Rapha saddles

[adrien]

Just got the launch email.

They look nice, well thought out and well executed. My behind may disagree.

https://www.rapha.cc/us/en_US/men%27s-shop/saddles/category/Saddles

Not sure how they think they can make a recommendation based on my waist and my weight, though. I hope the clubhouses will have some sort of loaner / rental program.

And by the way, I like Rapha a lot.

[dbnm]

As I just posted on the RCC forum, I think they are about $100 too high. The usual.

At $295 they probably would have taken away a lot of sales from the Specialized Power and Arc saddles. But at $395, people will have to think about it.

With that being said, there are thousands of folks who will buy anything and everything with the Rapha name on it.

[fiamme red]

The classic aesthetic is completed with a fully perforated cover, with seamless pleating where it meets the shell for a frictionless finish. I hope it's not completely frictionless, or it would be hard not to slide off. :rolleyes:

[Climb01742]

Will someone please get one and tell me how it is?;) I like most Rapha stuff, but these seem, as was said, too pricey. Went to the site and read through it, but can’t find a convincing case to pay the premium. They are pretty, though.:rolleyes:

[bicycletricycle]

they look nice, a bit to pricey for me though.

[AJosiahK]

I saw 'rapha saddle' and laughed. Saw the photos and think they look pretty good actually. Still not for me.

agree with the price point, as per usual too high.

They are starting to dabble in branding things ( I think ) a clothing apparel company shouldn't. I mean why not right but still, not a trend I like seeing.

I miss the old days when they did collabs with cool companies.

[CNY rider]

Will someone please get one and tell me how it is?;) I like most Rapha stuff, but these seem, as was said, too pricey. Went to the site and read through it, but can’t find a convincing case to pay the premium. They are pretty, though.:rolleyes:

Patience.
I bet you will be able to put one under the Christmas tree for $200.

[makoti]

Saw this. So, who actually makes them?

[Mzilliox]

Saw this. So, who actually makes them?

pure speculation but they look like Fabrics. no idea if this is the case.

They are way too expensive. you can get a Jure Berk for less. weird

[adrien]

Saw this. So, who actually makes them?

I believe Selle Italia

[pasadena]

Selle Italia, made in Italy

[rallizes]

Selle Italia, made in Italy

where are you seeing this?

[adrien]

https://www.bikeradar.com/us/road/news/article/rapha-pro-team-saddle-classic-saddle-weights-and-prices-52300/

[Salty]

where are you seeing this?

Says so on the Radavist: http://theradavist.com/2018/05/rapha-enters-the-saddle-market-with-various-widths/#disqus_thread

ETA: And, apparently, on BikeRadar as well. ;)

[jtbadge]

I'd like to try the Classic saddle. At $250, the price doesn't seem out of line, at least for that model, but then again I never buy saddles new.

[AngryScientist]

of course the prices are high.

Rapha puts everything on deep discount sooner or later. unless you need the latest and greatest, you'd have to be nuts to pay full price for anything Rapha. Just wait for a sale.

i'm a big Rapha fan, but i think the practice of big sales, regularly devalues the brand, and makes you feel like a fool paying msrp.

i'll still buy and like most of their product line, but no way will i pay full tag anymore.

[Mzilliox]

of course the prices are high.

Rapha puts everything on deep discount sooner or later. unless you need the latest and greatest, you'd have to be nuts to pay full price for anything Rapha. Just wait for a sale.

i'm a big Rapha fan, but i think the practice of big sales, regularly devalues the brand, and makes you feel like a fool paying msrp.

i'll still buy and like most of their product line, but no way will i pay full tag anymore.

Perhaps, but even the shoes are barely the same price as other giro shoes when on sale... why not just buy a selle italia if they make the saddles? surely the design is not actually Raphas?

[AngryScientist]

Perhaps, but even the shoes are barely the same price as other giro shoes when on sale... why not just buy a selle italia if they make the saddles? surely the design is not actually Raphas?

can't argue with that.

[IJWS]

I love 'em! All they had to do really was look cool and be expensive. In both cases Rapha knocked it out of the park.

One of the upsides of being "exotic" is that they don't really have to work that well--it's never going to affect my ride. And no one is going to admit that they don't like their rapha. You never hear "I hate my Berk" or "My Ferrari rides a little rough".

Personally, I think that Rapha should really push themselves to design the entire riding experience--including the helmets and of course the nutrition--the nutrition! Rapha drink mix, Rapha Gu, Rapha sport beans??? This is low-hanging fruit Rapha--take my money!!

Also, am I missing something because of my income level (running in the wrong circles)? How does Rapha not have a "bespoke bike selection and fitting service" at each of their clubhouses where they hold customers' hands through a selection of stock bikes or act as a middleman between the customer and a frame-builder? They could do this with almost no investment and then be that much closer to delivvering a fully-branded experience...and then coaching services and personalized guided rides? Why can't Rapha be better at marketing?

I take it back. The saddles look good but Rapha really needs to be pushing it.

[charliedid]

Perhaps, but even the shoes are barely the same price as other giro shoes when on sale... why not just buy a selle italia if they make the saddles? surely the design is not actually Raphas?

I believe it is actually. I'm not aware of a Selle Italia of that design.

[Dr Luxurious]

F... f... f... four hundred??
DOLLARS??

four HUNDRED??!?!

Four freaking hundred freaking dollars??!?!?

[Andy sti]

The Classic is $250. 179gm saddle with a nice shape for that price is totally in line with most brands or just a smidge over.

[simonov]

F... f... f... four hundred??
DOLLARS??

four HUNDRED??!?!

Four freaking hundred freaking dollars??!?!?

Selle Italia makes a bunch of saddles in that price range. Plus, with a name like Dr. Luxurious, I'd think you'd be pretty blasé about an expensive saddle.

[FlashUNC]

F... f... f... four hundred??
DOLLARS??

four HUNDRED??!?!

Four freaking hundred freaking dollars??!?!?

Best not look at Fizik then: https://www.excelsports.com/main.asp?page=8&description=Aliante+OO+Saddle&vendorCode=FIZIK&major=1&minor=18

Or Selle San Marco: http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/selle-san-marco-aspide-superleggera-saddle/rp-prod170346

Or Brooks: https://www.competitivecyclist.com/brooks-england-b15-swallow-ti-saddle?skidn=BHS0071-BLA-ONESIZ&ti=UExQIENhdDpCaWtlIFNhZGRsZXM6MTo4OmNjQ2F0MTAwMDg 2

Or Selle Italia: https://www.competitivecyclist.com/selle-italia-slr-tekno-saddle-sel0079?skidn=SEL0079-BK-S1&ti=UExQIENhdDpCaWtlIFNhZGRsZXM6MTo2OmNjQ2F0MTAwMDg 2

[dbnm]

I'll buy the RCC Pro Team saddle for $400.

I'll use it for 3 months and then sell it on ebay for $350.

Yes. Yes I will.

[DCilliams]

Love me some Perf :hello:

[m4rk540]

Fizik's strategy in reverse. Pair bibs to saddles or pair saddles to bibs.

Synergy.

[Dr Luxurious]

https://www.probikekit.com/bicycle-saddles-seatposts/selle-san-marco-regal-saddle/10774563.html

[jinbok]

Perhaps, but even the shoes are barely the same price as other giro shoes when on sale... why not just buy a selle italia if they make the saddles? surely the design is not actually Raphas?


100% of the design is done by the design team at Rapha and manufactures by Selle Italia.

[ERK55]

100% of the design is done by the design team at Rapha and manufactures by Selle Italia.

Oval carbon rails only across the various models, no titanium etc option?
Some of my seatposts will only accept round rails, and I’m not replacing them anytime soon.

[Expedited]

Got an email for the rapha saddles this morning. I think the shapes of the saddles are great, but honestly the pro team stuff is a hard pill to swallow at 400.

[happycampyer]

The shape of the Classic looks like it could be a reasonable replacement for the old (original) style Aliante, which Fizik discontinued for no apparent (or good) reason. The price of the Rapha saddle is in line with an Aliante with carbon shell and rails, and the Rapha saddle is lighter. It would be nice to be able to demo the saddles. If in fact the Classic is as nice (or nicer) than the old style Aliante, I could see Rapha selling a lot of them. The perforated cover looks nice—a throwback to the Selle San Marco Concor.

[Spdntrxi]

Overpriced by atleast $100...and I am a RaphaRCC homer..

[pasadena]

THey did a good job of making the saddles distinctive. Love that perf!

Prices are in line with other brands. I bet Rapha's customer service and warranties beat them all.

I love my Fizik but these look worth trying once mine wear out.

[shoota]

Say what you will about the price but those are the sexiest saddles I've seen in a long time.

[UKBROOKLYN]

I know this is an old thread but since I have ridden both the wider and the narrow pro team Rapha saddles on test in the past week I thought I would drop some thoughts.

First of all they are designed by Rapha and have differing foam densities. They are manufactured by Selle Italia.

My current saddle is a Selle SLR with Ti rails.. (Huge Cut Out) I was starting to have problems so though I might as well give the Rapha saddles a test.

Both were comfortable.. The narrower one worked best for me despite the fact that their measuring system suggests the wider one.. But turns out one can have narrow sit bones and still be a fat lad.

Yes they are expensive.. Yes the Tour is looming and Rapha is likely to have a sale.. I don't get why people are so down on Rapha.. The kit is good. Assos is just as expensive but seems to draw little or no ire..

Here's the thing.. folks think nothing of spending 2K on a set of carbon wheels that, let's face it, for most of us does nothing to improve our riding. The saddle you sit on for 5 hours on a long ride can make or break your riding day. It is one of the most important parts of the bike. If you are lucky you get a cheapo that works for you. I have tried a bunch of different saddles as my body has changed over the years,, So if I can find a comfy one I am ok paying a bit more.

Having said that I am a little bit pissed off at how great the ride was today because now I feel like I need to buy one.

[pdmtong]

I know this is an old thread but since I have ridden both the wider and the narrow pro team Rapha saddles on test in the past week I thought I would drop some thoughts.

First of all they are designed by Rapha and have differing foam densities. They are manufactured by Selle Italia.

My current saddle is a Selle SLR with Ti rails.. (Huge Cut Out) I was starting to have problems so though I might as well give the Rapha saddles a test.

Both were comfortable.. The narrower one worked best for me despite the fact that their measuring system suggests the wider one.. But turns out one can have narrow sit bones and still be a fat lad.

Yes they are expensive.. Yes the Tour is looming and Rapha is likely to have a sale.. I don't get why people are so down on Rapha.. The kit is good. Assos is just as expensive but seems to draw little or no ire..

Here's the thing.. folks think nothing of spending 2K on a set of carbon wheels that, let's face it, for most of us does nothing to improve our riding. The saddle you sit on for 5 hours on a long ride can make or break your riding day. It is one of the most important parts of the bike. If you are lucky you get a cheapo that works for you. I have tried a bunch of different saddles as my body has changed over the years,, So if I can find a comfy one I am ok paying a bit more.

Having said that I am a little bit pissed off at how great the ride was today because now I feel like I need to buy one.

The saddle is the only part of the bike that people should be price inelastic when it comes to meeting their needs.

how much would you pay for a saddle that works for you?
how much would you pay to have the saddle disappear for 10 hours?

I get people here have N+1 so a $400 saddle becomes 4x $400= $1600 (ouch)
But then again 4 bikes is an indulgence too.

I got lucky...arione cx poof disappears 10+ hours. so no need to investigae the rapha saddle now. But, when I am going for my 15# build then ues I will take a look....

[dbnm]

UnBrooklyn is so right.

If you have a happy ass, you have a happy ride.

So, have a happy ass.

PS... I am waiting on the sale but I am hard pressed to buy another saddle. My $300 Specialized S-Works Arc is ah maze ing.

[madsciencenow]

Agree on saddle being important and would probably throw shoes into the mix as well.

I’m a Rapha fan boy and I think the reason the price seems crazy (even to me) is that there aren’t ten different companies including amazon selling for much less. Once Rapha has a sale these will probably seem like pretty good bang for the coin.


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[colker]

The saddle is the only part of the bike that people should be price inelastic when it comes to meeting their needs.

how much would you pay for a saddle that works for you?
how much would you pay to have the saddle disappear for 10 hours?

I get people here have N+1 so a $400 saddle becomes 4x $400= $1600 (ouch)
But then again 4 bikes is an indulgence too.

I got lucky...arione cx poof disappears 10+ hours. so no need to investigae the rapha saddle now. But, when I am going for my 15# build then ues I will take a look....

Do you ride 10+ hours? Does anyone here ride 10+ hours? How would anyone have time to argue on cycling forums if we rode 10+ hrs?
I will pay 100 bucks for a saddle and i am sure i can find the shape i like for that price. It may weigh 50 gr more but that´s it.
Cycling is not a 20k bike only sport. Anyone can spend as much as he likes but there is no need to.

[pdmtong]

I ride 60 minutes I ride ten hours. Same saddle. I don't switch saddles for a ride. I just go ride. Shoes are important too.

Be comfortable. Don't skimp on comfort

[colker]

I ride 60 minutes I ride ten hours. Same saddle. I don't switch saddles for a ride. I just go ride. Shoes are important too.

Be comfortable. Don't skimp on comfort
I have been using platform pedals and soft shoes for 3 years already. No more hot spots .
If ever ride 10 hrs i will feel wasted..

[pdmtong]

Do you ride 10+ hours? Does anyone here ride 10+ hours? How would anyone have time to argue on cycling forums if we rode 10+ hrs?
I will pay 100 bucks for a saddle and i am sure i can find the shape i like for that price. It may weigh 50 gr more but that´s it.
Cycling is not a 20k bike only sport. Anyone can spend as much as he likes but there is no need to.

it is all about finding the right shape. I would think that anyone who rides a lot, if they found the shape that works, and the only alternative is to pay $400, they would buy that saddle. I would.

life is too short to ride uncomfortably or on a bike that doesn't quite fit. I dont have a 20k bike but you can be assured that if the difference between a day of pain and a day of enjoyment, was $400, I have no issue paying the $400.

of course the rapha $400 is for
- shape R/D
- materials (carbon)
- mfg
- premium

[R3awak3n]

I have triend many many saddles. It is indeed all about the shape and I agree I would never skimp on a saddle. Also we are talking about $400 but they have $200 saddles which are not hard to find in this forum, most people have fancy saddles here.

I have to say after spending thousands to find a saddle I like, have had $250 selle italias, $150 specializeds, $200 berthouds, ect, I now find most comfort on a $70 fabric. Just works great. Its funny because I fell of the bike a month ago, and somehow was a fall that did not damage anything but brokw the saddle and bent the rails. Was glad that the saddle was only $70

[flydhest]

I have a couple extra Ariiones in my parts bin. They work so well go me. One each on three bikes and four back ups for the next build and subsequent years.

[Climb01742]

Part of the math, too, is...if I love a new saddle and want it on every bike I ride regularly, what will replacing all those saddles cost? One Rapha (or any $400 saddle) is one question. But 3 or 4 $400 saddles is a whole other thing. That’s a big reason I think Fabric and Specialized are smart to have a tier of very affordable saddles. Putting theirs on every bike so that every bike greets your butt equally and happily is much more affordable.;)

[happycampyer]

I don’t get all the hate. The classic saddle has carbon rails, and costs $250. That’s about the same as what a carbon-railed Aliante cost. I was at the NYC store and saw the saddles in person, and they are very nicely made/finished. The fact that one can demo them is a plus.

[colker]

it is all about finding the right shape. I would think that anyone who rides a lot, if they found the shape that works, and the only alternative is to pay $400, they would buy that saddle. I would.

life is too short to ride uncomfortably or on a bike that doesn't quite fit. I dont have a 20k bike but you can be assured that if the difference between a day of pain and a day of enjoyment, was $400, I have no issue paying the $400.

of course the rapha $400 is for
- shape R/D
- materials (carbon)
- mfg
- premium

Shape costs 50 dollars. Or 35 maybe.
It´s the shape that makes it feel good.
Why do you want carbon on a saddle? You want carbon on rims. Maybe on a frame.
A saddle is a contact point. You are just touching it. All the weight should be placed on the pedals.
I remember the Keith Bontrager ad that said: You want comfort? Buy a couch. These are racing bicycles.

[pdmtong]

I don’t care what it’s made from

I’m saying if that was the only shape I could find and it happen to cost $400 I would pay it.




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[pdmtong]

Agreed it’s smart to offer a given shape but. with multiple price options.

There’s never going to be a $75 Rapha saddle

The bigger issue is the nagging wondering if there could be something else that works better than current. But I’m happy enough with what I am using that the temptation is tempered


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[charliedid]

I'd make both shapes in both price points if I was in charge

[colker]

Agreed it’s smart to offer a given shape but. with multiple price options.

There’s never going to be a $75 Rapha saddle

The bigger issue is the nagging wondering if there could be something else that works better than current. But I’m happy enough with what I am using that the temptation is tempered


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BUt isn´t there a big smoke and mirror show going on? IME there are basic saddle shapes: you are either a Regal kind of a guy, a Turbo, a Rolls or a Flite guy. Maybe i drank too much of the tradition kool aid but every saddle i see falls in one of these camps. I have not tried them all but the Aliante is for me a lightweight Regal.
Saddles used to be expensive at 100 dollars. Now they are expensive at $250. Rapha is pushing it to $400. I have to confess i am slightly disgusted about the pricing game but in the end i strongly believe you are free to spend your money as you chose; although 105 is working so well only a pro1 racer should have dura ace in my cycling style code.
I don´t buy the magic that high price gear is supposed to bring. Rapha is boutique. Rapha is style and cycling is basically a working class sport so style never came from high $$ tags. It comes from hierarchy and codes. Style is a pair of tubular aluminum wheels or a steel frame painted right. It is having your brake levers and handlebar placed perfect. It´s a jersey w/ history.
Otoh Rapha is good to look at. Too bad it plays wrong the snob appeal game. Just like Shimano has 105 and Campagnolo has Veloce for the upcoming cyclist, Rapha should have that 75 dollar saddle if it wanted to be part of cycling tradition, cycling style.

[bicycletricycle]

I don't think $250+ is totally ridiculous for the market. I do think $250+ is too much for me for a saddle. I used to like Ti B17's but when they became $250+ I had to bow out. Luckily the Cambiums came out with a price, shape and reliability that I like.

On another personal note. I am a big man and don't trust carbon rails. If they made that 145mm saddle with metal rails for $175 or something I would buy one and try it out.

[R3awak3n]

Shape costs 50 dollars. Or 35 maybe.
It´s the shape that makes it feel good.
Why do you want carbon on a saddle? You want carbon on rims. Maybe on a frame.
A saddle is a contact point. You are just touching it. All the weight should be placed on the pedals.
I remember the Keith Bontrager ad that said: You want comfort? Buy a couch. These are racing bicycles.

carbon is actually a really good saddle material, Its light, strong, absorbs vibrations. I bet you are also an aluminum bars and seatpost while some people like them carbon.

Rapha does not want to be part of cycling tradition and they have created their own style and all the other brands have copied it like it or not. At the end of the day, it not for you, we get it but there are many people that like them and will buy em. No one needs more than a $500 steel frame, 105 and some decent lightish alloy rims but if everyone thought that way the bike industry would not exist, we area also all bike nerds in a bike forum and like different things.

[R3awak3n]

I don't think $250+ is totally ridiculous for the market. I do think $250+ is too much for me for a saddle. I used to like Ti B17's but when they became $250+ I had to bow out. Luckily the Cambiums came out with a price, shape and reliability that I like.

On another personal note. I am a big man and don't trust carbon rails. If they made that 145mm saddle with metal rails for $175 or something I would buy one and try it out.

I bet carbon rails are stronger than ti/steel rails. That said, when I feel my ti rails just bent, carbon would have probably broke (no not?!?)

[benb]

Do you ride 10+ hours?

I have rode that long this year. One of the cheapest Arione works for me for that long.

Sore sitbones from riding forever and ever and ever but no skin issues. But if you ride hard for that long literally everything hurts anyway. You know something is wrong when one part of the body hurts more than the others!

The Rapha saddles are too much like some of the SI saddles, I've tried enough of those to know the Raphas wouldn't work for long distance riding for me. All personal. The Rapha saddles look really traditional to me actually.

Why does Rapha get so much crap for these saddles when Brooks has been selling $400 saddles for years and years?

I tried a Brooks like 11 years ago and even back then their saddles were in the stratosphere price wise. They are almost too expensive to even try.

[R3awak3n]

I have rode that long this year. One of the cheapest Arione works for me for that long.

Sore sitbones from riding forever and ever and ever but no skin issues. But if you ride hard for that long literally everything hurts anyway. You know something is wrong when one part of the body hurts more than the others!

The Rapha saddles are too much like some of the SI saddles, I've tried enough of those to know the Raphas wouldn't work for long distance riding for me. All personal. The Rapha saddles look really traditional to me actually.

Why does Rapha get so much crap for these saddles when Brooks has been selling $400 saddles for years and years?

I tried a Brooks like 11 years ago and even back then their saddles were in the stratosphere price wise. They are almost too expensive to even try.

paceline... rapha is bad, disc brakes are bad, sram is bad, non threaded BBs are bad.

[Cicli]

paceline... rapha is bad, disc brakes are bad, sram is bad, non threaded BBs are bad.

This. Except Rapha maybe. The others are true. :banana:

[R3awak3n]

oh clinchers are also bad, 27.2 is the only seatpost size, unless you have colnago then whatever random size is fine as well. anything other than king cage is garbage. new silca is apparently also garbage but old is fine. shimano is acceptable now.

[colker]

I have rode that long this year. One of the cheapest Arione works for me for that long.

Sore sitbones from riding forever and ever and ever but no skin issues. But if you ride hard for that long literally everything hurts anyway. You know something is wrong when one part of the body hurts more than the others!

The Rapha saddles are too much like some of the SI saddles, I've tried enough of those to know the Raphas wouldn't work for long distance riding for me. All personal. The Rapha saddles look really traditional to me actually.

Why does Rapha get so much crap for these saddles when Brooks has been selling $400 saddles for years and years?

I tried a Brooks like 11 years ago and even back then their saddles were in the stratosphere price wise. They are almost too expensive to even try.

Brooks saddles were sold by Rivendell for $150 dolars untill a while a go.

[colker]

oh clinchers are also bad, 27.2 is the only seatpost size, unless you have colnago then whatever random size is fine as well. anything other than king cage is garbage. new silca is apparently also garbage but old is fine. shimano is acceptable now.

Clinchers were bad untill recently when rims got wider.
Indeed.

[bicycletricycle]

I bet carbon rails are stronger than ti/steel rails. That said, when I feel my ti rails just bent, carbon would have probably broke (no not?!?)

“Stronger “ really isn’t the best word to use here because of the variables. My weight + my preferred seatposts + the set back I need + the failure mode I prefer = metal rails. (Not extra light hollow tubular metal rails.)

I am sure some carbon rails could outperform some metal rails in some situations, even if they did. I don’t have a problem with the metal rails I use and I don’t want to spend extra money to save some grams.

[dbnm]

Put the name Rapha in the title of any thread here and watch the posts pour in.

Totally nuts.

They make great clothing and back it with great customer service and guarantees.

They promote cycling and a healthy lifestyle. Who the frick do they think they are? :mad:

[colker]

Put the name Rapha in the title of any thread here and watch the posts pour in.

Totally nuts.

They make great clothing and back it with great customer service and guarantees.

They promote cycling and a healthy lifestyle. Who the frick do they think they are? :mad:

They are Fred and call themselves Rapha.

[pakora]

the failure mode I prefer

Not saying I don't have one (thought I wouldn't have known to have phrased it or stated one) but this both made me laugh and made me think about what standard has come to pass for normal or at least typical. That failure is inevitable, so have a preferred way to fail (gracefully, but with a weight or performance penalty vs catastrophically, but for some perceived gain).

This is how I ended up with two seatposts, one weird 3 piece flexible carbon one I didn't have the guts to try on my big events, and the regular metal one.

[cadence90]

BUt isn´t there a big smoke and mirror show going on?
Give Rapha more a little more credit than that!
"Smoke and mirrors" is for newbs.
Rapha have managed to pull off "smoke and mirrors" AND "smoked your money, over and over and over again!" in one fell swoop.
Sophisticated.... https://forums.thepaceline.net/images/icons/icon14.gif

oh clinchers are also bad, 27.2 is the only seatpost size, unless you have colnago then whatever random size is fine as well. anything other than king cage is garbage. new silca is apparently also garbage but old is fine. shimano is acceptable now.
:D

Why does Rapha get so much crap for these saddles when Brooks has been selling $400 saddles for years and years?

I tried a Brooks like 11 years ago and even back then their saddles were in the stratosphere price wise. They are almost too expensive to even try.
Why? Well, prima materia for starters:
Rapha saddle, US $395: "Cover: Water resistant microfibre over polyurethane foam".
Brooks saddle, US $390 (but avail for much less): "Cover: Vegetable tan leather top".
Etc., etc....

So, for that $150/$200+ more the Rapha gives you a very standard water-resistant microfibre top, but the saddle is at least "designed to work with Rapha Pro Team Bib Short II".... Please, give me a raphin' break. :rolleyes:

They are Fred and call themselves Rapha.
:D



Seriously, if a cyclist can't make his or her ass fit at least a small number of saddles (within a "family" of shapes/dims as colker pointed out above), while wearing a variety of shorts/bibs, then that cyclist is spending far too much money on advertised claims and far too little time on actual bicycles.

.

[beeatnik]

I've been trying to think about something clever to comment about the type of cat who would think they need a Rapha saddle. Too easy, yet too hard...kinda like the perfect saddle.

[cadence90]

I've been trying to think about something clever to comment about the type of cat who would think they need a Rapha saddle. Too easy, yet too hard...kinda like the perfect saddle.

Catella cats don't rap about Rapha, do they?
.

[beeatnik]

T, choice is nice. I like going to Bristol Farms or Whole Foods or the Silver Lake Cheese Store and walking out knowing that I ignored or didn't consider 99% of cheese producers or varieties. Which is to say, for tires I'll stick with tire manufacturers and for saddles I'll stick with saddle companies. Some industries or products should have barriers to entry.

[cadence90]

T, choice is nice. I like going to Bristol Farms or Whole Foods or the Silver Lake Cheese Store and walking out knowing that I ignored or didn't consider 99% of cheese producers or varieties. Which is to say, for tires I'll stick with tire manufacturers and for saddles I'll stick with saddle companies. Some industries or products should have barriers to entry.
I can see that. All I can afford at BFs is a bathroom break.
And a Veloflex saddle or Arione tires wouldn't dent my credit card one dime.

But, back to cheese, would you really have the intestinal fortitude to pass up a "Rapha Vegemite Melt: Toasted Sourdough; Vegemite; Melted Cheddar."?

It's a real thing, at Rapha Sydney. I just saw it, on the Google-construct.
.

[R3awak3n]

but come on my dudes, we all know these are not actually made by rapha... same as their shoes (giro), their helmets (giro), bikepacking bags (epidura), tape (cinelli), ect, ect, ect


but I would not get a veloflex saddle because it would probably melt just by looking at it

[cadence90]

but come on my dudes, we all know these are not actually made by rapha... same as their shoes (giro), their helmets (giro), bikepacking bags (epidura), tape (cinelli), ect, ect, ect


but I would not get a veloflex saddle because it would probably melt just by looking at it

Maybe not the Veloflex saddle, OK.
But, I bet you're thinking very hard about those Arione super-aero gumwalls, the ones designed to work flawlessly with the new Arione CO2 canisters.
I bet you are.

:) ;)
.

[beeatnik]

but come on my dudes, we all know these are not actually made by rapha... same as their shoes (giro), their helmets (giro), bikepacking bags (epidura), tape (cinelli), ect, ect, ect






Exactly, so what's the point other than pure consumerism (which is qoo) and matching your panties to your socks like your 5 other RCC pals?

My azz don't have to sit on bartape for 4 hours while averaging 27.2. Know what I'm sayin? :P

[soulspinner]

Exactly, so what's the point other than pure consumerism (which is qoo) and matching your panties to your socks like your 5 other RCC pals?

My azz don't have to sit on bartape for 4 hours while averaging 27.2. Know what I'm sayin? :P

:)

[colker]

T, choice is nice. I like going to Bristol Farms or Whole Foods or the Silver Lake Cheese Store and walking out knowing that I ignored or didn't consider 99% of cheese producers or varieties. Which is to say, for tires I'll stick with tire manufacturers and for saddles I'll stick with saddle companies. Some industries or products should have barriers to entry.

Yes. Ralph Lauren should not brand tubular tires and neither Pirelli sell underwear.

[Ttx1]

I've been trying to think about something clever to comment about the type of cat who would think they need a Rapha saddle. Too easy, yet too hard...kinda like the perfect saddle.

Bike forums are so wierd

[R3awak3n]

Exactly, so what's the point other than pure consumerism (which is qoo) and matching your panties to your socks like your 5 other RCC pals?

My azz don't have to sit on bartape for 4 hours while averaging 27.2. Know what I'm sayin? :P

no its absolutely consumerism but what isnt in the bikes world? I mean do we really need that C60 or those 5 custom TI bikes? but we keep buyin....

It doesn't bother me if they make random crap that is off brand, as long as the stuff is good quality. I won't buy it till on sale and then it actually becomes a good deal.

I mean look at campy, they make jerseys and clothes and they are garbage but I don't see anyone complaining that they are making clothes when they are a component company

[colker]

no its absolutely consumerism but what isnt in the bikes world? I mean do we really need that C60 or those 5 custom TI bikes? but we keep buyin....

It doesn't bother me if they make random crap that is off brand, as long as the stuff is good quality. I won't buy it till on sale and then it actually becomes a good deal.

I mean look at campy, they make jerseys and clothes and they are garbage but I don't see anyone complaining that they are making clothes when they are a component company

Are you comparing Colnago´s history of frame building to Rapha?
Or even Campagnolo branding and the weight of it´s name.. to Rapha´s marketing of matching saddle to a bib and calling it technology?

[colker]

no its absolutely consumerism but what isnt in the bikes world? I mean do we really need that C60 or those 5 custom TI bikes? but we keep buyin....

It doesn't bother me if they make random crap that is off brand, as long as the stuff is good quality. I won't buy it till on sale and then it actually becomes a good deal.

I mean look at campy, they make jerseys and clothes and they are garbage but I don't see anyone complaining that they are making clothes when they are a component company

Campagnolo moved cycle racing forward. Colnago moved cycle racing forward. I don´t doubt Rapha makes a nice pair of bibs... but did it move cycling forward? Assos did it... not Rapha. Rapha exploits cycle racing history.
Rapha impersonates a traditional company when it´s not. Their clothing is well made... but their 400 dollar saddle makes us all look like a bunch of idiots dedicated to burn money away.

[cadence90]

Bike forums are so wierd
Paraphrasing a specific member's renowned line is so weird. ;)

Bike forums are so wierd
Mis-spelling "weird" in a paraphrase post is so weird. ;)


Are you comparing Colnago´s history of frame building to Rapha?
Or even Campagnolo branding and the weight of it´s name.. to Rapha´s marketing of matching saddle to a bib and calling it technology?

Lord, I hope not, since regardless of any "ancillary products" the primary identities of these companies are clearly, historically established:

Colnago's id is in making bicycle frames.
Campagnolo's id is in making bicycle components.
Rapha's id is in making bicycle cheese.

Pick two....
.

[colker]

They promote cycling and a healthy lifestyle. Who the frick do they think they are? :mad:

They exploit cycle racing history and cycle racing is as healthy as the Roman Coliseum lifestyle.

[cadence90]

Rapha impersonates a traditional company when it´s not. Their clothing is well made... but their 400 dollar saddle makes us all look like a bunch of idiots dedicated to burn money away.

You left out the part about the co-branded grit-urban stubble-beard maintenance "kit".
"Superior Sheffield steel bits, etc. blah blah"...only $265 for the basic version; only $355 for the Paul Smith luxe edition.

It's coming.
.

[R3awak3n]

Ok... if you have some cycling history you can do no wrong. Go on I tap out.

[colker]

Ok... if you have some cycling history you can do no wrong. Go on I tap out.

If you go wrong 1, 2, 3 times... you go bankrupt. Like Suntour did.

Just because everybody here is full of Record bikes, we forget where Campagnolo gained all the love they have: at Veloce and Centaur.
We love Campagnolo because their lower end groups work as good as Record except being heavier. It took Shimano some time to have a 105 group working just as well. I remember when Shimano was ridiculed for those horrible creaky clanky 105 8sp brake shifters. I had a pair.
Now Rapha pretends to be cycling tradition w/ the tough look of black and white pictures of racers covered in mud and grit ... but it´s all marketing that has nothing to do w/ real life. They sell image.

[cadence90]

Ok... if you have some cycling history you can do no wrong. Go on I tap out.
Why tap out?

Sure, Campagnolo clothing is not so great for the $$$. But I have no idea (I assume little?) of what percentage of Campagnolo's market that clothing represents, whereas a $400 Rapha saddle is the ne plus ultra pinnacle of absolute snobbery on their part, imo at least, and certainly is no Super Record gruppo.

And, yes, Rapha also has far less history in cycling, but that needn't be a negative, not at all, if the products are truly good, truly innovative, and truly fairly priced. Many new companies are doing wonderful things.

I personally find Rapha's products in general, and these saddles in particular, coupled with their advertising onslaughts, to be just as offensive as many found Oliviero Toscani's "beautiful" photographs of impoverished children worldwide wearing "United Colors of Benetton" t-shirts, while Benetton was simultaneously sponsoring Formula-1 racing teams! The complete cynicism and hypocrisy was/is not a minor thing, imo.
.

[R3awak3n]

Whats the problem? Rapha has been doing a ton of crap for cycling. Throws a ton of free events, sponsors womens team, sponsors races. Whats the hate? You dont like you dont buy.

Rapha probably makes more money than campy too so I guess cyclists like rapha too or were the cyclists that made campy so loved smart but the rapha ones are jumb dumb?

I just dont get the hate over this particular brand. I am wasting my breath I know.

[colker]

Why tap out?

Sure, Campagnolo clothing is not so great for the $$$. But I have no idea (I assume little?) of what percentage of Campagnolo's market that clothing represents, whereas a $400 Rapha saddle is the ne plus ultra pinnacle of absolute snobbery on their part, imo at least, and certainly is no Super Record gruppo.

And, yes, Rapha also has far less history in cycling, but that needn't be a negative, not at all, if the products are truly good, truly innovative, and truly fairly priced. Many new companies are doing wonderful things.

I personally find Rapha's products in general, and these saddles in particular, coupled with their advertising onslaughts, to be just as offensive as many found Oliviero Toscani's "beautiful" photographs of impoverished children worldwide wearing "United Colors of Benetton" t-shirts, while Benetton was simultaneously sponsoring Formula-1 racing teams! The complete cynicism and hypocrisy was/is not a minor thing, imo.
.

If Rapha sold a 100 dollar saddle along it´s 400 unit.. they would send a message of commitment to cycling, racing and training.
Campagnolo sells the wrong clothing? It does not matter since they sell us Shammals, Boras and most of all: they sell Zondas.

[R3awak3n]

Why tap out?

Sure, Campagnolo clothing is not so great for the $$$. But I have no idea (I assume little?) of what percentage of Campagnolo's market that clothing represents, whereas a $400 Rapha saddle is the ne plus ultra pinnacle of absolute snobbery on their part, imo at least, and certainly is no Super Record gruppo.

And, yes, Rapha also has far less history in cycling, but that needn't be a negative, not at all, if the products are truly good, truly innovative, and truly fairly priced. Many new companies are doing wonderful things.

I personally find Rapha's products in general, and these saddles in particular, coupled with their advertising onslaughts, to be just as offensive as many found Oliviero Toscani's "beautiful" photographs of impoverished children worldwide wearing "United Colors of Benetton" t-shirts, while Benetton was simultaneously sponsoring Formula-1 racing teams! The complete cynicism and hypocrisy was/is not a minor thing, imo.
.


My tapout is not about you, I have no problem discussing this with you but colker and I don’t ever see eye to eye (only thing I ever agreed with him on was that black black components look good on vintage frames). I wont change my opinion, he wont change his so its just wasted kb. But thats what i get to even come on a rapha thread.
:bike:

[cadence90]

To be completely accurate, then, for a "niche", and a very small one at that, in cycling, and certainly not "cycling". Like Red Bull, I guess; just not my bag either.

For me it is not "hate" as much that I find their "mission" extremely phony and tedious, and the equally opposite (of "hate") completely uncritical kool-aid praise of all things "R" Really Ridiculous.
.

[R3awak3n]

If Rapha sold a 100 dollar saddle along it´s 400 unit.. they would send a message of commitment to cycling, racing and training.
Campagnolo sells the wrong clothing? It does not matter since they sell us Shammals, Boras and most of all: they sell Zondas.

This makes 0 sense. So because they dont sell a cheap saddle they have no commitment to the sport?

Also I bet if these saddles are sucessful they will introduce a cheaper one. Just like they now have a cheaper cloathing line that now with the 25% discount gets you a nice jersey for $70 ( thats pearl izzumi prices)

[colker]

Whats the problem? Rapha has been doing a ton of crap for cycling. Throws a ton of free events, sponsors womens team, sponsors races. Whats the hate? You dont like you dont buy.

Rapha probably makes more money than campy too so I guess cyclists like rapha too or were the cyclists that made campy so loved smart but the rapha ones are jumb dumb?

I just dont get the hate over this particular brand. I am wasting my breath I know.

I am sure a lot of hate for Rapha comes from the exploitation of cycling tradition while turning it into Polo club style.
It´s phony.Cycling has working class roots. It was never Polo Club.
I just want to wear a pair of Bibs w/ "Fred" written in a similar typeface. Beeatnik.. please do it!

[cadence90]

If Rapha sold a 100 dollar saddle along it´s 400 unit.. they would send a message of commitment to cycling, racing and training.
Campagnolo sells the wrong clothing? It does not matter since they sell us Shammals, Boras and most of all: they sell Zondas.

Yes, of course. That is the entire point.
Rapha think Zondas are beneath them and their clients.
That's Rapha's right.
And, based on that stance they choose, I also have the right to then think that Rapha is essentially purely snob bs, as a consequence.
.

[cadence90]

My tapout is not about you, I have no problem discussing this with you but colker and I don’t ever see eye to eye (only thing I ever agreed with him on was that black black components look good on vintage frames). I wont change my opinion, he wont change his so its just wasted kb. But thats what i get to even come on a rapha thread.
:bike:

You two guys just need to share a Rapha-beer at Campagnolo-day in Cambiasso (MI), IT.
Like Obama and that guy.

:beer:
.

[colker]

This makes 0 sense. So because they dont sell a cheap saddle they have no commitment to the sport?

Also I bet if these saddles are sucessful they will introduce a cheaper one. Just like they now have a cheaper cloathing line that now with the 25% discount gets you a nice jersey for $70 ( thats pearl izzumi prices)

So because they dont sell a cheap saddle they have no commitment to the sport?

Yes.


Also I bet if these saddles are sucessful they will introduce a cheaper one. Just like they now have a cheaper cloathing line that now with the 25% discount gets you a nice jersey for $70 ( thats pearl izzumi prices)

It should be a line for most of people.... like cycling is meant to be. It should start from day one. Rapha makes no sense: it´s cycling but wants to be yachting.

[cadence90]

I am sure a lot of hate for Rapha comes from the exploitation of cycling tradition while turning it into Polo club style.
It´s phony.Cycling has working class roots. It was never Polo Club.
I just want to wear a pair of Bibs w/ "Fred" written in a similar typeface. Beeatnik.. please do it!

:no:
Reverse-snobbery is just as ugly as the original thing.
.

[colker]

You two guys just need to share a Rapha-beer at Campagnolo-day in Cambiasso (MI), IT.
Like Obama and that guy.

:beer:
.

Rapha beer: when the beer taste matches the smell of your bibs after on a long day in the Alps.
I am so wasting my talent.

[colker]

:no:
Reverse-snobbery is just as ugly as the original thing.
.

You are right... cartoonish humour and fashion don´t go well together.

[cadence90]

Rapha beer: when the beer taste matches the smell of your bibs after on a long day in the Alps.
I am so wasting my talent.

What a conundrum: broke, need the money, but sell your ad copy to Rapha and you then become a "sell-out"....

Maybe stick with the photography thing?

:)
.

[pasadena]

I like visiting paceline. It's like visiting 2009.
Quaint. When the only game was Castelli and Primal Wear was fred-de rigueur.

[AngryScientist]

this thread seems to be getting a little too personal and full of tit-for-tat comments.

we can open a new thread about the actual saddles if someone wants to, but we're past the point of productivity here...