circular breathing beneficial?

[ivanooze]

So i was listening to Al Hirt long ago and was wondering how he was able to play the trumpet so long without coming up to take a breath. Later on i realized that he uses a technique called circular breathing which is basically exhaling out of your mouth and inhaling through your nose at the same time.

-Up until recently the topic of circular breathing popped in my head again and start thinking if this can actually help while riding?

-What if we can use circular breathing to continuously supply our muscles with oxygen while simultaneously exhaling all the CO2? Imagine how much more efficient you'll be at a TT or a climb. Did i just create a new form of doping? thoughts?

[Burnette]

So i was listening to Al Hirt long ago and was wondering how he was able to play the trumpet so long without coming up to take a breath. Later on i realized that he uses a technique called circular breathing which is basically exhaling out of your mouth and inhaling through your nose at the same time.

-Up until recently the topic of circular breathing popped in my head again and start thinking if this can actually help while riding?

-What if we can use circular breathing to continuously supply our muscles with oxygen while simultaneously exhaling all the CO2? Imagine how much more efficient you'll be at a TT or a climb. Did i just create a new form of doping? thoughts?

Just so you know I was off to bed when I read your post. I have ODCP and was stuck here trying to figure out how to do circular breathing from what you posted and finally gave up and watched a video. I have no clue if it would help in cycling but I have to say that it's an interesting topic and question!

I'll check back tomorrow to see what you and the group come up with on this one.

And, this is the video I looked at to figure out how to do it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcyY0tsGm6A

[bikinchris]

Nope. The oxygen requirements are too critical during aerobic work. Circular breathing requires that you can hold your breath, which is not possible during aerobic level exercise. Well, maybe you could try it, but you would likely pass out.

I always loved it when "athletes" would come out for their first ride and give us advice on breathing. I had at least three people over the years tell us cyclists that you are supposed to breath in through the nose and out through the mouth. I made sure they were breathing with a face that looked like a guppy in a few miles.

[jimcav]

from what i know of the pulmonary system, that isn't possible, there is one trachea and the lungs can either inhale, or exhale, not both?

[Michael Maddox]

I'm a trombonist and I've taught a series of breathing exercises developed by members of Canadian Brass called Breathing Gym. Circular breathing doesn't involve the lungs on the exhale part; you're holding air in your mouth. Didgeridoo players are arguably the most proficient at this technique, which allows them to maintain air pressure on the embouchure as they inhale through the nose.

And that pressure on the embouchure is the point of circular breathing. There's no way to empty your lungs of CO2 while inhaling more oxygen simultaneously.

Also consider the physiology of breathing itself. The diaphragm ONLY contracts to fill the lungs, it does NOT press back the other way; like all muscles, it only contracts. Breathing out is actually a relaxation of the diaphragm.

Suffice it to say, simultaneously inhaling and exhaling would require significant alteration of the human anatomy.

[jimcav]

that makes sense, does not sound easy, but at least I get it now

[HTupolev]

It's not possible to exhale and inhale to the lungs at the same time. Humans just don't have the plumbing for it; we've only got one trachea, to which the mouth and nose are both connected.

Breath out when the air in your lungs isn't oxygenated enough. Breath in when your lungs need more air.

[ivanooze]

I made sure they were breathing with a face that looked like a guppy in a few miles.

hahaha, i'm a witness to seeing the same expression on people's faces who try and tell me the same thing

[ergott]

Trombone! https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180421/272a239ed904aaa5777452ce07e7f968.jpg

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[Burnette]

I'm a trombonist and I've taught a series of breathing exercises developed by members of Canadian Brass called Breathing Gym. Circular breathing doesn't involve the lungs on the exhale part; you're holding air in your mouth. Didgeridoo players are arguably the most proficient at this technique, which allows them to maintain air pressure on the embouchure as they inhale through the nose.

And that pressure on the embouchure is the point of circular breathing. There's no way to empty your lungs of CO2 while inhaling more oxygen simultaneously.

Also consider the physiology of breathing itself. The diaphragm ONLY contracts to fill the lungs, it does NOT press back the other way; like all muscles, it only contracts. Breathing out is actually a relaxation of the diaphragm.

Suffice it to say, simultaneously inhaling and exhaling would require significant alteration of the human anatomy.

I just checked back in an wanted to say that this is great news that it won't work for us because I couldn't do it, Ha!

[berserk87]

This is a sentence that I never thought I would read in my lifetime, much less on my favorite cycling forum:

Didgeridoo players are arguably the most proficient at this technique, which allows them to maintain air pressure on the embouchure as they inhale through the nose.

That's what keeps this place lively. Post of the day, for originality.

[Michael Maddox]

This is a sentence that I never thought I would read in my lifetime, much less on my favorite cycling forum:

Didgeridoo players are arguably the most proficient at this technique, which allows them to maintain air pressure on the embouchure as they inhale through the nose.

That's what keeps this place lively. Post of the day, for originality.

I’m surprised that: 1) it was relevant and 2) it was ME.

[ivanooze]

well now that we have that settled ,how about training the intercostal muscles? Would that provide any significant improvement to our breathing rather than just the diaphragm?

-Maybe it can act as a support to your diaphragm? I dont know. I think at this point I'm just making stuff up to keep the conversation going

[Bob Ross]

What if we can use circular breathing to continuously supply our muscles with oxygen while simultaneously exhaling all the CO2? Imagine how much more efficient you'll be at a TT or a climb. Did i just create a new form of doping? thoughts?

I remember leading a ride back in 2011 where some folks were complaining about oxygen debt on one of the many climbs, and I half-jokingly told them about Circular Breathing. At first some folks thought it would have to be a game-changer for cycling...but the more we discussed how it works, the more it became obvious that it wouldn't really work: We're not continuously and forcefully exhaling while riding, and so there's really no advantage to being able to inhale and exhale simultaneously. Plus as Michael pointed out, it simply doesn't work.