do.+1

[belopsky]

I've been offered a Wraith Hustle in my size. The want is strong.

[FlashUNC]

I *assume* a steel bike will ride more comfortable than an aluminum one. Is this assumption wrong?



Yes.

I have a Rock Lobster, gigantic alloy tubes, 44mm head tube, tapered fork, and I find it comfortable and smooth for long rides. Is it as comfortable as my Della Santa? No, but the geometry is a bit different and designed with a different end goal in mind. But it isn't like the old CAAD2's that rattle your kidneys to death.

[colker]

I've been offered a Wraith Hustle in my size. The want is strong.

HOw did you figure your exact size?

[belopsky]

Well I suppose I am taking a stab at it, but the Medium geometry will work. :banana:

Now - anyone have thoughts on Light-Bicycle rims/wheels?

[mtechnica]

I *assume* a steel bike will ride more comfortable than an aluminum one. Is this assumption wrong?

Is there a steel frameset for under $1000 that will net me a 18lb bike?

The wheels on the stock Caad12 or the Supersix Evo 105 are hogs. Even my HUNT wheelset beats em.

Go straight to carbon and skip steel imo